Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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pratyush_utd said:
No its not hilarious. If there is an upgrade, then yes it makes sense to part with him. Sacking him because of a tough season with lots of injuries and with one 20 year old new player as only recognised striker, is not fair. Maybe it is for you.

If you think options are better then fair enough. I dont. I dont like Tuchel teams so i dont consider him an upgrade
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One of the main reasons we had such a tough season is because Ten Hag stubbornly refused to adapt his zero midfield set up in order to provide our already vulnerable and injury hit back line with greater protection. If he had shown more pragmatism and tactical flexibility I am confident he would have provided our injury hit squad with a much more stable platform to fight for results from - just look at what we’ve achieved in the past couple matches with a change in set up.

It’s impossible to predict which prospective manager might do better, but it’s pretty fecking easy to identify one of the fatal managerial flaws we’ve already suffered from this season.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
Given we are talking about a man who's coaching for over a year is the most inept we have seen.
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That would be Moyes by a country mile. The effects of the damage he did to our club can be felt to this day. I would argue that both Ole and LVG were far worse as well.

OverratedOpinion said:
I mean what does "available" mean?

Given we are talking about a man who's coaching for over a year is the most inept we have seen.

But anyway you are looking at that in a very linear way. I see no world where we couldn't get Emery. We are Man Utd and he is at Aston Villa, regardless of champions league.

Mancini is a better manager and would come. Tuchel is a better manager and would come.

We aren't aiming to replace Sir Alex Ferguson. We are aiming to improve on a man who has knowingly left gaping holes in midfield all season which caused us to be the most open team in the league.
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And yet not a single other club is aiming for these managers you've listed. I wonder why?

And for the love of God, why Emery? Flopped at Arsenal and PSG. The man is a Spanish Moyes. Good a midtable clubs, but once the pressure ramps up he looks like a deer in headlights.
 
Bastian said:
It's old and things are moving quickly. The Bayern mouthpiece things Tuchel is joining United, and says it is what the Bayern hierarchy believe. That Jan Age cnut has been proven wrong with regards to ETH having been informed of his impending sacking prior to the Arsenal match, as he's unequivocally said he's never been told he's out. And it's a watershed moment today for many, even though many feel aggrieved by that.

I think it's quite timely.
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What’s old?
 
Rista said:
Have people really completely forgotten how we've played for the entirety of the season? The worst league campaign in modern history, the CL humiliation?
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Pretty sure SAFs 13th place finish would top that. And for the older folk, the 1974 relegation season would top this as well.

But if you want to talk post SAF, Moyes and Ragnick had way worse league finishes in my view.
 
ArmaDino said:
Please. The fella that was brought to PSG to win the CL and failed. Then went to Chelsea and won the CL against City(same like we did tonight).

However since then his career has been in a downturn. Sacked at Chelsea, went to Bayern bottle the CL and losses the title(first time Bayern hasn't won the title in 10+ years).

Clearly this is the guy that we need to turn our misfortunes around. While we're at it, let's bring Di Mateo since he did exactly what Tuchel did. Suppose he'd be an improvement too, no?


Go on lad, show me these superior manager waiting to to take job.
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You’ll find out in a weeks time
 
Ace of Spades said:
Sure, if they had talent and ability. And yet the inexperienced ones have achieved the most success. And set the highest standards.
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You probably mean Pep and Zidane, but they are exception of the rule considering the stacked teams that they inherited and as mentioned the thousands of other inexperienced failures...

Ace of Spades said:
So, Moyes was not good enough, and that was after we had just won the league. ETH 2nd season does not excuse his awful results and performances. Injuries are not an excuse,and does explain the non existant midfield and cluless attack.
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EtH has his flaws but having ton of injuries and playing Casemiro/almost 40 years old Evans as CB is one of the reasons we're 8 points off the 4th spot.

Ace of Spades said:
Klopp finished 5th with +28GD, after proving a success by winning the PL and CL.
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he still finished 5th.
Ace of Spades said:
Lego Pep ahs been top 4 two years in a row.
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So did Ole, want to appoint him again?
 
Zumbi said:
One of the main reasons we had such a tough season is because Ten Hag stubbornly refused to adapt his zero midfield set up in order to provide our already vulnerable and injury hit back line with greater protection. If he had shown more pragmatism and tactical flexibility I am confident he would have provided our injury hit squad with a much more stable platform to fight for results from - just look at what we’ve achieved in the past couple matches with a change in set up.

It’s impossible to predict which prospective manager might do better, but it’s pretty fecking easy to identify one of the fatal managerial flaws we’ve already suffered from this season.
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This is what has cost him his job in my eyes. Well put.

Arguing about there being very few elite managers available is silly when the man they would be replacing has caused our worst performances in over 30 years with his tactics.

His performance in his role cost this. Forget the poor signings, I can forgive that and hope for a great director of football, forget the issues with Sancho and Ronaldo, I still think the 2 players were in the wrong. What I can't see past is his week to week performance in preparing his team tactically for over a year.
 
He's being sacked. That is completely obvious. I'd have kept him but I can fully see why he can't stay.

Let's remember he played Oleball today and there's no future in that. Weirdly he lost credibility today because he abandoned his own project.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
We are Manchester Utd. If we look like the 2nd best team on the pitch nearly every week then I demand change.

The awe inspiring work that Sir Alex did made us into a club where that is unacceptable.
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In SAF's first few years we were usually the second best team on the pitch every week, I know, I was there, and we showed very little sign of getting better.
 
simonhch said:
Just to correct the tweet, it says Mainoo had Agüero applauding him, but he was applauding the team. He first lauded the pass from Rashford, and then said “I have to applaud the goal from United. In truth that goal from United is very impressive”.

Semantics, I know.

Either way, fair play to him.
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Understood, he sure loved that Rashford pass.
 
stevoc said:
We know Ten Hag can set a team up to play like the underdogs as we did today. It was the sensible thing to do, and he got his tactics spot on. He is a good manager but he hasn't shown he can implement his own system, he should be able to do that regardless of the personnel. He's said he made compromises on the style of play he watns to play, ok but in that case what was the point of how he set us up all season adn why did he continue with it if that's not how he even wanted to play. Especially as Stevie Wonder could see it wasn't working.
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He's answered this question time and again. He didn't want to change his tactics from how he wants us to play because going defensive then it not working would be extremely demoralising for players and fans alike. He also gambled that sooner or later players will come back and we'd be better positioned for that style of play with his preferred personnel rather than switch styles and formations all the time.

When he says comprise, I imagine he means compromise with the personnel who cannot play this way (maguire, lindelof, Evans, varane unable to play a high line) or personnel out of position (amrabat, awb dalot ar lb, casimero at cb, rashford up top).

This statement about being About to implement his own style regardless of personnel, do you honestly believe that? Do you believe Guardiola can come in and implement how he's playing right now with the personnel that have been readily avaliable this year (your awbs, maguires, Evans, lindelofs, casemiros of the footballing world)?
 
OverratedOpinion said:
Is there a manager available that you think could avoid us being the most open team in the league and conceding around 20 shots per game?
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So, your criticism of Ten Hag revolves around the number of shots we conceded. Today, we witnessed how the return of Martinez and Varane significantly improved our defense and overall performance. Considering Varane and Evans are leaving, we will sign a new center-back. Additionally, Shaw and Malacia will return, and Onana's will get better next season. I have no doubt we’ll be better defensively and offensively next season. As I said, I don't see a better available manager right now.
 
ArmaDino said:
That would be Moyes by a country mile. The effects of the damage he did to our club can be felt to this day. I would argue that both Ole and LVG were far worse as well.
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You'd be wrong on all 3 accounts.

Moyes was extremely basic tactically but he did the basics of preparing a defence and having players in midfield.

Van Gaal was extremely poor for his first month where he obsessed over 3-5-2 with some poor results. He then settled into an extremely possession heavy 4-3-3 which resulted in us being countered on and struggling to score but controlling most games.

Ole understood his squad for 2 years set up in a way that Ten Hag has done in the games that have yielded his biggest results. Ole just set his defence up better and understood he needed to have 2 grafters in midfield.

The stats back up that no coach has ever seen us seed so much control to opposition teams.
 
red.knight said:
So, your criticism of Ten Hag revolves around the number of shots we conceded. Today, we witnessed how the return of Martinez and Varane significantly improved our defense and overall performance. Considering Varane and Evans are leaving, we will sign a new center-back. Additionally, Shaw and Malacia will return, and Onana's will get better next season. I have no doubt we’ll be better defensively and offensively next season. As I said, I don't see a better available manager right now.
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I think the centre halves have very little to do with the lack of control we have had in games even against some of the worst sides on the league. The fact that Ten Hag decided a 1 man midfield was some sort of genius idea and was too stubborn to admit it was destroying our season was the cause.

I think there are a lot of coaches available who would have seen that being ridiculous and as such given us better results this season.
 
ArmaDino said:
Pretty sure SAFs 13th place finish would top that. And for the older folk, the 1974 relegation season would top this as well.

But if you want to talk post SAF, Moyes and Ragnick had way worse league finishes in my view.
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This season was objectively worse than either of those. Less points, less goals scored, more goals conceded than Moyes. By almost every metric we were very fortunate to finish 8th as well.
 
Red in STL said:
In SAF's first few years we were usually the second best team on the pitch every week, I know, I was there, and we showed very little sign of getting better.
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What happened 35 years ago and became a fluke circumstance with the greatest manager to ever live is not particularly relevant.

What is your stance? Because 3 and a half decades ago the most special man to ever grace our club did something incredible we should completely stagnate and never act on clear and obvious indicators that someone is the wrong man for the job?
 
Nas-JR said:
He's answered this question time and again. He didn't want to change his tactics from how he wants us to play because going defensive then it not working would be extremely demoralising for players and fans alike. He also gambled that sooner or later players will come back and we'd be better positioned for that style of play with his preferred personnel rather than switch styles and formations all the time.

When he says comprise, I imagine he means compromise with the personnel who cannot play this way (maguire, lindelof, Evans, varane unable to play a high line) or personnel out of position (amrabat, awb dalot ar lb, casimero at cb, rashford up top).
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That's my point if this is how he wants us to play then he has to go. His tactics are suicidal and likely won't work with regardless of the personnel. You can't play a high forward line while having the defence drop deep, it's nonsensical.

All of those defenders can a play a high line. Dortmund play a high line with a 35 years old Hummels.


This statement about being About to implement his own style regardless of personnel, do you honestly believe that? Do you believe Guardiola can come in and implement how he's playing right now with the personnel that have been readily avaliable this year (your awbs, maguires, Evans, lindelofs, casemiros of the footballing world)?
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Yes, Guardiola might tweak things to suit the players we have but yes absolutely. He could implement a style with the current squad and then evolve it over time as he got more players in, that's what he did at City after all.
 
red.knight said:
What do you mean by saying 99% of managers are available to United?
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Ten Hag is one of the top 5 highest paid managers on the planet.

Outside of Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti and a few others virtually every manager is available to United when you're offering them a £9m per year salary.

How do you think we got Ten Hag? Was he availalable 2 years ago?
 
glazed said:
He's being sacked. That is completely obvious. I'd have kept him but I can fully see why he can't stay.

Let's remember he played Oleball today and there's no future in that. Weirdly he lost credibility today because he abandoned his own project.
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Oleball wins against City. Ole had their number
 
VP89 said:
Hes also a proven bed wetter at Bayern, more recently.
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Yeah against a team that went unbeaten all season, nobody was beating them. You have every excuse under the sun for a manager that finishes 8th, plays crap football, -1 GD, bottom of a weak CL group (a group win by the "bed wetter"). All while spending £400m for the privilege. And yet you come out with guff like that and ignore all context. Your opinion is worthless.
 
Immense game from him today.

The players gave their all for this man and it’s obvious. As a fanbase we should archive that very silly argument that we use as a crutch for any underperforming manager.

They are either not good enough or poorly coached. I think it’s been a combination on both and you don’t need to pick which to solve, you can solve both.

I don’t think he is a poor coach though. I think his stubbornness got the best of him. Perhaps he was naive about his approach to transitioning us into his vision of how he would want us to play.

Anyway, INEOS, your call now
 
ArmaDino said:
Pretty sure SAFs 13th place finish would top that. And for the older folk, the 1974 relegation season would top this as well.

But if you want to talk post SAF, Moyes and Ragnick had way worse league finishes in my view.
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There were people who witnessed the 1974 season saying on here recently that this felt worse due to the football and despair of watching us.
 
Arsenal had poor seasons in 2017 and 2020 and won the Fa Cup (beating City and Chelsea both times in last 2 games). Chelsea had a meh/average season in 2017/18 and won the Fa Cup beating us (2nd in league) in final. Fa Cup win makes a season more bearable but doesn't change the reality of a bad season. On the other hand, manager reaching 3 finals in two seasons and winning 2 trophies is a really good achievement. Especially when we only won 3 trophies in 10 years prior.
 
Stadjer said:
But of those 99% available managers most arent superior.
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No obviously not all but unless you think Ten Hag is one of the top 5-10 coaches in the world then we can find someone who is potentially superior and/or a better fit.

Do you think he's that good?
 
Rista said:
This season was objectively worse than either of those. Less points, less goals scored, more goals conceded than Moyes. By almost every metric we were very fortunate to finish 8th as well.
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When you want to use the words objectively, maybe try getting your facts straight first? We had more points than the Ragnick season, equal goals scored and one less goal conceded. In that season we had nothing to play for for the last 3 months and, most importantly, we didn't win a bloody fa cup! How on earth can you claim this season is worse! The agenda is mental!
 
glazed said:
He's being sacked. That is completely obvious. I'd have kept him but I can fully see why he can't stay.

Let's remember he played Oleball today and there's no future in that. Weirdly he lost credibility today because he abandoned his own project.
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Absolutely. Hailed as a tactical masterclass by his fans on here though. We were on our game no doubt, and were both dogged and effective, but it was a simple tactic as old as time.

The funny thing was that in what is probably his last game, he got a win against City using the exact tactics he was brought in to phase out 2 years ago. Ultimately he has failed in what he was brought in to achieve, and today's game and recent games show that.
 
golden_blunder said:
I don’t even mind that. A good manager will do what it takes to win
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“why isn’t ten hag flexible? he should be able to change the way we play depending on who’s available and who we’re playing.”

and

“can’t believe ten hag changed the way he plays. weakness.”
 
Nas-JR said:
When you want to use the words objectively, maybe try getting your facts straight first? We had more points than the Ragnick season, equal goals scored and one less goal conceded. In that season we had nothing to play for for the last 3 months and, most importantly, we didn't win a bloody fa cup! How on earth can you claim this season is worse! The agenda is mental!
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Well, we did finish a couple of places lower, and our league position was pretty flattering on how we actually played.

The cup win makes it a better season overall though, yeah.
 
Bastian said:
The poll. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this the poll that first asked whether or not ETH should be in charge for the FA Cup final?
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No that one closed. Read the question :)

the % that wanted him fired has changed today from around 73% to just over 60%
 
Nas-JR said:
When you want to use the words objectively, maybe try getting your facts straight first? We had more points than the Ragnick season, equal goals scored and one less goal conceded. In that season we had nothing to play for for the last 3 months and, most importantly, we didn't win a bloody fa cup! How on earth can you claim this season is worse! The agenda is mental!
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Nobody said anything about the cup, we were talking about the league campaign. The agenda!!
 
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