F1 2022 Season

rpitroda said:
I’d be surprised if anyone can properly challenge RB next year, except Ferrari who are actually close in performance but miles away from being a championship contending team. I think it’s realistically the year after where it’s possible.
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I would agree with that to an extent as I was thinking beyond that i.e. RB not dominating for 4-5 years. It will only be RB, Merc, and Ferrari challenging next year with RB + Max probably winning. I think Spa made it look worse than it was, we've seen the reverse earlier in the season (Ferrari better pace and less tyre degradation vs RB).

I don't expect the midfield to challenge soon but they will close up by 2024-2025 especially where the investment from AM and McLaren starts to pay off (hiring and wind tunnel etc). Renault and Audi should have strong teams as manufacturers so I think F1 competition looks healthy compared to the last 20 years of single team dominance per era by Ferrari, RB, and Merc.
 
rpitroda said:
I’d be surprised if anyone can properly challenge RB next year, except Ferrari who are actually close in performance but miles away from being a championship contending team. I think it’s realistically the year after where it’s possible.
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RB feels dominant only because Ferrari's tactical blunders. Else it'd be a far closer title race. Mercedes are just hovering right there too.
 
What's the difference in prize money and wind tunnel time between finishing 2nd and 3rd? Would Mercedes rather finish behind or ahead of Ferrari?
 
goalscholes said:
What's the difference in prize money and wind tunnel time between finishing 2nd and 3rd? Would Mercedes rather finish behind or ahead of Ferrari?
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It's written somewhere, I think on the F1 site. Someone said extra wind tunnel time would be worth two tenths this year but wasn't sure if that was Merc vs Ferrari politics.

My understanding is that teams would always rather have the prize money as ultimately this is a business and that's the significant source of income other than sponsors. Otherwise you'd try to finish last.

Don't forget the top directors and drivers salary isn't part of the budget cap. Look at McLaren paying RIC off.
 
goalscholes said:
What's the difference in prize money and wind tunnel time between finishing 2nd and 3rd? Would Mercedes rather finish behind or ahead of Ferrari?
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You'd want the prize money normally i would think. A few of the teams have been developing new software to simulate porposing. Obviously it cant be done in the wnd tunnel but it can be done in CFD by very clever people. Stuff like that would make the prize money more useful you would think.

The drop off in wind tunnel time next season is quite dramatic. RB will go from 92.5% to 70%. I think i read somewhere that anything around 90% is 150 wind tunnel runs in total. So you have to be absolutely sure about the benefit of each run.

Teams' previous season's championship positionPercentage of current aero testing allowed for 2021Percentage of current aero testing allowed for 2022-25
190%70%
292.5%75%
395%80%
497.5%85%
5100%90%
6102.5%95%
7105%100%
8107.5%105%
9110%110%
10+ or new team112.5%115%
 
Lando falling further from the likeable pole (or poll) with his comments on Daniel. It’s incredible that a bloke with zero wins next to his name has an ego like he does. Daniel is one of if not the most popular blokes in F1 and it won’t win Lando any fans if he carry’s on like a feckwit. Even worse if Piastri is as good as his junior career has suggested as he may just wipe the floor with Lando.
 
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mariachi-19 said:
Lando falling further from the likeable pole with his comments on Daniel. It’s incredible that a bloke with zero wins next to his name has an ego like he does. Daniel is one of if not the most popular blokes in F1 and it won’t win Lando any fans if he carry’s on like a feckwit. Even worse if Piastri is as good as his junior career has suggested as he may just wipe the floor with Lando.
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What did he say?
 
laughtersassassin said:
Crazy for it to fall through. Red Bull built an entire engine facility.

Even if they go with Honda they won't build engines out of Milton Keynes.

This most likely really fecks their plans for 2026 onward
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Reading the article it makes more sense for them not to get into bed with porsche. Especially as porsche wont be providing an engine. It will end up being a marketing exercise.

Porsche and RB dont have very long to do a deal. Porsche has a ipo floatation this autumn which means any acqusisitions i.e. 50% of RB would be on hold. Also there is a cut off for october for new engine manufacturers to join so they can have a say on 2026 PU.

Be interesting to see what RB do...
 
dinostar77 said:
Reading the article it makes more sense for them not to get into bed with porsche. Especially as porsche wont be providing an engine. It will end up being a marketing exercise.

Porsche and RB dont have very long to do a deal. Porsche has a ipo floatation this autumn which means any acqusisitions i.e. 50% of RB would be on hold. Also there is a cut off for october for new engine manufacturers to join so they can have a say on 2026 PU.

Be interesting to see what RB do...
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Oh for sure but it's years of planning down the drain so no matter what happens Red Bull are going to need to pivot quickly.

Hard to see them just abandoning a brand new PU facility but also hard to see them not falling back on the Honda option since they want back in.

Tough decisions
 
F1 Manager 22 game just got released and I'm historically obsessed with manager games so most probably will give it a try. Anyone had a chance to play already?
 
Red Star One said:
F1 Manager 22 game just got released and I'm historically obsessed with manager games so most probably will give it a try. Anyone had a chance to play already?
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I used to have one of the old ones called grand prix manager 2 and used to be obsessed with it as a kid. Will definitely give this one a go for a laugh.
 
dinostar77 said:
Be interesting to see what RB do...
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Try to persuade Honda to come back?

Failing that I could imagine a scenario where in 2026 you have

Merc supplying themselves, Mclaran and Aston
Ferrari supplying themselves and HAAS
Renault Supplying themselves
Audi supplying themselves

This would mean under the rules that if RB (and alfa tauri) did not have an engine supplier then Audi / Renualt would have to supply them (as they have the fewest customers)

Red Bull being forced to use renault would be funny - as would red bull being forced to use an Audi engine without bringing in the porsche money

hope horner messes this up just to see him moan about it - or better still thinks that can devleop themselves.
 
sun_tzu said:
Try to persuade Honda to come back?

Failing that I could imagine a scenario where in 2026 you have

Merc supplying themselves, Mclaran and Aston
Ferrari supplying themselves and HAAS
Renault Supplying themselves
Audi supplying themselves

This would mean under the rules that if RB (and alfa tauri) did not have an engine supplier then Audi / Renualt would have to supply them (as they have the fewest customers)

Red Bull being forced to use renault would be funny - as would red bull being forced to use an Audi engine without bringing in the porsche money

hope horner messes this up just to see him moan about it - or better still thinks that can devleop themselves.
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RB have the RB powertrain faciities so i presume they would be building their own PUs under their own banner reluctantly. Which despite having taken staff off other teams, would be a huge achievement for a team with no experience of builiding commercial engines.

I thought the rules for 2026 were that you had to supply at least one other team? Maybe im mistaken.
 
sun_tzu said:
Try to persuade Honda to come back?

Failing that I could imagine a scenario where in 2026 you have

Merc supplying themselves, Mclaran and Aston
Ferrari supplying themselves and HAAS
Renault Supplying themselves
Audi supplying themselves

This would mean under the rules that if RB (and alfa tauri) did not have an engine supplier then Audi / Renualt would have to supply them (as they have the fewest customers)

Red Bull being forced to use renault would be funny - as would red bull being forced to use an Audi engine without bringing in the porsche money

hope horner messes this up just to see him moan about it - or better still thinks that can devleop themselves.
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Audi would never supply Red Bull as new power unit entrants in 2026 wouldn't be required to comply with the obligations of competitor supply in year one, plus it's likely they be taking over Sauber in the next 12 months. So it would be either Red Bull as themselves, Honda or Renault. Given the infrastructure set up and people on board (Andy Cowell rumoured to be at RBPT's also) they should have a working engine by 2026. Everything they're doing at the moment is a move to be sold to a manufacturer at some point in the near future.
 
dinostar77 said:
RB have the RB powertrain faciities so i presume they would be building their own PUs under their own banner reluctantly. Which despite having taken staff off other teams, would be a huge achievement for a team with no experience of builiding commercial engines.

I thought the rules for 2026 were that you had to supply at least one other team? Maybe im mistaken.
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Red Bull would supply AlphaTauri right?
 
F-Red said:
Audi would never supply Red Bull as new power unit entrants in 2026 wouldn't be required to comply with the obligations of competitor supply in year one, plus it's likely they be taking over Sauber in the next 12 months. So it would be either Red Bull as themselves, Honda or Renault. Given the infrastructure set up and people on board (Andy Cowell rumoured to be at RBPT's also) they should have a working engine by 2026. Everything they're doing at the moment is a move to be sold to a manufacturer at some point in the near future.
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Hard to see Red Bull and Renault working together again, hard to imagine Honda returning to F1 so soon and hard to imagine that RBPT will be in a position to produce a competive f1 engine s their first engine (particularly as Honda only leased them IP till the end of the current regs)
 
BBC F1

Hamilton on RedBull

Lewis Hamilton says Red Bull could be embarking on an era of domination similar to his with Mercedes.

Hamilton said: "The chances are very high that that's already happened. They are already on that way.
"It's going to be very tough for teams to close that gap."

Max Verstappen is on course for a second consecutive title after winning nine out of 14 races so far, while Red Bull are poised for their first constructors' title since 2013.

However, Hamilton said he still believed his Mercedes team could make up the necessary ground to challenge Red Bull.

"If your car is fast one year, it evolves into a faster car the next year, so the gap they have now will be very hard for anyone from third down to ever close in this cycle of car design," Hamilton said.

"But we have won the last eight world titles. As a team, we've got amazing and talented engineers. I don't doubt they can.

"There are limitations with budget and wind tunnel and CFD time and we have to be very clear and precise in the direction we want to go and very efficient in our time."

Hamilton praised Red Bull for starting this year's new era of technical regulations so strongly, saying that they were "a great team and they've done an amazing job".

And he singled out their chief technical officer Adrian Newey for special praise. Newey did his university thesis on 'ground effect', the aerodynamic phenomenon that has been reintroduced into F1 by this year's rules.

Hamilton said: "They have the aero balance great. They've got great ride quality. He [Verstappen] doesn't ever have any problems with bumps. When you have a stable platform like that…

"They had a great car last year as well. Adrian Newey doesn't generally build bad cars. He has built amazing cars over the years. My first championship car was a evolution of one of his cars.

"I know he did his thesis on ground-effect floors so it is no surprise. He is one of the only ones who draws by hand. His understanding has been an advantage them and they have done a great job."
 
ArjenIsM3 said:
Red Bull would supply AlphaTauri right?
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In its current guise, yes. However Alpha Tauri will most likely be sold off by Red Bull before 2026.

sun_tzu said:
Hard to see Red Bull and Renault working together again, hard to imagine Honda returning to F1 so soon and hard to imagine that RBPT will be in a position to produce a competive f1 engine s their first engine (particularly as Honda only leased them IP till the end of the current regs)
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Agree on Renault being a closed door. The amount of resource and talent that they've poached from Mercedes AMG HPP, RBPT should be able to produce a competitive and a less complicated engine than the current regs in 3 years.

Honda will be plan B, if plan A hits challenges between now and 2025.
 
F-Red said:
In its current guise, yes. However Alpha Tauri will most likely be sold off by Red Bull before 2026.



Agree on Renault being a closed door. The amount of resource and talent that they've poached from Mercedes AMG HPP, RBPT should be able to produce a competitive and a less complicated engine than the current regs in 3 years.

Honda will be plan B, if plan A hits challenges between now and 2025.
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I think they will end up teaming up with Honda but instead of Honda producing everything in Japan they'll do it at the new RB facility instead with Honda providing a lot of know-how.
 
Piastri-gate announcement will be soon. Interesting to see what happens there.
 
Only thing that will make this weekend interesting is if Max has to fight through the field again, otherwise its a legit whitewash guaranteed. I would imagine his FP1 problem is on an older engine/gearbox so he will just lose track time.
 
Red Star One said:
F1 Manager 22 game just got released and I'm historically obsessed with manager games so most probably will give it a try. Anyone had a chance to play already?
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I've had it since early access. Really loved it, but recently people have been investigating and said that there's almost no change in pace between softs, mediums and hards, and that's really put a dampener on it for me. Holding out for a patch to fix that hopefully.

I've started with ferrari to try and put things right, and it's quite realistic pace wise, with Charles mainly battling it out with Max, and a few seconds behind Carlos and Sergio fight closely, with Mercedes and the rest quite far behind.

It is a lot more technical than I thought it'd be, being able to develop all your own parts etc
 
Adam-Utd said:
Piastri-gate announcement will be soon. Interesting to see what happens there.
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My gut feel will be that McLaren will have to pay some money to Alpine in respect of the Piastri/Alpine contract. Piastri is also announced at the same time that he signs for McLaren in 2023, and then Gasly to be announced at Alpine at Monza.

Silly season prediction - The merry go round of Ricciardo potentially to Haas and then it leaves the conundrum of Mick Schumacher (Alpha Tauri?), however with Latifi going I think Logan Sargeant will take the seat at Williams.
 
Shame the gearbox issue didn’t happen in the race, to inject even the slightest amount of jeopardy into the title battle.
 
goalscholes said:
Shame the gearbox issue didn’t happen in the race, to inject even the slightest amount of jeopardy into the title battle.
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What title battle?

More confusongly why are mercedes quick? Not seen any footage just bbc f1 updates. Bizarre.

Massive test for lando and piastri next season. I think lando will come out on top over the course of the season.
 
dinostar77 said:
What title battle?

More confusongly why are mercedes quick? Not seen any footage just bbc f1 updates. Bizarre.

Massive test for lando and piastri next season. I think lando will come out on top over the course of the season.
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Russel on mediums is within 3 10ths of the fastest driver (Sainz) on the softs. Madness.

Cue a small gust of breeze to develop and the Mercedes to be battling with Alpine for the rest of the weekend.

Edit: poorly worded on BBC. I think Sainz run was also on the mediums.
 
Sods law really that Merc look good and Lewis either runs an old engine or takes a grid drop for a new one. Russell races with a horseshoe up his arse I reckon.
 
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