As an outsider, it's difficult to understand. Germans in general seem extremely historically aware, and I thought the links between AfD and the Neo-Nazis were actually pretty well documented, not just something that can be passed off as a vague accusation.
German elections on Sunday 23rd February 2025
- Thread starter VorZakone
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There's nothing vague about those links whatsoever. You'd really expect better from us
famous German optimism
I know it's a lot, but they're still effectively powerless and don't forget it's an incompetent, largely vibes driven bunch. I read some very defeatist post here that even if AfD doesn't take power now, they will in 4 years time or soon - maybe, but for now 'celebrate' that you had a great turnout and despite a massive effort put by the world's richest man, skewed algorithms promoting far right, general geopolitical landscape and conveniently timed terrorist attacks sponsored by your enemies the German society at large rejected far right. Politics are shit and will be shit, but it's good to enjoy shortcomings of the extremists, especially if they're in favourable positionCan any German explain why on earth it was Scholz and not Pistorius leading SPD into this election? Just seemed such an obvious decision to bring back some life into the party.
It's not that simple. Is the AfD far right? Oh yes for sure. Is it the ideological successor to the NSDAP? Definitely not.
For example there are Jewish groups supporting the AfD because the AfD is the only relevant anti-Islam party and by now they are more scared of antisemitic Muslims than of Nazis for example. So in that way you can make a point that people vote AfD because of their historical awareness, because they think other parties ignore that.
Obvious for everyone who isn't member of the SPD. Pistorius is part of the rightmost wing inside the SPD and therefore never would get the support of the left wing.
How conservative are CDU? When I see "Christian" as a part of the party name I get a horrible feeling in my stomach.
Are we talking anti-abortion, anti-gay, anti-trans etc? Or is it more "hippie" Christian i.e. "what would Jesus do?"
Are we talking anti-abortion, anti-gay, anti-trans etc? Or is it more "hippie" Christian i.e. "what would Jesus do?"
They'll beat United in 2 weeks
Forget the "Christian" part of their name, the party did so as well. They are a bit right of the middle, conservative but not right wing.
What you are probably thinking of are people you would find in the PBC (Partei bibeltreuer Christen - Party of Christians true to the bible). They are irrelevant.
Merkel voted against same-sex marriage, while getting credit internationally for legalising it. That sums up that party pretty much. Merz is more right-wing than her.
SPD knew they'll suffer a heavy loss, so didn't want to tie Pistorius to that, giving him a chance in four years. At least that's my theory
East German People's Republic when?
Holy shit.
That's comforting!
That’s a good explanation but it probably gives too much credit to (any) party apparatus in terms of thinking ahead.
AfD up to 20.2 now
Usually the left/right divide tends to be emphasized when you look at rural vs urban within a country. With Germany though it's striking to see how massively different East Germans vote.
Should Scholz have gone on Joe Rogan?
Interesting insight, thank you. As an observer with pretty much no knowledge of German politics outside of all the AFD madness in the run up to this - what has driven people to vote CDU ahead of the alternatives?
This was the CDU's second worst result of all time I think
Im not super knowledgable about either - but i seem to recall seeing the Dutch elections prior to the last sharing some similarities here? If that's the case, they may be able to lock out AfD through a coalition this time around, but perhaps it also is a warning shot for the next time around setting the stage for even more gains for them?
IMO it's a warning shot and a degree of normalization. If the next German coalition can't deliver and we get another couple of stabbings or cars driving into crowds, then it could turn uglier.
Don’t think she really had a choice. Both Union parties were clearly against it. So yes by North European values they are conservatives. But if you compare them to American politics or Mediterranean Europe I’d say they are progressive and liberal enough.
This is how they voted on gay marriage. 25% of their MPs actually supported it. When France passed gay marriage in 2013, the Center right party (Republicans or UMP back then) naturally voted against and only 3% of their MPs (6 out of 194) voted in favour…
The alternatives were all part of a failing government. They were the only viable opposition. I personally believe they should have done much better, considering the general resentment towards the SPD, Greens and FDP coalition.
I remember that all Muslim members of the Bundestag voted in favour of legalisation of gay marriage.Don’t think she really had a choice. Both Union parties were clearly against it. So yes by North European values they are conservatives. But if you compare them to American politics or Mediterranean Europe I’d say they are progressive and liberal enough.
This is how they voted on gay marriage. 25% of their MPs actually supported it. When France passed gay marriage in 2013, the Center right party (Republicans or UMP back then) naturally voted against and only 3% of their MPs (6 out of 194) voted in favour…
Not sure what difference that makes, the party mainly voted against same-sex marriage, which makes them conservatives. There is nothing progressive about the current CDU and if anything the party has shifted considerably to the right since Merkel left office. I don't really care how they compare to American politics, at best the US should be seen as a warning what's going to happen in Germany.
These kind of results and stuff like rainbow coalitions is why there still needs to be things etched out with Proportional Representation:
Having a center left, centrist and center right coalition government will mean that everything will get watered down to a point where the compromise benefits nobody and everyone is left unhappy and the stick will never shift.
Still remember the Green Party debacle with their Energy policy.
Having a center left, centrist and center right coalition government will mean that everything will get watered down to a point where the compromise benefits nobody and everyone is left unhappy and the stick will never shift.
Still remember the Green Party debacle with their Energy policy.
Young and first-time voters avoided the traditional centrist parties in significant numbers.
They avoided a far-right take-over for now, but its not built to last.
Social democracy will die in Europe, as it died in the US, it is inevitable.
Social democracy will die in Europe, as it died in the US, it is inevitable.
I finally figured out who Friedrich Merz reminds me of:
SocDems existed in the US in the first place?
It's always been Right Wing vs Center Right.
From a European perspective it's been two different shades of right wing. Historically democrats have been more on the right than the most right wing party in my country and that party has most often been in power.
Trump is thrilled about the result?
The CDU has ideological ties to the GOP. A delegation of CDU politicians once visited De Santis and raved about him later.
It kinda existed until the 80s, did it not? May not ever had universial healthcare, but on most other fronts, it wasn't that much different from Europe, i don't think.
What happens in the US tends to carry over to Europe though, which is a bad sign in of itself.
80's was peak Reaganism which is the last thing I would consider Social Democracy to be honest.