You are absolutely right. But as long as we see people write here "but SAF was given time and came good" @Yagami has a point. It's beyond stupid that this seems a good idea, but still it is true.What, we have to do something really, really stupid for a long time, because that's the only way we can stop being stupid?
Anyone with half a brain already knows that having many years and a squad full of their own players does not turn someone into Sir Alex.
Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Sacked
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There was rumour of it but I think it was perpetuated more by the people who wanted to believe something had changed with the new structure, i.e. a new contract with different terms on transfer strategy.
They ended up activating the one year extension on the same terms, presumably to give the illusion of trust after looking elsewhere, which was almost as braindead.
I was asking a genuine question mate.
Extremely optimistic. I struggle to find a team we are comfortably better than right now. Maybe Southampton? Its a toss up with the other 19. That's how bad things are.
Sorry, wasn’t a dig but also my thoughts on it. I’m in the camp it’s absolutely on him.
Yeah I'm an analyst by trade and I'm not sure how they can predict a series of games like that. I understand using previous years data, as you would normally. But just seems like trying to do that in sport, especially football, doesn't really work.
So I think all sane people agree it shouldn't matter if we win both of our next two games he should be fired either way.
But I reckon as long as he wins one of 2 he gets to keep his job.
But I reckon as long as he wins one of 2 he gets to keep his job.
Play like we have been and we’ll lose both. The only thing that’ll save him is us miraculously deciding to turn up, like the 3-0 spurs win under Ole that everyone thought was going to be the final nail.
How anybody can think that changing now has 'little sense' is crazy. Writing off another season has little sense.
Indeed. Would be interesting if they did a breakdown of metrics and models they use to predict each game!
Yep, I agree. I've been critical of ten Hag since his first transfer window indicated to me he wasn't set on playing possession football, and have wanted him out for a while, but we've made our bed by keeping him, and I want us to lie in it. Backing out may save this season from embarrassment but won't help in the long run.
It's like the Phoenix rising from the ashes. We need to hit rock bottom to force a cultural change that will allow us to compete at the top long term.
Probably not, no, but it's better than going round in circles like we have been doing for over a decade now.
It's not just people on here. It's a significant portion of the worldwide fan base. I'm from Manchester and go to games and that opinion is a very popular one. We need something drastic like this to change that mindset. After the final against City, the majority wanted to keep ten Hag. Let's give them what they want until they see that it's not going to benefit the club, and then if future managers are clearly out of their depth, there will be no hesitancy in criticising the job they're doing.
No worries mate.
I'd agree at United its definitely mostly Ten Hags fault for our struggles.
Sure, I believe that it's a broader issue. Just for me this forum is the only place where I regularly talk to United fans, so I just think of this
I expect even if we don't play well we will fluke one win and he keeps his job for another few weeks/months.
That's what happened constantly with him so far
85.3% say sack, that's fairly conclusive.
I get what you're saying but personally I'd prefer to look forward and if we at least try to get back to the top under a different manager. In a relatively short period of time.
Just ignore the people who waffle on about give the manager time, give him until Xmas/Summer, Fergie got 6 years, breaking cycles and all the rest of the shite they spout. Once the new managers in place the majority will just switch their allegiance to him anyway. And the faith in the new messiah will begin.
Makes sense! I know you're a Hannover fan but, for the longest time, I thought you were a United fan, too! Either way, I think you're a great poster and make some great posts about UnitedSure, I believe that it's a broader issue. Just for me this forum is the only place where I regularly talk to United fans, so I just think of this
I think, to be fair, the argument is more that stability brings success. The first 2 seasons under ETH have been anything but stable what with the takeover and injuries so I don't think that theory has really been put to the test yet.
We all know it's when not if now.
The other 15% are probably supporters from other clubs how would love him to stay.
Winning away to Porto feels like a long shot and we are going to get absolutely trounced by Villa. 3 day turnaround from an away European trip, dreadful form, against a team in good form with a very good home record.
Imagine 10 years ago telling somebody that Aston Villa were a champions league side and we were mid table/bottom half club... thanks Glazers.
That'll put us back in the same mess again.
Ask yourself this, what happens if we get our Di Matteo and fluke a big trophy? How far someone like that be allowed to sink the club? Relegation?
We need completely destroy this mindset within the clubs fanbase. And that won't happen until we're willing to see this one out. We've already invested 600m and 2 years into this so let's get something out of it.
Funny to see all these posters coming in to let us know they've finally changed to sack in the vote. Now we get to see who these 20% were. Mostly newbies by the looks of it, who don't post much. As expected.
That's completely reasonable. I mean, that's the ideal way and I'd love it if it were to happen the way you say rather than what I'm saying. I just think we'll end up going round in circles again, so I'm all for the drastic action approach.
I echo @Skills post above.
This is another reason as to why I'm for keeping ten Hag. We need to keep him until there are no excuses left. Until the fan base can just admit that he himself was not good enough.
Correct.
There's still people defending some of our post-Fergie ex-managers, despite the fact that they were all monumental failures. The only argument to be had is who was the "least worst" of the lot. And, that's up to personal preference. I genuinely believe the weird affiliation to managers will continue unabated, no matter how much further we fall.
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Thanks a lot! I always had a soft spot for United as well (which is why I'm here). It's actually easy to be a fan of both as both clubs are operating in completely different spheres. Sadly in Hannover's case, I'd be happy if Hannover had United's problems
It's not correct to just single out the managers imo. The club has been an absolute disaster from top to bottom for years.
Can’t afford not to sack.
That's exactly the problem. It's not stability that brings success, it's the other way round. Success brings stability. If you prove that you are the right one for a job by being successful (and in this regard small steps forward can be counted as success) you deserve more time and can enter a phase of stability. If it turns out that you are not up to the job keeping you only deepens the trouble.
I get what you're both saying and wish I could be of the same mindset, as our fans deserve this. But for me personally, it's not good for my health watching this
I don't know how I'd get through another year or more of this. It was hard enough knowing early doors that both he and Ole weren't the one, but having to wait 12-24 months for the rest of the fans (some other fans also saw it early on and shared the same concerns) and media to realise it too. It's like torture when you can see what will happen and why, and it starts slowly playing out. But others just make excuse after excuse, whilst you're just ready for it to end and for us to move on.
You'd probably get a closer representation if the poll was posted in the general so the newbies couldn't vote.
It seems that way, people lose their logic over our managers for some reason. These same individuals would undoubtedly not treat their own businesses this way nor would they have the same opinion about other clubs managers but when it comes to ours there is this weird almost cognitive dissonance that happens.
Good post.
Yet we all know that there's not a single manager on the planet who could have been successful over the last 10 years with the way the club has been run.
I still believe in Erik. This 24 hour media cycle is monstrous, and it loves feeding on United.
I always argued that (most - Mou, LVG, Ole somewhat, even EtH) of United managers post SAF had decent success for a reasonable/normal amount of time and stayed in the job similarly long to most other top clubs in Europe. And that the club always messed up choosing the right successor to advance based on that, instead their choices meant rebuilding everything.
I wouldn't dispute that. But based on what also happens on the pitch, it's fair to say that we haven't appointed particularly well. A bigger problem though, is that we keep underperforming managers on far longer than we should.
That's a good point too. If Jose and Ole had been let go after their second place finishes when it was clear they'd taken the team as far as they could, and then the club built on those seasons instead of throwing all the progress away, I think their respective tenures would be viewed much more positively today.
Of course they would, especially Ole. There was positivity around Ole's second place finish but definitely not around Jose's, who had started his transition into a toxic weirdo by that point.
I'm not so sure about that. I suspect that they've all been constantly undermined, Jose and Ole did as well as they could be expected to do. Can we honestly look back over the last 10 years and imagine any scenario where any manager could have done anything respectable? Perhaps bringing in Jose instead of Moyes could have worked but, other than that, none of them have stood a chance.
I'm, reluctantly, in full agreement that it makes sense to ditch ten Hag at this point as there's clearly an issue between him and the rest of the management structure.
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