Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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It ain't a cult where you aren't allowed to discuss any mistakes he may have made.

Discussing mistakes isn't about doubts. Its about mistakes. He will be on a learning curve as will the squad.

Its a mature discussion and not some infantile expectations of ETH being some saviour.
I know it's not a cult where you can't discuss mistakes, I am talking about posters who made point that they aren't sure of ETH or whether he would be able to succeed here, I am talking about those doubters which creep up after just one loss.
Most of us knew it's going to be a bumpy ride initially, or maybe a couple of seasons in which we make our identy first and built the club from bottom.
 
Can't believe we have fans already doubting him or giving out.

We were crying out for a modern coach and modern style of football and we have fans already giving out. Needs time and chance to rebuild. Was left with a average squad from previous managers.
Exactly. If anything, his coaching is the one thing I'm still excited about. It was clear his instructions got through to them throughout preseason. And it was clear that his instructions almost went out the window against Brighton. That just exemplifies how mentally weak our current players are, and how our midfield in particular isn't technical enough to have confidence in their ability to carry out the instructions.

Give him better tools (midfield) to start with and let him mold the side around his system.
 
I got hated for saying that I heard this.

Ajax fans said he was quite crap at transfers.

But he's clearly not if he won things with the players he bought, no matter how crap they look on paper.

I'll admit it's winding me up seeing all these links to, ex players, Dutch players, Dutch league players, etc, it's making him look small minded, but I'm a nobody and he's a top manager.

After a good start it's him not getting his targets that's worrying now, as this new list of players we're suddenly been linked to is coming from I have no idea, I just hope the club aren't forcing them on him thinking they know better.
 
But he's clearly not if he won things with the players he bought, no matter how crap they look on paper.

I'll admit it's winding me up seeing all these links to, ex players, Dutch players, Dutch league players, etc, it's making him look small minded, but I'm a nobody and he's a top manager.

After a good start it's him not getting his targets that's worrying now, as this new list of players we're suddenly been linked to is coming from I have no idea, I just hope the club aren't forcing them on him thinking they know better.
That was Overmars, not him
 
That was Overmars, not him
I thought club realized they needed a top talent hunter and squad rebuild expert when they hired RR. ETH needs someone like that, every top manager needs good top management to succeed. I hope for his and ours sake we go after Overmars and move the responsibilities from Murtough.
 
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This is a bit Captain Hindsight, but it always irked me that people who knew him from previous clubs mentioned he's rather average with transfers but he himself demanded a lot of input and power over signings before joining United.
I got hated for saying that I heard this.

Ajax fans said he was quite crap at transfers.
The most worrying part is we've given him absolute freedom to pick the transfers
 
I need to hear from those supporters that were absolutely convinced of ETH, because as much as it genuinely pains me to say it, I am a bit worried.

I was at the game this weekend and left shell shocked. I think my exact words when Brighton scored the second and we looked abysmal were "this cannot be happening". I've not posted a lot about ETH since then whilst I try to figure out what I'm thinking about this whole thing. But there's a lot on my mind that I'd like to discuss (may have been discussed 1000 times already this week so far).

1) Those tactics. Going with the false 9. Fred deepest midfielder and Mctominay advanced. Honestly, what was he thinking? I genuinely believe he has massively underestimated the PL. He's tried to come off as a genius, tried to do what others failed at. In my opinion, you can't play with a false 9 with this squad until we have absolutely mastered the possession side at least. We lost an outlet, a focal point, and were aimless. A false 9 is not a player of Eriksen or Bruno's mould. Next, it was proven a long time ago that Fred cannot play that role. There are actual quotes from players to say that Fred is the trigger to press us, it is common knowledge that this is his weakness. We actually played to his weakness!! He can only function further up the pitch, pressing and linking. That is it. And Mctominay offers nothing further up the pitch. In fact, he's such a liability for defensive positioning and recovery that he's useless at the strongest aspect of his game if he's too far forward.

So, has ETH watched us play in depth? He's supposed to be a man of detail yet missed very glaring issues. Which leads me to my next question, does nobody at the club, Fletcher for example, point all this out to him when discussing tactics? He's been there to witness this with his own eyes.

2) Our shape. On the ball we had 2 CBs with Fred in front of them. Our fullbacks right up the pitch practically marking themselves out of the game. The rest of our players (this probably wasn't noticeable on TV for those not there) were literally in a line across the pitch about 35 yards ahead. When our CBs had the ball they looked up and saw a sea of Brighton players. Nobody ahead dropping back to offer an angle past Fred. No movement. Is this by design? Because I was at there thinking that I can see how this will look like LVG football very quickly, chaining the ball across defence very slowly to find an opening. I thought he's all about possession? Where's the triangles? The numerous passing options? Watch analysis of Peps football and you'll see that City and Barca create diamond shapes around players in possession so they always have plenty of options. Movement to create opening, 3rd man running. We saw none of that and not even an attempt at that. What we actually ended up with was a lot of long balls to nowhere because we had no passing options.

3) the subs. I know this has been discussed but it felt like we killed the game for them from the 80th minute onwards. Just as we had a head of steam. It was clear from early on that Rashford wasn't offering a thing. There was no risk in throwing Garnacho on earlier, for example. Then the fact that he took Sancho off instead. He looked a bit tired, but I would have liked to have seen him on the left instead of Rashford as he has proven to be a goal threat from there.

4) We did better in the second half up to a point. I said at half time that Eriksen needs to play deeper as he's our only hope of progressing play forward. We did that and it worked, though I think more because Brighton closed out the game instead and changed their shape. But, what I saw in the second half was a bit worrying again. No route through the middle but instead trying to whip crosses in. Moyes Vs Fulham anyone? But what was happening a lot was that line of 6 or 7 players up the pitch just wasn't making enough effort to get into the box. In preseason we overloaded the box well. Against Brighton our wide players were having to delay too many times to wait for the runs. Why did this happen? Are we going to become a long ball/crossing team against well organised teams?

5) Shaw coming straight back in. It's been discussed. But what a lazy, reactive player he is. Zero intensity, half asleep on the pitch. Stops to watch his man receive the ball before he realises he needs to close them down. It is time to integrate Malacia.

6) No Iqbal on the bench. I know people will say it was only preseason and he's just a kid, but due to point number 2, we were crying out for a player that can beat the press by carrying the ball. Only because we'd backed ourselves into such a corner with our shape, but surely he would have been a good option in this sense. Not only that but he deserved it. He was better than most of these lot. I seriously hope ETH isn't going to be that manager that puts players unworthy ahead in the pecking order just because of their name or their age. Iqbal should have been on the bench and Savage looked far better than Garner and he's disappeared.

7) Unrelated to the game but another thing that is bothering me. Thinking back to Rangnick being let go and ETH not wanting to talk to him. Plus the stories about demands from ETH to get the job, I'm starting to wonder if ETH wanted full control over transfers. And if he did, this summer brings me nothing but fear if so. Are these his targets? Are we genuinely going to go along with this? Is the FDJ debacle down to him? Honestly he's treating us like we play in Eredivise with some of these names we're being linked with. I'm hoping he's not going to prove to be an arrogant manager that doesn't believe the hype about the PL, only to be eaten alive by it. I've seen it with LVG, another Dutch manager that felt his very particular ideas were the only way to play football.

I wanted to get all this off my chest because I'm desperate for him to be a success and I'm a bit worried right now.


If you are already worried now after just one game, with a worse, and a squad with low mentality from than last year, and writing out so many problems after one game.........I don't think anyone can convince ya to come back down from where you are at.
 
If ETH started Garnacho and Iqbal, let’s say, he would be able to win over the fans. But what have we got - the same stuff as last year? There is no point


When we would have lost that game, you be nuts to think the backlash wouldn't have been worse. You'd have the same ones claiming he should have started the players who are getting the hammering at the moment.


This match is the total definition of "kneejerk"
 
I thought club realized they needed a top talent hunter and squad rebuild expert when they hired RR. ETH needs someone like that, every top manager needs good top management to succeed. I hope for his and ours sake we go after Overmars and move the responsibilities from Murtough.
Let's say someone like Overmars, not the man himself :nervous:
 
I need to hear from those supporters that were absolutely convinced of ETH, because as much as it genuinely pains me to say it, I am a bit worried.

I was at the game this weekend and left shell shocked. I think my exact words when Brighton scored the second and we looked abysmal were "this cannot be happening". I've not posted a lot about ETH since then whilst I try to figure out what I'm thinking about this whole thing. But there's a lot on my mind that I'd like to discuss (may have been discussed 1000 times already this week so far).

1) Those tactics. Going with the false 9. Fred deepest midfielder and Mctominay advanced. Honestly, what was he thinking? I genuinely believe he has massively underestimated the PL. He's tried to come off as a genius, tried to do what others failed at. In my opinion, you can't play with a false 9 with this squad until we have absolutely mastered the possession side at least. We lost an outlet, a focal point, and were aimless. A false 9 is not a player of Eriksen or Bruno's mould. Next, it was proven a long time ago that Fred cannot play that role. There are actual quotes from players to say that Fred is the trigger to press us, it is common knowledge that this is his weakness. We actually played to his weakness!! He can only function further up the pitch, pressing and linking. That is it. And Mctominay offers nothing further up the pitch. In fact, he's such a liability for defensive positioning and recovery that he's useless at the strongest aspect of his game if he's too far forward.

So, has ETH watched us play in depth? He's supposed to be a man of detail yet missed very glaring issues. Which leads me to my next question, does nobody at the club, Fletcher for example, point all this out to him when discussing tactics? He's been there to witness this with his own eyes.

2) Our shape. On the ball we had 2 CBs with Fred in front of them. Our fullbacks right up the pitch practically marking themselves out of the game. The rest of our players (this probably wasn't noticeable on TV for those not there) were literally in a line across the pitch about 35 yards ahead. When our CBs had the ball they looked up and saw a sea of Brighton players. Nobody ahead dropping back to offer an angle past Fred. No movement. Is this by design? Because I was at there thinking that I can see how this will look like LVG football very quickly, chaining the ball across defence very slowly to find an opening. I thought he's all about possession? Where's the triangles? The numerous passing options? Watch analysis of Peps football and you'll see that City and Barca create diamond shapes around players in possession so they always have plenty of options. Movement to create opening, 3rd man running. We saw none of that and not even an attempt at that. What we actually ended up with was a lot of long balls to nowhere because we had no passing options.

3) the subs. I know this has been discussed but it felt like we killed the game for them from the 80th minute onwards. Just as we had a head of steam. It was clear from early on that Rashford wasn't offering a thing. There was no risk in throwing Garnacho on earlier, for example. Then the fact that he took Sancho off instead. He looked a bit tired, but I would have liked to have seen him on the left instead of Rashford as he has proven to be a goal threat from there.

4) We did better in the second half up to a point. I said at half time that Eriksen needs to play deeper as he's our only hope of progressing play forward. We did that and it worked, though I think more because Brighton closed out the game instead and changed their shape. But, what I saw in the second half was a bit worrying again. No route through the middle but instead trying to whip crosses in. Moyes Vs Fulham anyone? But what was happening a lot was that line of 6 or 7 players up the pitch just wasn't making enough effort to get into the box. In preseason we overloaded the box well. Against Brighton our wide players were having to delay too many times to wait for the runs. Why did this happen? Are we going to become a long ball/crossing team against well organised teams?

5) Shaw coming straight back in. It's been discussed. But what a lazy, reactive player he is. Zero intensity, half asleep on the pitch. Stops to watch his man receive the ball before he realises he needs to close them down. It is time to integrate Malacia.

6) No Iqbal on the bench. I know people will say it was only preseason and he's just a kid, but due to point number 2, we were crying out for a player that can beat the press by carrying the ball. Only because we'd backed ourselves into such a corner with our shape, but surely he would have been a good option in this sense. Not only that but he deserved it. He was better than most of these lot. I seriously hope ETH isn't going to be that manager that puts players unworthy ahead in the pecking order just because of their name or their age. Iqbal should have been on the bench and Savage looked far better than Garner and he's disappeared.

7) Unrelated to the game but another thing that is bothering me. Thinking back to Rangnick being let go and ETH not wanting to talk to him. Plus the stories about demands from ETH to get the job, I'm starting to wonder if ETH wanted full control over transfers. And if he did, this summer brings me nothing but fear if so. Are these his targets? Are we genuinely going to go along with this? Is the FDJ debacle down to him? Honestly he's treating us like we play in Eredivise with some of these names we're being linked with. I'm hoping he's not going to prove to be an arrogant manager that doesn't believe the hype about the PL, only to be eaten alive by it. I've seen it with LVG, another Dutch manager that felt his very particular ideas were the only way to play football.

I wanted to get all this off my chest because I'm desperate for him to be a success and I'm a bit worried right now.

Don't agree with most of that but good post nonetheless. I'll also annoy the bedwetters who cry at any discussion so that's a bonus.

I say I disagree only because I think the players reverted to their standard play rather than it being tactical incompetence from ETH. It's going to take him plenty of time to iron out what is ingrained with these players.

The false 9 was necessity but yeah clearly didn't work and probably should have been changed sooner.
 
Really really needs a much better performance against Brentford.

Needs to switch around the starting 11 - Damned if he does - damned if he doesn't.

Erik and Murtugh are going to have to carry the FDJ cross on their backs for a long time.

Pressure is just going to mount, all the other noise around the Glazers etc is only going to intensify what has already been a baptism of fire.

And that Liverpool game…..
 
I know it's not a cult where you can't discuss mistakes, I am talking about posters who made point that they aren't sure of ETH or whether he would be able to succeed here, I am talking about those doubters which creep up after just one loss.
Most of us knew it's going to be a bumpy ride initially, or maybe a couple of seasons in which we make our identy first and built the club from bottom.

Yeap. It's 12-18 months before we will see any platform for any sustainable success
 
I am not the kind who reacts quickly, I always try to be measured and avoid being hyperbole and dramatic.

But in the next game, few players should be dropped, 2 players must not start together no matter what (McFred), 1 must not start no matter what (McTominay).

- McTominay must not start, simple as.
- Shaw, Fred, Bruno & Rashford must be dropped, I'd be happy if Malacia, Garner, DvB & Garnacho replace them.
- I would also like to see Dalot dropped as well, but the other options aren't good enough (AWB is shite and Laird is not ready for PL footy).

These players should expect to be dropped and remain dropped when they perform badly as they did against Brighton, and if they are dropped, and the team wins the next game, then that should mean the same players who started in the winning game should keep their places, as long as they perform to a minimum acceptable level (at least 6/10). I know the game afterwards is vs Liverpool, but I don't care really, these players can't just keep stinking up the place and be selected to start every game, and I am certain this way, they will know that their reputation (which is already in the gutter) would go further down if they are benched by players like Garner or DvB or Malacia.

One thing I'm 100% sure of, despite what I mentioned above, I will get it if Ten Hag starts these players again and gives them another chance (Shaw, Fred, Bruno, Rashford, etc...), but if Ten Hag starts McTominay against The Bees, I will lose respect for him, and I will doubt his coaching & managerial credentials and not trust his ability to be the head coach at United, which means I will be firmly in the Ten Hag Out camp the moment he selects McTominay to start a PL game.

McTominay was the best player on the pitch a few times last season. You need a player who can get stuck in !
 
My understanding of the situation is, ETH wanted to see what players he finds useful and the preseason flattered to deceive. Anybody that has watched these players for a while now can tell you the ones that don't fit ETH system whether they are on form or not but the preseason didn't do a good job at exposing that to ETH.

We all know DDG can't play out from the back and is unsuited for a highline. Maguire is also prone to being exposed in a highline due to his very slow pace. Fred simply won't work as the deepest midfielder as he can't beat the press and is inconsistent In passing. You can't control the game with Bruno and McFred as your midfield three. And

Changes have to be made for the next game. It shouldn't be as dramatic as some are suggesting but at the very least, ETH must play the best players available that are suited to his system instead of trying to make it work with players that don't. I'd like to see

Ronaldo
Rashford Eriksen Sancho
Zidane Fred
Shaw Martinez Maguire Dalot
DDG​
 
Exactly. If anything, his coaching is the one thing I'm still excited about. It was clear his instructions got through to them throughout preseason. And it was clear that his instructions almost went out the window against Brighton. That just exemplifies how mentally weak our current players are, and how our midfield in particular isn't technical enough to have confidence in their ability to carry out the instructions.

Give him better tools (midfield) to start with and let him mold the side around his system.
It’s not his coaching skills or man management that most on here are bothered about; all the evidence is that both are top class. It’s the ability of the club to deliver on the bolded bit that people are doubting.
 
If ETH started Garnacho and Iqbal, let’s say, he would be able to win over the fans. But what have we got - the same stuff as last year? There is no point

I want some of the youth to be given a chance too, but knew it just wasn't going to happen with a new manager.
Besides the disgruntled atmosphere that would likely arise from the regulars we wouldn't be able to ship-out in a non-champions league season, I'm not sure I'd just throw them in the deep end, particularly given how toxic our fan base is.

I feel quite a few fans still expect(ed) us to be competitive this season, want tier-1 signings right away and a team "good-to-go". On my end, have no problem hitting the hard-core reset button, playing the youth and using one proper season to really assess who we can build upon. Alas that's not going to happen.
I have my fingers crossed that ETH will only accommodate the "usual suspects" until after the Liverpool game, after that heads should roll.
 
The problem ETH has now is if he makes several changes for the next game he will be questioned as to what has been going on in training over preseason - however, if he starts with McFred again then I fear that the outpouring will be very hostile.

I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that one of the two is injured/unwell for Saturday
 
When we went for him, I said he wasn't one of the best in the world and not close to Klopp or Pep but none of the very best were available. I said I'd have preferred Conte (on the grounds that he'd be tough with the players and the board), but ETH was better than a number of other rumoured candidates and I said we'd have to give him time and space.

Part of me wondered if we should gamble on Potter, but I never thought for a moment we would.

A few weeks on, I still prefer ETH to (for example) Poch but I have been shocked that he thought some of the dross at the club deserved a third or fourth chance (although of course it's not him giving him those extra chances). He needs time but he also needs to be backed far more forcibly by the board (fat fecking chance).

My guess is that if things don't go right, he'll quit before being sacked. It would be helpful if we had a DoF but of course the club has been promising us one of those for about four years...
 
When we would have lost that game, you be nuts to think the backlash wouldn't have been worse. You'd have the same ones claiming he should have started the players who are getting the hammering at the moment.


This match is the total definition of "kneejerk"

How is this logical? Have you actually read what people are complaining about? The problem is we are seeing the same mistakes being made from a board and transfer aspect and then making the same mistakes on the pitch. All people want to see is something different. If we did start the youngsters you wouldn't see this level of backlash the reason why you see it is because it's the same players and the same mistakes.
 
How is this logical? Have you actually read what people are complaining about? The problem is we are seeing the same mistakes being made from a board and transfer aspect and then making the same mistakes on the pitch. All people want to see is something different. If we did start the youngsters you wouldn't see this level of backlash the reason why you see it is because it's the same players and the same mistakes.

Have we forgotten the LvG days? He spent the bulk of his second season primarily playing youngsters due to in large part the small squad size and injuries. Folks hated it. Fans like winning and they love very talented youngsters who perform consistently (something that is not the norm). Like most fanbases we lack patience and some of the posts in this thread are proof of that.
 
McTominay was the best player on the pitch a few times last season. You need a player who can get stuck in !
I could get stuck in. Getting stuck in is not the defining criteria needed of a United player. McTominay is woefully inept at so many other areas of the game that can't be made up by the occasional hard hitting challenge. He's another Gibson, Cleverley etc that has no right to play for United, other than he's an academy player.
 
Leading down this road with De Jong is absolutely on him. He’s had the worst possible start.
ETH and John Murtough have already been defined by the FDJ saga - it will take some time to recover from this even if he actually came.

What I find astonishing from our senior management though is there is no dialogue to try and placate the worried fan base that they know what they are doing.

Even coming and saying something like don’t believe all these nonsense stories and links - activity is going on in the background blahblah blah - by saying nothing a lot of the blame is landing on ETH which is unfair and could be quashed. Silence is often the worst option.
 
Leading down this road with De Jong is absolutely on him. He’s had the worst possible start.
Isn't that on the board? If the issue is making up the difference of the €17m and ten Hag has been unequivocal that De Jong is essential to the rebuild, it was their responsibility to figure it out with the nutters at Barca.
 
ETH and John Murtough have already been defined by the FDJ saga - it will take some time to recover from this even if he actually came.

What I find astonishing from our senior management though is there is no dialogue to try and placate the worried fan base that they know what they are doing.

Even coming and saying something like don’t believe all these nonsense stories and links - activity is going on in the background blahblah blah - by saying nothing a lot of the blame is landing on ETH which is unfair and could be quashed. Silence is often the worst option.
The big boss was caught on camera talking to fans in the a pub about having lawyers in Barcelona to sort out FdJ deal.

After that, there is no going back, silence or statement
 
Isn't that on the board? If the issue is making up the difference of the €17m and ten Hag has been unequivocal that De Jong is essential to the rebuild, it was their responsibility to figure it out with the nutters at Barca.
We have had a deal in place for a month. The player seemingly doesn’t want to come. That’s on the manager.
 
I could get stuck in. Getting stuck in is not the defining criteria needed of a United player. McTominay is woefully inept at so many other areas of the game that can't be made up by the occasional hard hitting challenge. He's another Gibson, Cleverley etc that has no right to play for United, other than he's an academy player.

I wish he were, those guys got sold very quickly. Cleverly played only 79 games in total for United compared to McTominay who'll surely reach 200 appearances this season.
 
I really don’t know what people expect, that ETH comes out and publicly criticizes individual players? Does your manager do that at your employers??? ETH inherited a squad, it will take time to improve the quality & balance of the squad and in the meantime a good man manager will try to fill the players he has at his disposal with confidence. Hence ETH’s positive remarks about a player like Fred for example. As we have already seen from clips of the training sessions during the tour ETH can be brutally honest towards the players when required. In other words, what ETH says publicly is not what he and his coaching staff will be thinking privately.
 
We have had a deal in place for a month. The player seemingly doesn’t want to come. That’s on the manager.
Its on the board. The manager is there to manage the team, not give Frenkie a verbal BJ to lure him in.

Even if ETH thought he can convince him, its an absolute punt based on barca forcing him and United being a destination. Chelsea and other clubs were not considered in our decision making and thats beyond daft. Murtough should have pulled a long time ago while there was still good time for other targets.

Rob Dawson briefed as early as May / June that even if FdJ leaves, United is NOT his destination of choice.
 
I got hated for saying that I heard this.

Ajax fans said he was quite crap at transfers.
Yes they did, but the difference is so are we as a club. Ajax seemed to have their shit together regarding transfers and footballing people like VDS and Overmars making the calls. We are just not a good football club at the moment and haven't been one for a long time.
 
Its on the board. The manager is there to manage the team, not give Frenkie a verbal BJ to lure him in.

Even if ETH thought he can convince him, its an absolute punt based on barca forcing him and United being a destination. Chelsea and other clubs were not considered in our decision making and thats beyond daft.

Rob Dawson briefed as early as May / June that even if FdJ leaves, United is NOT his destination of choice.
All we’ve heard all summer is that it’s ETH insisting on him and no one else. That is a joke and so inflexible which reflects poorly on him. The board are a joke as well for actually allowing this madness and being so spineless with zero structure but the majority of this saga lays at the feet of the manager.
 
All we’ve heard all summer is that it’s ETH insisting on him and no one else. That is a joke and so inflexible which reflects poorly on him. The board are a joke as well for actually allowing this madness and being so spineless with zero structure but the majority of this saga lays at the feet of the manager.
Who do you think would brief this in the club?
You think Ten Hag actually said FdJ or no one? Very naieve thinking given we are moving for two midfielders to replace him.

If ten hag said no one we would get no one. The brief out there isnt coming from ten hag.
 
All we’ve heard all summer is that it’s ETH insisting on him and no one else. That is a joke and so inflexible which reflects poorly on him. The board are a joke as well for actually allowing this madness and being so spineless with zero structure but the majority of this saga lays at the feet of the manager.
A coach will obviously want a player that he thinks will make his football start to work and it's perfectly understandable he would be steadfast on De Jong when the club have sacked their heads of scouting. How is he supposed to rely on the alternatives they suggest when they sacked the people who lead the whole department? Maybe he would have been inflexible anyway but it's completely reasonable to be so given those circumstances.
 
We have had a deal in place for a month. The player seemingly doesn’t want to come. That’s on the manager.
I was under the impression that the deal had reached an impasse because of Barca not wanting to pay the $17m in deferred wages and De Jong understandably not wanting to forego it.
 
Who do you think would brief this in the club?
You think Ten Hag actually said FdJ or no one? Very naieve thinking given we are moving for two midfielders to replace him.

If ten hag said no one we would get no one. The brief out there isnt coming from ten hag.
Please don’t try and make the argument that Ten Hag hasn’t been the one leading this or absolutely insisting we go all in for FdJ. That’s what it comes down to. We are going for alternatives now because he’s taken one look at a competitive game and realised how desperate the situation. I fully believe he completely underestimated Brighton and was shocked at just how bad we are.
 
I wish he were, those guys got sold very quickly. Cleverly played only 79 games in total for United compared to McTominay who'll surely reach 200 appearances this season.
Yep. The difference is we had Fergie back then. Makes me sick that the Glazers hid behind him, continue to accumulate insane wealth because of him and still aren't arsed about building a proper structure to build on his legacy. It's rotten to feck.
 
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