Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Fallon d'Floor said:
I was kind of taking the piss with my tone.

I believe that's he's a very good Eredivisie manager. Just like Peter Bosz and Gio van Bronckhorst are.

I have little sympathy with regards to injuries due to a lack of rotation last season and poor preparation/overtraining this season. They've all had an impact in terms of injuries. We'd be 5% better with a fit Shaw at LB. The season would still have been a mess. Some people blame the injuries on everything.

You'll probably get some fans blaming INEOS for signing certain players if they struggle next season.

"We'd have been better off leaving ten Hag in control of transfers" :D
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There's a lot to criticize but we do seem to have been disproportionately hit by injuries that have nothing to do, so it least it would seem, with training.

Martinez -- his foot and knee injuries happened in competition
Shaw -- ETH inherited an injury prone player
Malacia -- a real mystery as to why he's missed the entire season
Varane -- old and injury prone
Lindelof -- this one we might be able to blame on overly intensive training although we have no idea
Maguire -- pulled a hamstring in competition I believe
Casemiro -- probably overly intensive training but he might have have turned into an old man quickly
Martial -- a legendary performer in the physioroom long before ETH arrived
Rashford -- I'm not convinced he ever fully recovered from his fractured back
Eriksen -- can't keep up with the pace of the PL any longer
Sancho -- mental health issues, but I think we can blame ten Hag for contributing to Sancho's malaise
Hojlund -- out for a month or so at one point in the season, which is reasonable under the circumstances
 
Nicoseth said:
So we weren't better last year than the year before?
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We were. We got back to our 20-21 level. We are also worse this year than we were in any of the previous 30 seasons.

Kind of not the point though. Moyes is leaving West Ham following a season very similar to the one we are having now because they don’t feel like it’s good enough and want to progress. Meanwhile we seem OK with this level.
 
Nas-JR said:
Like I said, the price of trying to play gung-ho football with bang average and incompatible players.

We are lacking in many departments but you can't seriously suggest we lack entertainment value?
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We aren't playing gung-ho football - we are getting taken apart with no style of play. Crap teams are getting twice as many shots off as us and dominating large periods of the game.

We lack entertainment value for ourselves. If any United fan enjoys watching the parts of games which are us on the ball or us defending, then they're mental.

Some games for example

Against Brentford they had 31 shots to our 11 (5 SoT each) - battered

Against City, they had 27 shot (8 ot) to our 3 (1 ot)

Bournemouth, 20 shots (5 ot) to our 8 (2 ot)

The only games where we were actually dominant were our last two out against the two bottom teams in the league. Even against Everton, where we won, they had 1/3 more shots than us
 
BarstoolProphet said:
Neville is famously pro-managers, so no wonder he failed to address his obvious lies while making excuses, which made the interview all cosy. Nevermind the sackable 7-0 loss, he also started this season with his preferred back four and midfield and the issues we have seen all season was evident also then. Injuries have been a convenient excuse to hide from him being completely unable to adapt to the squad available to him. Everyone bar Dalot has regressed badly under him, even our exciting youngsters look absolutely shot.

Moyes might win the worst manager accolade based on a bigger fall from grace but this season is by far the worst in isolation.
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Yeah, in the media.

Not at Salford :wenger:
 
The Mitcher said:
It makes no sense. I refuse to believe we don't have ten million lying around to sack him.

It's also stupid that INEOS thinks there's no one else, when Liverpool found their replacement already (jury is out as Slot could be their ETH) and there are managers like Tuchel, Amorrim, Valverde, Enrique, Xavi, McKenna, Carrick and others that we could convince to leave clubs or sign straight away.
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Correct.

If they're going to be spending at least £100 million on signings, then 9 million isn't that much. It could be less due to us not playing in The CL next season. His salary might be less for his final year. We don't know.

The manager is more important than spending £10-15 million on a squad player like Malacia. Just as an example.

They'll also have to spend a few million sorting out Ashworth's early release from Newcastle.

I'd argue that Ashworth and a new manager are the priorities for next season. A new manager should be able to improve multiple players. That's what Emery did at Villa. We'll need to make some signings, obviously. But improving what we already have is vital.

There's no real excuse for not having a list of managers in mind months ago. They've witnessed first hand how the season has processed in 2024. The underlying data is there to be analysed. 6th flatters us. It could have been a lot worse. They'll also be able to notice a clear decline since winning The League Cup.

The team has been out of form long before this season's injuries. The likes of Shaw, Martínez and Casemiro all played in the 7-0 at Anfield and were involved in the Sevilla collapse. They all played on the opening night when Wolves cut through us for fun. They were on the pitch when Wolves almost fought back against us. We conceded multiple shots vs Newport County with them all starting. We've lacked control in 90% of our games this season. No matter what players we've used.

If they keep ten Hag, so be it. It's a big risk.
 
Amir said:
We're clearly not fine with where we are.

We've also got a lot of issues to deal with beside the manager, and just replacing him won't bring us to where we want to be.

Which doesn't mean he'll stay or should stay. Just that we're doing a lot to get things right in other departments that should also reflect to what we end up seeing on the pitch.
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If they keep Ten Haag and he starts next season badly in a manner that ends up leading to another lost season, that will be unforgivable. It would be a lot of faith in someone that hasn't proven he deserves it. As a club, we've been big enough to endure being poor for a decade. However, we're getting to the point where the failures are affecting us financially and would start to affect our standing in the game. We can't afford not to be competitive. This isn't about being honorable or trying to be friendly. As a club, we need to start being serious and stop playing politics. If they keep him, it better work or they'll completely lose the trust and support of the fans.
 
Fallon d'Floor said:
Correct.

If they're going to be spending at least £100 million on signings, then 9 million isn't that much. It could be less due to us not playing in The CL next season. His salary might be less for his final year. We don't know.

The manager is more important than spending £10-15 million on a squad player like Malacia. Just as an example.

They'll also have to spend a few million sorting out Ashworth's early release from Newcastle.

I'd argue that Ashworth and a new manager are the priorities for next season. A new manager should be able to improve multiple players. That's what Emery did at Villa. We'll need to make some signings, obviously. But improving what we already have is vital.

There's no real excuse for not having a list of managers in mind months ago. They've witnessed first hand how the season has processed in 2024. The underlying data is there to be analysed. 6th flatters us. It could have been a lot worse. They'll also be able to notice a clear decline since winning The League Cup.

The team has been out of form long before this season's injuries. The likes of Shaw, Martínez and Casemiro all played in the 7-0 at Anfield and were involved in the Sevilla collapse. They all played on the opening night when Wolves cut through us for fun. They were on the pitch when Wolves almost fought back against us. We conceded multiple shots vs Newport County with them all starting. We've lacked control in 90% of our games this season. No matter what players we've used.

If they keep ten Hag, so be it. It's a big risk.
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I also don't get the single minded pursuit of Ashworth, aside from him being buddies with some of the new higher ups. There are other DoFs out there, and they should have forseen this from Newcastle when approaching him.
 
tjb said:
If they keep Ten Haag and he starts next season badly in a manner that ends up leading to another lost season, that will be unforgivable. It would be a lot of faith in someone that hasn't proven he deserves it. As a club, we've been big enough to endure being poor for a decade. However, we're getting to the point where the failures are affecting us financially and would start to affect our standing in the game. We can't afford not to be competitive. This isn't about being honorable or trying to be friendly. As a club, we need to start being serious and stop playing politics. If they keep him, it better work or they'll completely lose the trust and support of the fans.
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First we'll have to wait and see if he actually starts next season. And then we'll have to see how next season pans out.

At worst, if it does happen, it'll turn out to be a mistake and Ineos will look to rectify it.

Look, there WILL be mistakes along the way. I don't think fans should lose faith within a few months over one mistake, but even if they do, so be it. It'll hardly drive Ineos out. And if Ineos then gets things right, the fans will calm down.
 
The Mitcher said:
It's also stupid that INEOS thinks there's no one else, when Liverpool found their replacement already (jury is out as Slot could be their ETH) and there are managers like Tuchel, Amorrim, Valverde, Enrique, Xavi, McKenna, Carrick and others that we could convince to leave clubs or sign straight away.
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Liverpool didn't exactly have a choice as they had to appoint someone. Xavi is staying at Barcelona and the idea of getting Carrick or McKenna is just wrong at this stage.

The right and better manager is obviously out there somewhere. But in order to identify the right man for what we want under the new structure we need the new cogs in place - Ashworth, etc. I mean, that's a big part of the idea of creating that structure.
 
As a non-United fan I pray united keep him. Seems utterly clueless not only tactically but with regards to transfers there is no one manager in the world with as poor a record. Can't wait to see what he does in the summer.
 
crossy1686 said:
Here we fecking go, banging on about the defence when it's the gaps in midfield that are the issue, talking about not having a left footed CB like it's the only possible way football can be played. God knows how we fecking coped with two right footed defenders like Rio and Vidic. Also feel for the likes of Milan who struggled for all those years with Nesta and Stam, or literally any other great CB pairing that ever existed...
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You know if the defence steps up into the attacking half there won’t be those gaps. Look at what City and Arsenal do. Hence no gaps.

Defence absolutely is a massive part of that.
Fallon d'Floor said:
I actually dislike people who continue to defend ten Hag more than the man himself at this point. There's only really 4-5 of you in this thread these days.

You yourself made up your mind that the structure is to blame for most things and push that narrative regularly. Come rain or shine.

ten Hag being a success going forward would mean that he'd have to start doing the opposite of pretty much everything we've seen for over a year now. That would piss me off, seeing someone rewarded for his failings.
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This is a really disappointing post from you. You’re someone who I think expresses themselves generally really well and has shown a lot of promise

But this is a really saddening thing to see that you dislike anyone who has an opposing view to you especially when we don’t see it as defending him but more contextualising.
Fallon d'Floor said:
I'm very secure, thanks.

You're also welcome to post your excuses regularly. I think you're completely delusional and keep going around in circles on a regular basis.

Each to their own.
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Another disappointment.

Im sure you can express your own views without being disdainful towards those who disagree.
 
sammyhol said:
The scariest thing about that interview is his answer to the questions about why there are so many gaps in midfield, and why is Casemiro so isolated. His response is that it is because we have had an unsettled back 4.... and then quoted that the settled back 4 is the sole reason we were so solid last year.

No Erik... it is because we didn't play a Kamikaze press with the front 5 last year, and Casemiro had a partner (usually Eriksen) sat alongside him all season in a relatively deep, compact shape. Casemiro looked great last year because he is great defensively in tight areas, great at getting a foot in early, and pretty positive forward passer. The space around him this season is what is exposing his weaknesses... that being a complete lack of legs and mobility.

It just confirms to me that he doesn't even understand what the problem is, let alone how to fix it.

Worrying stuff.
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Its actually scary. Im even angrier that Neville didnt say what you said and push him some more.



Realistically, Carragher should have done that interview if we wanted Ten Hag to answer properly and be pushed.
 
RedStarUnited said:
Its actually scary. Im even angrier that Neville didnt say what you said and push him some more.



Realistically, Carragher should have done that interview if we wanted Ten Hag to answer properly and be pushed.
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Not sure. Neville being a United fan and former player should have pushed him like you said. He can clearly see the issues that all of us are seeing and i imagine he watches us every game which will be more than Carragher.
 
If this guy is here next season, we're getting Spuds'd
 
I actually felt a bit sorry for him that he wasn’t given his biggest targets. United should be providing them like Madrid do.

I know it’s just one player, but Kane would have made a significant difference IMO
 
LawCharltonBest said:
I actually felt a bit sorry for him that he wasn’t given his biggest targets. United should be providing them like Madrid do.

I know it’s just one player, but Kane would have made a significant difference IMO
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Spurs we're never selling to a rival. Ten Hag is an idiot if he thought that was ever going to happen.
 
I watched the interview. I think he’s realistic, he knows this season is not up to standard.

It got me thinking, wow, he really isn’t a great communicator. His English isn’t great and he has almost zero charisma. Maybe to win the league in the PL, maybe you need more charisma? Klopp, Pep, Arteta, SAF, Mourinho, Conte, Tuchel, Wenger… I’m trying to think of the last boring manager to win the league. Ranieri maybe?

Also, I take his point about not being able to implement his tactics because he doesn’t have the players. But if you count Donny, we now have Antony, Onana, Donny Lisandro and Amrabaat that have played under him and his “tactics”. Only Lisandro has shown he can play at this level, Onana too I guess. The importance of a left footed CB seems paramount.

Clearly, he rates Casemiro, Mount and Shaw and Mainoo, Hojlund and Garnacho. He bought Malacia and Eriksen too.

I was hoping the interview would help me understand why we are playing so poorly, but I just came out knowing that he isn’t good enough as a manager to win the league.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
I actually felt a bit sorry for him that he wasn’t given his biggest targets. United should be providing them like Madrid do.

I know it’s just one player, but Kane would have made a significant difference IMO
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I think we would be in the same place now, talking about how pathetic our structure is because they got him an aging striker and expected him to make it work.
 
iato89 said:
SJR has full control of the football aspect of the club, so yes he can sack him whenever he wants!
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The Mitcher said:
Sir Jim is co-owner with the glazers...
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That is not the point. Yes, Ratcliffe has reportedly negotiated control over football operations but that means that he got the main say to pick a new CEO and DoF. These are his people, but they have not started working yet (or in the case of Ashworth, not yet been hired).
He himself has no position, what is he going to do, phone in and tell the manager that he has been sacked? That is not how it works. This is not Abramovich's Chelsea. The people who are tasked with deciding the managers fate are not there yet, hence there will be no sacking until they are. Is it really that hard to understand?
 
I don’t think the club does that interview and then chucks him end of season.

I think he’s lucky if this is the case.
 
Nas-JR said:
Like I said, the price of trying to play gung-ho football with bang average and incompatible players.

We are lacking in many departments but you can't seriously suggest we lack entertainment value?
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Gung ho football would suggest we are a swashbuckling side that throws caution to the wind to go all out attack.

We aren't though, we're shit at attacking and we're shit at defending. In fact due to the nonsensical way we play there's not much we're actually decent at despite having a squad full of internationals.

Which players are bang average?
 
FortunaUtd said:
That is not the point. Yes, Ratcliffe has reportedly negotiated control over football operations but that means that he got the main say to pick a new CEO and DoF. These are his people, but they have not started working yet (or in the case of Ashworth, not yet been hired).
He himself has no position, what is he going to do, phone in and tell the manager that he has been sacked? That is not how it works. This is not Abramovich's Chelsea. The people who are tasked with deciding the managers fate are not there yet, hence there will be no sacking until they are. Is it really that hard to understand?
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If you really think the new hires are just weeding their gardens in the meantime, you need to take a reality check.
 
Just noticed this - is this new poll a joke? Have a thousand people voted and half of them wanting Erik sacked before the Cup Final? Even factoring in that the structure being built is not ready so it would be money people making decisions yet again?
 
Sarni said:
We were. We got back to our 20-21 level. We are also worse this year than we were in any of the previous 30 seasons.

Kind of not the point though. Moyes is leaving West Ham following a season very similar to the one we are having now because they don’t feel like it’s good enough and want to progress. Meanwhile we seem OK with this level.
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And we should feel privileged with where we are, without Ten Hag and this bunch of ban average players not fit for the championship we'd probably be relegated. If we just keep the faith in 1-2 years we could be challenging for 4th. In 3-4 years we could maybe, possibly, perhaps even be circling around a 3rd-2nd place finish. And 6-8 years from now when Ten Hag is in his 60's and he's been allowed to build his second complete squad we may even flirt with a title challenge.
 
Bastian said:
Just noticed this - is this new poll a joke? Have a thousand people voted and half of them wanting Erik sacked before the Cup Final? Even factoring in that the structure being built is not ready so it would be money people making decisions yet again?
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No I don't think so, but the results so far show 100% of people who voted think Ten Hag should be sacked (at some point).
 
stevoc said:
No I don't think so, but the results so far show 100% of people who voted think Ten Hag should be sacked (at some point).
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It’s a poor poll given no option of him taking the final and staying.
 
Sarni said:
Very likely yes.
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The more possible credible hints in the media are saying.

1) INEOS don't think that club had the correct structure so he was hampered by that.
2) They don't want to pay compensation.
3) There isn't anyone out there that they desperately want.

So carry on until they feel it everything is in place and a top manager is available.

On that basis he could be here for the next 5 - 10 years.
 
stevoc said:
And we should feel privileged with where we are, without Ten Hag and this bunch of ban average players not fit for the championship we'd probably be relegated. If we just keep the faith in 1-2 years we could be challenging for 4th. In 3-4 years we could maybe, possibly, perhaps even be circling around a 3rd-2nd place finish. And 6-8 years from now when Ten Hag is in his 60's and he's been allowed to build his second complete squad we may even flirt with a title challenge.
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What makes you think that we would get better and not worse ?
 
stevoc said:
No I don't think so, but the results so far show 100% of people who voted think Ten Hag should be sacked (at some point).
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I think there might be some within that other camp who might give him more leeway, but I'm surprised to see 500 posters wanting him sacked now. I could maybe understand it if it were two months ago with an interim.
 
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