Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[sullydnl]

That's similar to the football klopp plays, right?

Hadn't seen this. That's very nice to read, then we go back to the players being terrible.

What a mess we are in, squad revamp needed, infrastructure revamp and parasite owners. It could really be the end for united as a major force unless something drastically changes.

Closer a more pragmatic version of Pep's possession football than Klopp's, I'd say.

Also worth noting his comments on Pep's first season in the PL:

Only once in his career has Pep made a mistake – in his first year at Manchester City when he completely underestimated the power and speed of the Premier League. He realised that you can't play the kind of football he loves without having a couple of physically strong athletes – and so he brought them in.

So it isn't that he's unaware of the physicality of the PL or the need to be pragmatic in that regard either.

 

[chb23]

It was offside, Rashford was offside when Ronaldo first collected the ball and the flag went up (delayed as usual) to indicate that even if he'd scored, it wouldn't have counted.

But I'm assuming from your reaction you are a Ronaldo fan and would be happy to have him at United till he's 40, well that is your right, freedom of speech and all that.

I'm of a different opinion: once Ronaldo indicated that he really didn't want to be at United this season, he should have been forced out - and not playing him would be key to that. He could easily buy himself out of his own contract and join a CL club as a free agent giving him the chance to improve his stats in that competition. But more importantly, Manchester United will have a better chance of winning a cup, maybe getting top-4 without him, than with him, mainly because of the problems his presence will cause the manager behind the scenes. Sir Alex Ferguson always said nobody is bigger than the club, but sadly Ronaldo thinks he is....

They showed a replay after that showed he was on side.

And no Ronaldo can leave if he wants. I was just pointing out that he wasn't to blame that game and actually did contribute something, if rashford scored.

 

[glazed]

It's going to take a long time and it might never happen. It was never going to happen in the first few games with mostly the same players.

Let's not worry too much about results this season. As long as we don't get relegated it's just about rebuilding.

 

[Relevated]

Closer a more pragmatic version of Pep's possession football than Klopp's, I'd say.

Also worth noting his comments on Pep's first season in the PL:



So it isn't that he's unaware of the physicality of the PL or the need to be pragmatic in that regard either.

This is really positive to be honest, when you think logically rather than emotively. But the obvious fact is that none of this succeeds without the correct players.

 

[sglowrider]

They'd have to sell, how would they generate enough money to pay off their loan?

If you were the Glazers, would you sell? You would asset strip before you sell and hope United can bounce back in a season. The loans/interest aren't that expensive in the general scheme.

We will need to be in the Championship for a bunch of seasons before they may contemplate selling.

 

[royboy16]

It’s going to take time to coach these players,I expected this season to be similar to last season just hope he can turn it around in time.

 

[bond19821982]

Didn’t know Evra was a CB, when in the Harry Potter did that happen?

If you really can't get the context, then lets better stop the discussion.

 

[DatIrishFella]

This is basically it

 

[bond19821982]

My biggest concern isn't the result. But that second half was LVG esque. Keep going to wings and crossing. We didn't try any thing through the centre. Probably due to a lack of a striker who can hold the ball or lack of right midfielder but that's a serious concern to me . Hopefully it gets fixed soon.

I am least bothered about the result. I expect a loss against Liverpool too.

 

[sglowrider]

Not sure what he is complaining about. He insists on having Frenkie de Jong despite it being a very complicated deal. Antony is never a £70million player.

Getting mainly Ajax-related players esp Martinez who many said was too small to be a CB for the PL showed his naivety or an over-blow ego. I think we now know the role Overmars played in Ajax's success.

 

[mancan92]

You say he needs to be more pragmatic but the gameplan today was specifically to go long.

De Gea just didn't do it, something he alluded to in his post-match interview when he said he didn't read the situation well enough. But ETH is trying to be pragmatic in that sense. That's also why all the CFs we've been linked with are big, physical players you can fire the ball up to.

The problem is again anyone who has watched united would be able to tell you that if you want to have de gea do anything intelligent with the ball then you are in serious trouble. He shouldn't be giving him more instructions except punt it. Otherwise get a different keeper.

 

[DickDastardly]

Wow is that all? How about we burn down OT because it leaks while we are at it. You cannot get rid of everyone without replacements… and we struggle to even upgrade our squad. It’s a toxic squad alright but it’s all we have

Well read the fecking post till the end.

He has ONE mistake to correct! Just one, not "everyone". One.

Harry Maguire should never start a game playing for Manchester United again.

And until he rectifies that mistake, we will never move forward as a team.

 

[Newtonius]

Will personally lose confidence if he doesn't at least drop Shaw, Maguire, Bruno and Rashford for the next few games you can see how it changes even slightly once most of them are off the pitch they are just awful. Lazy, wasteful and completely lacking ability and intelligence. (Especially Rashford and Shaw my god, and that kid wants a contract? Feck off let PSG have a discount take him for 50).

Can't imagine he will persevere though thankfully you can very easily tell hes come to the same conclusions as the rest of us. And for me this has been ETH's biggest mistake particularly not sitting down with Ralf because this was ultimately a problem for 3 months ago.

Even if you couldn't sell them you could have pushed to improve on them, certainly mentally they crumble at the slightest breeze. It says it all for me that after the Brighton game it very quickly went from patience and 'finding the right player' to absolute panic, given how much control he has had up to this point he was obviously trusting himself and those players to make a clean break and that is most likely going to come back and bite him.

 

[USREDEVIL]

Football eritage

 

[sglowrider]

None of the signings even made any sense. We had half a dozen CBs, why sign another? Those we had would’ve been decent in the right system with proper protection in front of them. Instead we’ve signed a short dude for obscene money who will get bullied by most CFs in the league.

Backup LB. Why? Shaw has at least proven once or twice that he is capable of having an acceptable season. Not saying he doesn’t need replacing but RB was a far bigger priority. Even if we assume Malacia becomes first choice soon we’ll then have a better LB on the bench than the starter at RB.

Eriksen on a free is fair enough but for me it creates more problems than it solves. You can’t shoehorn him and Bruno into the same team.

We’ve created new issues while the pre-existing problem areas of GK, RB, DM/CM, winger and CF still remain the same.

Agree. The priorities in the signings were weird. I like Malacia but Martinez really worries me. Paying all that money, when it could have spend on other areas first.

 

[city-puma]

The only positive from today’s game is that ETH knows more about the players and the league. Hope he find a solution.

 

[Cassidy]

Seems like the penny has dropped. Hopefully he has been humbled in his belief he can get these lot playing and now fully understands more about the issues here. If he'd have spoke to Ralf he could have saved himself this trouble. Hell, those involved with the football side at the club should have known the issues and should have been pushing big changes. Instead they've hoped ETH is some sort of magic bullet that can turn these players round.



We'll both you and the players would be in for a shock if that's what you think. Look at how Poch took Southampton from lowest running team to highest, with the changes being visible pretty quickly. I was told during the managerial selection stage that ETH had this covered too. Yet here we are, lethargic and second to everything.



Why did you believe that, out of interest? ETH himself or those around him?



I'm sorry but this is part of my main gripe with all this. He could have spoke to Rangnick or any supporter and we'd have told him what he has hopefully now found out. There was absolutely no need for all of this.

I get trying to build up the players, but Ole tried that and it barely lasted. In the end it actually backfired badly because he'd assembled a team of cowards.

Unless we bought him an entirely new 15 players hes going to have to build up some players. Its a bit silly to think otherwise.

 

[sglowrider]

Completely agree. But we're bottom of the league and probably will be rooted to the bottom after our next game, the knives will be out.

Too many see him as some saviour and that's why they had some unrealistic expectations of ''being in Top 4 at the end of this season or he is out'' mindset.

He has to learn about the league, the various managers etc. The players need to absorb what he is attempting to teach and that will take time to implement. I don't expect any consistent signs of improvement till the 2nd half of this season. We won't be in a position to compete till his 3rd season when his systems are more entrenched.

 

[sglowrider]

The only positive from today’s game is that ETH knows more about the players and the league. Hope he find a solution.

Another 36 games to go then.

40 points. 40 points.

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

That's similar to the football klopp plays, right?

It is. The biggest problem though is that we have too many players, who are too deficient to even learn.

 

[OneUnited24]

Well read the fecking post till the end.

He has ONE mistake to correct! Just one, not "everyone". One.

Harry Maguire should never start a game playing for Manchester United again.

And until he rectifies that mistake, we will never move forward as a team.

God sake drop maguire and see how bad the rest are. This team is devoid of quality but the first 11 is the best we have. I think I’ll trust a manager over an angry fan

 

[Rozay]

‘ETH’s football’. ‘This will not be allowed to happen now with ETH here’. ‘He can’t play ETH’s style’. ‘With proper coaching now he will be better’. x10000000.

As I’ve said, this man has proven little. If people have skepticism towards Ajax and Eredivise players, the same should apply to their managers. I feel like this summer people got way too carried away.

Now I’m not writing him off, but there’s always been a clear understanding that he needs to prove himself as the real deal. I’m seeing ‘ETH resignation watch’ threads as of we’ve been done a big favour. Not sure why people have gone for that spin rather than ‘ETH sack watch’ thread. Have we all decided that all the previous guys were not real managers who knew anything about football or something, but now we’ve got Ten Hag, it’s the players that can only fail him, not the other way?

His approach to the transfer market has been concerning. He’s brought in a centre half who is built like a winger, and has targeted Arnautovic. He’s also come in and made Maguire his undisputed. As I said, I have hope, but not blind hope. He needs to do better.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Well read the fecking post till the end.

He has ONE mistake to correct! Just one, not "everyone". One.

Harry Maguire should never start a game playing for Manchester United again.

And until he rectifies that mistake, we will never move forward as a team.

 

[DickDastardly]

God sake drop maguire and see how bad the rest are. This team is devoid of quality but the first 11 is the best we have. I think I’ll trust a manager over an angry fan

Harry Maguire is not just a player.

He's the captain of this club.

And right now, he epitomizes everything that's wrong at this club.

And he's without any hesitation, the absolute worst player at this club.

Yes, drop him or suffer the consequences.

Easy as that.

 

[city-puma]

Another 36 games to go then.

40 points. 40 points.

I think by October, we will play like a proper team.

 

[SirMonteyne]

Even klopp and pep will suffer with our midfielders. Bruno has exposed, in his first season opponents gave too much respect for him. Now everyone make simple two men press against him and he loses his shit. Huge change of formation may give us some run.

Buy some midfielders and we are fine.

 

[OleksUsykUD]

The big problem is, the next 11 fixtures are:
Liverpool
Southampton
Leicester
Arsenal
Crystal Palace
Leeds
City
Everton
Newcastle
Tottenham
Chelsea


I don't see against Liverpool. I think they will annihilate us badly. And from that point i don't see us getting more than 15 points from the next 10 matches, which is a disaster.


ETH needs to find solution very fast.

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

If you were the Glazers, would you sell? You would asset strip before you sell and hope United can bounce back in a season. The loans/interest aren't that expensive in the general scheme.

If what Gary Neville said about what the Glazers allegedly have in their bank accounts is true, they will be forced to sell because it is just unsustainable for them to have this little money and yet operate 2 massive sports franchises. It's either their hometown Tampa Bay Buccaneers or Manchester United to be sacrificed. Considering how interest rates have moved higher higher (to fight inflation), loans and mortgages will become a lot more expensive for anybody as well.

 

[city-puma]

The big problem is, the next 11 fixtures are:
Liverpool
Southampton
Leicester
Arsenal
Crystal Palace
Leeds
City
Everton
Newcastle
Tottenham
Chelsea


I don't see against Liverpool. I think they will annihilate us badly. And from that point i don't see us getting more than 15 points from the next 10 matches, which is a disaster.


ETH needs to find solution very fast.

The worst effect today is that everyone lose confidence on this team and think every opponent in the league can destroy it in the most simplest way.
I can imagine how everyone of the team itself feels.

 

[sullydnl]

The big problem is, the next 11 fixtures are:
Liverpool
Southampton
Leicester
Arsenal
Crystal Palace
Leeds
City
Everton
Newcastle
Tottenham
Chelsea


I don't see against Liverpool. I think they will annihilate us badly. And from that point i don't see us getting more than 15 points from the next 10 matches, which is a disaster.


ETH needs to find solution very fast.

Yeah that's not a pretty looking run of games.

 

[sglowrider]

I think by October, we will play like a proper team.

No way. I am expecting after the Qatar WC before we see tangible signs.

 

[sglowrider]

If what Gary Neville said about what the Glazers allegedly have in their bank accounts is true, they will be forced to sell because it is just unsustainable for them to have this little money and yet operate 2 massive sports franchises. It's either their hometown Tampa Bay Buccaneers or Manchester United to be sacrificed. Considering how interest rates have moved higher higher (to fight inflation), loans and mortgages will become a lot more expensive for anybody as well.

Well, I will take any good news or rumours at this point in time.

Keep Hope Alive!

 

[Skills]

The big problem is, the next 11 fixtures are:
Liverpool
Southampton
Leicester
Arsenal
Crystal Palace
Leeds
City
Everton
Newcastle
Tottenham
Chelsea


I don't see against Liverpool. I think they will annihilate us badly. And from that point i don't see us getting more than 15 points from the next 10 matches, which is a disaster.


ETH needs to find solution very fast.

If the fanbase can get the Liverpool game postponed, i still think there's a run of games there to build some self belief. Liverpool destroy us, it might be game over.

 

[sglowrider]

The big problem is, the next 11 fixtures are:
Liverpool
Southampton
Leicester
Arsenal
Crystal Palace
Leeds
City
Everton
Newcastle
Tottenham
Chelsea


I don't see against Liverpool. I think they will annihilate us badly. And from that point i don't see us getting more than 15 points from the next 10 matches, which is a disaster.


ETH needs to find solution very fast.

We will be in the bottom half of the table by the end of that stretch of games. But start to pick up more points after the World Cup.

Arsenal was at the bottom of the league in Sept/October and yet come above us at the end.

 

[city-puma]

No way. I am expecting after the Qatar WC before we see tangible signs.

If so late, ETH will be let go.

 

[sglowrider]

If the fanbase can get the Liverpool game postponed, i still think there's a run of games there to build some self belief. Liverpool destroy us, it might be game over.

I don't think the expected loss to Liverpool will be such a big issue considering that they arent expected to win it anyway. Its possible poor results against the likes of Southampton and shitty Leicester that will affect the team even more.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

I said it many times. I'm ok with the defeats. We need time to change.

However, the most worrying part was we played exactly like under Ole. Slow and zombie football. No movement and option to pass. Players jogging.

I expect something like Klopp first season. Results are not important but we need to be able to see a certain obvious style the manager want the team to play.

But so far ETH has been very disappointing. Offered nothing at all.

 

[sglowrider]

If so late, ETH will be let go.

I don't think so. Murtough and Arnold have sunk in so much political capital in ETH that they cant chop him this season. They will have to go too if they panic and sack him this pre-maturely.

 

[city-puma]

I don't think so. Murtough and Arnold have sunk in so much political capital in ETH that they cant chop him this season. They will have to go too if they panic and sack him this pre-maturely.

I mean by the end of the season.

 

[Skills]

I don't think the expected loss to Liverpool will be such a big issue considering that they arent expected to win it anyway. Its possible poor results against the likes of Southampton and shitty Leicester that will affect the team even more.

The squad is mentally fragile. City carving us open at the Etihad broke them last season under Rangnick, and Liverpool at Old Trafford during the 5-0 did the same under Ole. If its anything like they're not recovering this season.

These aren't machines, they're human beings and these humiliating defeats - especially now that they've become such a regular habit cause long lasting damage.