Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended

Mike Smalling said:
Season 7 was still crap. It included possibly the worst episode of the whole show - episode 6, 'Beyond the wall'. It made absolutely no sense at all.
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I still maintain that, as amazing as it was, the final episode of Season 6 fecked everything up.

Dany is on her way with three dragons, Dorne in support and her army of Dothraki and Unsullied. Cersei just got rid of her enemies but at the cost of blowing up the church in a heavily religious city. How is Cersei going to get out of this muddle?!

The answer; she isn't. She's screwed. Either Dany toasts her in a second or the zealous peasants revolt.

Unless the writers start making crap up that goes against the essence of the show just simply to make things easier for a character.
 
Shamana said:
Sansa tried to sabotage him though by declaring to everyone at the council that he's impotent. Real mastermind she is.
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Will not top onion knight telling the unsullied to start their own house though
That's 4D chess
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Ah, of course. When you play the Game of Thrones you either win or you scratch your arse for eight seasons and fall into the position.
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Or end up like Jon Snow, completely fecking impotent by the last season.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
I still maintain that, as amazing as it was, the final episode of Season 6 fecked everything up.

Dany is on her way with three dragons, Dorne in support and her army of Dothraki and Unsullied. Cersei just got rid of her enemies but at the cost of blowing up the church in a heavily religious city. How is Cersei going to get out of this muddle?!

The answer; she isn't. She's screwed. Either Dany toasts her in a second or the zealous peasants revolt.

Unless the writers start making crap up that goes against the essence of the show just simply to make things easier for a character.
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That's the moment that Cersei should have invited all the common folk in to stop any chances of being torched and they could have had her play up that Dany and her demon dragons are here to continue the work of the mad king.
I mean it could have worked if told correctly

If anything given Tyrions rant about everybody in KL in season 4 he should have been happy to see them all burn
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Season 7 had the last intrigue plot of the show, even if it was absolutely terrible. When Littlefinger was gone and Varys did absolutely bugger all apart from become a dick joke the last two people who were playing the Game were gone.
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This scene though. fecking dreadful imo

 
MaxiPaxi said:
This scene though. fecking dreadful imo

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I hated it so much when it happened but after Season 8 I should've appreciated it more. It's like turning your nose up at a soggy bacon sandwich when you don't have the foresight to realise you're going to die of starvation in the not too distant future.
 
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Mr Pigeon said:
I hated it so much when it happened but after Season 8 I should've appreciated it more. It's like turning your nose up at a soggy bacon sandwich when you don't have the foresight to realise you're going to die of starvation in the not too distant future.
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Yeah I guess. Still, the fact that they needed to play out the whole scene with Arya walking in like she did just shows you how far the writing had fallen by that point.
 
Little finger was a great character, one of my favourites in the first few seasons. Someone who couldn't really be outsmarted and always appeared 5 steps ahead. Until the later seasons where he seems like a love sick puppy with the IQ of a carrot.
 
MaxiPaxi said:
Yeah I guess. Still, the fact that they needed to play out the whole scene with Arya walking in like she did just shows you how far the writing had fallen by that point.
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Oh yeah. And the "...Lord Baelish" was the tropiest of tropes. From the man who wrote Troy, I guess.
 
So almost 2 years since s8 and HBO go and release a season 8 trailer :lol:

 
It really grinds me gears when people make a throwaway comment about 'how bad the ending of GoT was'. No you dipshit. It noticeably declined the very minute the writers started to diverge from GRRM's written masterpiece, way before the end. It just had some great moments still to carry the rest.
 
Part of me wants to wipe my memory and rewatch GOT again, but the other part of me says I’d have to rewatch S5-8 again after the amazingness of S1-4.

The wheels started to fall off in S5 when Stannis died the way he did and how badly setup it was, and S5 is where GRRM’s manuscripts end and D&D have to actually write when up to that point they’d been excellent at adapting it to the medium of TV.

It sadly falls into cliched, plot armour laden, CGI porn, action based pile of meh. The best parts of GOT are the character interactions, political powerplays and power struggle. Don’t make it like LOTR because even GRRM has said LOTR did it the best and anyone trying to copy it, will pale in comparison to it.

Some of the major ending plot points I could have seen happening but they were executed so poorly. The White Walkers aspect felt like “oh shit, how do we deal with them?” plus I felt the ending could have been more pyrrhic. It looks like Westeros was back to normal in the final scenes when it should have been a desolate wasteland with the bittersweetness of the survivors slowly rebuilding everything back up.

I did like the concept of having Bran/3EC being the King, since it’s a commentary point that the ideal ruler of a kingdom is a god figure who is genuinely incorruptible, has no ties to family (since Bran is not really a Stark now) and can see every event that has ever taken place and may ever take place (can see every deceit and sleight of hand action). It’s an impossible concept in the real world but is possible in the world of fiction. Deceit and corruption concerning power seems impossible to avoid and the only way that you can truly have the system working is a completly unbiased deity running it, which itself is impossible.
 
Can't believe they included a 'muh queen' line :lol: but I guess it's hard to find a scene with Jon Snow where he says anything else.
 
@Chairman Steve I agree with your assessment. It became a completely different type of show - no longer about shades of grey and political intrigue but rather high fantasy with lots of action and dragons and plot armor.

I don’t actually mind the latter in it’s own right, but it’s simply not what GoT was, and what made it so great initially.
 
Vidic_In_Moscow said:
It really grinds me gears when people make a throwaway comment about 'how bad the ending of GoT was'. No you dipshit. It noticeably declined the very minute the writers started to diverge from GRRM's written masterpiece, way before the end. It just had some great moments still to carry the rest.
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The ending really sucked
 
Everyone lost.

HBO lost. Sad state of affairs when they feel the need to milk a cash cow that was butchered and buried years ago.

D&D lost. Sacked from star wars before they could even get started. Poetic justice for these pathetic pricks.

Martin lost. His entire legacy is ruined because he's the laziest cnut ever. Why start something if you're never going to complete it? feck you clown.

The fans lost. Imagine if we had a season 9 last year and a season 10 in the making this year. It would have eased lockdown pains for millions of people. We would have spent endless hours on insane theories, predictions and discussions.

Pisses me off that we had this one thing uniting the world and none of the decision makers could see the real value it brought to the world.
 
Funnily enough I started rewatching this last week. I’m up to The Door episode as we speak and it really has been incredible so far.
 
Samid said:
Everyone lost.

HBO lost. Sad state of affairs when they feel the need to milk a cash cow that was butchered and buried years ago.

D&D lost. Sacked from star wars before they could even get started. Poetic justice for these pathetic pricks.

Martin lost. His entire legacy is ruined because he's the laziest cnut ever. Why start something if you're never going to complete it? feck you clown.

The fans lost. Imagine if we had a season 9 last year and a season 10 in the making this year. It would have eased lockdown pains for millions of people. We would have spent endless hours on insane theories, predictions and discussions.

Pisses me off that we had this one thing uniting the world and none of the decision makers could see the real value it brought to the world.
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Great summary.
 
The pacing in the earlier seasons was so good, the story was progressing each episode but not at the all-out ridiculous pace of later seasons. The way Ned investigated & found out about Gendry & Robert’s bastards then uncovered the truth about the Lannisters, then confronts Cersei leading to his arrest & ultimately Joffrey’s power play - just brilliant drama over several episodes. The action sequences got bigger & better in the later seasons, but IMO the story suffered & we ended up with rushed nonsense like season 8.
 
It’s crazy how much of a cultural impact this show had. You literally couldn’t get away from it. I still remember Arya Stark appearing in the NQ in the days after The Long Night aired. To have built something up to be so big and suddenly think nah cba, it’s laughable now. The final two seasons were indeed terrible but the finale was the icing on the cake, it’s as if they wanted to sabotage their own legacy.
 
Vidic_In_Moscow said:
It really grinds me gears when people make a throwaway comment about 'how bad the ending of GoT was'. No you dipshit. It noticeably declined the very minute the writers started to diverge from GRRM's written masterpiece, way before the end. It just had some great moments still to carry the rest.
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Happens on Reddit a lot, because it's an easy low effort way to get karma. Especially r/freefolk

"Season 8 was bad Iol" +32k upvotes. Yes we know, well done for your insightful post.

"It should've been ten seasons" +32k upvotes. Great, why not twenty seasons? Care to elaborate on how you would write it for ten seasons? No? Well feck off then.

"D&D kinda forgot about this character (usually Quaithe)" +32 upvotes. Yeah, they forgot about her because she does literally nothing of value throughout the story. She appears in three dream sequences, out of four subsequent books. fecking Moonboy is mentioned more than her.

D&D properly fecked up but they put more effort into the shitshow they gave us than the majority of the complaints that folk have.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Happens on Reddit a lot, because it's an easy low effort way to get karma. Especially r/freefolk

"Season 8 was bad Iol" +32k upvotes. Yes we know, well done for your insightful post.

"It should've been ten seasons" +32k upvotes. Great, why not twenty seasons? Care to elaborate on how you would write it for ten seasons? No? Well feck off then.

"D&D kinda forgot about this character (usually Quaithe)" +32 upvotes. Yeah, they forgot about her because she does literally nothing of value throughout the story. She appears in three dream sequences, out of four subsequent books. fecking Moonboy is mentioned more than her.

D&D properly fecked up but they put more effort into the shitshow they gave us than the majority of the complaints that folk have.
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Yeah it's such a trendy critique. It's like what you'd expect Gwenyth Paltrow to say about it 'oh ya ya got ending so bad ya hahaha'. When people just blase say it had a bad ending it lets me know what kind of person they are on so many levels. I don't want to get drawn into it because it'll upset me but these people don't even see how they turned one of the greatest characters; Sandor Clegane, into some caricature who has lines worthy of a sitcom on comedy central. They butchered my boy.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Happens on Reddit a lot, because it's an easy low effort way to get karma. Especially r/freefolk

"Season 8 was bad Iol" +32k upvotes. Yes we know, well done for your insightful post.

"It should've been ten seasons" +32k upvotes. Great, why not twenty seasons? Care to elaborate on how you would write it for ten seasons? No? Well feck off then.

"D&D kinda forgot about this character (usually Quaithe)" +32 upvotes. Yeah, they forgot about her because she does literally nothing of value throughout the story. She appears in three dream sequences, out of four subsequent books. fecking Moonboy is mentioned more than her.

D&D properly fecked up but they put more effort into the shitshow they gave us than the majority of the complaints that folk have.
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Tbf it doesn't happen here as most of those points have been discussed eg how it could be a ten season show

Comparing this place to another is a bit weird

And to vidic point, the ending was bad because of the delivery. Most disnt have a problem with the destination of some of the characters, the issue was the journey
 
Vidic_In_Moscow said:
Yeah it's such a trendy critique. It's like what you'd expect Gwenyth Paltrow to say about it 'oh ya ya got ending so bad ya hahaha'. When people just blase say it had a bad ending it lets me know what kind of person they are on so many levels. I don't want to get drawn into it because it'll upset me but these people don't even see how they turned one of the greatest characters; Sandor Clegane, into some caricature who has lines worthy of a sitcom on comedy central. They butchered my boy.
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I'm the same. Sandor, Tormund, even Cersei and Tyrion just became generic fan favourites with a catchphrase that was just missing the canned laughter (Cersei being the uber evil, oh I love to hate her look at how evil she is drinking her wine and cackling at the moon, villain instead).

But I'm going through the books again and it's tiring at times. So many characters who just stand around doing feck all and, if they're lucky, getting a single line of dialogue each chapter. And the repeated phrases....fecking hell. If I read Jaime thinking about Ser Osmund, Lancel and Moonboy ploughing Cersei one more time I'll probably chop off my hand.

The difference, of course, is that I'm going through the books again. I have no interest in returning to the show. Even if GRRM finally releases the last two books and it's just two pieces of paper that, when joined together, show a valyrian steel armoured direwolf riding on the back of Drogon shouting "I'm a dog woof" it'll still be better than the show. Maybe that was the point of the show all along? To temper fan expectations for the books? A ploy as grand as anything in ASOIAF.
 
Sylar said:
Tbf it doesn't happen here as most of those points have been discussed eg how it could be a ten season show

Comparing this place to another is a bit weird

And to vidic point, the ending was bad because of the delivery. Most disnt have a problem with the destination of some of the characters, the issue was the journey
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Not sure I compared Reddit to this place?
 
To my death I'll still maintain that the last shot of Season 6 was the breaking point for the show, and when it all went to shit. All because they wanted an epic ending to the season.

Cersei has blown up the Sept of Baelor, Jon is King in the North, Dany is coming over with her absolutely ma-hoo-sive army, Theon and Yara are bringing the Iron Fleet to fight for her, and Dorne have also pledged for the Dragon Queen.

It's great as a "ooooh shit! Cersei's gonna be screwed" hype moment. But that's exactly the problem. She is absolutely and totally fecked. The religious fantastics that we know make up a large portion of King's Landing, the poor and downtrodden, the remaining Reachlanders, almost everyone already hates her, and on top of that she's also got to deal with an unstoppable army. At this point they had to go completely against the whole "actions have consequences" cornerstone of the show, and have rational characters start making irrational decisions, just so she wasn't turned to mush in the first 60 minutes.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
To my death I'll still maintain that the last shot of Season 6 was the breaking point for the show, and when it all went to shit. All because they wanted an epic ending to the season.

Cersei has blown up the Sept of Baelor, Jon is King in the North, Dany is coming over with her absolutely ma-hoo-sive army, Theon and Yara are bringing the Iron Fleet to fight for her, and Dorne have also pledged for the Dragon Queen.

It's great as a "ooooh shit! Cersei's gonna be screwed" hype moment. But that's exactly the problem. She is absolutely and totally fecked. The religious fantastics that we know make up a large portion of King's Landing, the poor and downtrodden, the remaining Reachlanders, almost everyone already hates her, and on top of that she's also got to deal with an unstoppable army. At this point they had to go completely against the whole "actions have consequences" cornerstone of the show, and have rational characters start making irrational decisions, just so she wasn't turned to mush in the first 60 minutes.
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I'm still hurtin too bro
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Not sure I compared Reddit to this place?
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True you didn't out right compare it but you did bring up another place with regards to the original point made on the criticism towards the final season?

Unless it was just a rant on another place and you felt it was most apt, then nevermind carry on :)
 
Sylar said:
True you didn't out right compare it but you did bring up another place with regards to the original point made on the criticism towards the final season?

Unless it was just a rant on another place and you felt it was most apt, then nevermind carry on :)
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Haha, yeah I was just using it as a springboard for a Reddit rant. I suspected @Vidic_In_Moscow was also talking about general discussions and not about the Caf.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
To my death I'll still maintain that the last shot of Season 6 was the breaking point for the show, and when it all went to shit. All because they wanted an epic ending to the season.

Cersei has blown up the Sept of Baelor, Jon is King in the North, Dany is coming over with her absolutely ma-hoo-sive army, Theon and Yara are bringing the Iron Fleet to fight for her, and Dorne have also pledged for the Dragon Queen.

It's great as a "ooooh shit! Cersei's gonna be screwed" hype moment. But that's exactly the problem. She is absolutely and totally fecked. The religious fantastics that we know make up a large portion of King's Landing, the poor and downtrodden, the remaining Reachlanders, almost everyone already hates her, and on top of that she's also got to deal with an unstoppable army. At this point they had to go completely against the whole "actions have consequences" cornerstone of the show, and have rational characters start making irrational decisions, just so she wasn't turned to mush in the first 60 minutes.
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I think this is fair especially the last bit with regards to s6. From that shot there was no way cersei had a chance

They could have salvaged it however in s7 with the arrival of the golden company and eurons fleet if he had enough backing (it did seem to grow from s6 to s8)

But that's another issue with consistency. Another of course being the dothraki being wiped then it being 'half wiped out' to then looking like thousands before only a few?
 
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