ISIS in Iraq and Syria

Relevated said:
why do the iraqi soldiers always run away?
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One of the best answers to this was from a former US serviceman on reddit (I vehemently disagree with him on US troops staying behind but he answers your question pretty well)

I can give you guys a little insight on this.

When I trained the Iraqis in infantry tactics what I saw really surprised me as an American and it took a while for me to fully appreciate just how little Iraqis give a feck for their country.

Before you judge them too harshly remember that when they lived under Saddam they lived under a dictator. It's very hard to take ownership of your community or nation when someone takes the power to change things out of your hands. You develop this feeling that the only thing you can do is protect your family. After a couple of decades you really don't think you really matter in the scheme of things. You also have to appreciate the typical Iraqis opinion of the consequences of war.They lost hundreds of thousands killed in the war against Iran and won nothing. They then lost to the U.N. coalition in the first Gulf War. They then lost to the U.S.. They then had to deal with an insurgency that was more likely to kill them than U.S. troops. During this time propaganda told them they were winning when every single time they were actually losing.

So take all that in and imagine you're a typical Iraqi young man that shows up for training. You look around and everyone you see doesn't give a feck about whats going on as long as they get a paycheck and a rifle. You notice people don't show up the next day. Your Iraqi officers aren't picked by meritocracy like the U.S. Army but by who is a Shia or who is rich. Everyone talks about how ISIS takes no prisoners and how Iraqi bases surrender en masse. You look at each others cellphones and see Iraqi soldiers get executed in droves.

That's what I saw when I tried to train them. 1 out of 50 loved their country and tried hard. Some of them would show up very excited to get trained by the U.S. Army but by the end of the week most just kept their rifles and never returned. Half the ones that did stay would take our training and go home just to protect their neighborhoods against the opposing Sunni/Shia in their religious wars that were fought between mosques. None of them really saw the training as a tool to protect their country because they had little sense of nationalism.

I imagine things are very similar still. They probably have corrupt officers that are only chosen because of their connections to the ruling Shia elite. Those officers get X amount of money and weaponry to train X amount of soldiers that don't show up. They probably take the money and guns and distribute them based on their own micro loyalties to neighborhood and family.

I remember several Iraqis that were very good men. I think about them often and wonder if they're still alive. Some of those guys knew it would take decades to rebuild the Iraqi Army. We saw things starting to slowly get better by 2007. This is why we shouldn't have left. We should have developed their officer corps based on skill and dedication. We should have protected the electorate from the religious divide and let them get a taste of seeing their vote change things. This is the essence of why a dictators army always loses. The men have no sense of ownership of what they are protecting. We really failed them in this regard.

This is why the Iraqi Army gets rolled when they face ISIS. This is why their officers are so corrupt.

My opinion on the current situation and the prospects of victory against ISIS are very dismal. For this to work we would need thousands of officers to lead Iraqi units and each of those officers would have to be given power to pick Iraqis based on merit. Our officers would need to develop the skills of this new officer corp and show them modern doctrine. And above all we would need victories on the ground with these new Iraqi officers taking charge so the average Iraqi conscript developed faith in their leadership.
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TL;DR - An army composed mostly of Shia have no interest in dying to defend Sunnis territory.
 
Suli said:
I would say the Kurds have been getting a lot of attention recently. Most of what I see on European and American news channels about this whole crisis has been pro Kurd. There's been a lot of support for the Kurdish forces in the form of arms and regular visits from leaders and their respective governments, from across the world.
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Considering what a good job they seem to be doing I would have expected more coverage. The reports coming out of Iraq and Syria that I see are almost exclusively about the brutal treatment of civilians in the areas controlled by Isis. I mean for example, the initial seige of Kobani seemed to draw a lot more attention than the recent Peshmerga successes (including repelling the attack on Gwer, which I wouldn't have even known about).
 
Kaos said:
One of the best answers to this was from a former US serviceman on reddit (I vehemently disagree with him on US troops staying behind but he answers your question pretty well)



TL;DR - An army composed mostly of Shia have no interest in dying to defend Sunnis territory.
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Ahh thats pretty interesting, thanks
 
soap said:
Considering what a good job they seem to be doing I would have expected more coverage. The reports coming out of Iraq and Syria that I see are almost exclusively about the brutal treatment of civilians in the areas controlled by Isis. I mean for example, the initial seige of Kobani seemed to draw a lot more attention than the recent Peshmerga successes (including repelling the attack on Gwer, which I wouldn't have even known about).
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I see where you're coming from, but the Kurds in Rojava (such as in Kobane) have been the ones getting less coverage. Nearly all of the coverage I see these days about them is because of their female fighters, which the West seem to be crazy over.

Hopefully the support for all Kurds continues and we see the YPG being properly armed to get rid of ISIS.
 
Suli said:
How old is he? The kid looks 10 ffs, shooting two men!
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yeah and i don't even know how to half-boil eggs properly ffs. I think hes around 12.

They just used him as a way of saying 'the next generation of ours will be even tougher' etc, otherwise they have no reason to use him. I know its a gun and real death but compared to a fully grown man, a kid doesn't really invoke fear into you so it can't be them trying to make others scared.
 
Interview here by the German journalist Jürgen Todenhöfer, who spent some time in the Islamic State recently, with a German IS recruit in Mosul. Doesn't really say anything new or original, but it's interesting all the same:

 
@Relevated You know the video with the kid shooting two Russians. The adult ISIS guy next to the kid got killed in Kobane today.
 
2cents said:
Interview here by the German journalist Jürgen Todenhöfer, who spent some time in the Islamic State recently, with a German IS recruit in Mosul. Doesn't really say anything new or original, but it's interesting all the same:

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Unbelievably brave journalism. I can't imagine how big your balls have to be to go to a place like that after other journalists and innocent aid workers were taken as hostages and beheaded.
 
Pexbo said:
Unbelievably brave journalism. I can't imagine how big your balls have to be to go to a place like that after other journalists and innocent aid workers were taken as hostages and beheaded.
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Here's his CNN interview, chilling stuff:





 
This is the start of World War 3 isn't it?
 
He's going to do a suicide mission in Kobane soon, I am sure.
 
I saw him say hes apart of their 'special forces'.

Do you know what hes saying in that vid?
 
Relevated said:
I saw him say hes apart of their 'special forces'.

Do you know what hes saying in that vid?
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Who said that? Bin Bieber or the guy in the video? He's saying that PKK are kufr and will get beheaded and Kobane will be liberated soon.
Relevated said:
Why do you think that?
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People in those ISIS videos usually go to Kobane, especially as he's in Raqqa. And he's a bit special to be holding a rifle, so they'll just tell him to drive and blow himself up.
 
Suli said:
Who said that? Bin Bieber or the guy in the video? He's saying that PKK are kufr and will get beheaded and Kobane will be liberated soon.

People in those ISIS videos usually go to Kobane, especially as he's in Raqqa. And he's a bit special to be holding a rifle, so they'll just tell him to drive and blow himself up.
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Isn't bin bieber the one talking? Bieber said hes part of their special forces but you're probably right - He will probably blow himself up.
 
Serious escalation of violence in Hasakah between YPG and SAA. Negotiations broke down over arrested Kurdish journalists and clashes broke out. YPG have captured 20 regime soldiers and the SAA have responded with artillery on Kurdish controlled areas. 2 tanks have been used by the SAA in clashes, one of which has been destroyed and the other is burning. YPG have also brought special forces from other areas.

This escalation could have severe consequences. ISIS are near the city and could take advantage of it. Also, YPG might see this as the time to kick the regime out of Hasakah, and perhaps Qamishlo, once and for all.
 
Suli said:
Serious escalation of violence in Hasakah between YPG and SAA. Negotiations broke down over arrested Kurdish journalists and clashes broke out. YPG have captured 20 regime soldiers and the SAA have responded with artillery on Kurdish controlled areas. 2 tanks have been used by the SAA in clashes, one of which has been destroyed and the other is burning. YPG have also brought special forces from other areas.

This escalation could have severe consequences. ISIS are near the city and could take advantage of it. Also, YPG might see this as the time to kick the regime out of Hasakah, and perhaps Qamishlo, once and for all.
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This is a really stupid development. You have a barbaric menace that's purging, pillaging and raping its way across Syria and Iraq, and now you have the SAA and YPG fighting each other.
 
Footage of today's clashes in Hasakah



The commander talks about how the regime attacked them, they retaliated and seized all public buildings. He mentions that they captured all the weapons and ammo with no losses on the YPG side.
 
barros said:
Time for the Kurds to kick isis and other groups from the Kurdish territory and create a country because everybody around them are fecked up.
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YPG don't have the resources or manpower to take on ISIS and Assad at the same time atm. It's either America decides to thump opposition with air strikes in coordination with YPG, or he arms the YPG adequately, or the Peshmerga put their differences aside and send in thousands to liberate Kurdish lands in Rojava.

Hopefully all three happens but thats just a dream. :)
 


Involvement of Eastern Kurds in the fight against ISIS.
 
Do you mean Iranian Kurds?

(Edit): Never mind, I just watched the video!
 
the SAA pisses me off. They've done some pretty fecked up shit. I hope they get annihilated, give ISIS their own territory and the kurds can have their own.
 
barros said:
Time for the Kurds to kick isis and other groups from the Kurdish territory and create a country because everybody around them are fecked up.
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Speaking to a Kurd the other day, he said he didn't want a Kurdistan but representation in the Turkish, Iranian. Iraqi assemblies.
 
Relevated said:
Ok lets not give them their own territory but maybe somebody else can take their share. but then they will keep fighting so that wont solve anything.
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:lol:
You can't give ISIS territory.
 
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