Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[kunal18]

Can see why Erik wants a striker and a midfielder.
Rashford was ill and Martial was not fit. So he had to start Ronaldo who is not good enough any more.
Fred is not good enough to play for us.

But the parasitic Disneyland fans wont spend.

The manager is set up to fail.

We have spent more than 200 million in the summer with majority signings being managerial priorities.

 

[Litch]

10 games, one window. Impossible to say other than can see signs of improvement especially defensively

 

[Andycoleno9]

How are we in better state than Spurs? We neither create much or have the goalscorers they do.

I'm a Martial fan but pinning our hopes on him is disastrous. He'll never stay fit.

Conte is there 2 years now. Do you see patterns or some kind of style of play? No. They are grinding their wins (which is also a trait and congrats on that). But we are more and more looking as a team who can dominate games. Give this team proper striker and we are there.

 

[DWelbz19]

I think he still gets the benefit of the doubt for a while yet, but we’re still awfully pragmatic and quite smash-and-grabby in how we play.

The transition was never going to be instantaneous, and I think we’ve still got a fair way to go. I’m not super convinced with the early signs, but it is only 10 games this far!

I still hold out some level of hope that he bins/phases out underperforming “key figures” like De Gea and Fernandes next season.

 

[andersj]

Conte is there 2 years now. Do you see patterns or some kind of style of play? No. They are grinding their wins (which is also a trait and congrats on that). But we are more and more looking as a team who can dominate games. Give this team proper striker and we are there.

He has been there for one year.

 

[criticalanalysis]

I'm not concerned. Poor starts/intensity continues but overall we were patient and tried to play with our game. The same as mid-week.

ETH is learning fast on the fly and I'm sure it'll be a bumpy road but there's a clear improvement in the interplay even if the execution is erratic.

Not having a striker is hurting us bad though.

 

[Sunny Jim]

He is the right Man to lead as forward. He needs players though. It was telling we only made 1 sub when chasing the winner

 

[Red-17]

Partly true. We've had more possession in the past two games against two sides that are happy to concede it but overall we're still midtable for possession. We've also been playing one of the deepest lines in the whole of Europe's top 5 leagues. If you're going to be critical of ETH so far then the case is quite easy. He's spent more than any other manager in the league whilst failing to bring in any of the changes that he was hired to do, at least from the point of view of the fans. Of course this is the start of his tenure and we may have to look at this as a mid-term and very expensive project but he's not really showing himself to be a top tactician capable of performing being his means, or even equal to them, at least so far.

Sorry but what were your expectations for this season? We hardly looked like a professional football team last season. We look miles more organized defensively bar two shocker results, way better at playing through a press even compared to the start of the season, never mind last year when we were hopeless. There is clear progress in terms of style of play, player signings, and overall organization.

This is the first time in a long time that you can actually see an organization structure to our possession rather than passing and moving for the sake of it. We created enough to win today despite not having any attacking depth to make desired substitutions. We forced a very good Newcastle team to hold out for a point at the end, when in previous years, they would have been trying to counter us and nick a goal.

 

[Leftback99]

Conte is there 2 years now. Do you see patterns or some kind of style of play? No. They are grinding their wins (which is also a trait and congrats on that). But we are more and more looking as a team who can dominate games. Give this team proper striker and we are there.

Have Conte sides ever been pretty? That is his style and its effective at getting results. We're unlikely to finish above them or in the top 4 to be able to attract the required striker.

 

[arthurka]

Clear signs of improvements.

 

[crossy1686]

After 10 games I can honestly we’ve improved but we’re still way off. Forward line and Bruno are the biggest concern for me, look too disjointed and force everything in the worst possible way. Then they run out of ideas after trying something twice and start playing stupid balls out of desperation.

We need another summer window for sure.

Can’t complain about the manager, he’s doing his best but it’s going to take time.

 

[Luka Mora]

Sorry but what were your expectations for this season? We hardly looked like a professional football team last season. We look miles more organized defensively bar two shocker results, way better at playing through a press even compared to the start of the season, never mind last year when we were hopeless. There is clear progress in terms of style of play, player signings, and overall organization.

This is the first time in a long time that you can actually see an organization structure to our possession rather than passing and moving for the sake of it. We created enough to win today despite not having any attacking depth to make desired substitutions. We forced a very good Newcastle team to hold out for a point at the end, when in previous years, they would have been trying to counter us and nick a goal.

Last season we had an interim who had no pre-season, no transfers and having to deal with a dysfunctional dressing room.

We now have a manager who has had the luxery of spending over 230 million to bring in his own players, more than any other team in the league, along with full pre season, and still we are lingering around the same position as we were last season and grinding out results on good days,

There's no excuses for why we should be playing deep line counter attacking moment's fc football when ten hag has been hyped up to be this tactical genius

 

[Vapor trail]

As long as there's something to build from that is progress. The Arsenal and Liverpool games were good results but they didn't provide a foundation to be established in terms of the performances. There's also the issue with personnel many of these same players have failed under consecutive managers.

United is perhaps the only top team in world football that has a very similar crop and spine of the same individuals who haven't progressed through seasons. It's going to take time and the addition of new players for the team to succeed.

 

[flameinthesun]

It's an egregious myth that you need to spend £500m to play possession football. Last season Burnley had the second lowest amount of possession of all the teams in the top 5 leagues in Europe. Under Vincent Kompany (a manager with an unremarkable record so far in management) they are now averaging 64% possession per game as they lead the Championship. To draw the contrast, compared to the highest team possession average in Europe's top 5 leagues that would put Burnley as equal to the 5th highest possession retaining team. From the very bottom to the very top. This occurred within a single pre-season.

Just to double check, burnley had the second lowest amount of possession in the prem last season and now has the most in the championship? Can't remember who got relegated last year.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Sorry but what were your expectations for this season? We hardly looked like a professional football team last season. We look miles more organized defensively bar two shocker results, way better at playing through a press even compared to the start of the season, never mind last year when we were hopeless. There is clear progress in terms of style of play, player signings, and overall organization.

This is the first time in a long time that you can actually see an organization structure to our possession rather than passing and moving for the sake of it. We created enough to win today despite not having any attacking depth to make desired substitutions. We forced a very good Newcastle team to hold out for a point at the end, when in previous years, they would have been trying to counter us and nick a goal.

Last season we had a collapse but the season before we finished second and reached the Europa League final with many of the same players we have now. The idea that we should be happy to finish 5-10th in the league after spending more than any other side in this delusional bollocks. At the least you'd expect to see some progression rather than stagnation.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Just to double check, burnley had the second lowest amount of possession in the prem last season and now has the most in the championship? Can't remember who got relegated last year.

Eh?

 

[Red-17]

Last season we had an interim who had no pre-season, no transfers and having to deal with a dysfunctional dressing room.

We now have a manager who has had the luxery of spending over 230 million to bring in his own players, more than any other team in the league, along with full pre season, and still we are lingering around the same position as we were last season and grinding out results on good days,

There's no excuses for why we should be playing deep line counter attacking moment's fc football when ten hag has been hyped up to be this tactical genius

Are you a troll? When did we play with a deep line today? The only games we have sat back are games against teams who are further along and better at playing progressive attacking football than we are 3 months into his tenure.

Funny you list all the mitigating circumstances for last year and then neglect to factor in that those don't just vanish the moment a new manager comes in. Did you forget the level of toxicity around us at the end of last season? To pretend that he has a dream job just because he has money to spend is just willfully ignorant.

 

[flameinthesun]

Eh?

Burnley didn't go from the worst posession team to one of the best in the premiership...part of them getting better at possession will be coaching yes, another factor would be the fact they got relegated and are now playing in an easier league. Burnley would find it very difficult to do the same in the prem.

The possession play at united has been slowly getting better and improving, but only so much can be done with coaching, the other part will be recruitment, getting the right players in. That doesn't necessarily mean buying the de jongs of the world but the many midfielders who can play possession football better than fred.

 

[Red-17]

Last season we had a collapse but the season before we finished second and reached the Europa League final with many of the same players we have now. The idea that we should be happy to finish 5-10th in the league after spending more than any other side in this delusional bollocks. At the least you'd expect to see some progression rather than stagnation.

Who says we will be happy to finish 5-10th? We are 3 points off top 4 and clearly in a transition season. There are 6 teams who all expect to finish top 4, so obviously not everyone will do it. Simplifying the season down to our finishing position and ignoring everything else is not a successful future strategy. If it was, us finishing 2nd under Ole and Jose would have meant more, but in reality it was more down to other teams being off their best than us being anything overly special.

Under what definition are we "stagnating"? We have played less than a quarter of a season and look miles better than at any point in the past 12 months. I would encourage you to watch a few of our matches at the end of last year if you need a reminder of where we were 6 months ago.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Partly true. We've had more possession in the past two games against two sides that are happy to concede it but overall we're still midtable for possession. We've also been playing one of the deepest lines in the whole of Europe's top 5 leagues. If you're going to be critical of ETH so far then the case is quite easy. He's spent more than any other manager in the league whilst failing to bring in any of the changes that he was hired to do, at least from the point of view of the fans. Of course this is the start of his tenure and we may have to look at this as a mid-term and very expensive project but he's not really showing himself to be a top tactician capable of performing being his means, or even equal to them, at least so far.

Also partly agree. But I really think this group of players were not coached at all in the last 5 years. We couldn’t even progress the ball through a half competent press from the opposition. Now we can play our way through a team.

The signs are there, but it is very slow, slower than what most coaches impact a team. But this is a special case imo. Jose and Ole clearly didn’t do any technical coaching to these players.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Burnley didn't go from the worst posession team to one of the best in the premiership...part of them getting better at possession will be coaching yes, another factor would be the fact they got relegated and are now playing in an easier league. Burnley would find it very difficult to do the same in the prem.

The possession play at united has been slowly getting better and improving, but only so much can be done with coaching, the other part will be recruitment, getting the right players in. That doesn't necessarily mean buying the de jongs of the world but the many midfielders who can play possession football better than fred.

It's not getting better though. Possession is lower under ETH than it ever was under Ole. I mean if you want to keep living under this false consciousness then fair enough.

 

[Wumminator]

I genuinely am baffled how any United fan can’t be encouraged by this start. I genuinely don’t get it.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I genuinely am baffled how any United fan can’t be encouraged by this start. I genuinely don’t get it.

Maybe there are ones amongst them who don't want to see the progress and didn't want him in the first place.

 

[Zlatans Knee]

Anyone who can't see the progress we have made this season does not understand football. Some of our football last year was an embarrassment to this club. This season we actually have some patterns of play. We badly need a striker we can depend on. But even with Eriksen instead of Fred and I reckon we would have won today.

 

[V.O.]

It's not getting better though. Possession is lower under ETH than it ever was under Ole. I mean if you want to keep living under this false consciousness then fair enough.

Even if that's true, you can't compare full seasons to the schedule we've had so far. Most of the teams we've played so far have been top half.

After the Chelsea game, we play something like 8-9 shit teams in a row (assuming the postponed fixtures against Palace and Leeds end up in that run too). Comparisons will be a lot more valid then.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Anyone who can't see the progress we have made this season does not understand football. Some of our football last year was an embarrassment to this club. This season we actually have some patterns of play. We badly need a striker we can depend on. But even with Eriksen instead of Fred and I reckon we would have won today.

Think Antony missed some of those sublime passes from Eriksen.

 

[flameinthesun]

It's not getting better though. Possession is lower under ETH than it ever was under Ole. I mean if you want to keep living under this false consciousness then fair enough.

You mean like the 63% possession we had today and the 70+% a couple days ago, the 61% away v everton, the 70+% a couple days before that? And by the way only 13 games/2 and half months into ten haag being here. Its quite clear we are getting better at keeping possession, slowly getting better at beating the press. Which is down to the coaching. There is also a limit to what you can reach with players like De Gea, Bruno, Fred, Mcg, Ronaldo, Rashford etc in the team when it comes to possession play. Hence why as much as we have clearly statistically improved, there is still a big need for further recruitment.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Even if that's true, you can't compare full seasons to the schedule we've had so far. Most of the teams we've played so far have been top half.

After the Chelsea game, we play something like 8-9 shit teams in a row (assuming the postponed fixtures against Palace and Leeds end up in that run too). Comparisons will be a lot more valid then.

Maybe so. Although there's no such thing as a shit team in the competitions we're in.

 

[Luka Mora]

Are you a troll? When did we play with a deep line today? The only games we have sat back are games against teams who are further along and better at playing progressive attacking football than we are 3 months into his tenure.

Funny you list all the mitigating circumstances for last year and then neglect to factor in that those don't just vanish the moment a new manager comes in. Did you forget the level of toxicity around us at the end of last season? To pretend that he has a dream job just because he has money to spend is just willfully ignorant.

I'm a troll, because I expect us to be playing better football after spending over 230 million and bringing in Pep's apparent prodigy? Get over yourself , we've brought in an unproven manager from a weak league who has question marks around him and I'm simply questioning exactly what he's brought to the table so far. And so far there's a lot to be desired. We've already been stomped on by the likes of Brighton, Brentford and city where we could have lost 10-0 if city didn't make wholesale changes to rest key players.

I'm not talking about today even though we could has easily been 2-0 down in the first half after Varane dropped one of their players in box and then the corner miss I'm talking about games against arsenal, Liverpool, Leicester and key parts of everton game where we've ended up sitting deep and relying on counters

All the players who brought forth toxicity and dressing room leaks mostly have left, pogba, lingard, henderson, Cavani, Bailey. The only player that's left who's toxic is Ronaldo. Other than that he's been given a clean slate.

We all heard over the summer that he needed his players which were all from erevidese league to help implement his special system immediately. He's got his players and I dont see any system being implemented other than a few good overlaps with the wingers and fullbacks and a bit more hunger from the players.

Tactically there is nothing revolutionary and I watched Ajax a lot last season under Hag and I didn't see much special then other than flat track bullying teams with a quarter of Ajax's budget.

 

[ManUnitedCanuck]

Why are our managers so calm when decisions don't go our way? I want to see him pressuring the ref, look at Pep, Klopp, Arteta, Conte they are always putting extra pressure on the ref. Used to grind my gears with Ole as well.

Get in someone's face, say something in the pre and post match press conference, make it a talking point so they feel some pressure!

 

[Red-17]

You mean like the 63% possession we had today and the 70+% a couple days ago, the 61% away v everton, the 70+% a couple days before that? And by the way only 13 games/2 and half months into ten haag being here. Its quite clear we are getting better at keeping possession, slowly getting better at beating the press. Which is down to the coaching. There is also a limit to what you can reach with players like De Gea, Bruno, Fred, Mcg, Ronaldo, Rashford etc in the team when it comes to possession play. Hence why as much as we have clearly statistically improved, there is still a big need for further recruitment.

You don't even need statistics to see we are miles better in posession especially in the build up and in midfield compared to last year. The most basic of presses was our downfall last season. Newcastle are a very good team and press very well, and we forced them to defend deep pretty much the entire second half. Yes we still need to improve our final third play, but the building blocks are clearly there. Last season we looked like a team who hadn't seen each other the entire week and turned up 10 minutes before the game to warm up.

 

[Adisa]

Happy with the way we dominated a good Newcastle side. I know its baby steps but we are starting to control games better. Our lack of a great CF is killing us.

 

[Sweet Square]

Regardless of his coaching ability, it's very unlikely we are going to get top 4. If we don't win europa league, I wouldn't put it pass these arseholes to sack him.

 

[Red-17]

I'm a troll, because I expect us to be playing better football after spending over 230 million and bringing in Pep's apparent prodigy? Get over yourself , we've brought in an unproven manager from a weak league who has question marks around him and I'm simply questioning exactly what he's brought to the table so far. And so far there's a lot to be desired. We've already been stomped on by the likes of Brighton, Brentford and city where we could have lost 10-0 if city didn't make wholesale changes to rest key players.

I'm not talking about today even though we could has easily been 2-0 down in the first half after Varane dropped one of their players in box and then the corner miss I'm talking about games against arsenal, Liverpool, Leicester and key parts of everton game where we've ended up sitting deep and relying on counters

All the players who brought forth toxicity and dressing room leaks mostly have left, pogba, lingard, henderson, Cavani, Bailey. The only player that's left who's toxic is Ronaldo. Other than that he's been given a clean slate.

We all heard over the summer that he needed his players which were all from erevidese league to help implement his special system immediately. He's got his players and I dont see any system being implemented other than a few good overlaps with the wingers and fullbacks and a bit more hunger from the players.

Tactically there is nothing revolutionary and I watched Ajax a lot last season under Hag and I didn't see much special then other than flat track bullying teams with a quarter of Ajax's budget.

Thank you for clarifying your position. I won't waste any more of my time arguing with someone who has such a myopic perspective of where we are now compared to where we were 6 months ago.

 

[Escobar]

A World class striker off being a very good team in my opinion

And another midfielder

 

[DomesticTadpole]

And another midfielder

RB?

 

[mav_9me]

Arteta's done it at Arsenal over experienced players. Now I'm not saying it'll get us winning results, but we want to see something different than years of seeing same ol performances from the likes of Fred.

Not in the beginning he didn't. Ozil was playing regularly in the beginning. Then he had Luiz and Willian as regulars. As part of his process he gradually moved away from them to younger players who better bought into his vision.

 

[Garethw]

Happy with the way we dominated a good Newcastle side. I know its baby steps but we are starting to control games better. Our lack of a great CF is killing us.

We know that the club bid for Arnautović this summer. So the need for a central striker was identified. So the question is why the feck didn’t we go for anybody else?

I cannot believe that the board placed their trust in a 37 year old Ronaldo that had spent the entire summer trying to engineer a move away, and Martial that had just failed miserably in his loan spell.

It’s utter madness.

 

[Raven]

He's really been hamstrung by his striking options so far. Did well to control the game today but it's hard to get cohesion up top when we have no natural strikers available. Need Martial back and need another CF asap.

 

[flameinthesun]

You don't even need statistics to see we are miles better in posession especially in the build up and in midfield compared to last year. The most basic of presses was our downfall last season. Newcastle are a very good team and press very well, and we forced them to defend deep pretty much the entire second half. Yes we still need to improve our final third play, but the building blocks are clearly there. Last season we looked like a team who hadn't seen each other the entire week and turned up 10 minutes before the game to warm up.

I actually think that second half was very encouraging (and the first ten when we played out their high press). We have a looonnggggg journey ahead, but I'm genuinely surprised when I see posts like that guy's post when as you said its plain to see without stats that we are improving.