Get rid of VAR NOW! We want our game back! (...or not, some are happy)

[Rafaeldagold]

I (and 60% according to the poll) don't find robbery entertaining.

Robbery haha. So many drama queens here. At most there’s 5-10 terrible ref decisions a year. That doesn’t mean you ruin the game by bringing in a system not suitable for football. Even goals for United today I checked myself celebration wise in case some small thing happened in the build up.
It causes as many (if not more) problems than it solves.

 

[pocco]

My original concerns from when we first heard about it are coming true. Still heavily reliant on the opinion of somebody, which are still questionable. Breaks up play, ref leaning on the system etc. It's also ruining the goal celebrations as nobody is 100% sure anymore.

 

[Snow]

VAR is great. In the top women's league here in Iceland there are now 2 points separating the top 2 teams. They drew each other earlier in the season and had won every other match but last round one team drew their match. In that match they had a perfectly legal goal disallowed because of a wrongful offside call. That single goal might be the title decider for the season.

 

[The Irish Connection]

Var is class ye cnuts

 

[VP89]

Robbery haha. So many drama queens here. At most there’s 5-10 terrible ref decisions a year. That doesn’t mean you ruin the game by bringing in a system not suitable for football. Even goals for United today I checked myself celebration wise in case some small thing happened in the build up.
It causes as many (if not more) problems than it solves.

You don't watch a lot of football, do you

 

[Vato]

imagine not celebrating goals anymore because they might get ruled out a few seconds later than they did before there was VAR. It's honestly the stupidest argument I've ever heard.

 

[Le Red]

Robbery haha. So many drama queens here. At most there’s 5-10 terrible ref decisions a year. That doesn’t mean you ruin the game by bringing in a system not suitable for football. Even goals for United today I checked myself celebration wise in case some small thing happened in the build up.
It causes as many (if not more) problems than it solves.

5-10 terrible decisions a year?????
I bet even the rest of the anti VAR brigade would find that to be utter dross. Haha indeed.
Tech assist is present in every sport nowadays. I don't see why football should be the special snowflake.
This "I can't celebrate goals anymore" bullshit is laughable. Most goals don't have anything dubious in the build up and can be celebrated instantly. If you can't spot the dubious plays that will lead to a VAR check, that's on you. I don't have the greatest eye and still I can tell when a goal will undergo a review most of the time.
By the way, do you people even realize that, before VAR, there were also goals ruled out after they were scored? And sometimes it took minutes to make the call?
Like I said before, the antis keep omitting facts that don't fit their agenda, not to mention making up absurd stats, which your post is a good example of.

 

[Le Red]

imagine not celebrating goals anymore because they might get ruled out a few seconds later than they did before there was VAR. It's honestly the stupidest argument I've ever heard.

Exactly! It's like goals weren't rule out before VAR existed.
Not to mention that a lot of those goals were legit!

 

[VeevaVee]

I don't like the poll. I don't love it, but it's the right way.

 

[Orwellians]

Rice cleared the ball from the rebound. He denied another goal scoring opportunity.

Yellow card Rice? Nothing was clear about the decision, in fact many viewers were shown the goalie had 'left his line' by an inch, with the implication VAR had penalised this misdemeanor. Without a clear visual explanation many viewers without commentary (in noisy pubs, etc) are understandably left unconvinced. The point stands: VAR is currently failing to enhance the drama of clearly correcting poor play/calls. Early days still, and much to improve upon.

I do not bet, and dislike the way football and betting have become synonymous like horse racing. Are football fans ever neutral? My team won 4-0 yesterday and should be joint top, so VAR matters across the league. VAR must bring immediate clarity to the match in progress; your comment, mate, about Rice stopping a 'clear goal-scoring opportunity' is something I have not seen. Maybe Rice a straight red?

 

[Hound Dog]

It is remarkable that there are people against it in an extremely low scoring sport where one of the key rules (offside) is applied almost at random in a lot of situations due to the pace of play.

For a long time I wonderes how those poor assistant refs made decisions on close offside calls. Took me a while to realize that they guesstimate, which is unacceptable given the stakes.

 

[montpelier]

It is remarkable that there are people against it in an extremely low scoring sport where one of the key rules (offside) is applied almost at random in a lot of situations due to the pace of play.

For a long time I wonderes how those poor assistant refs made decisions on close offside calls. Took me a while to realize that they guesstimate, which is unacceptable given the stakes.

Yes, I think so. And back in olden times, they'd just whack the flag up most times, and usually catch someone or other. It was the main way of defending. And yet again, teams wouldn't get an awful lot go their way at Anfield or Old Trafford. ''Push out lads, he'll put his flag up.''

I suppose, eventually, it was decided that 25 times a game was a bit much.

 

[KirkDuyt]

Should rename this thread to, do you like change? Some people don't. They will moan. They did when the CD replaced the Casette and when the iPod replaced the discman.

You're old, get of the train.

 

[Judas]

VAR didn't stop me celebrating any of our goals yesterday, weird, I thought people were saying it would ruin every goal? It's almost like people are over dramatic.

 

[Thunderhead]

Yellow card Rice? Nothing was clear about the decision, in fact many viewers were shown the goalie had 'left his line' by an inch, with the implication VAR had penalised this misdemeanor. Without a clear visual explanation many viewers without commentary (in noisy pubs, etc) are understandably left unconvinced. The point stands: VAR is currently failing to enhance the drama of clearly correcting poor play/calls. Early days still, and much to improve upon.

I do not bet, and dislike the way football and betting have become synonymous like horse racing. Are football fans ever neutral? My team won 4-0 yesterday and should be joint top, so VAR matters across the league. VAR must bring immediate clarity to the match in progress; your comment, mate, about Rice stopping a 'clear goal-scoring opportunity' is something I have not seen. Maybe Rice a straight red?

No idea what you're going on about but Rice was penalised for encroachment not dagso

 

[R'hllor]

Who let Oscie make a new account?

Oh yea that was/is his name

 

[R'hllor]

Why people pretend that before VAR we never had situations where goal is scored, crowd is celebrating just to be scratched by a ref for some reason? Didnt hear a peep of QQ in those instances, it was always a making a laugh of those fans for celebrating a disallowed goal.

 

[montpelier]

Should rename this thread to, do you like change? Some people don't. They will moan. They did when the CD replaced the Casette and when the iPod replaced the discman.

You're old, get of the train.

Whereas youse FOR VAR lot are like a bizarre religious cult that believes VAR will MAGICALLY make EVERYTHING better.

And everyone knew cassettes were crap. So that isn't an argument even by the formidably low standards most of us are using here, as positions become even more entrenched, .

 

[montpelier]

Did we all see the Stockley Park yellow button & red button feature with G Nev & Jamie Clog?

Because I was thinking OK, to have VAR applied to everything that happens. You keep what they are doing now. A ref watches the main camera & clicks yellow for possible reference points - depending on following events (a goal, stuff like that) & presses the red button when he wants to intervene (as little as possible).

So what if there is a 3rd guy who simply shouts ''phase starts'' & ''phase over'' but they follow everything all over the pitch with the same system, protocols whatever?

You could render whole portions of play completely irrelevant but everything would be correct & fair, which is what we want more than anything else, isn't it?

 

[Sir Red Devil]

During West Ham - Man City game VAR made 3 incorrect decisions (City's 2nd goal should have counted while 3rd and 5th shouldn't have) but a lot of people defended those decisions saying "well it's a technology, if VAR decided so, then it must be 100% correct". But the reality is that, right now there is no technology behind VAR whatsoever, its just two guys behind the monitors who are watching replays and making subjective decisions and a lot of those decisions are incorrect. I want VAR to be 100% automated technology like Goal Line Technology, which makes 100% correct decisions all the time. Overall I am not against VAR even with the way it is now with the exception of offside decisions. In the video posted in the previous page, Andy Gray makes great points why the VAR as it is shouldn't be used to determinate whether the play was offside or not.

 

[montpelier]

During West Ham - Man City game VAR made 3 incorrect decisions (City's 2nd goal should have counted while 3rd and 5th shouldn't have) but a lot of people defended those decisions saying "well it's a technology, if VAR decided so, then it must be 100% correct". But the reality is that, right now there is no technology behind VAR whatsoever, its just two guys behind the monitors who are watching replays and making subjective decisions and a lot of those decisions are incorrect. I want VAR to be 100% automated technology like Goal Line Technology, which makes 100% correct decisions all the time. Overall I am not against VAR even with the way it is now with the exception of offside decisions. In the video posted in the previous page, Andy Gray makes great points why the VAR as it is shouldn't be used to determinate whether the play was offside or not.

What do you think of the 2 guys system if they stick to cutting out the clear & obvious whopper mistakes?

 

[Sir Red Devil]

What do you think of the 2 guys system if they stick to cutting out the clear & obvious whopper mistakes?

As I said I am not against VAR even in its current state because its better than nothing but its still far from perfect because there is no technology behind it, its completely based on subjective decisions of a few people.

I hope a real technology will be introduced in the future that would be 100% automated. That's what makes "Goal Line Technology" so great, it makes 100% correct decisions all the time and people can't argue about those decisions because they are absolutely objective unlike the decisions made by VAR.

 

[Orwellians]

No idea what you're going on about but Rice was penalised for encroachment not dagso

It is perfectly clear. Aguero missed the penalty. VAR judged re-take in a confusing manner, especially to those who without commentary/sound. This unexplained decision changed the final score, from 4-0 to 5-0. What don't you understand, City lad?

 

[montpelier]

As I said I am not against VAR even in its current state because its better than nothing but its still far from perfect because there is no technology behind it, its completely based on subjective decisions of a few people.

I hope a real technology will be introduced in the future that would be 100% automated. That's what makes "Goal Line Technology" so great, it makes 100% correct decisions all the time and people can't argue about those decisions because they are absolutely objective unlike the decisions made by VAR.

Ah I see, OK.

The full science fiction model for you then? - .

I completely agree with your point about moving from subjective ---> slightly better, but still subjective, though.

 

[Patience]

I was in the south stand yesterday - between the players' families and the directors boxes - and I didn't celebrate Rashford's brilliant second goal because I was convinced when Pogba played that clip over the top that Rashy was half-a-yard offside.

This is why I HATE VAR.

You can't live in the moment. You have to just put your fingernail in your mouth after a close-run goal like that is scored and then just wait... and wait..and wait while the ref sticks his finger in his ear, has a conversation with some guy in a truck and then finally points his hand to the half-way line to signal goal is allowed. Then, instead of celebrating like a hyper monkey, jumping up and down and hugging the bloke next to you, you just clench your fist and sit down.

VAR ruins fan enjoyment of the game.. we can't even celebrate goals because we know there is a guy in a truck somewhere looking back it it on replays before the referee can allow the goal. feck that.

 

[RobinLFC]

I was in the south stand yesterday - between the players' families and the directors boxes - and I didn't celebrate Rashford's brilliant second goal because I was convinced when Pogba played that clip over the top that Rashy was half-a-yard offside.

This is why I HATE VAR.

You can't live in the moment. You have to just put your fingernail in your mouth after a close-run goal like that is scored and then just wait... and wait..and wait while the ref sticks his finger in his ear, has a conversation with some guy in a truck and then finally points his hand to the half-way line to signal goal is allowed. Then, instead of celebrating like a hyper monkey, jumping up and down and hugging the bloke next to you, you just clench your fist and sit down.

VAR ruins fan enjoyment of the game.. we can't even celebrate goals because we know there is a guy in a truck somewhere looking back it it on replays before the referee can allow the goal. feck that.

I really pity you. How you can't celebrate a goal like that is completely beyond me.

 

[Patience]

I really pity you. How you can't celebrate a goal like that is completely beyond me.

Wow - you haven't understood a word I'm saying.

I am saying this is what the future of football will be like.

Once we get used to VAR, close-run offside calls like this one that lead to goals won't be celebrated in real time... we'll all turn to the ref, watch him poke his finger in his ear and wait... and wait until he signals that the goal is allowed.

Because of VAR, we won't live in the moment of the football match... we will wait with baited breath until the goal is allowed.

Goals like this one aren't given straight away like they used to be... there is a delay of about 30-seconds, by which time the euphoria of the goal being scored has been diluted.

VAR ruins the spectator's live enjoyment of the game.

 

[Sir Red Devil]

Well if officials are going to count every millimeter to decide whether the play was offside or not then please bring up the technology that's capable to fix the exact moment (down to milliseconds precise) the passer is releasing the ball. Otherwise its not fair and VAR was brought to make the game more fair in the first place. At the moment the best scenario would be to change the offside rule, so unless the attacker is not fully ahead of the defender then it's not an offside.

 

[sullydnl]

Wow - you haven't understood a word I'm saying.

I am saying this is what the future of football will be like.

Once we get used to VAR, close-run offside calls like this one that lead to goals won't be celebrated in real time... we'll all turn to the ref, watch him poke his finger in his ear and wait... and wait until he signals that the goal is allowed.

Because of VAR, we won't live in the moment of the football match... we will wait with baited breath until the goal is allowed.

Goals like this one aren't given straight away like they used to be... there is a delay of about 30-seconds, by which time the euphoria of the goal being scored has been diluted.

Except we know that's no the case from sports like rugby, where they celebrate a try and then celebrate a second time if the try is checked and allowed to stand. That's how people react in that situation. People aren't going to stop celebrating goals like dead eyed computers unless they're very odd people.

 

[brian017]

I thought Dan James was reserved in his celebration while he waited for it to be confirmed. Totally ruined the moment for him

 

[Escobar]

Wow - you haven't understood a word I'm saying.

I am saying this is what the future of football will be like.

Once we get used to VAR, close-run offside calls like this one that lead to goals won't be celebrated in real time... we'll all turn to the ref, watch him poke his finger in his ear and wait... and wait until he signals that the goal is allowed.

Because of VAR, we won't live in the moment of the football match... we will wait with baited breath until the goal is allowed.

Goals like this one aren't given straight away like they used to be... there is a delay of about 30-seconds, by which time the euphoria of the goal being scored has been diluted.

VAR ruins the spectator's live enjoyment of the game.

now that's a tad over dramatic, dont you think?

 

[montpelier]

I thought Rashford probably has to be offside too. What a pass though, fecking hell.

What about 3 or 4 refs who throw little flags down like they do in America?

Gawd, we used to laugh at the frenzied excitement & drama of ''there's a flag on the play'' - .

 

[RobinLFC]

Wow - you haven't understood a word I'm saying.

I am saying this is what the future of football will be like.

Once we get used to VAR, close-run offside calls like this one that lead to goals won't be celebrated in real time... we'll all turn to the ref, watch him poke his finger in his ear and wait... and wait until he signals that the goal is allowed.

Because of VAR, we won't live in the moment of the football match... we will wait with baited breath until the goal is allowed.

Goals like this one aren't given straight away like they used to be... there is a delay of about 30-seconds, by which time the euphoria of the goal being scored has been diluted.

VAR ruins the spectator's live enjoyment of the game.

You're wrong. Auomatic review is already implemented in other sports and no one doesn't celebrate because "it might get disallowed".

You'd be better off cancelling your season ticket ASAP if the above is really what you think of VAR.

 

[mancan92]

My original concerns from when we first heard about it are coming true. Still heavily reliant on the opinion of somebody, which are still questionable. Breaks up play, ref leaning on the system etc. It's also ruining the goal celebrations as nobody is 100% sure anymore.

Your right we definitely didn't celebrate rashford's goal.................

 

[montpelier]

You're wrong.

He can't be wrong though, can he, if that is the way it is for him?

edit - although how much of that is thinking it is offside & so on...

who knows for each event

 

[Adisa]

Anything that helps refs make more correct decisions is a good thing.

 

[RobinLFC]

He can't be wrong though, can he, if that is the way it is for him?

He can't be wrong about his feelings regarding VAR, no. But this:

Once we get used to VAR, close-run offside calls like this one that lead to goals won't be celebrated in real time...

Is wrong.

 

[Patience]

You're wrong. Auomatic review is already implemented in other sports and no one doesn't celebrate because "it might get disallowed".

You'd be better off cancelling your season ticket ASAP if the above is really what you think of VAR.

I am telling you that it will only take one or two instances of fans celebrating like lunatics, then being burnt 30-seconds later when the referee disallows it, for them to be hesitant of celebrating goals like Rashford's yesterday.

I'm not saying grounds will be quite.. far from it. I'm just saying we now have to wait and wait for goals like that to be officially given and that wait will cause hesitiation of enjoyment.

This is obvious.

It hasn't happened yet because we are at the very start of VAR, but after a while we'll get used to the fact that a goal isn't officially a goal until the referee has pointed to the half-way line.. and now, because we use VAR, there is a delay of about 30-seconds for goals like Rashford's yesterday to be officially awarded. Once we get used to this, and fans become more conscious of this, there will inevitably be a more diluted recation to these types of goals.

VAR is not a good tool for the enjoyment of the spectator.. whether in the ground or watching on TV... it will inevitably - once we get used to it - delay the live reaction.

See Man City's last-gasp goal against Spurs in the CL last season... GOAL - wild celebration - 30 seconds later utter despair because it's disallowed.

Well.. by late November this year, that will have happened a dozen or so times in the PL and then it will eventually seep, slowly but surely, into they mindset of the fan that they have to wait for the referee to allow the goal before it is officially awarded as a goal. SO, in instances like Rashford's goal yesterday, the ball will hit the net, the fans will celebrate but there will be discussions of 'that was off, wasn't it? VAR is going to call that offside". and then wait, wait, wait....

I have absolutely no doubt about this whatsoever. Once we all get use to VAR - we will get used to having to wait on confirmation of the goal. You don't want to be celebrating like a lunatic if in the back of your head you feel VAR may overturn a goal 30-seconds later.

 

[pocco]

Your right we definitely didn't celebrate rashford's goal.................

Obviously you still go mental but then you start to think it might be offside etc. There have been some very questionable decisions made by VAR already, it will definitely be a big discussion point throughout the season.

As a side not, how cringeworthy is the system in the stadium? The "VAR complete" voice that rings around the stadium after each decision sounds like something off Robocop. Might just be at Old Trafford though, not sure.

 

[RK]

I was in the south stand yesterday - between the players' families and the directors boxes - and I didn't celebrate Rashford's brilliant second goal because I was convinced when Pogba played that clip over the top that Rashy was half-a-yard offside.

This is why I HATE VAR.

You can't live in the moment. You have to just put your fingernail in your mouth after a close-run goal like that is scored and then just wait... and wait..and wait while the ref sticks his finger in his ear, has a conversation with some guy in a truck and then finally points his hand to the half-way line to signal goal is allowed. Then, instead of celebrating like a hyper monkey, jumping up and down and hugging the bloke next to you, you just clench your fist and sit down.

VAR ruins fan enjoyment of the game.. we can't even celebrate goals because we know there is a guy in a truck somewhere looking back it it on replays before the referee can allow the goal. feck that.

Totally agree.

Normally at the stadium you'd be able to have a quick glance at the ref and lino while celebrating like mad. Now you have to hold back.

The best thing about football is celebrating a goal. VAR is somewhat taking that away from us.

Last night I watched from home. I still celebrated properly because I'm not used to VAR yet, but each time I remembered earlier and earlier that it could be ruled out, and we'd be left feeling like mugs, empty and dead inside ... Was it a penalty? Did Martial wrestle Azpilicueta? Was Rashy offside? Was Zouma fouled?

When we have one ruled out, I expect more people will understand where we're coming from.