ISIS in Iraq and Syria

@2cents I was thinking about the national pact thing without really knowing anything about it. I thought it might still have some (cultural) relevance. Turkish nationalism seems to put special emphasis on territorial unity. It was just a random guess and could be total nonsense.

interesting explanations. Thats the kind of knowledge that I casually drop at dinner parties, acting as if it is the most normal thing in the world to know these things. Is is a fine line between looking like a smug bastard and unsettling/impressing your counterpart.
Turkish nationalism is still stuck in the Ottoman mindset, whereas the modern reality is Turkey ought to concede some territory (to the Kurds who were robbed by Sykes-Picot) if anything.

Heck, they could start by simply acknowledging the Armenian genocide but I won't hold my breath.
 
Turkish nationalism is still stuck in the Ottoman mindset, whereas the modern reality is Turkey ought to concede some territory (to the Kurds who were robbed by Sykes-Picot) if anything.

Heck, they could start by simply acknowledging the Armenian genocide but I won't hold my breath.

If you look at the maps of 'Greater Armenia/Kurdistan/Turkey' peddled by their respective nationalists, they overlap so much!

@Kaos is there an official Kurdish stance on the Armenian Genocide? Or an acknowledgement that many of the atrocities were carried out by Kurdish irregulars?
 
If you look at the maps of 'Greater Armenia/Kurdistan/Turkey' peddled by their respective nationalists, they overlap so much!

@Kaos is there an official Kurdish stance on the Armenian Genocide? Or an acknowledgement that many of the atrocities were carried out by Kurdish irregulars?
Not sure about official apologies but there appears to be a general sentiment of recognition. The consensus seems to be that some Kurds did take part in the massacres but only out of fear from their Ottoman superiors or they were prisoners offered freedom on the condition that they would carry out massacres. Now as to how accurate that sentiment is, your guess is as good as mine.

Honestly I'm not very clued up on it, but considering kurdish involvement is indisputable I'd very much like to see an official acknowledgement and apology from the KRG. Some major international kurdish organisations and even the leader of the PKK have done so, but it needs to come from more official channels.
 
Turkish tanks rolling into the Azaz corridor today:



Meanwhile the US-vetted and armed Brotherhood-aligned Faylaq ash-Sham in Idlib have reportedly disbanded and joined Nusra.
 
Meanwhile the US-vetted and armed Brotherhood-aligned Faylaq ash-Sham in Idlib have reportedly disbanded and joined Nusra.
It'd actually be funny, if it weren't so tragic. The proxy war policy version of slapstick.
 
Let’s see how long Russia and Turkey continue to get along. Once the border corridor between Afrin and the Euphrates is secured, the Turkish backed rebels will start to march south towards Aleppo….
 
Does this new heavy assault increase the likelihood of a counter terror attack/attacks?
 
https://theintercept.com/2016/10/23/how-syrias-forgotten-revolutionaries-rose-up-to-kill-this-fear

AS NAJI JERF stepped out of an office building in the southern Turkish city of Gaziantep last December, a man walked up to him and fired two shots from a silenced pistol, striking Jerf in the head and chest and killing him instantly.

Jerf, 38, was a Syrian filmmaker and journalist who had become a popular activist during the revolution. A fierce critic of both the Assad regime and the Islamic State, he had received numerous death threats in the months before he was killed. Shortly after his murder, the Islamic State issued a statement claiming responsibility and Turkish authorities arrested three men in connection with the shooting.

Jerf is only one of the innumerable Syrian revolutionary activists who have lost their lives over the past five years. An editor and documentarian, he helped train a generation of young Syrians to continue the fight for democracy in their country. But his story, and the stories of those like him who continue the spirit of the 2011 uprising, rarely register in broader narratives of the conflict. For all they have sacrificed, their struggles have gone largely ignored, in a framing of the conflict that has been convenient for the Assad government.

Leila Shami, co-author of the book “Burning Country: Syrians in Revolution and War,” told me, “The Syrian government has taken huge efforts to frame the conflict as one solely between themselves and extremist groups. People are not aware that there is a third option in Syria, that there are many Syrians from a wide range of backgrounds who are still fighting for the original goals of the revolution.”

Shami added, “Syria has had so many heroes, but people often don’t know who they are.”

KHALIFA AL-KHADR WAS one of those whose lives Naji Jerf had touched. A student at Aleppo University when the war began, he now belongs to a new generation of writers and journalists committed to carrying on the goals of the revolution. Last week in Gaziantep, on the Turkish-Syrian border, Khadr sat drinking tea at a bustling outdoor restaurant, occasionally rising to greet other young Syrians who now also call this Turkish city home.

“When all this started, we were mostly too young to have any kind of ideology,” Khadr told me. “The reason we rose up was to just kill fear. To kill this fear that we had all been living under as a society.”

Khadr looked younger than his 23 years. He wore glasses, an orange jacket, and a beige scarf wrapped around his neck. The revolution had begun when he was only 17. It came to consume every aspect of his life and worldview. Despite his youthful appearance, he spoke with the serious intensity of someone who had come of age during war. On his cellphone, the background photo was a picture of a young Syrian girl killed in a government bombardment of the city of Idlib.

“When protests began at Aleppo University several years ago, we held them for only 15 or 20 minutes, just to show solidarity with other cities under attack and then disperse before the security forces came for us,” he recalled. “We were not calling for Assad to fall, just to remove the emergency laws and allow some space for democracy in the country.”



When the government met those protests with brutal violence, Khadr saw sentiments harden among his fellow students. Now they realized that the government would choose force over incremental reform, and they began calling for bringing down the regime. Some spoke of taking up arms in self-defense.

As it turned out, they wouldn’t have to. In the summer of 2012, rebel fighters from surrounding villages swept into Aleppo and captured several key districts from government control. The people of Aleppo were divided in their response to the rebels’ arrival. Some wealthy residents were uneasy with the influx of poor, rural fighters. Even among those who had supported the uprising, there were divisions and concerns. Khadr didn’t share them. “I was excited,” he told me. “I felt like we were about to be part of something that was going to free the country.”

But as the war ground into a stalemate, many people fled Aleppo, and then Syria itself. Khadr was among the activists who stayed. He was continuing the revolution by other means: building an archive of photos and videos to document developments in opposition-held areas, and writing about his own experiences and observations of the uprising. In one passage of a longer reminiscence, he wrote about a childhood friend who took part in the revolution only to later turn away from it by joining the militant group the Islamic State:

A choke comes between memory and the bitter reality. The choke kills me and forbids me from mourning him. If I were an armed fighter, I would have killed him the minute I saw him on the battlefield, to save his soul. To prevent him from infecting others, to prevent his soul from sinking into others’ blood.

I won’t mourn your deeds, even if the one you killed was my own father. As you have loyalties of your own, I have loyalty to our revolution, more sacred than yours.


THE CULTURE OF the revolution had imprinted itself indelibly on Khadr’s personality, as it had on those of many other young Syrians. Creating a “Free Syria” — free from oppression and upholding basic rights like freedom of expression and equal treatment under the law — had become the guiding purpose of his life. Like many others, Khadr felt compelled both to write and to seek out like-minded young Syrians.

It was through social media that he first met Naji Jerf three years ago. Khadr was engaged in a debate with other young Syrian activists on Facebook when Jerf, known to many of them as the editor of the Syrian revolutionary news outlet Hentah, “liked” his status, part of a Facebook conversation that had begun around the quote “Man does not live on bread alone.” The two began messaging and Jerf invited Khadr to take part in a media workshop he had arranged for young activists in southern Turkey, where Jerf was then based.

Jerf became a mentor and adviser to Khadr, encouraging him to develop his writing and publishing his articles periodically on Hentah. While Khadr lived between relatives’ and friends’ homes in different areas of opposition-held Syria, he would occasionally cross the border to Gaziantep to meet with Jerf and other activists. In the relative calm of Turkey, they would spend days talking and reflecting on the future of their country — discussions that helped shape the nascent worldviews of Khadr and the other young activists.

“Syrians have tried secularism, nationalism, Islamism, and they have all failed in various ways,” Khadr told me. “The reality is that it doesn’t matter what the orientation of the government is per se. What matters is that the ruling system respects the rights of citizens and protects them from injustice.”

Under the Assad regime, Syria had become a police state whose prisons were notorious for torture, murder, and indefinite detention. Many activists, including Ghiath Matar, known as “Syria’s Gandhi,” and the Syrian anarchist *********** Omar Aziz, had lost their lives in Syria’s torturous detention facilities.

“Even before the revolution, we all grew up hearing stories of people who disappeared, we knew the fear this created,” Khadr reflected. He told me that now he dreams of a country with “no prisons” — a country where the all-encompassing fear that characterized Baathist rule is finally removed.

THE OUTSIDE NARRATIVE of the Syrian conflict, which focuses exclusively on the actions of armed groups and states, has minimized or excluded a significant dimension. The revolution fostered a Syrian civil society that continues to fight for the future of the country. Across cities and small towns in Syria, in areas that have slipped from the central government’s grip and are free of Islamic State control, local councils operate that provide a semblance of democratic rule in a country that, in its modern history, has known only totalitarianism. A huge array of new independent newspapers, radio stations, and video production companies has arisen, giving voice to a people who had long been either silenced or forced to consume Soviet-style Baathist propaganda.

Khadr’s life, like the lives of many other Syrians of his generation, has been irreversibly transformed by the events of the revolution. Though he is still young, he exudes a brash confidence and poise. “All my old friends from before, when I was just a student, we lost touch and don’t talk anymore,” he said, fingering a string of beads wrapped around his fingers. “Everyone who is a friend to me today, they are people I shared experiences with during the revolution.”

Khadr was back in Syria last December when he received the message informing him that Naji Jerf had been murdered. In a Facebook post that day, Syrian journalist Rami Jarrah lamented that people like Jerf — Syrian civil revolutionaries who had given their lives for the freedom of the country — had been effectively airbrushed out of history.

“Syrians who have dedicated so much for principle and stood against tyranny and extremism [receive] no real recognition,” Jarrah wrote. “This mess of misinformation says that there are two sides fighting (Assad and ISIS) with little mention of those that oppose both wrongs. Those like Naji.”

In Muslim societies, funerals are typically held within a few days of death. Despite Khadr’s wishes, he could not cross the border back to Turkey in time to attend his friend’s farewell.

“Death has a different meaning in different cultures. At the beginning you mourn, but then, when so many begin to die, you have to find a way to stop mourning them and just keep going,” he told me, emotion slowly creeping into his voice.

“When I think of Naji now, I remember the things he taught me and I say: Your memory is my path.”
 
Great article on western media biased coverage of the events in the Middle East.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...-cockburn-propaganda-we-consume-a7373951.html

Compare the coverage of Mosul and East Aleppo and it tells you a lot about the propaganda we consume
In both countries, two large Sunni Arab urban centres – East Aleppo in Syria and Mosul in Iraq – are being besieged by pro-government forces strongly supported by foreign airpower. Yet the coverage is very different
I was in Iran in early 2011 when there were reports from opposition sources in exile saying that protests were sweeping the country. There was some substance in this. There had been a demonstration of 30,000 protesters in north Tehran on 14 February – recalling the mass protests against the allegedly fixed presidential election of 2009 – that had caught the authorities by surprise. There was hopeful commentary from Western pundits suggesting that the Arab Spring uprisings might be spreading to Iran.

But, by the time I got to Tehran a few days later, nothing much appeared to be going on, though there were plenty of bored looking riot police standing around in the rain doing nothing. It looked as if the protests had dwindled away, but when I checked the internet I found this was not so. Opposition spokesmen were claiming that protests were taking place every week not just in north Tehran but in other Iranian cities. This account appeared to be confirmed by videos running online showing protesters resisting baton-wielding riot police and militiamen.

I met some friendly Iranian correspondents working for the foreign media and asked why I was failing to find any demonstrations. The reporters were well informed, but could not work because their press credentials had been suspended by the Iranian authorities. They laughed when I described my vain pursuit of the anti-government protests, explaining that I was failing to find them because they had ceased earlier in the month.

One journalist usually sympathetic to the opposition said that “the problem is that the picture of what is happening in Iran these days comes largely from exiled Iranians and is often a product of wishful thinking or propaganda.” I asked about the videos online and he said that these were mostly concocted by the opposition using film of real demonstrations that had taken place in the past. He pointed to one video, supposedly filmed in the middle of winter, in which trees covered in leaves were clearly visible in the far background.

I asked the journalists if this was not the fault of the Iranian government which, by suspending the credentials of local reporters who were credible eyewitnesses, had created a vacuum of information which was swiftly filled by opposition propagandists. The stringers agreed that to some extent this was so, but added gloomily that, even if they were free to report, their Western editors “would not believe us because the exiles and their news outlets have convinced them that there are big protests here. If we deny this, our bosses will simply believe that we have been intimidated or bought up by the government.”

It is a salutary story because later the same year in Libya and Syria opposition activists were able to gain control of the media narrative and exclude all other interpretations of what was happening. In Libya, Gaddafi was demonised as the sole cause of all his country’s ills while his opponents were lauded as valiant freedom fighters whose victory would bring liberal democracy to the Libyan people. Instead, as was fairly predictable, the overthrow of Gaddafi rapidly reduced Libya to a violent and criminalised anarchy with little likelihood of recovery.

In present day Syria and Iraq one can see much the same process at work. In both countries, two large Sunni Arab urban centres – East Aleppo in Syria and Mosul in Iraq – are being besieged by pro-government forces strongly supported by foreign airpower. In East Aleppo, some 250,000 civilians and 8,000 insurgents, are under attack by the Syrian Army allied to Shia paramilitaries from Iran, Iraq and Lebanon and supported by the Russian and Syrian air forces. The bombing of East Aleppo has rightly caused worldwide revulsion and condemnation.

But look at how differently the international media is treating a similar situation in Mosul, 300 miles east of Aleppo, where one million people and an estimated 5,000 Isis fighters are being encircled by the Iraqi army fighting alongside Kurdish Peshmerga and Shia and Sunni paramilitaries and with massive support from a US-led air campaign. In the case of Mosul, unlike Aleppo, the defenders are to blame for endangering civilians by using them as human shields and preventing them leaving. In East Aleppo, fortunately, there are no human shields – though the UN says that half the civilian population wants to depart – but simply innocent victims of Russian savagery.

Destruction in Aleppo by Russian air strikes is compared to the destruction of Grozny in Chechnya sixteen years ago, but, curiously, no analogy is made with Ramadi, a city of 350,000 on the Euphrates in Iraq, that was 80 per cent destroyed by US-led air strikes in 2015. Parallels go further: civilians trapped in East Aleppo are understandably terrified of what the Syrian Mukhabara secret police would do to them if they leave and try to pass through Syrian government checkpoints.

But I talked earlier this year to some truck drivers from Ramadi whom I found sleeping under a bridge in Kirkuk who explained that they could not even go back to the ruins of their homes because checkpoints on the road to the city were manned by a particularly violent Shia militia. They would certainly have to pay a large bribe and stood a good chance of being detained, tortured or murdered.

The advance on Mosul is being led by the elite Special Forces of the Iraqi counter-terrorism units and Shia militias are not supposed to enter the city, almost all of whose current inhabitants are Sunni Arabs. But in the last few days these same special forces entered the town of Bartella on the main road twelve miles from Mosul in their black Humvees which were reportedly decorated with Shia religious banners. Kurdish troops asked them to remove the banners and they refused. An Iraqi soldier named Ali Saad was quoted as saying: “(T)hey asked if we were militias. We said we’re not militias, we are Iraqi forces and these are our beliefs.”

It may be that Isis will not fight for Mosul, but the probability is that they will, in which case the outlook will not be good for the civilian population. Isis did not fight to the last man in Fallujah west of Baghdad so much of the city is intact, but they did fight for Khalidiya, a nearby town of 30,000, where today only four buildings are still standing according to the Americans.

The extreme bias shown in foreign media coverage of similar events in Iraq and Syria will be a rewarding subject for PhDs students looking at the uses and abuses of propaganda down the ages.

This has been the pattern of reporting of the wars in Syria and Iraq over the last five years. Nothing much has changed since 2003 when the Iraqi opposition to Saddam Hussein had persuaded foreign governments and media alike that the invading American and British armies would be greeted with rapture by the Iraqi people. A year later the invaders were fighting for their lives. Misled by opposition propagandists and their own wishful thinking, foreign government officials and journalists had wholly misread the local political landscape. Much the same thing is happening today.
 
Does this new heavy assault increase the likelihood of a counter terror attack/attacks?
Do you mean suicide attacks targeting civilians or counter-attacks meant to occupy new territory somewhere else? The latter is more likely at this stage. When Mosul is liberated the former will be more likely.
 
Very good article. It makes a lot of points that should be common sense, but are not. Walt is great.



http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/10/24...ntervention-in-syria-iraq-afghanistan-rwanda/

The Great Myth About U.S. Intervention in Syria

America’s standing in the world has not — and will not — be weakened by staying out of other countries’ humanitarian crises.



Greg Jaffe of the Washington Post has reported that the usual suspects in the foreign-policy “blob” are uniting around the idea of a more forceful U.S. response, which suggests that strategic amnesia is reaching epidemic proportions inside the Beltway. The underlying message: If the United States does not act, our rhetorical commitment that such atrocities must never again occur will be exposed as hollow, and the decision to remain aloof is just another worrisome sign of American decline.

As regular readers know, I do not think the United States should get more deeply involved in the tragic Syrian civil war. (And let’s not forget that the United States has been engaged in that conflict in a number of ways almost from the beginning.) But I recognize that there are coherent alternatives to my position. I respect those who believe broader humanitarian considerations should trump narrow national interests and who think the United States (and hopefully others) should do whatever is necessary to end the fighting and save the lives of thousands of innocent Syrians. We share the stated ends — saving lives — but we disagree over whether sending arms or committing U.S. forces to the battle will ultimately achieve that goal at an acceptable cost or just open the door to continued bloodletting, retribution, or even greater extremism.

In particular, I’ve yet to see any of the advocates of intervention lay out a plausible blueprint for a post-civil war political order in Syria and a plausible path for getting there. The United States remains committed to dismantling Bashar al-Assad’s regime (for reasons that are not hard to understand), but we lack a serious notion of what will replace it. Needless to say, this was the key omission when we invaded Iraq and when we helped topple Muammar al-Qaddafi in Libya: Getting rid of the bad guy and his henchman was the easy part, but we hadn’t the foggiest notion of what to put in their place.

What I object to most, however, is the attempt to scare Americans into doing something by suggesting that the country’s power, image, or reputation is at risk if we refrain. This claim does not stand up to even mild scrutiny, and the only thing that gives it any bite at all is endless repetition. Ironically, if enough Americans keep insisting that a decision not to get involved in a violent humanitarian crisis is ipso facto evidence of U.S. decline, a few gullible people may eventually believe them.

But there is in fact little or no basis for this assertion.

Why do I say so? Simple. Because like other great powers, the United States has repeatedly chosen not to intervene in many large-scale humanitarian catastrophes, but without anyone concluding that the country was growing weaker, lacked the will to defend its own interests, or was becoming a “pitiful, helpless giant.” Moreover, these previous acts of restraint did not have any significant impact on U.S. security, prosperity, or global standing; if anything, the United States was better off for having stayed out of many of these situations.

When Great Britain gave up its colonial empire in India in 1947, for example, the resulting partition of the subcontinent produced a flood of some 10 million refugees and more than a million dead in Hindu-Muslim clashes. That’s a level of suffering even worse than what we are witnessing in Syria, but the United States did not try to stop it. Washington’s failure to act did not undermine its reputation or prevent it from forming NATO, implementing containment, or building the full array of institutions and relationships with which it waged and won the Cold War. And as Gary Bass has shown in his book The Blood Telegram, the United States repeated this morally dubious policy during the 1971 war between India and Pakistan, turning a blind eye to clear evidence that the Pakistani Army was engaged in the deliberate massacre of some 300,000 Bengalis while forcing 10 million to flee as refugees. Yet nobody then (or now) believes this action, however reprehensible, had much impact on America’s standing as a global power.

Similarly, when the Khmer Rouge seized power in Cambodia in 1975 (in the wake of prior U.S. interventions there) and hundreds of thousands of people perished in the “killing fields,” the United States did not act. Ironically, it was the communist government of Vietnam — our enemy throughout the Indochina Wars — that eventually intervened and drove Pol Pot and his murderous associates from power. Washington’s failure to intervene did not cause NATO to collapse, rupture U.S. alliances in Asia, or prevent America from eventually triumphing over the Soviet Union.

One could go on. The United States did little to halt right-wing bloodletting in El Salvador and Guatemala, turned a blind eye to the Argentine “dirty war” between 1976 and 1983, and openly backed Iraq during its long war with Iran (in which roughly 1 million people died). Bill Clinton famously declined to intervene to halt the Rwandan genocide in 1994, but this omission (which he later said he regretted) did not undermine America’s global position, derail Clinton’s presidency, or abbreviate the “unipolar moment.” The United States (and the rest of the major powers) has mostly stayed out of the series of wars that have repeatedly engulfed the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Perhaps 5 million people died as a result of those wars, yet no one is suggesting that this failure has compromised its moral standing or international position.

In each of these cases, there were eloquent voices calling for the United States to “do something.” And perhaps they were right, at least some of the time. But the cold and harsh fact is that the United States (and its allies) did little in the face of these catastrophes and was largely unaffected.

All this is not to say that the United States should not do more in Syria or in other places where humanitarian crises loom.


All this is not to say that the United States should not do more in Syria or in other places where humanitarian crises loom. That is a separate issue, and for me it is mostly a question of whether the United States has the capacity and wisdom to make the situation better at an acceptable cost. Sadly, the track record of recent interventions in Iraq, Yemen, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, and Afghanistan casts considerable doubt on that proposition, and Syria is an even less propitious environment in which to try to re-create a political order that would not pose a greater danger down the road. But to repeat: I understand why other people disagree with my assessment, and I’ll concede that they could be right.


But by far the worst argument for intervening in Syria is the suggestion that greater U.S. involvement is necessary to preserve U.S. credibility, to maintain its reputation as a distinctly moral great power, or to preserve the respect of allies and adversaries alike. The historical record shows that not intervening in humanitarian tragedies has had little impact on America’s standing in the past, and the same is true today. Indeed, diving deep into the Syrian quagmire is a good way to squander resources and burn up the attention and political capital of America’s leaders, which would in fact make the United States less able to act when challenges to more serious interests arise (as they inevitably will).

To repeat: One can make a coherent case for intervening in Syria, based on the worthy goal of reducing human suffering. But we should reject the idea that the United States should intervene because its own security, prosperity, or reputation is on the line. It’s not.
 
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Erdogan announced, that he is willing to push to Manbidsch and Rakka even without help of the Americans.

He seems to be thinking more and more along the lines of a proper Turkish occupation of northern Syria; it's not likely to go go any better than Israel's occupation of southern Lebanon.
 
Turkey didn't do anything in all the conflict and now They want to be everywhere. What exactly do they want?.
Edit: What if by "accident" the russian ships start bombing turkish positions
 
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-offensive-idUSKCN12S0QP?il=0

The rebels are starting a large scale offensive to breach the siege of Aleppo in a collective effort.

"Heavy rebel bombardment, with more than 150 rockets and shells, struck southwestern districts, the Observatory said."
"The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a British-based war monitor, said more than 15 civilians had been killed and 100 wounded by rebel shelling of government-held western Aleppo."

So where's the outcry from the western powers? The so-called moderates, which is basically Al-Qaeda and various groups that support it refuse to leave the city when given a chance, wouldn't allow the population to leave and shell the other side of the city which is much more heavily populated, yet it's Assad and Russians that are the bad guys?
 
A cousin of Saddam was apparently captured fighting in Kirkuk for ISIS this week. Just been reading he's like the third or fourth fairly close relative to be caught or killed fighting for them recently.
 
A cousin of Saddam was apparently captured fighting in Kirkuk for ISIS this week. Just been reading he's like the third or fourth fairly close relative to be caught or killed fighting for them recently.
Not surprising, many ex Ba'athi seniors simply assimilated into the ISIS leadership, certainly alot of their military commanders are ex Iraqi military.

Always does my nut in when Saddam apologists smugly claim he would have not tolerated ISIS.
 
"Heavy rebel bombardment, with more than 150 rockets and shells, struck southwestern districts, the Observatory said."
"The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a British-based war monitor, said more than 15 civilians had been killed and 100 wounded by rebel shelling of government-held western Aleppo."

So where's the outcry from the western powers? The so-called moderates, which is basically Al-Qaeda and various groups that support it refuse to leave the city when given a chance, wouldn't allow the population to leave and shell the other side of the city which is much more heavily populated, yet it's Assad and Russians that are the bad guys?
Hyperbole should be your name.
 
Not surprising, many ex Ba'athi seniors simply assimilated into the ISIS leadership, certainly alot of their military commanders are ex Iraqi military.

Always does my nut in when Saddam apologists smugly claim he would have not tolerated ISIS.

I'd love to get a detailed account of the composition of ISIS's forces. I'm guessing that while most of the foreign imports are highly driven ideologically, many of the Syrian and especially Iraqi members are more casually committed and fighting for them for a wide range of mostly material factors. And they probably make up a big majority.
 
So where's the outcry from the western powers? The so-called moderates, which is basically Al-Qaeda and various groups that support it refuse to leave the city when given a chance, wouldn't allow the population to leave and shell the other side of the city which is much more heavily populated, yet it's Assad and Russians that are the bad guys?

Typical. Terrorists in Syria are angels but the same terrorists in other places are devils.
The qualification "terrorist" depends on who uses it.
 
So Syrians, who are coming from Syria, say the mosques in Germany are too extremist/conservative for them.

Last year around 890,000 asylum-seekers, more than 70 percent of them Muslims, entered the country. Around a third came from Syria. Many of them do not want to go to Turkish mosques because they do not understand the sermons. They prefer to worship where people speak Arabic.

Yet in these mosques, other problems arise. They are often short of funds, or else supported by Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states. Some back ultra-conservative or highly literal interpretations of Islam, such as Wahhabism or Salafism.


I think we have finally found the root of ISIS and Islamist extremism. It's obviously Merkel.
 
Al-Nusra and co resort to use of chlorine gas (again) as their attack on Aleppo seems to be slowing down.

Rebels fired toxic gas into Aleppo, Syria state media says
The head of Aleppo University Hospital, Ibrahim Hadid, told state television that "36 people, including civilians and combatants, were wounded after inhaling toxic chlorine gas released by terrorists."

The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights monitoring group told AFP there were "cases of suffocation among regime forces in Hamdaniyeh and Dahiyet al-Assad."

Observatory head Rami Abdel Rahman could not specify the cause.

http://www.france24.com/en/20161030-rebels-fired-toxic-gas-aleppo-syria-state-media-says

Glad to see SOHR so careful about suggesting any theories here, as he can't get himself to think of a possible cause for the suffocation of dozens of regime forces and people in regime held areas. :rolleyes:
 
So the same usual radio silence from the usual outlets following strong evidence of crimes committed by the Western backed rebels.
 
So the same usual radio silence from the usual outlets following strong evidence of crimes committed by the Western backed rebels.
I'm still waiting (for a week now) for the outrage about this.

US-led coalition killed 300 civilians in just 11 air strikes in Syria, Amnesty International report finds

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...es-aleppo-amnesty-international-a7380581.html


Syrian rebels' Aleppo offensive could amount to war crimes, UN envoy warns.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...to-war-crimes-un-envoy-warns?CMP=share_btn_tw
Yeah, Mr. De Mistura, this is the first time they have done it. They have never done it before. They only started doing it after they gave you the middle finger (twice) for your Al-Nusra proposal. :rolleyes:

By the way, here are the 4 suicide bombers who started the attack on Aleppo. 1 Saudi (the first picture), 1 Egyptian (the second picture) and 2 Turks (the last two). The moderate Syrian rebels...

CwCRFriW8AUT-ZV.jpg

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New audio speech by al-Baghdadi just released, his first since December last year. Apparently he blasts the Saudis, calls for death and destruction in Turkey, doesn't specifically mention Mosul, and says everything is going to plan. The tweets following this one give the gist of it:

 
New audio speech by al-Baghdadi just released, his first since December last year. Apparently he blasts the Saudis, calls for death and destruction in Turkey, doesn't specifically mention Mosul, and says everything is going to plan. The tweets following this one give the gist of it:



Sounds like this:

07-minister.jpg