Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Gabriel Djemba-Bebe said:
So, I know this sounds like some bullshit story that Jay from the Inbetweeners would make up but I feel like it's my obligation to share this :lol: Steve Mclaren's dad had a round of golf with my dad in York this afternoon and, according to him, Ten Hag and his coaching staff have been asked to resign but they're not budging.

Also, less interesting news - Steve is planning to retire very soon anyway to spend more time playing golf.

My dad and his new 88 year old mate are planning on having another round of golf this weekend. More (hearsay) updates to follow.
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This is the sort of quality insights we need in this thread. Keep sending your dad golfing please.
 
glazed said:
We've just blown off over a decade by feking about humouring Glazer bullshit
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Yes, and it's completely destroyed the financial edge we had over the rest of the league. We're in a precarious situation now.
 
romufc said:
I agree that the 3rd year challenging for 4th shouldn't be the target. You would expect him to challenge right? which means you think the team is ready to challenge.

What would your expectations be for a new manager then?
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Not now no, because we've wasted the best part of £400m on a load of players but the squad is arguably in a similar/worse shape now than it was in 2022.

My expectations for any new manager are the same. We have enough quality players and we spend enough to finish in the top 4 or close to it. So that should be the minimum expectation every season. Beyond that just like with Ten Hag I'd hope any new manager would be able to get the team challenging for the league by his 3rd year. Or at the very least show some positive progress in terms of performance, consistency and playstyle that make us look like we're not far off challenging.

I don't mind being patient but a manager has got to be showing something. You can't have someone in place that just writes off a season to persist with a bonkers system that isn't working. Ten Hag lost my trust with that decision, now I suspect we would just be wasting our time with him if we kept him on. I personally think managers should earn time and patience.
 
Newstyle said:
Genuine question to those who want to keep ETH; if the worst league performance in over 30 years is not enough to get sacked then what is?
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I'm only marginally Ten Hag In but there's context that needs to be used here.

Some of the teams above us this season are potentially at their strongest in the last 30 years.
The ridiculous amount (like an actual anomaly) of injuries which everyone seems to be ignoring.
The shit show of a media storm surrounding our club for the past year regarding stupidity of players, ownership etc.
Combine the first three points with the fact he's not really been here THAT long. If we are going to reset again, then we can't complain about 'not trying to create longevity and stability'.

Listen, I don't have an allegiance to ETH. I wasn't his fan as a kid, when he was a player. I am not an Ajax supporter and I am not Dutch. I form my opinion based on what I see. I see is a guy with a very good attitude, someone who has shown he can have his team playing beautiful football which amounts to success. Someone who has won us two trophies (not that easy believe it or not). Someone who protects the player's that deserve to be protected, and does not take crap from anyone.

I think one more year, and if it doesn't work out, then we can say we had a fair crack at it - but now would be too early after such a turbulent season for many reasons, not always controllable by the manager.
 
Castia said:
The story would have been shot down before it got to the point of multiple interviews and conferences we’re asking the manager if it was his last match. It’s weeks later there’s been no denial and they’ve been interviewing people for the man’s job it’s a fecking shambles as per usual
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Who have they been interviewing? I take it you were one of the candidates. Who else were in the waiting room? Tuchel? Zidane? Oh please tell me Zidane was there.
 
MadDogg said:
It must be all games, and then done part way through this season. If we take his full two seasons ETH has played 114 matches for 1.92 ppg. Yes it's still better than Klopp (who I did check and his stats are accurate for his first two seasons) and Arteta (who I didn't check but I presume is the same), but both of them came in midway through the season rather than from the start which is obviously a more difficult position.

Also cup games can distort ppg, as obviously a manager who is lucky enough to draw a lot of easy teams will have their ppg increase, whereas a manager who is unlucky enough to have tough draws will have the opposite. I didn't check the actual league stats but I expect it's likely closer.
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Yeah must be some feckwittery at play.
 
stevoc said:
Not now no, because we've wasted the best part of £400m on a load of players but the squad is arguably in a similar/worse shape now than it was in 2022.

My expectations for any new manager are the same. We have enough quality players and we spend enough to finish in the top 4 or close to it. So that should be the minimum expectation every season. Beyond that just like with Ten Hag I'd hope any new manager would be able to get the team challenging for the league by his 3rd year. Or at the very least show some positive progress in terms of performance, consistency and playstyle that make us look like we're not far off challenging.

I don't mind being patient but a manager has got to be showing something. You can't have someone in place that just writes off a season to persist with a bonkers system that isn't working. Ten Hag lost my trust with that decision, now I suspect we would just be wasting our time with him if we kept him on. I personally think managers should earn time and patience.
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So you want Eric to title challenge but dont think the squad is good enough to challenge?

The 400m wasted, granted is wasted, which is a failure from both the club and the manager. So what does a manager need to do to earn your trust? Play good football?

I think we want to take the easy way out, hire a new manager, say we will give him time and patience, give him 2 years and then start fresh again.
 
Phil said:
This is the sort of quality insights we need in this thread. Keep sending your dad golfing please.
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I will continue to keep my finger on the pulse as long as you guys promise not to tell Fabrizio. I'm sick of him taking credit for my hard work.
 
romufc said:
So you want Eric to title challenge but dont think the squad is good enough to challenge?

The 400m wasted, granted is wasted, which is a failure from both the club and the manager. So what does a manager need to do to earn your trust? Play good football?

I think we want to take the easy way out, hire a new manager, say we will give him time and patience, give him 2 years and then start fresh again.
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A manager has to show signs that he's worth patience. Performing like a bottom half side after spending £400m doesn't.
 
I'm curious...if these reports are to be believed (for the record, I don't) why wasn't Ashworth recommending Southgate for the Newcastle job when he was there?
 
Natener said:
Who have they been interviewing? I take it you were one of the candidates. Who else were in the waiting room? Tuchel? Zidane? Oh please tell me Zidane was there.
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Even Romano was saying that managers have been spoken to in the last week are you suggesting all the media are wrong on this?
 
MonkeysMagic said:
I'm curious...if these reports are to be believed (for the record, I don't) why wasn't Ashworth recommending Southgate for the Newcastle job when he was there?
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His current employer gave him a bonus to ruin United.
 
romufc said:
So you want Eric to title challenge but dont think the squad is good enough to challenge?
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No I just said in the last post, I now don't expect us to challenge next season (or the one after) with Ten Hag because of the poor job that's been done with the squad building.

romufc said:
The 400m wasted, granted is wasted, which is a failure from both the club and the manager. So what does a manager need to do to earn your trust? Play good football?
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Well as I said in my last post, a manager won't earn my trust by willingly tanking an entire season because he's too proud to abandon a system that isn't working. Beyond that and speaking generally, same as my last post there needs to be progress season on season.

stevoc said:
My expectations for any new manager are the same. We have enough quality players and we spend enough to finish in the top 4 or close to it. So that should be the minimum expectation every season. Beyond that just like with Ten Hag I'd hope any new manager would be able to get the team challenging for the league by his 3rd year. Or at the very least show some positive progress in terms of performance, consistency and playstyle that make us look like we're not far off challenging.
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romufc said:
I think we want to take the easy way out, hire a new manager, say we will give him time and patience, give him 2 years and then start fresh again.
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But they have to be showing something after 2 years to earn a 3rd year mate. The club can't afford to just say to a manager they'll be patient with them regardless of results/performances. 2 years is long enough to improve a team. Time is earned.
 
Leftback99 said:
A manager has to show signs that he's worth patience. Performing like a bottom half side after spending £400m doesn't.
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Arteta shouldn't have survived his two 8 placed finishes (or whatever it was) but he did and things worked out. There was zero indication that would happen, yet here we are.

So, clinging to some blind hope that ETH will turn this around likely won't happen as Arteta was a complete anomaly. I can't even think of any other manager in modern times who has survived finishing a season like ETH had, kept their job and had success. People will say Klopp but Liverpool fans were full sure early on that he was the man and they could see the progress. Not to mention that he came with a very good track record and done brilliantly in Europe with Dortmund.

If he starts next season then so be it. But, I would have extremely low expectations.
 
stevoc said:
No I just said in the last post, I now don't expect us to challenge next season (or the one after) with Ten Hag because of the poor job that's been done with the squad building.



Well as I said in my last post, a manager won't earn my trust by willingly tanking an entire season because he's too proud to abandon a system that isn't working. Beyond that and speaking generally, same as my last post there needs to be progress season on season.





But they have to be showing something after 2 years to earn a 3rd year mate. The club can't afford to just say to a manager they'll be patient with them regardless of results/performances. 2 years is long enough to improve a team. Time is earned.
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Fair enough, I do understand the logic why he should be sacked.

Ten Hag's football this season was dreadful I agree.

I suspect you wouldnt want to hear any reasoning either? In terms of injuries, off field issues ? Just he spent 400m for 8th so he should be sacked?

Who would your choice be to replace him btw?
 
Is Southgate looking for a new contract, and use us to get the pay up like everyone else?
I refuse to believe the rumours.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
In the season with the worst injuries under LVG, the squad had 39 injuries.

This season under ETH, the squad had 60 injuries.
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During that season, no matter who came in or out we played the same way. It didn't matter if the players were 'suited to possession football' or not we kept the ball. Smalling, Rojo, Young, Fellaini were constants and they were not 'possession' players. Nor Lingard, Blackett, Paddy McNair or Borthwick Jackson.. That is my biggest issue with Ten Hag. Your system should be constant - how well it is executed is down to form, players etc.
 
Can someone pop round to Ashworth's garden and have a word with him. Southgate managing Manchester United is almost as bad as Bozo being Prime Minister.
 
Everyone wanting to give ETH another trial run are going to feel mighty stupid in November when Ashworth hires his favourite clown.
 
romufc said:
Fair enough, I do understand the logic why he should be sacked.

Ten Hag's football this season was dreadful I agree.

I suspect you wouldnt want to hear any reasoning either? In terms of injuries, off field issues ? Just he spent 400m for 8th so he should be sacked?

Who would your choice be to replace him btw?
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Well yes he should be sacked for his performance this season. Where we ended up and more specifically the fashion in which we ended up there shouldn't be in any way acceptable for a guy who's being paid £9m per year. Van Gaal, Jose and Ole got sacked for less.

I do appreciate the injuries affected us this season, but for me it doesn't explain dropping 5 places down the table. And finishing on 15 points less than 22/23 with a negative GD. When we finally abandonded crazy ball in the lead up to the cup final, even with players still out and a make shift defence we looked a much more solid side. Where could we have finished if he'd done that in January?

The off field issues this season amount to him banishing Sancho who I got the impression he's never really fancied as a player anyway. We still had Garnacho, Antony, Amad and Pellestri as RW options so I personally don't think that had much of an affect on the season. Greenwood similarly was a total non issue for Ten Hag.
 
stevoc said:
Well yes he should be sacked for his performance this season. Where we ended up and more specifically the fashion in which we ended up there shouldn't be in any way acceptable for a guy who's being paid £9m per year. Van Gaal, Jose and Ole got sacked for less.

I do appreciate the injuries affected us this season, but for me it doesn't explain dropping 5 places down the table. And finishing on 15 points less than 22/23 with a negative GD. When we finally abandonded crazy ball in the lead up to the cup final, even with players stillout and a make shift defence we looked a much more solid side. Where could we have finished if he'd done that in January?

The off field issues this season amount to him banishing Sancho who I got the impression he's never really fancied as a player anyway. We still had Garnacho, Antony, Amad and Pellestri as RW options so I personally don't think that had much of an affect on the season. Greenwood similarly was a total non issue for Ten Hag.
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Yep that is the million dollar question, I cant answer that either. I have said it few times, any competent manager should get a team defensively solid against lower PL teams. I agree he has made mistakes.

The only reason I would keep him is due to the options available, I feel are not that great.

Say Alonso, Nagglesman or the like were available, yes get rid but when the options are Poch, Southgate, Tuchel, Di Zerbi.

The one thing I dont understand is why is it that every manager that comes with a philosophy but can never implement it at United. We get worse as a team with every manager.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
In the season with the worst injuries under LVG, the squad had 39 injuries.

This season under ETH, the squad had 60 injuries.
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Is that how you measure whether things were worse or not? Has an example Varane registers at least 3 injuries and Shaw 2 but both of them missed less games than Valencia and Shaw who missed more games in 15-16 but only register 2 combined injuries? Also for roughly 4 months we had anywhere between 10 and 14 first team players out while having a very shallow team unlike our current one.

Even if you were to conclude that this year was worse, it's by a fine margin because the 15-16 team largely had long term injuries to important players and we had a shallow team that had to rely on the likes of McNair, a young Lingard and eventually Rashford.
 
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