Erik ten Hag | Currently unemployed

[Sviken]

Seems like he is not a tactical flexible manager. Didn't watch the game, but didn't seem like he put on a tactical masterclass. Either way, they were playing away from home. They will have the advantage going into next leg

Same as Guardiola, eh? Top managers like to impose their will on the opponent, regardless of whether it is the most sensible thing to do. Klopp is the same in that regard. Pragmatic managers like Mourinho never seem to last because they have no philosophy to stick to and once they are found out, they quickly crumble into obscurity.

I take a few embarrassing losses here and there and dominate 90% of our matches than watch what I'm watching right now with United (or more or less ever since SAF retired).

 

[Amadaeus]

Same as Guardiola, eh? Top managers like to impose their will on the opponent, regardless of whether it is the most sensible thing to do. Klopp is the same in that regard. Pragmatic managers like Mourinho never seem to last because they have no philosophy to stick to and once they are found out, they quickly crumble into obscurity.

I take a few embarrassing losses here and there and dominate 90% of our matches than watch what I'm watching right now with United (or more or less ever since SAF retired).

Nah, guardiola counter attack is as deadly as his possession based game from what we have seen. He just barely implement it because his team is mostly dominate in possession

 

[United in sin]

He's really not. Ask any PSG fan and they would say they've been extremely fortunate to be in the position they are in. Their football does not reflect the gap. In contrast, Ajax are utterly dominating the league and other European football clubs which the way they play. And quite frankly, i'm in agreement with the PSG fans from what I've seen - every time I've seen a PSG match they look very uninspired and reliant on individual brilliance and vibes (reminds me of a certain United manager).

The same PSG fans who wanted Tuchel gone? Not all of them are in agreement about Pochettino by the way, many of them are actually measured in their thinking about the modus operandi of the club and the issues Leonardo role brings

 

[RedRonaldo]

We should get him at all cost. Just offer him double the amount he would ask for, and give him 5 years without any condition, to show our complete trust on him. There's nothing else to loss really.

 

[stefan92]

Nah, guardiola counter attack is as deadly as his possession based game from what we have seen. He just barely implement it because his team is mostly dominate in possession

True, his team can counter attack well if they get the opportunity, but they will never willingly retreat to hit teams on the counter.

 

[Pintu]

Let's not get carried away shall we. Not his best night, and he still got a draw at Benfica while dominating most of the match. Let's have this convo after the return leg.

I don't think I'm getting carried away. He's been criticized by Ajax fans for the disappointing results in Europe over the last 2 seasons(going out early in the EL to Getafe and then to Roma). A bit like Conte, they've both been disappointing in Europe for different reasons.

This year Ajax has done far better in the CL and they are likely to make it past Benfica, but it still won't dissipate the questions surrounding him.

 

[Caesar2290]

I don't think I'm getting carried away. He's been criticized by Ajax fans for the disappointing results in Europe over the last 2 seasons(going out early in the EL to Getafe and then to Roma). A bit like Conte, they've both been disappointing in Europe for different reasons.

This year Ajax has done far better in the CL and they are likely to make it past Benfica, but it still won't dissipate the questions surrounding him.

Who are these Ajax fans you speak of? Every single one I've spoken to would feel devastated if ETH left them now. They think he is the best manager they had since LVG who won the the CL. They also think that Ajax are overachieveing in Europe. Those last matches against Roma and Getafe were lost due to him losing most of the first team to injuries and not having capable back ups.

Fact is this Ajax side shouldn't be anywhere near the knockout stages this season. Last night, Tadic who is a 33 year old Soton started the game. He is considered one their main attacking players. That should give you an indication of the "squad" ETH has to work with.

Also calling someone a bottler for drawing a match away from home despite dominating for the majority of it is kind of harsh. Our very own SAF bottled quiet a few European matches himself: Dortmund, Bayer, Porto, Bayern just of the top of my head.

 

[Ludens the Red]

So we see The Poch thread bumped anytime PSG concede a goal. Noticed Ajax lost today and are in a serious tussle for the title. The way people are on here about him over Poch I expected Ajax to be I dunno 15 points clear or something ….

 

[2 man midfield]

So we see The Poch thread bumped anytime PSG concede a goal. Noticed Ajax lost today and are in a serious tussle for the title. The way people are on here about him over Poch I expected Ajax to be I dunno 15 points clear or something ….

I mean I get it, since Ten Hag gets his best players nicked and is in a generally competitive league. While Poch has a bottomless pit of money in a league of financially poor teams with Mbappe, Messi and Neymar up front.

I don’t think the gap between them is as vast as some united fans make out though. Ten Hag has still only coached in Holland, and look at the likes of Koeman and De Boer who succeeded there before coming to the PL. He’d still be my first choice, but the way some people go on about Poch you’d think he was Mike Basset.

 

[charlenefan]

Im more intrigued about ETH than I am Poch, I feel like I know what we'll be under Poch (top 4 side, no trophies, maybe slightly more consistent level of performance than we have had post Fergie) but ETH is much more of an unknown

 

[Ludens the Red]

I mean I get it, since Ten Hag gets his best players nicked and is in a generally competitive league. While Poch has a bottomless pit of money in a league of financially poor teams with Mbappe, Messi and Neymar up front.

I don’t think the gap between them is as vast as some united fans make out though. Ten Hag has still only coached in Holland, and look at the likes of Koeman and De Boer who succeeded there before coming to the PL. He’d still be my first choice, but the way some people go on about Poch you’d think he was Mike Basset.

Ajax spend and budget completely dwarfs the rest of eredivisie too tbh. In all honesty both PSG and Ajax should walk their leagues. I’m no @Amadaeus though It is just a little weird how the one being managed by the club not walking the league is the one United should apparently 100% definitely go for.

 

[2 man midfield]

Ajax spend and budget completely dwarfs the rest of eredivisie too tbh. In all honesty both PSG and Ajax should walk their leagues. I’m no @Amadaeus though It is just a little weird how the one being managed by the club not walking the league is the one United should apparently 100% definitely go for.

I’ll confess to being pretty happy if we get either manager. I don’t really know enough about either to get militant about it, but I was really impressed with Ajax’s champions league run and the fact they’ve conceded about 5 goals all season. Poch is a great manager too no doubt, he made spurs a serious team.

 

[Caesar2290]

Ajax spend and budget completely dwarfs the rest of eredivisie too tbh. In all honesty both PSG and Ajax should walk their leagues. I’m no @Amadaeus though It is just a little weird how the one being managed by the club not walking the league is the one United should apparently 100% definitely go for.

Because he already won 2 Double Doubles and and would have had 3 consecutive Eredevise Titles if it weren't for Covid and is on track to winning the 4th consecutive Title. That and after his 2019 CL run, he managed to rebuild his team and have another good showing in the competition with a fraction of a budget.

Poch has yet to win anything serious. Though tbf this year he should win his first Ligue 1. But the fact remains that last year he needed 1 point from 2 relegation fodder teams in Lorient and Nantes to secure the title. He lost both those matches. That to me is as big of a red flag as it comes.

Poch is a good manager... for Spurs. To me he is a even a bigger gamble for a team like United whose aspirations is to challenge for a title.

 

[Offside]

Thats a dumb argument. So if Ajax won 33, drew 1, lost 0, and PSV 32, drew 1, lost 1, Ajax wins the league by 3 points, he should be penalized for Schmidt also had an excellent season?

That’s a dumb reply. It’s a perfectly reasonable point to make. You would expect the Ajax manager who everyone is waxing lyrical over to be dominant in Holland. He isn’t.

 

[lsd]

And my point being you can't necessarily be dominant if your rivals are matching your pace, which is totally out of your hands.

Yet Poch gets criticised for only being 16 points clear.

Both managers have the top teams in their countries with the most resources.

Surely we could compare how well they are doing in their respective leagues?

From my perspective Poch gets judged more harshly as he is at a bigger club with a higher profile.

Ten Hag doesn't have that problem yet my worry is how he would cope at a club like United when the media turns the pressure up on him and no Ajax and the Dutch league does not have the same scrutiny no matter of what people here might think.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Poch is a has been. He's damaged goods, that's my biggest concern. And he will never love us like he did Spurs.

ETH is on the rise, just like how Klopp was at Dortmund. He may not be dominating the league but his CL performances more than make up for it. He spanked Dortmund twice with less than half the resources.

 

[Cheimoon]

Because he already won 2 Double Doubles and and would have had 3 consecutive Eredevise Titles if it weren't for Covid and is on track to winning the 4th consecutive Title.

That's not really correct. In the season that was aborted, Ajax and AZ were level on points while AZ was enjoying much better momentum. At that point, AZ was likelier to win the title than Ajax, but Ajax got CL due to being ahead on goal difference (and may thus have been lucky with the season being stopped early).

 

[KirkDuyt]

Thats a dumb argument. So if Ajax won 33, drew 1, lost 0, and PSV 32, drew 1, lost 1, Ajax wins the league by 3 points, he should be penalized for Schmidt also had an excellent season?

That's not the case though. Ajax dropped 5 points against Go ahead Eagles alone. PSV are far from great this season and most of their fans are happy Roger Schmid is fecking off in the summer. Ajax tend to have severe lapses in concentratie in the league. The difference in squad quality is as big as it is with PSG in France. They will probably win the league, but that they're this close att his stage is quite embarrassing.

 

[DWelbz19]

I think, fundamentally, both Poch and Ten Hag are good managers. Are they elite level? Probably not, but they are both equally the best of the bunch we can get who come with their own flaws.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It’s interesting that so many people use Ajax’s CL run in 2019 as a reason we should definitely hire ATH while also claiming that the manager who ended that run and actually got his team to the final (at an arguably lesser club) is nowhere near good enough.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

It’s interesting that so many people use Ajax’s CL run in 2019 as a reason we should definitely hire ATH while also claiming that the manager who ended that run and actually got his team to the final (at an arguably lesser club) is nowhere near good enough.

His no where near good enough because he was atrocious for a full year in the league till he was rightly sacked. With the UCL run hiding this fact. He also beat Ten Haag using a side with superior experience and proven world class players.

He then is struggling to get a consistent systematic tune out of PSG with the best squad in all Europe, 1.5 seasons in. But every excuse under the sun is trotted out to absolve him of the responsibility. Yet all he does is win games in moments and sheer individual brilliance at his disposal. Things many of his supporter hated Ole's reign for.

 

[The Dane]

I much prefer that we take our chance with a Manager who is on his way up, even if he has only proven himself in a lesser league, than going for Poch, who like LVG and Mourinho when they came to us, might have peaked.

 

[acnumber9]

He may not be dominating the league but his CL performances more than make up for it.

They’ve got out of the groups twice in his five seasons. Including one season they were beat in the qualifiers by Rosenborg. To date it’s one good run. Great though it was.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

His no where near good enough because he was atrocious for a full year in the league till he was rightly sacked. With the UCL run hiding this fact. He also beat Ten Haag using a side with superior experience and proven world class players.

He then is struggling to get a consistent systematic tune out of PSG with the best squad in all Europe, 1.5 seasons in. But every excuse under the sun is trotted out to absolve him of the responsibility. Yet all he does is win games in moments and sheer individual brilliance at his disposal. Things many of his supporter hated Ole's reign for.

I much prefer that we take our chance with a Manager who is on his way up, even if he has only proven himself in a lesser league, than going for Poch, who like LVG and Mourinho when they came to us, might have peaked.

Another interesting inconsistency in this debate is how Poch’s “failure” at PSG is a definite red flag yet Tuchel going one better and actually getting sacked by the same club hasn’t tarnished his reputation.

 

[V.O.]

Another interesting inconsistency in this debate is how Poch’s “failure” at PSG is a definite red flag yet Tuchel going one better and actually getting sacked by the same club hasn’t tarnished his reputation.

Yeah, winning the Champions League the same season as getting sacked tends to even out the reputational loss a little bit.

This is just contrarianism for its own sake, isn't it?

 

[Jim Beam]

It’s interesting that so many people use Ajax’s CL run in 2019 as a reason we should definitely hire ATH while also claiming that the manager who ended that run and actually got his team to the final (at an arguably lesser club) is nowhere near good enough.

Aye, extremes as always.

I wouldn't want Poch because of this.

Spoiler

Horrendous against top 6 away and once he got the clear chance to win FA Cup at Wembley bottled it again in absolutely uninspiring way against Jose Mourinho who was already at exit door in United.

He is a good manager, would be our best since Fergie, but reservations are rightly there.

 

[Samid]

Aye, extremes as always.

I wouldn't want Poch because of this.

Spoiler

Horrendous against top 6 away and once he got the clear chance to win FA Cup at Wembley bottled it again in absolutely uninspiring way against Jose Mourinho who was already at exit door in United.

He is a good manager, would be our best since Fergie, but reservations are rightly there.

Yikes. Moyes level bad.

 

[andersj]

His no where near good enough because he was atrocious for a full year in the league till he was rightly sacked. With the UCL run hiding this fact. He also beat Ten Haag using a side with superior experience and proven world class players.

He then is struggling to get a consistent systematic tune out of PSG with the best squad in all Europe, 1.5 seasons in. But every excuse under the sun is trotted out to absolve him of the responsibility. Yet all he does is win games in moments and sheer individual brilliance at his disposal. Things many of his supporter hated Ole's reign for.

Still got top 4 in his last full season. Despite a very thin squad and a lot of injuries. That the squad was thin is well supported by their wage cost, 20-30 % below Arsenal and 35-45 % below Chelsea, LFC, MC and Man Utd.

 

[andersj]

Aye, extremes as always.

I wouldn't want Poch because of this.

Spoiler

Horrendous against top 6 away and once he got the clear chance to win FA Cup at Wembley bottled it again in absolutely uninspiring way against Jose Mourinho who was already at exit door in United.

He is a good manager, would be our best since Fergie, but reservations are rightly there.

By «biggest» reservation about him as well.

Get Tuchel.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Aye, extremes as always.

I wouldn't want Poch because of this.

Spoiler

Horrendous against top 6 away and once he got the clear chance to win FA Cup at Wembley bottled it again in absolutely uninspiring way against Jose Mourinho who was already at exit door in United.

He is a good manager, would be our best since Fergie, but reservations are rightly there.

This is alarming.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Another interesting inconsistency in this debate is how Poch’s “failure” at PSG is a definite red flag yet Tuchel going one better and actually getting sacked by the same club hasn’t tarnished his reputation.

Tuchel didn't get sacked because of a failure though.

He fell out with Leonardo, unless you want to term that as a failure too.

He's still accomplished more than Poch did at PSG.

 

[CM]

Another interesting inconsistency in this debate is how Poch’s “failure” at PSG is a definite red flag yet Tuchel going one better and actually getting sacked by the same club hasn’t tarnished his reputation.

Honestly don't think Tuchel is that good of a manager either. He obviously did well to win the Champions League and his Chelsea team are well organised defensively but they leave something to be desired in attack.

They've gone on a couple of barren runs in the league already under Tuchel where they haven't scored many or picked up that many points. Not that it makes him a terrible manager, but certainly not in the same bracket as Klopp or Guardiola as some suggested last season.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah, winning the Champions League the same season as getting sacked tends to even out the reputational loss a little bit.

This is just contrarianism for its own sake, isn't it?

Not at all. I just see loads of double standards here. Obviously Tuchel’s CL at Chelsea inflated his reputation since but it doesn’t change the fact that failing at PSG didn’t make him a bad manager. Yet there are hundreds of posts on here claiming that Poch is a bad manager for that same reason.

 

[Stadjer]

Not at all. I just see loads of double standards here. Obviously Tuchel’s CL at Chelsea inflated his reputation since but it doesn’t change the fact that failing at PSG didn’t make him a bad manager. Yet there are hundreds of posts on here claiming that Poch is a bad manager for that same reason.

Tuchel didnt fail at PSG. If Neymar could finish he would have won the CL with PSG. He won the league every time and was 1 point behind the number 1 when he was fired. Tuchel did better at PSG than Pog is doing.

 

[lsd]

Tuchel didnt fail at PSG. If Neymar could finish he would have won the CL with PSG. He won the league every time and was 1 point behind the number 1 when he was fired. Tuchel did better at PSG than Pog is doing.

Poch is 16 points clear is he not also outplayed Real in the first leg of the champions League and who knows where he would be if Messi and Neymar were playing anywhere near what they should be at.

How can you give Tuchel a pass on his half a season but not Poch in his half a season last year with the same team ?

 

[L1nk]

By «biggest» reservation about him as well.

Get Tuchel.

Why on earth do you think we’ll be able to get Tuchel from Chelsea? Some people living in FM world. The time to get him was when he left PSG but we stuck with Ole because we are stupid.

 

[Santoryo]

I like how people go through all these mental gymnastics to justify their double standards.

The scariest part is that they actually believe they are being impartial.

 

[Amadaeus]

Poch is 16 points clear is he not also outplayed Real in the first leg of the champions League and who knows where he would be if Messi and Neymar were playing anywhere near what they should be at.

How can you give Tuchel a pass on his half a season but not Poch in his half a season last year with the same team ?

It is crazy, he is repeating the same argument lots of fan on here are repeating like they have been gaslighted or something. Even when everything else point the opposite of what they say. Their next argument will be that poch failed to beat one team that would have won them the title, so poch is to blame because of that. Yet tuchel wasn't to blame despite losing as much the his half a season. I will have to do a research on who gaslighted these fans.

Not to divert to much from this thread, who was the team Ajax lost to??? I never heard of them before. Are they in contention for champion league spot?

 

[United in sin]

It is crazy, he is repeating the same argument lots of fan on here are repeating like they have been gaslighted or something. Even when everything else point the opposite of what they say. Their next argument will be that poch failed to beat one team that would have won them the title, so poch is to blame because of that. Yet tuchel wasn't to blame despite losing as much the his half a season. I will have to do a research on who gaslighted these fans.

Not to divert to much from this thread, who was the team Ajax lost to??? I never heard of them before. Are they in contention for champion league spot?

Go ahead eagles, that's the name of the team. I first heard about them in the 90s watching LVGs Ajax. They are a perennial midtable club. They did produce Marc Overmars and Raymond Van Der Gouw. They have won the Dutch league four times, last title was in the 30s. They are currently 12th, 31 points behind Ajax

 

[Caesar2290]

Poch is 16 points clear is he not also outplayed Real in the first leg of the champions League and who knows where he would be if Messi and Neymar were playing anywhere near what they should be at.

How can you give Tuchel a pass on his half a season but not Poch in his half a season last year with the same team ?

Because Tuchel reached the CL final in the Covid year, his PSG team only had 1 week off at the start of the season. That completely messed up his start of season, hence why he was off boil. In his previous campaigns PSG was always imperious in the league.

That’s a dumb reply. It’s a perfectly reasonable point to make. You would expect the Ajax manager who everyone is waxing lyrical over to be dominant in Holland. He isn’t.

Fergie won a couple of league titles by a couple of points. Our 1999 and 2008 team won their titles on the final day of season, but according to your logic those teams weren't dominant enough. Fair enough, let's compare their points and goals tally then.

ETH's Ajax has 57 points, scored 71 goals and conceded 7 in 24 games. That's 2.38 points per game, 2.96 goals scored per game and 0.29 goals conceded per game. And that is after today's 2-1 loss to Go Ahead Eagles(his ex-club btw)

Poch so far has 62 points, scored 56 goals and conceded 23 goals in 26 games. That's 2.38 points per game, 2.15 goals scored per game and 0.88 goals conceded per game. That with the most expensive attack in history of football.

Great stats for both, but league wise not much between them. In the CL ETH was head and shoulders above Poch, but his group didn't have City, so that's a moot point.

So ETH is performing slightly better in the Eredevise than Poch in the Ligue 1. Not his problem that Ligue 1 opposition is absolutely trash when it comes to the league.

Not to divert to much from this thread, who was the team Ajax lost to??? I never heard of them before. Are they in contention for champion league spot?

Friendly reminder that Poch needed 1 point from Lorient and Nantes who were relegation fodder to clinch the Ligue 1. In classic Poch fashion he chocked and missed out on the title.