Fabregas

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I really doubt united wouldn't have done some homework, whatever clause exists, if there is any I'm sure they've factored it in. As for Fabregas I'm sure he'd still want to give himself the best chance to win stuff, and its got to help that RVP, Nasri, clichy, Toure have all left and been successful. Plus in all honesty if say you only had enough for one big signing you don't need Fabregas as much as you could use a top class striker. Wilshere and Carzola as a middle two with Arteta holding can be very good if you can keep wilshere fit.
 
Brophs said:
I've seen journos say it, but there's no way it's 50% simpliciter. It'll be on the profit.
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Yep, I was being a little naive there. I still think there's a lot about this that doesn't add-up. All of the 'reliable' Arsenal sources are absolutely convinced we'll get him.
 
Ash_G said:
I really doubt united wouldn't have done some homework, whatever clause exists, if there is any I'm sure they've factored it in. As for Fabregas I'm sure he'd still want to give himself the best chance to win stuff, and its got to help that RVP, Nasri, clichy, Toure have all left and been successful. Plus in all honesty if say you only had enough for one big signing you don't need Fabregas as much as you could use a top class striker. Wilshere and Carzola as a middle two with Arteta holding can be very good if you can keep wilshere fit.
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I think using Nasri and Toure there is pushing it, but fair enough.

I reckon we'd rather he stuck it out at Barcelona allowing us to get all our transfer business done without having to worry about him going to United. If it becomes clear he's leaving, we'll do all we can to make sure it's to us.
 
alastair said:
Yep, I was being a little naive there. I still think there's a lot about this that doesn't add-up. All of the 'reliable' Arsenal sources are absolutely convinced we'll get him.
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Probably mentally preparing to prevent a RvP-like meltdown. We'd so the same if Ronaldo was heavily linked to City.
 
alastair said:
I was considering this whole deal today, and if my maths is anywhere near correct, I don't understand what Barcelona would really gain from the sale. There is this argument going around that they want to offload Fabregas in order to fund the sale of a top centre-half, but I don't see any circumstances under which this is possible.

The clauses Arsenal supposedly have are as follows: let's say for the sake of argument a buy back clause at the price at which Cesc was sold(£35m) and a 50% sell-on fee on whatever Barcelona get for him upon sale.

It's also been widely reported that Barcelona haven't even nearly paid Arsenal in full for Fabregas, with the deal having been made in installments. Currently, of the £35m, they've given us £20m.

All this means that I struggle to see the motive for Barcelona to sell. If they sell back to Arsenal, we will automatically have £15m knocked off the price for the unpaid money from the original transfer, plus another £5m of the Alex Song transfer, meaning they essentially only gain a £15m 'profit' on the whole deal.

Given that we have first refusal, this means Cesc has to categorically turn down any advance from Arsenal and decide that he will join Manchester United. Saying he does this, that means Barcelona will need to get top dollar to make it really worth losing him. If they sell for £40m, we get an automatic £20m, plus the money they still owe on the original transfer, totalling £15m, which leads us to £35m. Barcelona, selling at £40m, would actually make, for themselves, £5m.

Therefore, they need to sell at a fee around £60-70m to make it worth their while, but the fees United are offering are in that £40m range. I don't see how this is remotely enticing for Barcelona. Also, if they say openly he's up for sale, and he doesn't mind returning to Arsenal, they will be forced to accept our knock-down bid agreed two years ago. This makes no sense.
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You don't seem to have factored wages
 
What if all along Fabregas had bought Mazinho's tapas restaurant, and we were just trying to buy it back?
 
pocco said:
These aren't games, though. Fabregas is their player and they dictate to us what is acceptable. If we were in the region they wanted then they would have sat down and sorted the deal. Instead we've dragged our feet for a few days, showing no conviction in what we are doing.

In the past we'd just announce that a deal was done. The bit we didn't hear about was likely the negotiations where we had a small difference in values to make up. The fact we are publicly having bid after bid knocked back makes me feel this is us just chancing our arm a little.
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It may be simply a case of two inexperienced people who don't know what they're doing.
 
Brophs said:
This summer? I doubt it. If things stay the same I can see him going back to your lot next summer.
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I'd have thought so, but Darren Dein is the only reason I think he might go to United. His entire ambition at Arsenal was to get as many of our players contracted to him as possible so he could encourage them to leave as acrimoniously as possible.
 
According to journos, that 25m clause Arsenal have will only kick in if Fabregas tells to Barcelona that he wants to go to Arsenal. Nearly as pointless as the Suarez clause.
 
KM said:
According to journos, that 25m clause Arsenal have will only kick in if Fabregas tells to Barcelona that he wants to go to Arsenal. Nearly as pointless as the Suarez clause.
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In fairness, the Suarez clause was good for a laugh. Arsenal mugged Liverpool off completely.
 
KM said:
According to journos, that 25m clause Arsenal have will only kick in if Fabregas tells to Barcelona that he wants to go to Arsenal. Nearly as pointless as the Suarez clause.
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Arsenal are definitely a threat to us if Fab became available. But if Fab wants 200k a week wages, would arsenal pay it?
 
Grinner said:
'Like a new signing' will be heard in the coming weeks.
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Last year a few guys tried to get the song 'When I find myself in times of trouble, Arsene Wenger says to me, He's like a new signing, Diaby, Diaby,' going in the ground, unsuccessfully.(to the tune of Let It Be).
 
KM said:
According to journos, that 25m clause Arsenal have will only kick in if Fabregas tells to Barcelona that he wants to go to Arsenal. Nearly as pointless as the Suarez clause.
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What would be quite interesting is if we offered something like £40m and Fabregas told Barca that he wanted to go to Arsenal. I could see Barca putting a lot of pressure on Fabregas to go to the highest bidder, as they'd stand to lose around £15m quid.
 
Brophs said:
What would be quite interesting is if we offered something like £40m and Fabregas told Barca that he wanted to go to Arsenal. I could see Barca putting a lot of pressure on Fabregas to go to the highest bidder, as they'd stand to lose around £15m quid.
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I'm sure if that happened and we wanted him that we'd throw in some more scrillah...or try and give them Bendtner.
 
shaggy said:
Arsenal are definitely a threat to us if Fab became available. But if Fab wants 200k a week wages, would arsenal pay it?
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They would but I'm not sure why Fabregas will come back to Arsenal.
 
Had a peek at the barca forums to see what their fans were saying. they're all pretty much 100% convinced he's staying and we are wasting our time. It's very difficult to see otherwise. Some glimmer of hope from the man himself would be nice.
 
shaggy said:
Arsenal are definitely a threat to us if Fab became available. But if Fab wants 200k a week wages, would arsenal pay it?
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Aye. And would Barca pay it - he's 26 now, his contract expires in 2016. Given his status (he's a wanted man, obviously) it seems inevitable Barca will have to either offer him a new and vastly more lucrative contract (supposedly our offer is twice the amount he makes at the moment), or risk him becoming seriously grumpy, probably handing in a transfer request. They're at a crossroads with him, it would seem: Offer him a fat, new contract and thus go for him, long-term as a central player in the set-up - or decide, as Pep seemingly did, that he isn't the one to run their midfield in the years to come...
 
Brophs said:
What would be quite interesting is if we offered something like £40m and Fabregas told Barca that he wanted to go to Arsenal. I could see Barca putting a lot of pressure on Fabregas to go to the highest bidder, as they'd stand to lose around £15m quid.
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That'd be interesting but I think it's pretty unlikely.
 
shaggy said:
Had a peek at the barca forums to see what their fans were saying. they're all pretty much 100% convinced he's staying and we are wasting our time. It's very difficult to see otherwise. Some glimmer of hope from the man himself would be nice.
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Think the ball is in our court now, not Cesc's. If we want him that bad, then let's offer £40m, and if Barca accept, Cesc will know they want the money more than they want him. I really don't believe he wants to leave, but should they accept a bid, i think he will leave.
 
alastair said:
I think using Nasri and Toure there is pushing it, but fair enough.

I reckon we'd rather he stuck it out at Barcelona allowing us to get all our transfer business done without having to worry about him going to United. If it becomes clear he's leaving, we'll do all we can to make sure it's to us.
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Well maybe on Toure but his is more due to age and Nasri is more under performing, but either way that's a fair bit of the team he was a part of that has moved on.

Fair play on the second point but for me I think you'd be a stronger team with say Suarez than Fabregas right now. If you could really push the boat out and get both that would be amazing for you guys, would be right up there, though squad would be a little thin. Highly unlikely though.
 
alastair said:
Last year a few guys tried to get the song 'When I find myself in times of trouble, Arsene Wenger says to me, He's like a new signing, Diaby, Diaby,' going in the ground, unsuccessfully.(to the tune of Let It Be).
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Thanks for clarifying the song. Was scratching my head for a bit there.
 
Funny, a lot of Barcelona fans seem to think we're after Fabregas as a replacement for Rooney in the no.10 role. A lot of them seem to think that's his best/favourite position and that if he leaves it'll be because he wants to be a 1st choice player in that role. Surely we'd be playing him deeper than that, no?
 
That'sHernandez said:
Fourth place fighters, Arsenal? Behave, he left there for a reason.
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It's arrogant to dismiss them like they haven't got a chance. They are still a very attractive club to play for and he has emotional ties there.

Chesterlestreet said:
Aye. And would Barca pay it - he's 26 now, his contract expires in 2016. Given his status (he's a wanted man, obviously) it seems inevitable Barca will have to either offer him a new and vastly more lucrative contract (supposedly our offer is twice the amount he makes at the moment), or risk him becoming seriously grumpy, probably handing in a transfer request. They're at a crossroads with him, it would seem: Offer him a fat, new contract and thus go for him, long-term as a central player in the set-up - or decide, as Pep seemingly did, that he isn't the one to run their midfield in the years to come...
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If we're willing to pay him 200k and he's 'only' on 100k at the moment then he definitely could be using us to get a bigger deal. Hopefully they don't want to give him one.
 
apotheosis said:
Think the ball is in our court now, not Cesc's. If we want him that bad, then let's offer £40m, and if Barca accept, Cesc will know they want the money more than they want him. I really don't believe he wants to leave, but should they accept a bid, i think he will leave.
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I also think he'll join us if they accept a bid but from the way Barca's camp have flat out denied any chance of this happening after we bid £30 million makes me think the chances of them suddenly changing their mind with a £5 million increase is extremely slim. £40 million as well only gives them a £2.5 million profit due to the 50% clause. I think they are looking for £50+ million personally.
 
sullydnl said:
Funny, a lot of Barcelona fans seem to think we're after Fabregas as a replacement for Rooney in the no.10 role. A lot of them seem to think that's his best/favourite position and that if he leaves it'll be because he wants to be a 1st choice player in that role. Surely we'd be playing him deeper than that, no?
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I've been slightly thinking this, I always thought he was at his absolute best slightly higher up the pitch but think in most games he'd be class in the deeper role as well. Tbf in tougher games, he could easily swap in for Rooney, with kagawa playing tucked in on the left.
 
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