Gun control

If anyone outside the US wants to really understand why there are not stricter gun control law, a big part of the answer is in this thread: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/cop-in-america-doing-a-bad-job-again.420394/page-98

A lot of minorities and other Democrat constituents do not support stricter gun control because people do not feel safe being protected by a system that is ruled by racist authority. Or to put it how it was put to me "When my nieghborhood gets a 10 minute response time from police and even then those police are racist I need a gun to protect my home." A lot of people, even despite the shootings, don't feel safe giving up their self-protection when the society hasn't come far enough to establishing fair institutional protection. So if you are a black man in Texas and you know the local sheriff is a racist cnut, you might not want to support strict gun control because then you feel less safe while the racist sheriff still has his guns.
 
Nanook said:
There’s an NRA in the UK. I don’t know anything about them but I doubt they’re as crazy as the American NRA.

https://nra.org.uk/
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I should have been a bit more clearer. I wasn't thinking about guns in particular. I was just wondering if there was an organisation like the NRA in the UK that wields as much influence over British politics/politicians?
 
RedPed said:
Does anybody know if we have anything similar to the NRA in the UK? I'm just trying to set a frame of reference for this organisation because I can't get my around the power they have over the government and why the US just can't say feck it to guns.
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coutnryide alliance?
 
oneniltothearsenal said:
If anyone outside the US wants to really understand why there are not stricter gun control law, a big part of the answer is in this thread: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/cop-in-america-doing-a-bad-job-again.420394/page-98

A lot of minorities and other Democrat constituents do not support stricter gun control because people do not feel safe being protected by a system that is ruled by racist authority. Or to put it how it was put to me "When my nieghborhood gets a 10 minute response time from police and even then those police are racist I need a gun to protect my home." A lot of people, even despite the shootings, don't feel safe giving up their self-protection when the society hasn't come far enough to establishing fair institutional protection. So if you are a black man in Texas and you know the local sheriff is a racist cnut, you might not want to support strict gun control because then you feel less safe while the racist sheriff still has his guns.
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very good point.
 
Despite all those who are denouncing the idea of prayers for the victims (do a Google search for “Thoughts and prayers are not enough” and see how many hits you get), I will continue to pray for the victims and their families and for an end to this mindless violence, and I hope you will, too. In fact, amid all the finger-pointing and blame-laying and repulsive attempts to turn these tragedies to political advantage before the bodies are even cold, I would posit that the lack of thought and prayers is probably the single biggest factor in what is behind them.
 
berbatrick said:
coutnryide alliance?
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Rooted around on their site. Didn't realise they're the guys that are trying to preserve hunting and shooting in our countrysides. They're nothing like the NRA though in terms of political clout and influence.
 
How long do we reckon before the next one big enough to make news elsewhere?

The smaller ones have either already happened or are happening right now but the next one that makes news?

I'll give it a week.
 
berbatrick said:
Despite all those who are denouncing the idea of prayers for the victims (do a Google search for “Thoughts and prayers are not enough” and see how many hits you get), I will continue to pray for the victims and their families and for an end to this mindless violence, and I hope you will, too. In fact, amid all the finger-pointing and blame-laying and repulsive attempts to turn these tragedies to political advantage before the bodies are even cold, I would posit that the lack of thought and prayers is probably the single biggest factor in what is behind them.
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Your thoughts and prayers will achieve nothing so why the feck should I try it?
 
berbatrick said:
Despite all those who are denouncing the idea of prayers for the victims (do a Google search for “Thoughts and prayers are not enough” and see how many hits you get), I will continue to pray for the victims and their families and for an end to this mindless violence, and I hope you will, too. In fact, amid all the finger-pointing and blame-laying and repulsive attempts to turn these tragedies to political advantage before the bodies are even cold, I would posit that the lack of thought and prayers is probably the single biggest factor in what is behind them.
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Didn’t know we had a republican politician on the Caf. We really do have every flavor of person on here don’t we :drool:
 
berbatrick said:
Despite all those who are denouncing the idea of prayers for the victims (do a Google search for “Thoughts and prayers are not enough” and see how many hits you get), I will continue to pray for the victims and their families and for an end to this mindless violence, and I hope you will, too. In fact, amid all the finger-pointing and blame-laying and repulsive attempts to turn these tragedies to political advantage before the bodies are even cold, I would posit that the lack of thought and prayers is probably the single biggest factor in what is behind them.
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Prayer literally does nothing.

It has never achieved anything. Not once, ever.

You may as well talk to your bedside table instead. It is literally the most redundant thing a person can do in these situations.
 
Grinner said:
Your thoughts and prayers will achieve nothing so why the feck should I try it?
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Exactly. It's so dumb, though I guess it comes from a good place at the end of the day.

But instead of talking to yourself you'd obviously be better off actually doing something tangible to help.
 
Abizzz said:
Carrying a gun in public has to become to be seen as the cowardly act it is. Killing Americans (or wanting the ability to do so fast, effortless) has to somehow become unpatriotic.


People saying it's too late now because 300m guns etc. also need a fecking head exam. What do they think Europe looked like 1945? Guns everywhere.
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Completely completely different culture. Getting the guns back is going to also cost a lot of lives, as it's their right and they will defend their rights and kill or be killed to do so.
 
Red_toad said:
Completely completely different culture. Getting the guns back is going to also cost a lot of lives, as it's their right and they will defend their rights and kill or be killed to do so.
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Then let them die for their outdated, ridiculous and clearly selfish 'right.' Screw them.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
Then let them die for their outdated, ridiculous and clearly selfish 'right.' Screw them.
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Are you going to step up and risk your life to recover said weapons? As that's what it's going to take.
By no means am I saying they're right, but I know they will defend their right to bear arms. It's an alien culture to myself, but I'm aware how precious weapons are to elements within the USA.
 
Red_toad said:
Are you going to step up and risk your life to recover said weapons? As that's what it's going to take.
By no means am I saying they're right, but I know they will defend their right to bear arms. It's an alien culture to myself, but I'm aware how precious weapons are to elements within the USA.
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If I was in America I most certainly would. These people need to see reason one way or another for the greater good of everyone.

But thankfully I live in Australia, a country that had a brave and compassionate enough PM and politicians that actually did some, straight away, after our most horrific mass shooting incident. Gun reform works.

Those that are against it are completely selfish. And it comes down to them or the well-being of the rest of the population, then they have to go.

Maybe I'm too emotionally invested in this. This whole discussion that never ever changes makes my blood boil.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
If I was in America I most certainly would. These people need to see reason one way or another for the greater good of everyone.

But thankfully I live in Australia, a country that had a brave and compassionate enough PM and politicians that actually did some, straight away, after our most horrific mass shooting incident. Gun reform works.

Those that are against it are completely selfish. And it comes down to them or the well-being of the rest of the population, then they have to go.

Maybe I'm too emotionally invested in this. This whole discussion that never ever changes makes my blood boil.
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There are plenty of people in Australia who feel the need to have weapons to 'defend' themselves. That culture/mentality exists in Australia as well.

I have Australian friends who have safes in their homes with legally held guns. As far as I know they have numerous hoops to jump through with regards to having them. But I know there are some complete feck wits that hold guns to hunt with.

As for the US, I fail to see why anyone outside the military/ law enforcement would need access to assault rifles. That should be the first thing outlawed in the US, maybe eliminating the more likely to kill weapons first and gradually phase in further restrictions. Whatever they try it’s going to cause a lot of issues either way.
 
It all comes down to the fact that vast numbers of Americans are scared... Of everything. Their government, the police, black people Asian people, Mexican people, gay people, trans people, socialists, communists, feminists, anyone who isn't a cis gendered straight white Christian male who salutes the flag. Not all by any means but a significantly large number that changing anything is am almost herculean task. I have no idea where to even begin.
 
Red_toad said:
Completely completely different culture. Getting the guns back is going to also cost a lot of lives, as it's their right and they will defend their rights and kill or be killed to do so.
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If the law changed it wouldn't be their right anymore.

It's a different culture but that doesn't make it impossible, or even harder. Those that get killed when their guns are attempted to be taken away from them are the very first people who shouldn't have guns in the first place. It's like saying you can't take away the crack from the crackhead because they might react.
 
Abizzz said:
If the law changed it wouldn't be their right anymore.

It's a different culture but that doesn't make it impossible, or even harder. Those that get killed when their guns are attempted to be taken away from them are the very first people who shouldn't have guns in the first place. It's like saying you can't take away the crack from the crackhead because they might react.
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Doesn’t make a difference what the law says, people don’t all blindly follow laws. It’s an ingrained culture of protection and fear.
Like I said before who’s going to want to remove guns and risk their lives to do so? It will be far from pretty and just as someone doesn’t want to give up a gun, shouldn’t mean they deserve to die first.
 
berbatrick said:
Despite all those who are denouncing the idea of prayers for the victims (do a Google search for “Thoughts and prayers are not enough” and see how many hits you get), I will continue to pray for the victims and their families and for an end to this mindless violence, and I hope you will, too. In fact, amid all the finger-pointing and blame-laying and repulsive attempts to turn these tragedies to political advantage before the bodies are even cold, I would posit that the lack of thought and prayers is probably the single biggest factor in what is behind them.
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Was this copied and pasted from the Fox News comments section?
 
Red_toad said:
Doesn’t make a difference what the law says, people don’t all blindly follow laws. It’s an ingrained culture of protection and fear.
Like I said before who’s going to want to remove guns and risk their lives to do so? It will be far from pretty and just as someone doesn’t want to give up a gun, shouldn’t mean they deserve to die first.
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Could just execute them by drone like the US does with similiar threats around the world?
 
Abizzz said:
Could just execute them by drone like the US does with similiar threats around the world?
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I’d imagine it’d go down very well the military killing American civilians on mass. Extreme measures won’t solve the issue. I mean why not just execute everyone who breaks the law by drone, much cheaper for society and zero chance of reoffending. Not an issue unless for you until you break a law you don’t agree with or are forced by your circumstances to.
 
Red Dreams said:
Look at what whoreson Hannity is proposing.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sean-hannity-force-schools-malls_n_5d48f308e4b0d291ed05a05d
Sean Hannity Proposes Massive Armed Force To ‘Surround’ All Schools And Stores
The Fox News host is calling for a volunteer army of armed ex-cops and soldiers that would be “everywhere.”
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Sounds like a great idea to populate schools with bitter, second amendment loving veterans. Preferably ones suffering from PTSD. There is no way that will ever go wrong. Ever.

Also, do conservatives not realize that in order to pay for stuff, the government has to collect money from taxes? They're not just there to steal from people you know. Haven't these morons ever played Sim City?
 
If mental ill-health is such a big factor in mass shootings...where are all the female shooters?
 
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