It's okay, but they shouldn't have do the bit with him surviving dragon fire and should've planned/showed Arya's appearance better. I liked the episode though.
Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended
- Thread starter ha_rooney
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I remember that he's immune to a regular fire but didn't remember that bit about him surviving a dragon fire before. Maybe I should rewatch it.
I feel sorry for the amateur scriptwriters in here, who must have never enjoyed a Die Hard movie.
Personally, I think the Humans should have lost the Winterfell fight but were able to retreat. They kill several of the white walkers leaving only a few plus the Night King remaining (whos Dragon dies). As the humans are using dragon glass against them the dead the Humans kill can't be raised. But the Night King could have raised all the humans that died at Winterfell to restock his army. Then you have a big final battle at Kings Landing with the wildfire and everything left.
The way its happened in the TV Show was a cheap way to do it as no doubt it was super expensive to do all of the effects for this episode so they've rid themselves of the whitewalker expense at least. I just don't think you can big up this enemy for 8 seasons then have them defeated straight away in the first battle. I would be surprised if George (if he ever finishes the books) does the same.
As for this episode, on reflection and having slept on it, its probably one of my most hated episodes in terms of story telling in the entire show. Cinematic experience its up there with some of the best, but the storytelling for me was terrible. Also starting to suspect that Arya is going to be a much bigger player in the final than some expected as she got a lot of screen time in this episode.
Any one else thought the sound was absolutely shit 3/4 of the episode
This man singlehandedly safed the world from the WW. It's magic. Get over it.
Arya was probably hidden amongst the WW, as one of them.
You need their faces to take their disguise. You can't take a WW's disguise because once they die they explode into nothing
I know its a great episode in terms of battle for a TV show, but am I the only one to think Helmsdeep & Pelennor fields were better than this?
Maybe there is something else to it. Does she literally take the face of the one WHO's face she puts on herself.
Can people name the spoilers when using material from the previews please. Keep trying to read normal speculation and getting certainties due to people watching previews.
feck 'em. We're entertained that's all that matters!
Literally a case of, "It didn't go down how I wanted so it's poor writing," or "This is exactly how I imagined, bit predictable and boring" these days. Not just with this, with everything popular.
Also, one more thing was than we saw a lot of blood coming out from the whites, whereas previously, as far as I can remember, they are just bony. Am I missing something?
Helmsdeep sucks.
I could be wrong but my interpretation was the faces are basically masks. As soon as she puts one on, she becomes that person in physical form. The masks are physical objects, thats been clear from the start and given how she was told to prepare bodies back during her training it's suggested although I don't think ever said that they basically cut the faces off ala classic film Face Off.
The irony being, if it went down as they wished, it would be predictable, even if just to them
Why people cannot accept arya rikimaru-ed the night king. Simples
It really didn't. Both the Night King and Arya can overcome any obstacle, until the writers decide they (or one of them) can't. It's the same lazy writing that made Ramsey Bolton such an annoying and ultimately boring villain. You knew he would continue to succeed, until they decided: now is the time you die.
Maybe the Night King hired the Faceless Men to fight for him and Jaqen H'ghar came along with 100,000 Faceless Men who put on wight masks except for seven of them who all put on the faces of the WW's but to do that they needed to take their faces off whilst they were still alive so Jaqen told the Night King he was going back to Essos to find Syrio Forel and hire him to fight a WW and just slice his face off then they made copies of the face and gave the faces to the Faceless Men who were all with the Night King when he went to kill Bran but what he didn't realise was that Jaqen hadn't actually gone to Essos to find Syrio because he was actually Syrio all along and in reality he went to Arya and gave her one of the WW faces and told her that she could sneak past him and he wouldn't mention it to the Night King which is why Arya was able to sneak past that WW but unfortunately because the faces the Faceless Men were wearing were WW faces the faces exploded into ice but this created a chain reaction which killed all of the Faceless Men as well but it's ok because what Arya didn't know was that Jaqen had been in King's Landing earlier and had killed Theon and taken his face which is why he said he wanted to go to Winterfell to fight for the Starks and set himself up so that he could be close to Bran because the big twist is that Jaqen killed Bran and took his face and is actually the one sitting in the wheelchair when the Night King shows up which is amazing until you realise that Arya knew about this because Bran had looked into the future and knew it was coming so he warned Arya and so when Jaqen came to give Arya the WW face Arya killed and took Jaqen's face which she then took off to reveal that she was the Night King all along.
Well, I love Lord of The Rings. It's difficult to tell though given that Helmsdeep and Pelennor fields kept cutting to Frodo/Sam storyline which changed the pacing. This never happened with this episode, it was completely devoted to the battle. I didn't get any of those tingly back hair moments that I do in Lotr, but I was a tense mess for the first 45mins of this episode until I clocked on that it was clear the humans would win and nobody major was going to die.
The issue isn't who killed the NK or how, for me its more that the motivations of the WWs weren't really explained beyond the "they want to wipe the memory of the world" sh*t. Also, they spent so long telling us about Bran's powers but ultimately he made zero use of them. What is his role going forward now? He should have perished along with the NK in the final battle and the battle between the dead and the living should have been the final battle. The show has shown how Jon is the most suited to being the ultimate ruler because he is someone who prioritizes the bigger battle over petty politics and recognizes the futility of human conflict in face of an existential threat, but now they have made it out as though petty politics are more important than human survival and painted Jon as a moron.
The only way they utilize Jon now (unless he becomes Dany's sidekick) is if he turns against Dany and fights for the Iron Throne, hence himself getting involved in those petty politics he denounced for so long. Essentially, they have rendered Jon and Bran's story arcs as useless.
The only way they utilize Jon now (unless he becomes Dany's sidekick) is if he turns against Dany and fights for the Iron Throne, hence himself getting involved in those petty politics he denounced for so long. Essentially, they have rendered Jon and Bran's story arcs as useless.
I’m convinced they’ve never enjoyed anything at all.
Well, if we're looking at the bigger picture. Daenerys will be left with very few unsullied, no dothraki, two dragons (both of which looked wounded), friendzone died. She has no army left. They might try and bring the Second Sons over but given they made a huge deal about not having a fleet for several seasons it would be somewhat typical if they summoned some up for the Second Sons to bring over much needed reinforcements for Daenerys.
Meanwhile Jon and Co have even less left. They've got whatever remains from Winterfell, I imagine if they do march South they'll probably get reinforced by the Tullys but that won't be enough to fight back Cersei. I can imagine Tyrion might try and buy out the Golden Company though and have them turn on Cersei, thats the type of thing Tyrion would do convincing the Iron Bank that Daenerys is more than capable of destroying Cersei.
Ultimately, right now Cersei is unstopable. She has far too many troops to be stopped by Daenerys and Jon combined. Even with two dragons.
None of that was enough for her to suddenly go from washing corpses, being beaten with a stick and getting half killed by the world's shittest assassin to being able to take out an entire house and then kill TNK. Her training was bollocks.
Even in this episode she goes from struggling to sneak past a bunch of wights in the library to being able to hide in front of a whole bunch of them, all the White Walkers and fool TNK himself.
Big 40 minute behind the scenes video showing the making of the episode has just been released, for anyone interested.
I don't know how to put stuff in the spoiler tag but I think I can say this without it as it doesn't take a genius to figure out that we know the good guys in some form are gonna beat Cersei. Yes, logistically they shouldn't but we know there will be some shenanigans and ultimately she'll be a goner. But my point is Cersei/Euron being the final evil to vanquish shouldn't be how this series should be ending. They have built 7 seasons into showing the futility of human conflict in the face of this huge threat from beyond the wall, but now ultimately they are gonna end with a mad pirate and an alcoholic pregnant woman as the final endgame? Its kind of a let down for me and as I stated it makes the arcs of certain characters mean very little.
I honestly can't imagine what sort of on screen scenes you'd be looking for to establish a character's credentials as a supernatural mega assassin beyond what we got. She got half killed by what is established as one of the greatest assassin's in the World, killed her and was trained by the World's greatest assassin who serves a magic death God across many hours of screen time. They have continually reinforced her abilities since that point. I'm not sure what your looking for. They put time into setting her up to be what she is. She does a pretty good job of sneaking past hordes of zombies I'd say, but irrespective of that, Melisandre clearer inspires confidence in her in the scene that sets up Arya's attack. It's not Shakespeare, granted, but it's hardly deus ex machina either.
If Sansa had done it, I'd take your point.
I never saw the threat beyond the wall as being the point of the show. It's always been about the political intrigue and examination of humanity (which the dead were a metaphor and plot device to support). I'm glad it ends man vs man...the politics and war are always the bit I've enjoyed most.
She'd just bashed her head in and was panicking and even so we were concentrated on her and she went by unnoticed in the library, even dispatching one silently. It's also her whole character, a ninja assassin that no one notices and can sneak up on people. Even so she didn't fool the Night King, he spun around and grabbed her.
I hope this is revealed in the final episode!!!
it should have been the NK ending up on the iron throne. it would have been a poignant metaphor that despite all our politics and ambitions and pointless human ambitions and needs, in the end it is all meaningless and death inevitably conquers all.
shame they didn't bring in lars von trier for the final season.
shame they didn't bring in lars von trier for the final season.
It was a great episode... while it was happening. But the ending just left me feeling disappointed. They build the White Walkers up for years as this great existential threat, repeatedly making the point that it doesn't really matter who holds the throne, and that people aren't really the threat, they have to fight together, etc. And then, with three episodes to go... nope, guess they're dead.
That should have been the final episode, or second to last. Now we get three episodes of not-as-clever-as-she-thinks Cersei as the big bad again? It just feels pointless. I barely feel any need to watch the final episodes.
That should have been the final episode, or second to last. Now we get three episodes of not-as-clever-as-she-thinks Cersei as the big bad again? It just feels pointless. I barely feel any need to watch the final episodes.
So... uhh what is the point of Bran? I was laughing my ass off when he’s like hurr durr “Im going now” and wakes up having done nothing 
. He’s just a meme and I love it.
Overall, it was a good episode. Not a fan of how they dealt with the NK, too anticlimactic for my taste.
. He’s just a meme and I love it.Overall, it was a good episode. Not a fan of how they dealt with the NK, too anticlimactic for my taste.
Don't get me wrong, the war and politics are some of the best parts of the show, but they invested quite a bit in these magical elements. For instance, there is no NK in the books and the WKs aren't given anything close to the coverage they get in the show. So why do all that for the show and then dismiss it as a side plot? What is Bran's role in all this politics now? To each his own at the end of the day, but I must say, for the first time in GOT, the ending of the episode left me feeling a little bummed. I've never been one to critically analyse pieces of fiction and ask why they aren't realistic so some of the complaints people had for previous season don't really ring with me, but I did end up feeling underwhelmed with this episode.
First I don’t think they knew the size of the Ww army.
Falling back into a castle is always a last defensive resort
Meeting the enemy in battle has always been in the field whereby depending on the numbers and the way the battle is going they can maybe flank the enemy etc
There was no one coming to rescue them so they’d have nowhere to fall back to if they just started in the castle
Would they even have all fitted in the castle?
What if the NK had just knocked the walls down like the Great Wall? They’d have flooded in. At least this way they met them on their terms
So yeah it made sense to me because I’m obviously a military commander
Exactly this.
I disagree. They did build the walkers up but although they were the most serious threat, they were always the side threat. The predominant focus has always been the throne.
Moreover the show caveated it can all be over from one stab to the NK after Jon managed to take out shit loads of whites after killing their main man. We knew they can be beat this way, so we shouldn't be disappointed that's how it went.
Also we don't have long left. It was always going to go down to one epic showdown between the two sides and we got the battle we wanted. Surprised people can still have issues.
My theory is that Cersei will be defeated and Danaerys will become the main threat, she will eventually win over the Golden Company and bring over some additional forces from Essos, including all the other red women (witches of fire and maybe we will actually see Elephants). She'll be a bigger threat than the NK and Cersei combined and Jon Snow will be the one to vanquish her and bring balance to the world.. as first they destroyed Ice, then they destroyed the human threat in Cersei and then vanquished fire. The threat all along wasn't the Long Night but the Long Summer... it has been said that this is the Longest Summer, and it would explain why the NK decided to attack now after all these years as he saw Danaerys and fire as potentially as a permanent threat i.e. the Land of Always Summer. The only way to break the wheel was destroy all these spokes on the wheel.
Anything less than that, and if it really is just about doing away with Cersei.. is just too simplistic and anti-climax IMO.
Anything less than that, and if it really is just about doing away with Cersei.. is just too simplistic and anti-climax IMO.
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I cannot fathom why people feel the need to give away spoilers for Endgame in a Game of Thrones thread (or any thread), its such a asshole thing to do.
I disagree, the pilot of the series had the White Walkers as the dominant threat. "Winter is Coming" has been the main catchphrase for the entire show, the Show imo has always been about the White Walkers, most of the Seasons have ended with them as the final scene. Given the amount of transporting that happened last season, we'd still have more than enough time, its still 3 feature length films to go.