French Elections 2017

langster said:
Ahh, ok, thanks. It's certainly seeming that yet again Russia is involved in at the very least minor hacking and internet manipulation. WikiLeaks is ever-present yet again too. It really does seem this is the future for the Western World regarding elections and Russian interference. I just wonder how long it is going to go on for before there is a retaliation?
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What was interesting was that the documents on the offshore account was put on 4chan just 2 hours before the debate started, so the fact that Le Pen was briefed on the claims very quickly was interesting.

Either it was a coincidence that she was told about this document which was unverified and potentially fabricated (at the time, as now the document has been proven to be a forgery) as she was preparing for the debate or she was aware what was in this document before the document was published on 4chan and knew it was going to be leaked and was ready to mention it.

Because she refused to keep her mouth shut at the time til the claim was verified, 16 million voters watching the debate heard about these fake allegations within a few hours of this leak on 4chan.

The timing of that leak just seems dodgy.
 

The timing of that leak just seems dodgy

In what way do you mean dodgy ?

If it was meant to deceive, then I'd have stupid as a more accurate description.

The granny banger has a zillion faults - but he's way too smart to be caught out with hot money.....
 
Full bodied red said:
The timing of that leak just seems dodgy

In what way do you mean dodgy ?

If it was meant to deceive, then I'd have stupid as a more accurate description.

The granny banger has a zillion faults - but he's way too smart to be caught out with hot money.....
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The fact that its leaked so soon to the debate and that someone told Le Pen about it, whilst she would have been at the debate venue and preparing.

4chan timed the leak just before the debate and hoped it would have been mentioned in the debate for maximum attention. It just happens to occur that their gamble paid off with Le Pen mentioning it to 16 million voters.
 
Jippy said:
Bloody hell, a French MP dropped dead on stage while giving a speech supporting Macron.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3497008/french-mp-corinne-ehrel-dies-macron-campaign/
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Wow. So sad. Don't look at the replies to the tweets if you want to keep your sanity. Scum.

On a slight tangent (the sidebar), how annoying is the Davis-McConnell stuff? Thought the stupid saga was finally over last month when he was arrested on suspicion of assaulting her and now she's talking about having two more kids with him. :boring:
 
Fergies Gum said:
The fact that its leaked so soon to the debate and that someone told Le Pen about it, whilst she would have been at the debate venue and preparing.

4chan timed the leak just before the debate and hoped it would have been mentioned in the debate for maximum attention. It just happens to occur that their gamble paid off with Le Pen mentioning it to 16 million voters.
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And it kind of backfired when she admitted to have no proof.
 
Fergies Gum said:
Their plan is to put doubt in the voters minds and to attempt to make the reluctant Macron voters to abstain.
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And when you listen to people, Le Pen was a clown even some FN voters saw it that way.
 
Some people are confused by the media blackouts in France, one of the main reason is that overseas started to vote today and will continue during the night, the blackout is supposed to prevent their votes to influence mainland voters and also to allow voters to take a decision with the same informations.
 
JPRouve said:
Some people are confused by the media blackouts in France, one of the main reason is that overseas started to vote today and will continue during the night, the blackout is supposed to prevent their votes to influence mainland voters and also to allow voters to take a decision with the same informations.
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Has social media begun to affect the way this works? Obviously not everyone uses it, but I imagine if you want to find the info these days you can.
 
Ubik said:
Has social media begun to affect the way this works? Obviously not everyone uses it, but I imagine if you want to find the info these days you can.
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You can see the information but it won't be commented by professionals or politicians on the TV or Radio. Every voter is alone with his decision.
 
So Putin is trying to score a desperate last-minute goal in France as well. It sounds like a Fellaini thing.
 
Charlie Foley said:
Feck don't want to wait that long, after Trump I'm nervous :(
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It's a done deal. If anything the hacking scandal will favour Macron. The fact Trump has been awful will have done no favours to Le-Penn.
 
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UK's Brexit and the developing story behind its divorce will also have a negative effect on Le-Penn.
 
ISIS will gain the most to Le-Penn winning. They will have more ammunition to their recruiting policy.
 
JPRouve said:
Obviously they won't vote Macron. Yesterday I heard a guy say that he was going to vote for Le Pen because she promised to add 200€ to his pension while Macron didn't made promises, that's how a lot of people think.
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During a debate on the BBC yesterday, the general consensus was that Macron has to make it work otherwise there'll be no stopping Le Pen next time. They did acknowledge, however, that his good intentions (assuming they are so) could well be defeated by France's natural intransigence toward reform. The Blair 97 comparison did seem a bit OTT mind.


Sultan said:
UK's Brexit and the developing story behind its divorce will also have a negative effect on Le-Penn.
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What developing story?
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
During a debate on the BBC yesterday, the general consensus was that Macron has to make it work otherwise there'll be no stopping Le Pen next time. They did acknowledge, however, that his good intentions (assuming they are so) could well be defeated by France's natural intransigence toward reform. The Blair 97 comparison did seem a bit OTT mind.
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French people as a whole will not just vote for a fascist racist with no policies or viable plan, some will but our neighbours will demonstrate how that works over the next five years
 
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Nick 0208 Ldn said:
During a debate on the BBC yesterday, the general consensus was that Macron has to make it work otherwise there'll be no stopping Le Pen next time. They did acknowledge, however, that his good intentions (assuming they are so) could well be defeated by France's natural intransigence toward reform. The Blair 97 comparison did seem a bit OTT mind.




What developing story?
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EU and May acting Tom and Jerry.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
During a debate on the BBC yesterday, the general consensus was that Macron has to make it work otherwise there'll be no stopping Le Pen next time. They did acknowledge, however, that his good intentions (assuming they are so) could well be defeated by France's natural intransigence toward reform. The Blair 97 comparison did seem a bit OTT mind.
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He definitely needs to not be a "politician" and do the reforms he believes in, no matter what people think since they will complain either way. As for Le Pen being elected in 5 years, first we don't know where she will be in 5 years and the conservatives had a jump start but their candidates blew it, they still have a big chance in 2022.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
French people as a whole will not just vote for a fascist racist with no policies or viable plan, some will but our neighbours will demonstate how that works over the next five years
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Which French neighbour is ruled by a fascist, racist government? :confused:


Sultan said:
EU and May acting Tom and Jerry.
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The initial Brexit vote was good news for her, and i'd argue that the bombast of a globalist TTIPing EU, plays poorly with Le Pen's recent left-wing converts. Although i doubt whether the psst week of London-Brussels sniping registers much at all in the grand scheme of things.


JPRouve said:
He definitely needs to not be a "politician" and do the reforms he believes in, no matter what people think since they will complain either way. As for Le Pen being elected in 5 years, first we don't know where she will be in 5 years and the conservatives had a jump start but their candidates blew it, they still have a big chance in 2022.
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Sure, the French Conservatives have been riven by scandal, yet they are also one of the regular parties of government. If despite the presidency of a centrist the root causes for disillusionment still exist , i'd expect the political fringe to be resurgent once more.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b08pvkkw/dateline-london-06052017
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
Which French neighbour is ruled by a fascist, racist government? :confused:
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Le Pen is that and the UK has a borderline fascist leader with no viable plan for leaving the EU or for rectifying the inherent problems that led to such a decision, add in the racist/xenophobic element part of the reason they left and eyes will be on how the Uk copes with this. In five years time when the next election comes around we'll all have a clearer idea of the effect of Brexit and additionally Trump would have completed his four year term as a protectionist racist.
Add in what JPR said about the Conservatives making a comeback even if the socialists won't get back into the reckoning, will Le Pen even get into the second round next time.
This was her big chance and hopefully she has blown it because she is an empty shell filled only with bile and hatred.
 
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@Paul the Wolf I suppose that you noticed that french and anglophone medias have been repeating that Macron proposition were vague and not really explicit, like this article. While you can disagree with Macron propositions, don't you think that it's strange how they seem to not be aware of the freely accessible En Marche website where the program is there for everyone to read?
 
JPRouve said:
@Paul the Wolf I suppose that you noticed that french and anglophone medias have been repeating that Macron proposition were vague and not really explicit, like this article. While you can disagree with Macron propositions, don't you think that it's strange how they seem to not be aware of the freely accessible En Marche website where the program is there for everyone to read?
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Yes I find it odd, not only on the site but he has also explained how he will put in place the propositions. I can understand partly in the anglophone media as a lot of the French system is clearly not understood outside France. When you compare it to what Le Pen proposes with hardly anything to support what she says and her constantly changing position trying to fool the voters it's a bit ironic.
A close fought battle and the possibility of another populist getting to power makes news though.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Yes I find it odd, not only on the site but he has also explained how he will put in place the propositions. I can understand partly in the anglophone media as a lot of the French system is clearly not understood outside France. When you compare it to what Le Pen proposes with hardly anything to support what she says and her constantly changing position trying to fool the voters it's a bit ironic.
A close fought battle and the possibility of another populist getting to power makes news though.
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Too true. The moment Lepen got to the 2nd round, whoever was to face her was to be the next president.
I personally don't vote, never have and probably never will, for me politicians are more or less the same, nothing will fundamentaly change no matter who is in charge. The whole thing seems like a big joke.
 
Paul the Wolf said:
Yes I find it odd, not only on the site but he has also explained how he will put in place the propositions. I can understand partly in the anglophone media as a lot of the French system is clearly not understood outside France. When you compare it to what Le Pen proposes with hardly anything to support what she says and her constantly changing position trying to fool the voters it's a bit ironic.
A close fought battle and the possibility of another populist getting to power makes news though.
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But I don't understand the Guardian's journalist, I suppose that his role is to inform british readers and give them an idea about what both candidates propose. And in the case of Macron it's very easy, a simple reference to his program would make things easy for example in terms of EU reforms, he wants a EU security council, a EU border police, a EU military fund, a EU military HQ(already planned), a EU Exchequer, a "Buy European Act" which is supposed to limit public procurement to companies with 50% of their production chain in the EU, etc...
 
kouroux said:
Too true. The moment Lepen got to the 2nd round, whoever was to face her was to be the next president.
I personally don't vote, never have and probably never will, for me politicians are more or less the same, nothing will fundamentaly change no matter who is in charge. The whole thing seems like a big joke.
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I was never too interested in politics before but when the lunatics and extremists started coming out of the woodwork over the past couple of years , alarm bells started ringing.
 
JPRouve said:
But I don't understand the Guardian's journalist, I suppose that his role is to inform british readers and give them an idea about what both candidates propose. And in the case of Macron it's very easy, a simple reference to his program would make things easy for example in terms of EU reforms, he wants a EU security council, a EU border police, a EU military fund, a EU military HQ(already planned), a EU Exchequer, a "Buy European Act" which is supposed to limit public procurement to companies with 50% of their production chain in the EU, etc...
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That should be his role but how does he explain Le Pen's program, which has been changing every time she feels she needs to alter her stance to gain some more votes. It has to look like a close race to generate interest.
 
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