Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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I want to say though that it is weird that FBs are trying to dictate the playing making from in field behind with the FBs we have. Shaw is capable of doing it decently, but Dalot could not even pass the whole game and you wonder why our team play was shit.

Why not ask them to overlap and run behind them more in the second half?
 
Could've done better with the substitutions. Not reactive enough.
Could he? I'm not sure. Probably the idea was not to use Rashford if not needed. We could throw in Elanga or Garnacho, although I don't think that would make things better.

You could always argue about Iqbal, but is he seriously considered a senior player? Not sure.
 
Whether TH was stuck starting this team or not, surely at the 75 min mark, he could have got Garnacho or Elanga on, as we had not troubled their goal all 2nd half. Doesnt do the kids much hope if they cant get a few minutes in this team.
 
He has improved the team significantly. Now it’s time to think out of box to address the absence of Martial. Ronaldo is not the solution. Starting Ronaldo will get us draw all games.
 
Whether TH was stuck starting this team or not, surely at the 75 min mark, he could have got Garnacho or Elanga on, as we had not troubled their goal all 2nd half. Doesnt do the kids much hope if they cant get a few minutes in this team.
Yet we should, not could, have won it in the last seconds. I am surprised Garnacho is not getting more minutes. Elanga I find disappointing more often than not. The game shows we need Eriksen and McT in the side and not Ronaldo up front. When Ronaldo is not there, the players will take responsibility for scoring. When he plays they just try to play him in time after time. We play better without him.
 
Could he? I'm not sure. Probably the idea was not to use Rashford if not needed. We could throw in Elanga or Garnacho, although I don't think that would make things better.

You could always argue about Iqbal, but is he seriously considered a senior player? Not sure.
At the 70th minute, I would replace Fred with another attacker. Or leave Ronaldo to play with Rashford ahead of him. We needed mobility up front. Rash provided that, and we will get some decent chances from pressure in the late period when Ronaldo might come in handy.

The point is that we should have more attackers on the pitch in the late period at OT.
 
Yet we should, not could, have won it in the last seconds. I am surprised Garnacho is not getting more minutes. Elanga I find disappointing more often than not. The game shows we need Eriksen and McT in the side and not Ronaldo up front. When Ronaldo is not there, the players will take responsibility for scoring. When he plays they just try to play him in time after time. We play better without him.
Agree. With Elanga you get speed and Garnacho dribbling ability. If we dont give Garnacho especially, time in the first team he will start looking at other teams.
 
Agree. With Elanga you get speed and Garnacho dribbling ability. If we dont give Garnacho especially, time in the first team he will start looking at other teams.
I see what you mean about Elanga. They should have been constantly running at Dan Burn. We desperately need a cool head in front of goal as well. I hope Martial is back soon.
 
When Martial, Mctominay, DVB and Eriksen are out and Rashford is ill yes - he has no confidence in it. Because it’s full of kids. When it’s full of senior players he does use subs hence why our last 4 of our last 5 goal scorers have been brought on off the bench.
Yeah if anything, Ten Hag's subs have been better than advertised so far. One of his critiques form Ajax fans was him being too slow to substitute, but he has been anything but slow when he actually has options on the bench. We had no options with any experience in midfield or attack to bring on apart from Rashford. I really don't think bringing on Iqbal for Fred would have made us significantly more creative. It certainly isn't a sure upgrade.
 
This message is to ETH- Please do the following so we can get to the level we used to be.. Please sell/release Fred, Van de beek, Bruno, Ronaldo, Martial, Elanga, Amad, P. Jones, Harry M., Eric B., Wan Bisaka, Teles, Heaton, Dubravka. The money you get from these players around 160-170m add to a 200 m budget for the next two windows and buy the following players: H. Kane (60-70 m), Neymar (60 m), De jong or Maddison ( 60 m), Fellix (120 m), Pavard( 50).With these players in the team we can play a world class football. Just think of a team like: De gea- Shaw (Mallacia), Varane (Victor L.)- Martinez- Pavard ( Dalot), Casemiro(Scott)-De jong or Madisson (Eriksen)-Fellix, Neymar-Kane (Rashford)- Antony (Sancho).
 
Jury still out for me. He's stabilised us somewhat but I'm not seeing much progressive intelligent football on display.

That along with not seeing any youth players being given any first team minutes when he's been advertised as a man who develops and promotes youth, makes me wonder if he's ready for this

In most games we've been treading our luck, Varane could have easily gave away a penalty today and seems we don't get started playing some semblance of positive football until our backs are against the wall.
I think it is obvious how much progress we have made. We virtually dominated the second half against a team who have been very good so far this season and currently sit 6th with a +8 goal difference. We forced them into dropping into a low block with their only real chances coming from set pieces today (good chances granted). We are far more assured in progressing from defense to midfield and the early stages of attack. The last attacking phase still needs work which is partly down to personnel (striker especially), but there is a clear pattern and order to our play now that we just did not have last season.
 
His reluctuncy to make a sub is really annoying. Another manager who shits his pants, and cant just go and try things. We play on the counter, very slow in the build up. Similar to Van Gaal but at least he was throwing kids in and had a much worse squad..

Obviously not writing him off but early signs suggest he just dominated Dutch league with just a overpowered Team with best academy and budget in Netherlands which makes it very easy compared to competitive league like EPL.

Hopefully he will wake up and start acting it will be painful to watch another manager who is not good enough given too much time.
 
The only thing (if you ask me) you can hold against him today is that he took off Ronaldo when things got tight.. Can't help thinking it would have been different if Ronaldo got in the positions Fred/Rashford were in the end..
 
I want to say though that it is weird that FBs are trying to dictate the playing making from in field behind with the FBs we have. Shaw is capable of doing it decently, but Dalot could not even pass the whole game and you wonder why our team play was shit.

Why not ask them to overlap and run behind them more in the second half?
Yeah I completely understand the fullbacks coming narrow to help keep posession and make us more assured defending a counter, but we need more variability especially from right back. Dalot should be getting at least 2-3 crosses/cut backs in from the by line from overlaps where Antony either plays him in directly or via a linkup with a striker. That is City's bread and, butter and it also helps mitigate Antony's one footedness if a player still has to monitor the outside leaving him more room on his left.
 
Controlled the game well today. I can see improvements in the team. He’s just lacking a striker and another midfielder next to Casemiro. Would’ve liked to see Zidane play instead of Fred today and Garnacho introduced at some point.
 
Ones wanting Iqbal and Garnacho thrown in. If we had a clinical striker up front we might actually put games to bed early and that is when you let these kids have their time, no pressure on them, not chuck them in and they might sink or swim.
 
I think it is obvious how much progress we have made. We virtually dominated the second half against a team who have been very good so far this season and currently sit 6th with a +8 goal difference. We forced them into dropping into a low block with their only real chances coming from set pieces today (good chances granted). We are far more assured in progressing from defense to midfield and the early stages of attack. The last attacking phase still needs work which is partly down to personnel (striker especially), but there is a clear pattern and order to our play now that we just did not have last season.
If we step back and think about it, it might suggest we as a team have evolved our play quite a lot and we probably are already in the final phase ahead of reborn.
Everyone seems feeling what we are lack of at the moment is around the box, the final attacking phase. Let’s see how ETH solves it.
 
I was ready to lambast everyone at united for a pretty poor result and poor to average performance. But the reality is we know a lot of players, especially the back up players are just not good enough to play this style. Fred hasn't got the feet, control and passing to play the eriksen role but there is no one else to play there when eriksen's out. Our youngsters on the bench don't even stand out in u21 games so we can't throw them in. We know if martial is not playing then the alternatives in rashford and ronaldo are poor. As good as casemiro and mct are they are not progressers of the ball. We are still trying to figure if Dalot and Shaw are worth keeping around. We know Bruno, Rashford and Sancho are 50/50 on whether they are good enough to play for a title challenging side. As good as De Gea has been there's question marks around him. So in reality its an expected level of performance with key players out. There will be more of them as this will be a very frustrating season until we get a good 2 or 3 other players in.
 
I think it is obvious how much progress we have made. We virtually dominated the second half against a team who have been very good so far this season and currently sit 6th with a +8 goal difference. We forced them into dropping into a low block with their only real chances coming from set pieces today (good chances granted). We are far more assured in progressing from defense to midfield and the early stages of attack. The last attacking phase still needs work which is partly down to personnel (striker especially), but there is a clear pattern and order to our play now that we just did not have last season.

We were at home. The first half we could have easily been 2 goals down. I expect us to dominate a newcastle squad that has the likes of lonstaff, murphy, schar as their spine while we head out with a squad that cost over 700million.

There is nothing special about the football we're playing and yes it's going to take time to see full transformation, but the early stages is our play is predictable and easy to nullify. Every time we play a decent team we look like we're playing Ole ball.
 
It's an egregious myth that you need to spend £500m to play possession football. Last season Burnley had the second lowest amount of possession of all the teams in the top 5 leagues in Europe. Under Vincent Kompany (a manager with an unremarkable record so far in management) they are now averaging 64% possession per game as they lead the Championship. To draw the contrast, compared to the highest team possession average in Europe's top 5 leagues that would put Burnley as equal to the 5th highest possession retaining team. From the very bottom to the very top. This occurred within a single pre-season.
 
We were at home. The first half we could have easily been 2 goals down. I expect us to dominate a newcastle squad that has the likes of lonstaff, murphy, schar as their spine while we head out with a squad that cost over 700million.

There is nothing special about the football we're playing and yes it's going to take time to see full transformation, but the early stages is our play is predictable and easy to nullify. Every time we play a decent team we look like we're playing Ole ball.
Like I said, we are a work in progress, but to dismiss Newcastle when they have obviously been a very good side this season is just silly. They created almost nothing from open play which is absolutely a good sign. They had one great chance via Joelinton and a penalty shout and that was about it. No one is saying we are playing like peak Barcelona or City, but it is absolutely night and day compared to last season. How many times in recent seasons have we let games like this get away from us and concede dangerous counter attacking chances and goals as we chase the game? Newcastle didn't get a sniff the entire last half hour meanwhile we had 2 great chances and should have had a penalty or two.
 
Completely agree. If we had someone like Arteta doing what he did, he would have been sacked after his 2nd season.

Personally, I'm happy to see the defence looking more solid. It's the main thing I wanted after watching us concede for fun last season. We've had two really poor defensive games this season, but I think ETH has learned from them. The attacking patterns of play are going to take time improve.

ETH also doesn't have a striker he can rely on. I think these performances improve if we had one.


Exactly.

Newcastle played the last half hour like plucky underdogs down at the bottom of the table, we had them totally boxed in. Played like a unit.

Be plenty of teething issues rest of season but I'd take the solidness over having a go and getting tanked.


We certainly need fresh players up front, wil striker at least. Honestly would make a massive difference.
 
It's an egregious myth that you need to spend £500m to play possession football. Last season Burnley had the second lowest amount of possession of all the teams in the top 5 leagues in Europe. Under Vincent Kompany (a manager with an unremarkable record so far in management) they are now averaging 64% possession per game as they lead the Championship. To draw the contrast, compared to the highest team possession average in Europe's top 5 leagues that would put Burnley as equal to the 5th highest possession retaining team. From the very bottom to the very top. This occurred within a single pre-season.
Good point but we have dominated possession in every game apart from the top 6 games I believe. 63% possession today. Doesn’t mean anything if we aren’t doing much with it.
 
In 4 months we are in better state than Spurs are for example. You can see huge progress with ETH.
If only Martial is fit though. That is what we miss right now. Bloody striker.
Although, playing Ronaldo is on ETH. Play someone else ffs. He DOES NOT fit in this system.
 
The problems all boil down to going into the season relying Ronaldo to not play like a 38 year old despite him being 38 years old. Martial to not get injured despite being permanently crocked. And Rashford to play like he was 19 again and not the 24 year old flop who's 2 years into a serious downward spiral.
 
It's an egregious myth that you need to spend £500m to play possession football. Last season Burnley had the second lowest amount of possession of all the teams in the top 5 leagues in Europe. Under Vincent Kompany (a manager with an unremarkable record so far in management) they are now averaging 64% possession per game as they lead the Championship. To draw the contrast, compared to the highest team possession average in Europe's top 5 leagues that would put Burnley as equal to the 5th highest possession retaining team. From the very bottom to the very top. This occurred within a single pre-season.

Newcastle are also transformed under Howe. Who'd have thought they could play this kinda football under Bruce?
 
In 4 months we are in better state than Spurs are for example. You can see huge progress with ETH.
If only Martial is fit though. That is what we miss right now. Bloody striker.
Although, playing Ronaldo is on ETH. Play someone else ffs. He DOES NOT fit in this system.
How are we in better state than Spurs? We neither create much or have the goalscorers they do.

I'm a Martial fan but pinning our hopes on him is disastrous. He'll never stay fit.
 
Good point but we have dominated possession in every game apart from the top 6 games I believe. 63% possession today. Doesn’t mean anything if we aren’t doing much with it.

Partly true. We've had more possession in the past two games against two sides that are happy to concede it but overall we're still midtable for possession. We've also been playing one of the deepest lines in the whole of Europe's top 5 leagues. If you're going to be critical of ETH so far then the case is quite easy. He's spent more than any other manager in the league whilst failing to bring in any of the changes that he was hired to do, at least from the point of view of the fans. Of course this is the start of his tenure and we may have to look at this as a mid-term and very expensive project but he's not really showing himself to be a top tactician capable of performing being his means, or even equal to them, at least so far.
 
A World class striker off being a very good team in my opinion
An upgrade on Dalot is almost as important IMO. He isn't bad, but he isn't good either. Consistently has 2-3 misplaced passes and doesn't really offer much in terms of creativity or crossing.
 
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