Fredge | Deal done

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Walters_19_MuFc said:
8.
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I watched Fred in Champions League. As far as I remember, he played in a midfield of 2 with Stepanenko.

For what I have seen of Fred, he has defensive capabilities. If we sign another CM, we should go for a CAM.

So, do you think Herrera would be a better cover for Matic than Fred?
 
charlie9882 said:
City just didn't match what Shakhtar were looking for, it wasn't a case of Fred's camp saying see you later. That would be the case if City were in for him right now, which they aren't (they want Jorginho).
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They want the player to do what Mahrez did and kick up a fuss to try to force the selling club to wilt but it clearly didn’t work. It’s a tactic Real Madrid try with De Gea but he isn’t interested in forcing a move either.
 
Kapardin said:
That was an anomaly and shouldn't be the standard on which everything is judged.
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Right. Exactly my point. There are no standards or benchmarks. Many top clubs have spent hundreds of millions on players but we were the last repeat winner in the Prem 9 years ago. What a club spends on players is a major factor but it's a mix of thousands of factors including leadership, chemistry, skill, hard work, experience, team cohesion, luck, schedule, ambition, individual brilliance, keeping top players, dropping players at the right time, etc,... that makes a winning champion caliber team. All were factors that made our beloved team a dynasty.
 
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bdspeedy said:
Right. Exactly my point. There are no standards or benchmarks. Many top clubs have spent hundreds of millions on players but we were the last repeat winner in the Prem 9 years ago. What a club spends on players is a major factor but it's a mix of thousands of factors including leadership, chemistry, skill, hard work, experience, team cohesion, luck, schedule, ambition, individual brilliance, keeping top players, dropping players at the right time, etc,... that makes a winning champion caliber team. All were factors that made our beloved team a dynasty.
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Your previous point said nothing about this. Also there is no standard or benchmark is truly fault. Technical ability, physicality, tactical-nous... can vary from time to time, United players needed to keep standard under SAF. Work ethnic, leadership, mental strength. We didn't spend much at the end of SAF years but over his reign when SAF needed to spend, he spent. Over the length of his reign, we spent enough to be one of the top spenders in the league. You can have freak season and win the league, but to succeed in more than one years you need to build foundation. Foundation also requires spending.
 
Fer said:
I watched Fred in Champions League. As far as I remember, he played in a midfield of 2 with Stepanenko.

For what I have seen of Fred, he has defensive capabilities. If we sign another CM, we should go for a CAM.

So, do you think Herrera would be a better cover for Matic than Fred?
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He plays in a 4231 for Shakhtar, but he's given the licence to get forward, whilst his partner sits in front of the back four.

Yes, I do think Herrera would be better cover, be Fred could definately play as a 6. He'd be more of a Carrick type than a enforcer type, though.
 
ti vu said:
Your previous point said nothing about this. Also there is no standard or benchmark is truly fault. Technical ability, physicality, tactical-nous... can vary from time to time, United players needed to keep standard under SAF. Work ethnic, leadership, mental strength. We didn't spend much at the end of SAF years but over his reign when SAF needed to spend, he spent. Over the length of his reign, we spent enough to be one of the top spenders in the league. You can have freak season and win the league, but to succeed in more than one years you need to build foundation. Foundation also requires spending.
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My point is that "benchmarks" and "standards" can be subjective and aren't always the main factor in winning a league or division title or a major tournament. Most teams, corporations, organizations, etc,... use certain metrics to track performance and success but meeting objectives doesn't always end up with your team standing on a platform holding a trophy. That is usually the benchmark and the standard we all strive for. Second place ain't it.
 
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I'm dreading Fred's passes into Lukaku' feet, for him to control the ball...:devil:
 
It’s a bit weird seeing people trying to convince themselves that he’ll turn into a Carrick or that “he’s a holder”.

He’s your classic box-to-box and an upgrade on Herrera. Especially the Herrera who was known as more of a mobile passer and playmaker before he joined us. I would say Fred is more well-rounded in terms of his attributes but he’s nowhere near being a holder, be it a tackling one or a deep-lying playmaker.
 
NYAS said:
It’s a bit weird seeing people trying to convince themselves that he’ll turn into a Carrick or that “he’s a holder”.

He’s your classic box-to-box and an upgrade on Herrera. Especially the Herrera who was known as more of a mobile passer and playmaker before he joined us. I would say Fred is more well-rounded in terms of his attributes but he’s nowhere near being a holder, be it a tackling one or a deep-lying playmaker.
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He spends far too much time in the opponents half to be a 6. If we get him he'll be our Essien/Khedira. A player that moves the ball into the opponents half and prevents the ball going into our own half.
 
He's box to box imo. Not sure how much of an upgrade he would be to what we already get out of Matic and Herrera.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
Under [former manager Mircea] Lucescu, forwards and full-backs were responsible for that, but now I am the conductor.

Love the highlighted bit, and I can only imagine that's why Jose wants him.

It's something, most, including myself, have said to have lacked these last few seasons. Someone who can start play and control the pace of the game.

It's exactly what Jose did when he went to Chelsea. He identified that they didn't have a conductor in midfield, so he bought Fabregas, who went onto make 18 assists.

Initially, I think Jose felt Pogba could fulfil this role, but I guess he's realised that he's better slightly higher up the pitch, rather than deep.
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Jose was a bit obtuse to realise that, he has signed a 89m player full of technical prowess, why he should be kept in a deeper position just for passing long balls and tempo but not making runs to the box and scoring (as well as making assists).

That said, I can see he will be developed into a Carrick-esque player eventually as he approaches his latter stage of career.
 
breakout67 said:
He spends far too much time in the opponents half to be a 6. If we get him he'll be our Essien/Khedira. A player that moves the ball into the opponents half and prevents the ball going into our own half.
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Indeed.

Raoul said:
He's box to box imo. Not sure how much of an upgrade he would be to what we already get out of Matic and Herrera.
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Correct, which is why we still need at least one other midfielder. Either a young back-up tackling DM to Matic or an actual passer.
 
buckooo1978 said:
sorry if posted already but nice video - looks to be a positive energetic player - plenty of forward passing and running

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What I find most impressive is how little backlift he has with his passes. I could see that being a massive asset against PL defenders.
 
I have'nt watched Fred much apart from the UCL game with City. Could someone please compare him with what we have in Herrera. What he offers as an upgrade over Herrera and things Herrera does better?
 
Kwakazaka Hina said:
Jose was a bit obtuse to realise that, he has signed a 89m player full of technical prowess, why he should be kept in a deeper position just for passing long balls and tempo but not making runs to the box and scoring (as well as making assists).

That said, I can see he will be developed into a Carrick-esque player eventually as he approaches his latter stage of career.
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Unfortunately I think it’s the other way around as in Jose is asking Paul to play deeper as Carrick is done, Herrera refused to pass forward and Fellaini didn’t fit. He brought Mctominay through to try and resolve this. But if we didn’t move for Pogba when we did we’d have lost him so was worth the gamble (he’s been good without great) and we will get a bigger fee back because the transfer inflation nowadays and maybe just maybe Jose will sign a midfielder to allow Pogba to thrive a bit more in a better team.
 
I think we are just waiting for the Brazil NT to touch down in England next week before we get moving on the transfer again.
 
Plenty (albeit not especially reliable) rumours of us going for Savic at the moment. Hopefully we haven't ditched the Fred deal.
 
Scorpy said:
Plenty (albeit not especially reliable) rumours of us going for Savic at the moment. Hopefully we haven't ditched the Fred deal.
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We need 2 central midfielders, wouldn't be surprised if we landed both. Would love it!
 
VP89 said:
We need 2 central midfielders, wouldn't be surprised if we landed both. Would love it!
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We do need two, however the potential cost of both deals makes it unlikely IMO. We still need to strengthen in other positions.
 
Scorpy said:
We do need two, however the potential cost of both deals makes it unlikely IMO. We still need to strengthen in other positions.
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I find it sad that we need to act shrewdly in the market while City and PSG spend whatever they want. At least PSG are getting some sanctions against them.
 
Scorpy said:
We do need two, however the potential cost of both deals makes it unlikely IMO. We still need to strengthen in other positions.
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I don't think there's any position out there that we need to strengthen more than our central midfield. We have 2 competent midfielders of which 1 is terribly inconsistent.
 
An Irish Red said:
When a player is so open about the possibility of moving to us it rarely happens.

Wouldn't surprise me if this was this years Fabinho and we end up with someone else.
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Usually that's true but it changed with Lindelof, I guess Mourinho is a bit looser with his info.
 
VP89 said:
I don't think there's any position out there that we need to strengthen more than our central midfield. We have 2 competent midfielders of which 1 is terribly inconsistent.
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I agree and hope we land both Savic and Fred, however I think it's pretty obvious we want to sign two fullbacks and a right winger as well. There are even rumours of us going for a backup striker and a centre-back.

Weren't there some reports of us going for some younger midfielder after we land Fred? Maybe we'll try to unearth some gem instead of splashing 100 million on Savic.

Things could change drastically if Pogba leaves though.
 
breakout67 said:
I find it sad that we need to act shrewdly in the market while City and PSG spend whatever they want. At least PSG are getting some sanctions against them.
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We're hardly acting shrewdly if we're buy milinkovic savic for over 100m after paying 50m fir Fred...
 
The clips are interesting he reminds me of Anderson and we can all remember how good he could be and how bad he could be also
 
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