Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[crossy1686]

If you watched the full interview, there is a lot more to suggest he has a lot of support from the new owners than not.

Yeah, particularly where he says you need the best people in every position, people who are "10's" and outstanding in their area. Then also the part where he didn't back the manager and chose to speak about the last 11 years instead.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

You also had Stam, Van Nistelrooy, Blind and Van Persie. Stop painting with broad strokes.

Don't forget Edwin our penalty hero.

 

[VP89]

Yeah, particularly where he says you need the best people in every position, people who are "10's" and outstanding in their area. Then also the part where he didn't back the manager and chose to speak about the last 11 years instead.

You're being a bit silly here - there are various bits about him backing the manager. He said there's a style he expects and also said he's been pleased with the squad since he took over in the new year. He also said the managers have had no chance to really succeed under the structure they've operated under.

In other words, they aren't going to just be lazy like some fans are and go "blargh futbol is shite innit let's sack", without actually looking at the context.

 

[Yanited__]

As I said yesterday, the decider for me on Erik Ten Hag remaining as Manchester United manager beyond this season is not based on whether we get top 4/european football.

For me, I would be happy to give Ten Hag another year if I see an improvement in the football. I don't want to watch my team and be bored like that first half yesterday. That's happened too many times not just under Ten Hag, but several squads before this. That's not what this clubs about, it's not what I or any of us were brought up on.

Ten Hag has alluded to the philosophy of this club before. He's done an OK job at setting us up to play as a counter-attacking side which has been part of our allure in the past. But the time has come to make the next step. We need to start finding a way to break these teams down that sit back all game.

We're not gonna start doing that overnight however, I acknowledge that. But I want to see some building blocks being placed. If so, and we don't get top 4, no problem for me. He will deserve another year for me.

If Ten Hag reverts to short-termism to get him through this season, it might work. We might just snatch european football. But the same problems will appear next season, and he will be sacked.

 

[crossy1686]

You're being a bit silly here - there are various bits about him backing the manager. He said there's a style he expects and also said he's been pleased with the squad since he took over in the new year. He also said the managers have had no chance to really succeed under the structure they've operated under.

In other words, they aren't going to just be lazy like some fans are and go "blargh futbol is shite innit let's sack", without actually looking at the context.

Total diplomacy, all things you'd expect new owners to say right after a takeover, and yet each week there's someone else replaced. The manager will be the last to go but he is going.

 

[VP89]

Total diplomacy, all things you'd expect new owners to say right after a takeover, and yet each week there's someone else replaced. The manager will be the last to go but he is going.

Its not diplomacy to go out of your way and criticise the structure, and also go out of your way to say the football since the turn of the year has been good. He could have said none of that context and still been neutral to our current coach.

I do enjoy how your point about him in a cherry picked portion is not diplomacy but everything else is. That's brilliant.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

Don't forget Edwin our penalty hero.

Yeah that’s at least two league titles and a champions league thanks to the Dutch.

 

[Abhinav]

Klopp just showing one more example in the LC final that you dont need your best X1 to look like a team and play coherent attacking football.
The fact that our players look like strangers on the pitch even after 1.5 years is the biggest indictment of EtH as a coach.

 

[crossy1686]

Its not diplomacy to go out of your way and criticise the structure, and also go out of your way to say the football since the turn of the year has been good. He could have said none of that context and still been neutral to our current coach.

I do enjoy how your point about him in a cherry picked portion is not diplomacy but everything else is. That's brilliant.

He's criticised the the things him and Brailsford have replaced already, he's not criticising the things that haven't been replaced yet but he's not actively backing them either, and in the next few months they will be replaced and he'll criticise them also.

 

[VP89]

He's criticised the the things him and Brailsford have replaced already, he's not criticising the things that haven't been replaced yet but he's not actively backing them either, and in the next few months they will be replaced and he'll criticise them also.

What on earth are you on about. Do you think it's diplomatic to say the structure has sucked for 10+ years just because he has replaced Murtough and Arnold? That is still offensive to the Glazers, who he needs to butter up.

Also, you're basically guesstimating they don't rate him just because you don't rate him. In truth the fans are split on him, but suggesting it's an obvious unanimous truth that he's incompetent is pretty silly.

 

[Dannn411]

Klopp just showing one more example in the LC final that you dont need your best X1 to look like a team and play coherent attacking football.
The fact that our players look like strangers on the pitch even after 1.5 years is the biggest indictment of EtH as a coach.

Thry must have gone 30 players deep in their squad today and they have not skipped a beat. The style has not changed, the intensity has not dropped. Real football managers don't make excuses. They just get it done.

 

[crossy1686]

What on earth are you on about. Do you think it's diplomatic to say the structure has sucked for 10+ years just because he has replaced Murtough and Arnold? That is still offensive to the Glazers, who he needs to butter up.

Also, you're basically guesstimating they don't rate him just because you don't rate him. In truth the fans are split on him, but suggesting it's an obvious unanimous truth that he's incompetent is pretty silly.

The fans aren't split on him. Half want him gone, slightly less than half wouldn't be surprised if he got sacked at some point, might feel it's a bit harsh but some managers get less time, and about 10% will be up in arms about it and insist the entire club needs replacing before we can beat teams like Fulham at home when we have a couple of injuries.

Anyway, I'm tired of having this conversation about what will or won't happen. Just watch this space, bookmark my post if you have to, quote me in July. He'll be gone at the end of the season and nothing will save him short of winning the league.

 

[Laurencio]

I will remain of the opinion that he has the safest job in the league and is going to be untouchable for another 12+ months. If there’s one thing he is good at it is talking the talk, he will have assured our new governors behind the scenes that everything is heading in the right direction and I don’t delude myself into thinking that they won’t buy it.

Talk is cheap. Spend £400M with more or less complete control over transfers and wind up in a worse position and with a worse squad than you began with is not going to fly with any serious business people. He's shown nothing to suggest he "knows" what the team needs. You can't have that much control, spend that much, and still have serious people believe "you know what is needed".

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

I still can't believe we brought in what we thought was a progressive possession based coach from Ajax, and this is the football he has delivered.

I could understand if he'd turn us into an LVG-era type team that has a lot of the ball but struggles to create a lot as teams are forced to get a lot of men behind the ball. But he has less control of games than Ole's teams did. Our passing is even worse, ball retention even worse. 2 years and 400 million spent and he's not actually improved us on the ball.

It's not really a shock that he's failed because that seems to be inevitable for a Man United manager these days. It's the way he's failed that is shocking. There's absolutely no principle of possession or territorial dominance in our play.

Put well.

What he’s lacked in any tactical evolution he’s certainly made up for in his ability to pull the wool over the eyes of some of our fans.

All the noises from the club suggest that he’s highly valued and trusted.

Mate stop.

 

[VP89]

The fans aren't split on him. Half want him gone, slightly less than half wouldn't be surprised if he got sacked at some point, might feel it's a bit harsh but some managers get less time, and about 10% will be up in arms about it and insist the entire club needs replacing before we can beat teams like Fulham at home when we have a couple of injuries.

Eh? That's bullshit to be fair. Not denying there aren't bigger segments growing that want him out but there's a big many either wanting him to stay OR being open to the plausible scenario of him finishing strong and getting more time beyond the summer.
The match going fans definitely make themselves heard In that regard.

Anyway, I'm tired of having this conversation about what will or won't happen. Just watch this space, bookmark my post if you have to, quote me in July. He'll be gone at the end of the season and nothing will save him short of winning the league.

You're tired of having a conversation on what will happen, but everything you talk about is based on what you think will happen. Alright.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

He's criticised the the things him and Brailsford have replaced already, he's not criticising the things that haven't been replaced yet but he's not actively backing them either, and in the next few months they will be replaced and he'll criticise them also.

Yep.

He made the pony rather loudly that he & Ineos will set the expectations of performance/style. Diplomacy paints his handling of questions about EtH perfectly.

If Ineos are as gullible as some people think to these performances then we may as well of stuck with the Glazers. I don’t see how peopie think Ineos won’t look at the pitch & dugout then go radical with their changes.

 

[Rightnr]

Great example today what it means to have a proper coach/manager, not a fraud like with our club.

 

[parmenio]

If you watched the full interview, there is a lot more to suggest he has a lot of support from the new owners than not.

I watched the full interview and I was really pleased with what I heard. Regarding the manager what did you honestly expect him to say? He also was positive on the Glazers again what you expect him to say? ETH is not good enough for Manchester United to get where SJR wants us to be. I’m firmly of the belief the ETH isn’t getting the max out of the squad as it is. I’m not a billionaire but I cannot believe that SJR and his new management team want ETH to oversea and have input into the next £400m spend. He’ll be gone come the summer. Look what Klopp did today with half a team and compare it To what ETH continues to provide. Anyone still backing ETH are really grasping at straws now.

 

[Abhinav]

Thry must have gone 30 players deep in their squad today and they have not skipped a beat. The style has not changed, the intensity has not dropped. Real football managers don't make excuses. They just get it done.

Yeah, don’t want to praise him/them too much (or at all) but that is the level of manager we need to get next.
Also, I hope our next manager is as proactive and demonstrative as Klopp, Arteta or Pep. EtH’s lack of any personality on the touchline is annoying to watch.

 

[Woziak]

All the noises from the club suggest that he’s highly valued and trusted. I think they will sit down, he will present his vision (which he’s good at), tell them he needs 18-24 months to implement it and they will trust him to do it under new structure. Whatever happened this season will get discarded because injuries/weak squad/other factors.

They will get him the players he wants, or the profile of players he wants, and as long as we see good progress next season and finish top 6 comfortably, he will be given another one to get us closer to challenging/into top 4.

I am setting my expectations very low. I would rather be positively surprised.

Yep that’s not happening pal, let me explain why?

Sir Jim will be 72 in October of this year and he wants an instant impact, his team have done it due diligence which is why he said it will take 2-3 years taking him to 75.

He’s in a hurry, will want a new CEO, DOF, Head of Recruitment and naturally they will want a new manager, possible Ashworth, Brailsford, Sir Jim and Betada have already sounded out top coaches like Zidane, inzaghi, Lopetagi, Flick, Tuchel, Conte and Naigelsman.

They’ll discount obvious options like Jose and Maybe conte then they will agree a top 3 and ask them to interview for the job in May , just like the club did to LVG when he won an FA Cup..

Even Zidane can’t be discarded because if you give a new coach a blank cheque and tell him your build the club in a new mould it’s all of a sudden a very appealing opportunity?

 

[mav_9me]

I think he's actually


He is playing that style. That's what people don't get about this. The style just doesn't work the way it did in the Netherlands, ad Premier League teams can easily bypass the press and exploit counter attacking opportunities. So where in Holland, it would mean that the individual physical superiority they had led to turnover of possession in the opposition half, for us it leads to a basketball game where we have no control. This with the combination of width and fluidity in the backline means we are so easy to exploit. His Ajax system could never work her. At Ajax, Blind and Timber were constantly breaking through the lines and out of possession. In England, that's impossible to do.

What people have to come to terms with is that we essentially hired a Celtic manager. A manager who's team was so superior to the rest that he had the freedom to use strategies that can't work in top leagues. Now that he's being asked to use normal systems, he's struggling. This is why he hasn't adapted or experimented tactically. He just doesn't have ideas.

This is absolutely not what I saw Ajax play in the champions league. They had way better ball retention, way more ball progression, was more possession.

Maybe they played like this in Eridivisie like you say, I wouldn't know as I never watched them in the Dutch league but not in CL.

 

[VP89]

I watched the full interview and I was really pleased with what I heard. Regarding the manager what did you honestly expect him to say? He also was positive on the Glazers again what you expect him to say? ETH is not good enough for Manchester United to get where SJR wants us to be. I’m firmly of the belief the ETH isn’t getting the max out of the squad as it is. I’m not a billionaire but I cannot believe that SJR and his new management team want ETH to oversea and have input into the next £400m spend. He’ll be gone come the summer. Look what Klopp did today with half a team and compare it To what ETH continues to provide. Anyone still backing ETH are really grasping at straws now.

Eh? He didn't need to go out the way to say the structure has been so bad that it hasn't helped any manager to succeed.

 

[DJ_21]

I'll be honest, you guys have this doom and gloom before every City game at OT but you seem to win more often than not (someone correct me unless I am wrong?). Rival games are totally different. If Arsenal played Utd tomorrow at OT I can guarantee you Utd would be still favourites. There was this same doom and gloom before you played Liverpool this season at Anfield fearing another 7-0. Nothing of the sort happened.

Except we’re not at OT. We’re at the emptihad. We have every reason to fear getting battered when we’re conceding over 15 shots every single game. Every team aren’t as clinical as the top teams though so imagine how many goals we could concede when we concede so many chances.

 

[AshRK]

Yeah, don’t want to praise him/them too much (or at all) but that is the level of manager we need to get next.
Also, I hope our next manager is as proactive and demonstrative as Klopp, Arteta or Pep. EtH’s lack of any personality on the touchline is annoying to watch.

I am all for replacing eth ( and I do want him gone) but this arteta example really bugs me. Where was arteta in his 1.5 season. I will tell you fighting relegation battle and losing europa semis and then finishing 8th. You can't say hey sack eth and then use arteta as an example.

As for pep and klopp, they are special breed and you tell me how many managers are there who are as good as them.

 

[Darlington Padgett]

Except we’re not at OT. We’re at the emptihad. We have every reason to fear getting battered when we’re conceding over 15 shots every single game. Every team aren’t as clinical as the top teams though so imagine how many goals we could concede when we concede so many chances.

We faced 34 shots against Liverpool, it will probably be similar against City. Liverpool were not clinical at all and we were really lucky to get that draw. Another historical humiliation under Ten Hag is highly likely if we play like that again.

 

[pogbasformerbarber]

This constant churn of players and managers is part of why we are such a joke of an organization. We have the patience and sensibilities of gnats. We are one year removed from a very good season that saw a cup, a very good run of form for a sustained period, and some major positive changes to the club.

This year has been a disappointment for sure, but we have weathered some major injury blows, had some serious off-field issues with some of our biggest players, and are in a very competitive league this year. None of us seriously thought before the season started that we would be able to compete for a title, so slightly underperforming top four (which is exactly where we are right now) is exactly where we probably should be. We're, frankly, still in rebuild mode...which means you need to expect some growing pains during certain seasons.

We're never going to have sustained excellence if we just sack and sell everyone constantly. We need stability. I'm not saying thats Ten Hag, it might not be, but we need to give him more time before just tearing it all down and starting all over again.

 

[parmenio]

Eh? He didn't need to go out the way to say the structure has been so bad that it hasn't helped any manager to succeed.

Hes trying to motivate the man so we finish the season strong. At that point we were looking good. There was always going to be a full review between now and the end of the season. Also rarely when a club has new owners (people running the football side in our case) does the incumbent manager survive long. New tea, brings in their own man. We have enough players who chuck it by giving them and excuse were SJR to come out and say what we all think about ETH as a manager. He’s out if we want to improve. Also saying we can’t keep sacking managers etc I agree but that cannot be a reason to keep someone like ETH who clearly is not good enough.

 

[Abhinav]

I am all for replacing eth ( and I do want him gone) but this arteta example really bugs me. Where was arteta in his 1.5 season. I will tell you fighting relegation battle and losing europa semis and then finishing 8th. You can't say hey sack eth and then use arteta as an example.

As for pep and klopp, they are special breed and you tell me how many managers are there who are as good as them.

Weird reply. Firstly, I used Arteta as an example of a manager who is passionate on the touchline, not as someone who we should be aspiring to get.
And it is not my job to find the next Pep or Klopp. We will hopefully have competent people making these decisions soon and their remit would be to find the next Pep or Klopp.

 

[VP89]

Hes trying to motivate the man so we finish the season strong. At that point we were looking good. There was always going to be a full review between now and the end of the season. Also rarely when a club has new owners (people running the football side in our case) does the incumbent manager survive long. New tea, brings in their own man. We have enough players who chuck it by giving them and excuse were SJR to come out and say what we all think about ETH as a manager. He’s out if we want to improve. Also saying we can’t keep sacking managers etc I agree but that cannot be a reason to keep someone like ETH who clearly is not good enough.

This is my point. They are doing a full review and deep dive, and aren't going to necessarily going to come to the same conclusion as lazy fans who are certain he's "clearly not good enough"

 

[DJ_21]

We faced 34 shots against Liverpool, it will probably be similar against City. Liverpool were not clinical at all and we were really lucky to get that draw. Another historical humiliation under Ten Hag is highly likely if we play like that again.

We just lost the Fulham at home. The players heads will be all over the place. I’ll be very surprised if we snatched a draw let alone a win. City won’t want to drop points here as they have 2 other teams fighting for the league.

 

[Pscholes18]

Players he's brought in......

Onana - shite at first, cost us Champions League progress, but seems to be coming around...starting to make saves

Mount - give him a pass for now on Mount...think you have to play him in Brunos position to see what he can really do, ETH didn;t go after Mount but was told he was available and gave the yes, so fault him on that if you want.

Casemiro - solid gold last year, has dropped off since, but we needed someone to come in to hold the mid

Antony - absolute nightmare. Had a chance to get him for much less than we did but the board are numpties and the price we paid falls squaley on ETH. Tracks back and helps on defense but doesn't offer much more.

Martinez - solid gold.

Rasmus - looking like a great purchase so far.

Conclusion is half of those players are working out. Antony is the only one that has been an utter disaster and it's magnified because of what we payed for him.

 

[christy87]

This constant churn of players and managers is part of why we are such a joke of an organization. We have the patience and sensibilities of gnats. We are one year removed from a very good season that saw a cup, a very good run of form for a sustained period, and some major positive changes to the club.

This year has been a disappointment for sure, but we have weathered some major injury blows, had some serious off-field issues with some of our biggest players, and are in a very competitive league this year. None of us seriously thought before the season started that we would be able to compete for a title, so slightly underperforming top four (which is exactly where we are right now) is exactly where we probably should be. We're, frankly, still in rebuild mode...which means you need to expect some growing pains during certain seasons.

We're never going to have sustained excellence if we just sack and sell everyone constantly. We need stability. I'm not saying thats Ten Hag, it might not be, but we need to give him more time before just tearing it all down and starting all over again.

We’ve also been served 1 full year of absolute shit football, with no direction of where it’s going, what the plan is, what the system is, if you have ever worked under shit management you’d see that some players are on auto pilot like real life where you go into auto pilot just collecting your cheque, players are snapping mentality and at each other.

 

[VP89]

We’ve also been served 1 full year of absolute shit football, with no direction of where it’s going, what the plan is, what the system is, if you have ever worked under shit management you’d see that some players are on auto pilot like real life where you go into auto pilot just collecting your cheque, players are snapping mentality and at each other.

The plan and system is quite obvious. The problem is it's terribly open with the current crop of players, for various reasons.

 

[AshRK]

Weird reply. Firstly, I used Arteta as an example of a manager who is passionate on the touchline, not as someone who we should be aspiring to get.
And it is not my job to find the next Pep or Klopp. We will hopefully have competent people making these decisions soon and their remit would be to find the next Pep or Klopp.

Well I want the next manager to actually have us play good and dominant football. I don't want a clown on a touchline. We fans have to understand when you win everything looks rosey. This was the same Arteta's whose antics was called childish 2 years back.

Pep or klopp are hard to find. Hopefully we find one.

 

[Toblerone92]

We're never going to have sustained excellence if we just sack and sell everyone constantly. We need stability. I'm not saying thats Ten Hag, it might not be, but we need to give him more time before just tearing it all down and starting all over again.

Tearing what down exactly? You mean getting rid of Antony, Mount, Casemiro, Onana and Eriksen, all of whom he signed? Sounds great if you ask me. There is no style of play, no consistency, no signs of improvement, unmotivated players, awful signings and absolutely no sign anything is going to improve anytime soon.

A handful of players deserved to be retained but the rest need sending on their way, manager included.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

The plan and system is quite obvious. The problem is it's terribly open with the current crop of players, for various reasons.

Is it obvious? Suicidal high press with one of the lowest defensive line depth in the league? It’s obviously shit, regardless of personnel.

Look at what Klopp served up with a second string team. Personnel isn’t an excuse.

 

[VP89]

Is it obvious? Suicidal high press with one of the lowest defensive line depth in the league? It’s obviously shit, regardless of personnel.

Look at what Klopp served up with a second string team. Personnel isn’t an excuse.

You think we play a low block without Lindelof and Maguire at the back? Have a word.
I'm not saying it's the gold standard or that it's executed well, but don't try and claim he is implementing low block defences and high presses by design.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

You think we play a low block without Lindelof and Maguire at the back? Have a word.
I'm not saying it's the gold standard or that it's executed well, but don't try and claim he is implementing low block defences and high presses by design.

Do you think Ruben Dias or John Stones are quick? Or Lewis Dunk and Jan Paul Van Hecke? Why can’t Maguire and Varane/Lindelof do it? Those managers of those teams press high and keep the defensive line high.

Thefact that we are still pressing so high while dropping so deep is unacceptable. The chasm it creates in midfield is outstandingly shite. It’s clear that the coaching is not of an acceptable standard.

 

[Frosty]

Yep that’s not happening pal, let me explain why?

Sir Jim will be 72 in October of this year and he wants an instant impact, his team have done it due diligence which is why he said it will take 2-3 years taking him to 75.

He’s in a hurry, will want a new CEO, DOF, Head of Recruitment and naturally they will want a new manager, possible Ashworth, Brailsford, Sir Jim and Betada have already sounded out top coaches like Zidane, inzaghi, Lopetagi, Flick, Tuchel, Conte and Naigelsman.

They’ll discount obvious options like Jose and Maybe conte then they will agree a top 3 and ask them to interview for the job in May , just like the club did to LVG when he won an FA Cup..

Even Zidane can’t be discarded because if you give a new coach a blank cheque and tell him your build the club in a new mould it’s all of a sudden a very appealing opportunity?

I agree with what you have said, but surely the bit in bold is the one thing we have to avoid doing again? Unless you aren't implying the new manager will be at the centre of new signings.

 

[RedRover]

I still can't believe we brought in what we thought was a progressive possession based coach from Ajax, and this is the football he has delivered.

I could understand if he'd turn us into an LVG-era type team that has a lot of the ball but struggles to create a lot as teams are forced to get a lot of men behind the ball. But he has less control of games than Ole's teams did. Our passing is even worse, ball retention even worse. 2 years and 400 million spent and he's not actually improved us on the ball.

It's not really a shock that he's failed because that seems to be inevitable for a Man United manager these days. It's the way he's failed that is shocking. There's absolutely no principle of possession or territorial dominance in our play.

This is the issue I have. I didn't expect him to come in and turn us into a title challenging side in two seasons, but I expected us to be a better footballing side.

We're totally reliant to playing on the break. We can't control the midfield in games, even against what should be weaker opposition given resources (although, to be fair, apart from Mainoo, the midfield is no better off than it was when he took over) and concede far too many chances.

I think he'll be gone at the end of the season. There's no clear improvement nor any indication of how we'll get there. I think it may be a case of just being out of his depth in the PL. The only thing that might save him is it taking longer to get the other appointments in place than expected and that might see him stay in post.