Judging by the general election thread, not very representative!
EU Referendum | UK residents vote today.
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Judging by the general election thread, not very representative!
Think you're right. So a 70% whitewash is asking a bit too much then.
There is a Mail headline - Revealed: How HALF of all social housing in England goes to people born abroad" - and people believed it! The actual figure at the time was 8.6%: it now stands at 9%. So 91% of all new social tenancies are taken up by UK-born citizens.
Is there a similar poll in the newbies? Would be very interesting to see the difference and I'd bet it would start moving towards leave a little bit.
Just a thread... Only 11 pages and no poll.
Much of a muchness though I haven't read it in depth.
It just means that the average IQ of the caf is higher than half of Britain
Anyone think a "Shy Brexiter" effect may take place?
If I were a remainer I'd be very concerned the polls have it as close as it is, considering the possibility that a fair proportion of voters would be publicly ashamed to admit they're voting out.
If I were a remainer I'd be very concerned the polls have it as close as it is, considering the possibility that a fair proportion of voters would be publicly ashamed to admit they're voting out.
Farage and his mob will be hoping for nearer 90%.
Plus a good result at the polls.
My dear sister told me she was voting leave, a big surprise to me. She is neither stupid nor racist (quite the opposite on both counts, she always champions the underdog and is a lifelong Socialist), but she sees the EU as an expensive monolith which has indirectly resulted in public sector budgets in this country being compromised, due to the costs of bureaucracy. She worked in special education and feels passionately upset about worthwhile educational initiatives being shelved, just as they were beginning to bear fruit.
I don't believe she's right on the reasons, but at least her decision to vote that way is nothing to do with immigration!
Well Played.Thanks.
Really?
Are you in a university safe space or Greenpeace meeting or something?
Where I am in North Manchester I am in the minority by voting remain and people are not ashamed in the slightest to say they want to leave!
I think that's perfectly possible. Given how keen people are to label anyone who votes "leave" as a bigoted idiot, it's not really worth raising your head above the parapet. It happened in the general election and it could happen here.
I sympathise with her completely and would have been tempted to vote out myself had it not been for the vile campaign that the Leave camp have run.
Not sure about IQ but I think the caf is better educated. Largely because people who aren't great at writing/spelling/grammar are less likely to make it out of the newbs.
Happened in the general election, and you'd imagine voting Tory would be considered less taboo than voting to leave the EU.
Quite staggering how many people are now supporting this guy after slagging him off at every opportunity for years. Damn those experts!
To put it another way - you bet £1 for leave to win - if they do you get £6.40 back - only problem is that if Leave does win the £6.40 you now have will be worth less than the £1 you had originally
The only legitimate reasons to go are based on a number of assumptions (guesses) on what the future of the EU will be IMO. Noone has made a strong economic case for going. The immigration issue is a joke because we would certainly want a Norway/Switzerland type deal where we accept free movement of labour, which is very clearly a good thing anyway. Leaving does not solve any issues where people disagree with EU policy unless you assume (guess) the whole thing will fall apart. And if it does fall apart, that really cannot be a good thing for us or the rest of Europe. The EEA and the court of human rights at very least have to stay IMO.
Some of the more educated Leave voters fear a 'United States of Europe' and ever closer integration. I do not. I think a balance can and eventually will be found that allows sufficient in-country power (as I think there is today). I do not fear closer integration with Europe - there are many opportunities where that integration can deliver tangible benefits in security, efficiency and economic prosperity. The EU has to do better to realise those, and people need to start voting in MEPs that can help deliver them. The EU needs to invest its funds differently; less on attempting to inflate the economies of poorer members, and more on initiatives like Smart Borders which are good for all members. It needs to find a way to reduce project lead time and its own efficiencies. But we achieve nothing by leaving it. It would not make it easier for us to trade with non-EU countries, it would take time against a hostile backdrop to trade at the same level with EU countries and we would have to accept many conditions, and we run a huge risk of pushing our economy into a long recession.
Some of the more educated Leave voters fear a 'United States of Europe' and ever closer integration. I do not. I think a balance can and eventually will be found that allows sufficient in-country power (as I think there is today). I do not fear closer integration with Europe - there are many opportunities where that integration can deliver tangible benefits in security, efficiency and economic prosperity. The EU has to do better to realise those, and people need to start voting in MEPs that can help deliver them. The EU needs to invest its funds differently; less on attempting to inflate the economies of poorer members, and more on initiatives like Smart Borders which are good for all members. It needs to find a way to reduce project lead time and its own efficiencies. But we achieve nothing by leaving it. It would not make it easier for us to trade with non-EU countries, it would take time against a hostile backdrop to trade at the same level with EU countries and we would have to accept many conditions, and we run a huge risk of pushing our economy into a long recession.
To put it another way - you bet £1 for leave to win - if they do you get £6.40 back - only problem is that if Leave does win the £6.40 you now have will be worth less than the £1 you had originally
Thanks.That speaks volumes about them I'm afraid. People should have the courage of their convictions and hold their heads up high whichever way they vote. If you are ashamed of voting Leave it suggests you got it wrong.
No. I was discussing the referendum and said as an aside that it was pointless in the grand scheme of things. You jumped on that thought instead of all my other posts talking about the referendum.
They aren't well educated people.
I'll probably vote remain. More due to the lack of contingency planning by leave campaigners. Although I am tempted to leave just to see what happens.
To put it another way - you bet £1 for leave to win - if they do you get £6.40 back - only problem is that if Leave does win the £6.40 you now have will be worth less than the £1 you had originally
Or it speaksoon volumes about the society we have created whereby if you vote against the consensus you are labelled racist, a bigot and a xenophobe
A newbie is trying to argue that the EU is racist because white European women can come here freely but his black non-EU wife cannot.
Yes, I'm sure it will, just a case of how much.
The £ is currently surging on the markets, sitting at ~1.48750
I think you're right. If I was voting leave then I wouldn't be announcing it TBH
Personally I hope you do vote Remain and for the sound reasoning you mentioned yourself. Leave is a huge leap into the dark with no idea whatsoever what will happen next.
If only there was some way of sifting their votes out. We'd have had fewer Tory governments then.
I think it depends where you live and what circles you move in. I know from arguments I've seen amongst my younger middle class friends in urban areas that if you admit to voting leave you get absolutely slaughtered.
I've got to be honest, he is right to be annoyed.
If he is a UK national, then domestic law governs the immigration status of his spouse (and domestic law is notoriously strict in this respect). However, if he was an EU national, then EU law would allow his spouse, even if they are a third party national, to have the same rights as him in respect of free movement.
It is an anomaly, to be sure.
Any preliminary results? Pound is rising if that's an apt forecast.
Then take a step back.
Why do the people you're referring to hold the views that they hold? What are the reasons for them to hold that position? What can be done to improve prejudice, education and employment skills in the country and what are the barriers to taking these actions? There are reasons why some countries are more or less educated than others, even (especially) amongst the world's richest countries.
Snowjoe explained it well:
His argument is complete bollocks though. He isn't recognising that white non-EU women also cannot come here without a VISA. He's ignoring that black EU women are free to come freely. It has nothing to do with the colour of her skin which is what he's saying.
Well at least Jamie Vardy is in France so Brexit will have a vote less...
Well, there is that....!
I think this is indicative though of the poor level of education which people have about the EU (and that is not meant to be derogatory). Genuine issues get misunderstood, conflated and then the misunderstanding starts a life of its own.
Is that right? What about this Canadian trade deal that people have been talking about- seemed to be a UK only thing- UK has its Commonwealth pillar too.
Hard to tell, but I'd assume not so much. Large portions of society are voting out, some almost entirely. Everyone (or, maybe just everyone outside of London!) knows people who are voting out, it's not a minority opinion - see the support from the tabloids.
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