No, I'm referring to all the posts saying we will not win tomorrow. I think you're trying to argue something else. That doesn't make you sound a bit clever and that's not ok.
Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Sacked
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He's not good at it though. Of course he can't just burn everything through his answers, but there's more than one way to combine realism with optimism.
But Ten Hag just isn't a charismatic public speaker with strong oneliners (apart from that one about dynasties coming and going I suppose), so by now everyone should know what to expect.
He's doing a bloody good job at pissig off every United fan out there with his statements that's for sure. Quite a feat when "managing himself carefully"
The results are shit. So whatever he says will piss people off at the moment.
If the results were there those same people would post "
love it" at everything he said.The results are shit. So whatever he says will piss people off at the moment.
If the results were there those same people would post "
I don't disagree but he certainly doesn't help himself as some of the things he says sound like pure WUMs. Thing is I don't think he is wumming. I think he means these things. Which makes it even worse
Over 50% also thought we'd beat Spurs. Many still haven't caught up with just how bad we are.
It's not remotely positive. Just like it was a banker that we were going to get a late equaliser against Porto. That wasn't positive either. I can see him scraping a few wins before the international break, which will most certainly prolong this nightmare.
You get the point. Neither was Churchill, Genghis Khan, Hitler, the Pope, etc…
There has been so much banging on about how if Ten Hag were sacked, Southgate will be hired to replace him. Let me be clear, I wouldn’t want Southgate either, but:
Southgate with England: P 102 W61 D24 L17 59.8%
Ten Hag: P 125 W69 D22 L34 55.2%
Southgate with England: P 102 W61 D24 L17 59.8%
Ten Hag: P 125 W69 D22 L34 55.2%
Are you for real
Ok..
Most important discussion in this thread
Perhaps things just get lost in translation?I’m been fecking kind here and it doesn’t happen very often. Actually I was being a tad sarcastic.
“You’re a good man, Jonny Evans.”
Perhaps but then I do recall this thread also being quite sure we'd lose to Porto and Villa.
Similarities between LVG and ETH:
Both Dutch.
Both shite for United.
DIfferences between LVG and ETH:
LVG had a genuinely impressive resume at the top level. His arrogance was at least based on past glories. ETH has nothing of the sort. His arrogance is based on feck all.
LVG was a character, he had charisma in spades (whether his brand of charisma was your cup of tea or not). ETH is about as appealing as a flaccid cock wrapped in a wet blanket.
LVG had hair.
(And so forth).
I disagree, when it's been this bad for so long, you have to have some self awareness. Say something more meaningful that will get fans on side and also have the opposite effect of what the journalists want. He's playing into their hands with what he says, whilst winding supporters up who clearly aren't going to agree with what he's saying and his assessment of things.
I understand trying to be positive or whatever he's trying to do, but when it's so bad, he just has to be honest about things. But therein lies the problem, as it now seems to be more about him rather than the team. And he's the one making it that way.
There's a middle ground though that he's never found. He's come off as delusional for a long time, and you've hinted at this when you said you don't get why people "still" read into these things. There's another approach that he could have taken, one that doesn't offend the intelligence of fans. Last season he got people's backs up when he was asked why fans aren't happy and he said because they listen to the media. Do you recognise how that antagonised people? It's basically saying that fans can't form their own opinions based on what they're seeing.
No matter what you say, he's a PR disaster. Absolutely nobody buys what he's saying, so he's just digging his own hole.
You're right there, he's not charismatic.
We knew the ilk of manager we are getting though. When the chips are down I feel it's easy to look like a clown irrespective. When you're doing well it's also difficult to look bad. Ten hag was saying rude things in press conferences at Ajax and the caf was lapping it up at the time, saying they need a manager like that to set the players and the media straight. Of course that's only nice when the team is playing well. It's easy to dislike all the same when the team is shite.
Not comparable. How many games did England play when they were not the favorite. They’re some really bad international teams in there.
I'm already crying to be fair
Is it though? I think it’s the natural reaction, but look down the fixture list and most of the matches are against decent teams. Sure, you’ve got Malta, North Macedonia and Scotland, but there is also Brazil, Belgium, Italy, Spain, France… the only real minnows were in qualifying for the World Cup. Nations League has changed it so you’re playing the top teams consistently.
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It’s truly outstanding. Outstandingly bad.
Are you a baldie?
Apologies if I worded anything arseways, was in my shop and replying then got it busy so I was rushing! ha.
Regarding my question. Firstly, for longevity and success, it needs to be the right manager. I'm not saying than Ten Hag is the right manager - I'm not saying that he's not. I'm merely saying by sticking with a manager at United might have a long term benefit. It's such a stressful and hard job and not many managers in the world are able to actually do it. At United, only TWO managers have had massive success. But they had a long period of success. It was different eras - but the owners gamble on the two paid off. They stuck through a tragedy, Matt Busby rebuilt a team. Busby left, it took years for the right man to come - which is Sir Alex - and he was maybe a goal away from getting sacked. They gambled by keeping him and it paid off.
The one thing none of us know is what it's like behind the scenes. For all we know, the owners are confident Ten Hag is the right man because everything could be perfect......until it comes to match day. If the biggest problem is the players mentality - you can't put all that blame on the manager. Those players there now need to settle their nerves and drive on and who knows, with work they do behind the scenes - maybe that's what can happen. It's like if you work for a builder - you have your training done, you have the right tools and knowledge and then it comes to doing a big job and you're on a serious time frame to finish it and you mess it up....would you blame yourself or your boss? My point being, if a new manager comes in and here's the thing, the training might not be as good as Ten Hag, then match day comes along and their mentality is still bad.....then what? The thing is, none of us can say for sure that the training and behind the scenes work is bad. Benni McCharthy said this in an interview this week. Everything was perfect until matchday.
No.
I have many flaws with regard to appearance, but I have a full head of hair.
Not bragging or anything, but I do.
That said, I would trade all the hairs on my head for true managerial greatness.
(Probably.)
You don’t spend your summer interviewing multiple managers if you think you’ve already got the right man, it’s just illogical
Let me ask you something, do you keep a manager who’s regressing the team because you’re afraid that you might hire another crappy one? Again illogical
I understand that but they came to the conclusion that there wasn't anyone out there that was better and/or wanted the job.
I wasn't saying that. I'm not even trying to defend Ten Hag here but I know it looks that way.
Basically my entire argument here is perhaps the single biggest issue is the players mentality - and I don't think it's fair to put all of that problem on whoever the manager is.
Now, I hope we get a great win tomorrow and United put on an outstanding performance so I don't look like too much of an idiot
Exactly. Which is why I hope we lose most of ours matches coming up so we can be rid of him once and for all. Short term pain = long term gain.
Most of the matches are against decent teams? Are you sure about that.
102 games played:
9 games in World Cup 2018 qualifying against Slovakia, Scotland, Slovenia, Lithuania and Malta (two each apart from Slovakia).
2 games at World Cup 2018 against Panama and Tunisia.
8 games in Euro 2020 qualifying against Czech Republic, Kosovo, Bulgaria and Montenegero.
3 games in Euro 2020 against Czech Republic, Scotland and Ukraine.
2 games in Nations League 2020/21 against Iceland.
8 games in World Cup 2022 qualifying against Albania, Hungary, Andorra and San Marino.
4 games in World Cup 2022 against Iran, USA, Wales and Senegal.
2 games in Nations League 2022/23 against Hungary.
6 games in Euro 2024 qualifying against Ukraine, North Macedonia and Malta.
3 games in Euro 2024 against Slovenia, Serbia and Slovakia.
12 games in friendlies against Nigeria, Costa Rica, USA, Wales, Republic of Ireland, Austria, Romania, Ivory Coast, Scotland, Australia, Bosnia and Herzegovina and Iceland.
That's 59 games already (58% of his total), and this also (quite generously) classes the likes of Colombia, Sweden, Poland, Switzerland and Denmark as "decent", and not teams England should have been favourites against.
By and large, when he did play the "decent" teams, the results were falling in the D and L columns.
I understand that but they came to the conclusion that there wasn't anyone out there that was better and/or wanted the job.
I wasn't saying that. I'm not even trying to defend Ten Hag here but I know it looks that way.
Basically my entire argument here is perhaps the single biggest issue is the players mentality - and I don't think it's fair to put all of that problem on whoever the manager is.
Now, I hope we get a great win tomorrow and United put on an outstanding performance so I don't look like too much of an idiot
If that were the case then you have to ask yourself. Who has signed/promoted a good 80% of these players and been training and managing them for over 2 years now?
Mentality is also less easy to harness if you're constantly putting less confident personnel in high stake situations. Ten Hag's biggest own goal last season is the way he had everything so open and never resorted to pragmatism just to get some confidence and solidarity back among the players. It's a lot easier to build a winning mentality from that point, and then go on to try something expansive.
How many of those players has he worked with before and then gone and bought them again? So he’s already know their mentality.I understand that but they came to the conclusion that there wasn't anyone out there that was better and/or wanted the job.
I wasn't saying that. I'm not even trying to defend Ten Hag here but I know it looks that way.
Basically my entire argument here is perhaps the single biggest issue is the players mentality - and I don't think it's fair to put all of that problem on whoever the manager is.
Now, I hope we get a great win tomorrow and United put on an outstanding performance so I don't look like too much of an idiot
So sorry i don’t buy that. 1 or 2 players maybe but the rest is on the coach to motivate and drive them (regardless of who the coach is)
I’m struggling to think of one player he has improved
Yeah, it's a difficult situation to be in. A better media communicator might find a way to balance between admitting how poor things have been and taking some blame, and making a confident case for optimism for the future. But Ten Hag isn't that guy.
Either way, though, it seems many would only accept it if he told the media that things are terrible and that's his fault, and of course he'll never say that. Which manager ever did? I mean, if he did that, the next sentence could really only be 'and that's why I'm resigning'.
Well keeping him also makes them look daft too tbh
The “Eye of Sauron” has been focussed on the America’s Cup in Barcelona. As soon as SJR loses that, he’ll send Ben Ainslie up the Manchester Ship Canal, like Captain Jack Sparrow, wanting to know where all the rum has gone! EtH is done! His press conferences are just laughable and an absolute embarrassment!
Nothing to do with wasting hundreds of millions on terrible signings then Eric?
He talks absolute nonsense.
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