Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Sacked

[romufc]

The rumours of his sacking is pretty intense in the media. SJR was also asked by reporter on the subject. If the decision is 100% to keep ETH, I'm pretty sure one of the board personnel will speak to the media. As things stand, ETH days are numbered.

Why should one of the board speak to the media? Why do fans think that if they cry about Ten Hag, they will get answers from the board?

They had a review in June and then came out and said they back him and extended his contract. Thereafter; both Berrada and Ashworth have come out in support after the Liverpool game. Why would we get another briefing about the manager?

INEOS and the board are well within their right to not say anything unless they are sacking him.

The media and fans are driving this, they wont fall into the media and fan pressure to sack him, it will be because they have decided to sack him.

They are definitely not going to come out every 4 games to back him, the next time we hear anything will only be to sack him.

 

[Sarni]

The rumours of his sacking is pretty intense in the media. SJR was also asked by reporter on the subject. If the decision is 100% to keep ETH, I'm pretty sure one of the board personnel will speak to the media. As things stand, ETH days are numbered.

It’s not really though? No reliable outlets have said anything about him being fired.

It seems like it’s really a group fans being anxious about this and thinking his job is on the line. Otherwise he seems perfectly safe and happy, and that’s also how he seems to perceive it.

 

[Red in STL]

I can’t believe I’m still reading this sort of crap honestly. It’s just not relevant to where we are now in 2024? So much has changed.

Maybe because it's true, yes the game is much different

At the time the board thought he was the right man for the job but on the pitch there wasn't a great deal of evidence to prove it, what happened later shows the people running the club were right and much of the fanbase were wrong

That is exactly what the position seems to be today

 

[Garnacho Libre]

Despite his English his bullshite excuses are easy to understand.

Results are so bad it's like, what can you say? I think in his own language he would give a better detailed response. (That's where I am coming from).

I don’t think it’s going to be sound any different in Dutch that he doesn’t have a fecking clue what he is doing. He will sound the same, petulant, ludicrous and idiotic when he says one day it will click eh and we need to do better eh.

Maybe not just a thought.

It must be extremely hard to keep your lips shit though, if you were in his position. There's things going on you can't blame a manager. Players do have to take responsibility as well - everyone at the club does. Ten Hag does need to adapt better and not be as stubborn in his tactics that's' where I would be critical of him. But a player blatantly giving the ball away and not running and not tackling, that's nothing to do with a manager.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Why should one of the board speak to the media? Why do fans think that if they cry about Ten Hag, they will get answers from the board?

They had a review in June and then came out and said they back him and extended his contract. Thereafter; both Berrada and Ashworth have come out in support after the Liverpool game. Why would we get another briefing about the manager?

INEOS and the board are well within their right to not say anything unless they are sacking him.

The media and fans are driving this, they wont fall into the media and fan pressure to sack him, it will be because they have decided to sack him.

They are definitely not going to come out every 4 games to back him, the next time we hear anything will only be to sack him.

First of all, it's not "the fans cry" about ETH. Basically majority people in football (not only Man Utd fans) are still in disbelief that ETH is still in the job. It's simple, when people see terrible football, it tells. Especially after spending 600M and 3rd year into the job. This is basic football knowledge that football people understand. Hence, the intense rumours of sacking of the manager.

This is not under normal situations where we don't need our board to come up to clear the air every other game. We are in crisis and the football is terrible. The club need to have more communication with the fans. Sitting at 14th with negative GD is a crisis!

 

[romufc]

It’s not really though? No reliable outlets have said anything about him being fired.

It seems like it’s really a group fans being anxious about this and thinking his job is on the line. Otherwise he seems perfectly safe and happy, and that’s also how he seems to perceive it.

Exactly. I said this when posters were posting the same journalist who thought he will be sacked but I was told they are reliable. Mirror and Telegraph were saying he is definitely gone, same like they did in June, its pretty clear now that they do not have any clue and are guessing.

Like you say, alot of fans who were Ten Hag out have had a chance to come out and spark this, thinking they would be sacked and if not they have INEOS on fraud watch. Its the same people who didn't want INEOS in the first place and them backing Ten Hag is obviously a big ticket item to knock them on.

Although I want Ten Hag out and cannot see him turning it around, it is obvious they are willing to be patient in order to change the culture.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

It’s not really though? No reliable outlets have said anything about him being fired.

It seems like it’s really a group fans being anxious about this and thinking his job is on the line. Otherwise he seems perfectly safe and happy, and that’s also how he seems to perceive it.

A group of fans being anxious? I guess we have to agree to disagree.

 

[tjb]

I understand their wait, but for me, I genuinely feel for the players.

As long as he's here, they will be thrown under the bus for tactical failures. I genuinely believe that our attacking issues over the last 3 seasons and our defensive issues since last season have been down to tactics, which is why I find it so funny when people talk about goals not being in the team. There are goals, the system is just so poor that we don't create the requisite chances.

I saw the same thing with LVG. Complex structured systems in attack, that require so many variables to succeed before an actual chance can be created. In a league as fast and physical as the Premier League, unless you are Man City, that patient intricacy is not consistently possible. There are just too many elements in these attacks that can breakdown, and since we don't dominate possession, we don't have as many opportunities to get them right.

I'm not guaranteeing that this squad would be perfect with another manager, but i do feel its the most complete squad we've had since Fergie retired. I think we have good players, that can become great players if put in a position to succeed. Unfortunately, we have a purposely young team, where poor direction, poor tactics and poor team performances can kill their confidence and stunt their growth. I don't think as a club, we can afford to keep a manager that can hamper our future success. Fans might not be the biggest fans of Rashford at the moment, but I can make the argument that it was poor and inconsistent management that has led him not to fulfill some of the potential we had seen. The current system requires Garnacho and Amad to run past 3 players to get an opportunity to create a chance, we don't overlap and the movements around these players are poor when they are out wide.

 

[MUFC07]

It was a scheduled meeting. They’ve already said before he has their full backing, gave him an extension and for all we know they are happy with him. For all we know they may have not even discussed manager’s job yesterday.

So they were in there for hours discussing fixing bathrooms and potential recruiting of players, or worse, investors/sponsorships, for our 14th placed club?

 

[stevoc]

A food for thought.

This might have been discussed at some point so my bad if it has.

Does anyone think Ten Hag would be better off speaking Dutch with a translator at press conferences? My point being, I don't think he properly explains himself and things come out sort of ''simple'' and ''basic''. I think this could help him communicate to reporters and us (fans) with more intelligent commentary. Before anyone says it, he's not stupid. He looks and sounds worse than reality IMO because of results.

Well he's been living and working in England for 2 and a half years. He really should have been working with an English tutor to improve his English.

His English is fine for conversation but communicating with players and representing the club in press conferences. It could be better.

 

[romufc]

First of all, it's not "the fans cry" about ETH. Basically majority people in football (not only Man Utd fans) are still in disbelief that ETH is still in the job. It's simple, when people see terrible football, it tells. Especially after spending 600M and 3rd year into the job. This is basic football knowledge that football people understand. Hence, the intense rumours of sacking of the manager.

This is not under normal situations where we don't need our board to come up to clear the air every other game. We are in crisis and the football is terrible. The club need to have more communication with the fans. Sitting at 14th with negative GD is a crisis!

Well, I think he should be sacked, I am not here saying we need to keep him. The rumours are always there when we lose games about our manager being sacked. Add to that the media dont really like him, it adds the pressure. The club have said they speak to him on a regular, INEOS were watching the game so they know what the situation is. Its not like the Glazers who relied on Woodward. Brailsford, Ashworth, Wilcox are in attendance all the time.

 

[George The Best]

A food for thought.

This might have been discussed at some point so my bad if it has.

Does anyone think Ten Hag would be better off speaking Dutch with a translator at press conferences? My point being, I don't think he properly explains himself and things come out sort of ''simple'' and ''basic''. I think this could help him communicate to reporters and us (fans) with more intelligent commentary. Before anyone says it, he's not stupid. He looks and sounds worse than reality IMO because of results.

IF he has a communication problem, it’s more important that the players know what in the hell he’s telling them, rather than the Press or us fans.

 

[stevoc]

And if you apply that logic that historically then the SAF PL era would never have happened, in the modern day game he would have been sacked about 1988-89 season

Personally I don't think ETH is the man to takes us forward but be careful what you wish for because a lot of fans thought the same about Fergie after 3-4 years of his reign

I'd be willing to take that risk personally. Otherwise we'd have to keep every failing manager in the job for 6+ years on the very remote chance they might be another Fergie. We'd have only sacked Jose last season.

 

[didz]

A food for thought.

This might have been discussed at some point so my bad if it has.

Does anyone think Ten Hag would be better off speaking Dutch with a translator at press conferences? My point being, I don't think he properly explains himself and things come out sort of ''simple'' and ''basic''. I think this could help him communicate to reporters and us (fans) with more intelligent commentary. Before anyone says it, he's not stupid. He looks and sounds worse than reality IMO because of results.

No. By all accounts, this is pretty much how he communicated in Dutch too.

 

[lex talionis]

I honestly have never had the excitement to watch United leave me so quickly. It’s fecking October and I almost can’t be bothered

I'm a long suffering fan of losing clubs, which for some reason we call "franchises" in the US, and I like to think at least that I can handle a bad run of form by the club (or franchise) I support, but what we have been seeing now for over 12 months (and in truth, for about a decade with the exception of a few nice runs of form under Jose and Ole) -- with the exception of two very performances against City in the FA Cup and then the Community Shield -- has been shocking. If we were bedding in young players we'd all be on board with the rebuilding program, but we are not bedding in new young players. The performance level continues to drop.

Let's play a quick mind game: did anyone here, I mean is there a single United supporter whatsoever -- who was actually surprised to see Liverpool and Spurs dismantle us? I seriously doubt it. Is anyone actually surprised that after the abysmal summer friendlies that we have started the season so poorly?

There's not much to look forward to from United until we do something about the manager, who has lost the players in my humble opinion.

 

[Wilt]

Results are so bad it's like, what can you say? I think in his own language he would give a better detailed response. (That's where I am coming from).

Maybe not just a thought.

It must be extremely hard to keep your lips shit though, if you were in his position. There's things going on you can't blame a manager. Players do have to take responsibility as well - everyone at the club does. Ten Hag does need to adapt better and not be as stubborn in his tactics that's' where I would be critical of him. But a player blatantly giving the ball away and not running and not tackling, that's nothing to do with a manager.

Get what your saying, compared to Slot for instance his English is not great and can sound quite abrasive but it’s not difficult to understand. However, many of his decisions and excuses are difficult to understand.

 

[Redstain]

Too late for that. We all see what happens on the pitch. Whatever he’s saying and doing, isn’t clicking or achieving what he seems to want.

There's an interesting interview with Phil Jones and Rio where he mentions this very aspect. Though he's being conservative with criticism for the current manager (as he's coaching with u18's) the crux of that segment within the interview, is that one of the best qualities fans can't appreciate is the players need to resonate with the manager.

He mentioned Mourinho in this regard being the best manager for him since SAF retired but on the basis of what he was explaining it feels like none of the players have a strong enough association with Erik on an interpersonal level, almost as if he doesn't have the charisma to bring a group of individuals on board, Phil mentions the likes of Klopp, Simeone and Arteta having those characteristics that players want to play under.

So for all the talk about standards and procedures to get back at the top, I think one of the biggest issues with Erik is that he doesn't understand how to transcend a relationship with the players culturally.

I am surprised the interview isn't mentioned more on the forums, Jones comes across really well in the points he's making and all in all it's a confirmation for me that Erik will never succeed as a United manager.



I've timestamped the interview where he begins to touch on Erik's short-fallings as a manager:

 

[Zed 101]

I understand their wait, but for me, I genuinely feel for the players.

As long as he's here, they will be thrown under the bus for tactical failures. I genuinely believe that our attacking issues over the last 3 seasons and our defensive issues since last season have been down to tactics, which is why I find it so funny when people talk about goals not being in the team. There are goals, the system is just so poor that we don't create the requisite chances.

I saw the same thing with LVG. Complex structured systems in attack, that require so many variables to succeed before an actual chance can be created. In a league as fast and physical as the Premier League, unless you are Man City, that patient intricacy is not consistently possible. There are just too many elements in these attacks that can breakdown, and since we don't dominate possession, we don't have as many opportunities to get them right.

I'm not guaranteeing that this squad would be perfect with another manager, but i do feel its the most complete squad we've had since Fergie retired. I think we have good players, that can become great players if put in a position to succeed. Unfortunately, we have a purposely young team, where poor direction, poor tactics and poor team performances can kill their confidence and stunt their growth. I don't think as a club, we can afford to keep a manager that can hamper our future success. Fans might not be the biggest fans of Rashford at the moment, but I can make the argument that it was poor and inconsistent management that has led him not to fulfill some of the potential we had seen. The current system requires Garnacho and Amad to run past 3 players to get an opportunity to create a chance, we don't overlap and the movements around these players are poor when they are out wide.

I agree 100% it is not just about 1 season or a few games, the situation that has developed over the last 18 months is now deleterious to the development of the team, if we persist with ETH which is looking (unbelievably) likely then it is hard to see an upside even if we did manage to get a few results over the next games, unless ETH suddenly sees the light and starts employing tactics that could work in the premier league then it is not going to change, this team, these players and ETH have proven incapable of making ETHs tactics and system work since the latter part of his 1st season.

People look for signs of improvement and yes this season you could argue that we do look slightly better than last season, but that is against a backdrop of just how poor we were last season, confidence was up at the start of the season but it was so fragile that disappointing results see the team looking more disenchanted than they have at any time since Rangnick

 

[Musclehead]

Too late for that. We all see what happens on the pitch. Whatever he’s saying and doing, isn’t clicking or achieving what he seems to want.

My thoughts exactly on the ability to communicate. Think about it, with such a diverse team, do players really understand what he is saying or wants? I just get a very monotone feel when he talks, very little emotion and the team will reflect that. I cannot see him giving the hairdryer effect to motivate guys.

 

[RedRover]

I'm not really sure why you keep mentioning accountants as if they're the only people who care about the financial impact of a decision.

The finance team at United will be staffed by Accountants. Those people, and that team, will be consulted on the impact of potential decisions and advise on cash flow/forecasting. That info will be passed to the right people in the business within it's structure so they can make a decision. It's a pyramid structure, like all big commercial entities.

The people in Football Operations team will not make decisions based on cost and/or financial impacts because that's not their job and they're not paid to worry about it.

 

[The Firestarter]

There's an interesting interview with Phil Jones and Rio where he mentions this very aspect. Though he's being conservative with criticism for the current manager (as he's coaching with u18's) the crux of that segment within the interview, is that one of the best qualities fans can't appreciate is the players need to resonate with the manager.

He mentioned Mourinho in this regard being the best manager for him since SAF retired but on the basis of what he was explaining it feels like none of the players have a strong enough association with Erik on an interpersonal level, almost as if he doesn't have the charisma to bring a group of individuals on board, Phil mentions the likes of Klopp, Simeone and Arteta having those characteristics that players want to play under.

So for all the talk about standards and procedures to get back at the top, I think one of the biggest issues with Erik is that he doesn't understand how to transcend a relationship with the players culturally.

I am surprised the interview isn't mentioned more on the forums, Jones comes across really well in the points he's making and all in all it's a confirmation for me that Erik will never succeed as a United manager.



I've timestamped the interview where he begins to touch on Erik's short-fallings as a manager:

By that metric I don't think Tuchel would be successful long-term either. A nervous wreck that will progressively freak out everyone around him. His tactics actually will work though . So for steading the ship he would suffice.

 

[golden_blunder]

Results are so bad it's like, what can you say? I think in his own language he would give a better detailed response. (That's where I am coming from).

Maybe not just a thought.

It must be extremely hard to keep your lips shit though, if you were in his position. There's things going on you can't blame a manager. Players do have to take responsibility as well - everyone at the club does. Ten Hag does need to adapt better and not be as stubborn in his tactics that's' where I would be critical of him. But a player blatantly giving the ball away and not running and not tackling, that's nothing to do with a manager.

It is if the manager keeps picking him

 

[marcus agrippa]

And if you apply that logic that historically then the SAF PL era would never have happened, in the modern day game he would have been sacked about 1988-89 season

Personally I don't think ETH is the man to takes us forward but be careful what you wish for because a lot of fans thought the same about Fergie after 3-4 years of his reign

And there we have it folks. Jesus wept.

I suppose we should have stuck with Ron Atkinson too, right?

 

[Rasmus_9]

I suspect we are now in the position where the board are deciding if sacking him now makes sense financially- loss of income from poor performances on the pitch V’s compensation.

Unfortunately, extending his contract means the compensation he’d be due is over £10 million. I’d imagine he has a ‘non champions league’ clause in his contract where we can release him for cheaper than it would otherwise cost. Therefore, I think ETH will still be in charge until we mathematically can’t reach top four (same as Moyes/ Van Gaal)

Good news is that could be around January or February if our shocking results continue.

 

[Sarni]

So they were in there for hours discussing fixing bathrooms and potential recruiting of players, or worse, investors/sponsorships, for our 14th placed club?

It’s a monthly corporate meeting between several executives, they won’t run short of topics I’m sure.

 

[Sarni]

And there we have it folks. Jesus wept.

I suppose we should have stuck with Ron Atkinson too, right?

Time. The only thing that made Fergie great was time.

 

[Cloud7]

And if you apply that logic that historically then the SAF PL era would never have happened, in the modern day game he would have been sacked about 1988-89 season

Personally I don't think ETH is the man to takes us forward but be careful what you wish for because a lot of fans thought the same about Fergie after 3-4 years of his reign

So I just want to be sure that I'm following your logic here.

People said the same thing about SAF a few years into his time at United, but he ended up proving everyone wrong.

Does this mean that you believe every manager who manages at United should be given a similar amount of time, regardless of how we're doing or looking, because SAF didn't start off that well and got better?

Or do you mean you've seen something in ETH specifically in his time at United that makes you think that he might have a SAF like trajectory?

 

[santeria13]

First of all, it's not "the fans cry" about ETH. Basically majority people in football (not only Man Utd fans) are still in disbelief that ETH is still in the job. It's simple, when people see terrible football, it tells. Especially after spending 600M and 3rd year into the job. This is basic football knowledge that football people understand. Hence, the intense rumours of sacking of the manager.

This is not under normal situations where we don't need our board to come up to clear the air every other game. We are in crisis and the football is terrible. The club need to have more communication with the fans. Sitting at 14th with negative GD is a crisis!

The amount of people in our fanbase seemingly willing to let INEOS off the hook and are making excuses for them is shocking. I've not met a single person outside of our fanbase who isn't utterly shocked that we're allowing ETH to continue. To be fair, a lot in here realise that continuing with him is madness too. It's blindingly obvious.

 

[Cloud7]

Time. The only thing that made Fergie great was time.

It has become very apparent that SAF was wasted on this fanbase. Our takeaway from having one of the greatest managers of all time here for 20 odd years was that the reason he was so good is because he was given time at the start of his reign.

 

[NLunited]

It’s actually the opposite of stupid and it’s the opposite of what the other one calls “hyper-emotional”. It would be completely logical and unemotional for someone who had come to the opinion that a manager was not competent to be ambivalent about short term results that prolong their tenure - to the detriment of long term success, better football, fan happiness and the enduring health of the club.

What a load of shiit. Even at the best of times, there are poor games interspersed with good ones.

If you can’t enjoy a good game, sod off and take a break.

 

[Sarni]

It has become very apparent that SAF was wasted on this fanbase. Our takeaway from having one of the greatest managers of all time here for 20 odd years was that the reason he was so good is because he was given time at the start of his reign.

I find this incredibly annoying. We had perhaps the greatest manager of all time and people now feel it’s ok to compare Moyes and ten Hag to him.

 

[Rolandofgilead]

Damn good veggie burgers there, the green devil spicy burger is much better than anything i've eaten at any other stadium. Also you get to chant dirty vegan bastards at them all game!

Thanks for that. I'll give that one a go. I was going with something along the lines of sticking their tofu up their arse, but as we tend to chant 'you dirty northern bastards' whenever there's a foul, even if we're playing south of London, replacing 'northern' with 'vegan' sounds like a plan.

To be honest though, I just want more of you to find a soft spot for Weymouth fc. I jump on opportunities to promote us a bit. Watching United is painful at the moment so follow the mighty muff.

 

[BarstoolProphet]

I find this incredibly annoying. We had perhaps the greatest manager of all time and people now feel it’s ok to compare Moyes and ten Hag to him.

It's bizarre. Shitting on Sir Alex to put EtH in a better light. Poor Big Ron, if only the board had some patience so he could still be a United manager and regarded as the greatest of them all.

 

[Lee565]

I saw an article about van basten criticising ten hag for loading the team up with second rate players and would have to agree.

 

[MUFC07]

It’s a monthly corporate meeting between several executives, they won’t run short of topics I’m sure.

There's a huge gap in our midfield every time we're being attacked so probably that'll take a place on the "items to be repaired" list. Probably should call in whoever is in charge of "Gaps and meltdowns" as I believe the constant leaking would intervene with everything else that depends on the success of the team in the pitch?

 

[Woodzy]

Someone should probably tell the board that votes can now be changed

 

[NLunited]

A food for thought.

This might have been discussed at some point so my bad if it has.

Does anyone think Ten Hag would be better off speaking Dutch with a translator at press conferences? My point being, I don't think he properly explains himself and things come out sort of ''simple'' and ''basic''. I think this could help him communicate to reporters and us (fans) with more intelligent commentary. Before anyone says it, he's not stupid. He looks and sounds worse than reality IMO because of results.

I’m Dutch and I understand his English just fine. I think he gets his points across despite struggling to find the right words sometimes.

The funniest thing was when he translated the Dutch “verdomd goed voetbal (damn good football)” into “fecking good football” on live tv.

 

[Leftback99]

We should have kept Moyes. On two fronts, one he'd have become the next SAF given time and two we wouldn't have had to hire this guy.

 

[Sarni]

There's a huge gap in our midfield every time we're being attacked so probably that'll take a place on the "items to be repaired" list. Probably should call in whoever is in charge of "Gaps and meltdowns" as I believe the constant leaking would intervene with everything else that depends on the success of the team in the pitch?

I am not sure tactics are high on their agenda. It’s coach’s job and I doubt that they discuss it much without him present.

 

[TsuWave]

And if you apply that logic that historically then the SAF PL era would never have happened, in the modern day game he would have been sacked about 1988-89 season

Personally I don't think ETH is the man to takes us forward but be careful what you wish for because a lot of fans thought the same about Fergie after 3-4 years of his reign

do you reckon that with enough time someone like Ian Holloway could have rivalled Ferguson's legacy?