Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[gaffs]

I’ll be flabbergasted if he’s still here by the end of November. The Luton and Everton games have got ‘sack’ written all over them. The question is though, will they sack before INEOS arrive or will they just hang on and send everyone packing at the same time when they arrive?

We have to beat Luton. Imagine losing that - it would be carnage. Plus, no game for two weeks so a chance a potential change.
Everton will be tough, but i feel winning these two games is an absolute must.

Because after that its Galatasaray, Newcastle away, Chelsea home, Bournemouth, Bayern, Liverpool, West ham away, Villa.

That is a really tough run of game. There has to be a massive improvement post the international break.

 

[gaffs]

Careful what you wish for I'm Ten Hag In.

We could end up with Potter ffs and i'm not talking about Harry Potter who could come in and wave his magic wand.

I dont get that Potter talk.

I guess it comes from the fact INEOS were considering him last year for Nice. That was when the club were signing British players.

That doesnt mean he would come in under INEOS. Ratcliffe is not spending 1.5bil and bringing in a Chelsea reject.

 

[gaffs]

Shaw is the only one who's really been gone for months (since August). Martinez has been missing for less than two months, and the record with him on the pitch was terrible (2W4L). Varane has only missed 3 league games to injury. Wan-Bissaka missed a little over a month, and of all the players in the back four, he's the least obvious "first choice." The overwhelming consensus here around January was that Dalot was the better player.

You could see Martinez wasn't 100% from the start of the season. It feels like he was rushed back. I believe it was a reoccurrence of the foot injury that put him out again.

Shaw has been a big miss. But we do have Reglion fit, but Ten Hag seems to prefer Dalot at LB.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Why does everyone think we’ll just suddenly sack him. He won’t be sacked unless we finish very low in the table. If we come 3rd in the CL group stage then he’s basically got this full season as the board know if we win the Europa we’re in the CL anyway. Failure to qualify for next seasons CL could see him gone in the summer. Also the managers we’ll probably be targeting will be at current clubs and it’s much easier to approach them in the summer rather than mid season.

There’s absolutely nothing ‘sudden’ about it. This has been coming for a while and will come eventually. This period is literally him being given time to turn it around. He is actually doing worse than Ole and Mourinho were doing at this point when they were sacked. We’ll probably/maybe beat Luton but then after the break I believe it’s Everton/galatasaray/Newcastle away. Those will be the games that finish him off.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

We have to beat Luton. Imagine losing that - it would be carnage. Plus, no game for two weeks so a chance a potential change.
Everton will be tough, but i feel winning these two games is an absolute must.

Because after that its Galatasaray, Newcastle away, Chelsea home, Bournemouth, Bayern, Liverpool, West ham away, Villa.

That is a really tough run of game. There has to be a massive improvement post the international break.

honestly i wouldnt be surprised based on how we are playing if we didnt win any of those if we struggle before that stretch. Bournemouth would be the one we would be most expected to win, but could see them coming out just super hungry for that and us reeling. We need to get playing well all these scrappy wins against shit teams by 1 goal are masking our true level right now

 

[jesperjaap]

Got sympathy in that our first eleven isnt close to possibly the best we cold put ot, far from it.

But always thought thogh he was coming across well, people were far to quick to label him a great manager as seen others fail after a good first season.

Two things concern me:

1) His purchases in the transfer market. Yes he has wanted to get rid of most of the players he should and some we were unable to move on. But he has spent a lot of money in two summer windows and in my opinion only made two good long term signings and none of the loan signings so far have strengthened us. Continue that over three years peopl ewant to give him and we probably only have one more good signing

2) His in game decisions this season. I dont think he has picked the best eleven even with scarce resources but a lot of his substittions and lack of them have been poor for me and he hasnt adapted to game flow either. Last night was a great example, ten men....he sticks with Eriksen and McTominay as our central midfielders, was alwasy going to end one way.

Even last season, yet to see this tactical genis he was labelled and like others before him he seems to be losing the dressing room with some been here ages but some HE has signed.

I dont see who the right manager is, havent for a few years now and I do think it wold be good to see him with a fll squad....but regardless, look at our season so far, I can only think of a couple of games we havent been the weaker side, irrespective of results, injuries or not, that is absoltely shambolic and cant continue

 

[Plant0x84]

I hope news of INEOS looking to replace Ten Hag is wide of the mark, i think it would be a mistake and worst possible start to their tenure of the club.

 

[TsuWave]

I hope news of INEOS looking to replace Ten Hag aren’t wide of mark, i think it would be a good move and best possible start to their tenure of the club. We need decisive people with a vision, and that won’t dawdle on a wish and a prayer.

 

[Plant0x84]

I hope news of INEOS looking to replace Ten Hag aren’t wide of mark, i think it would be a good move and best possible start to their tenure of the club. We need decisive people with a vision, and that won’t dawdle on a wish and a prayer.

Ten Hag has vision. He’s just been let down by those around him.

 

[gantherbale]

Shaw is the only one who's really been gone for months (since August). Martinez has been missing for less than two months, and the record 192.168.100.1 192.168.1.1 with him on the pitch was terrible (2W4L). Varane has only missed 3 league games to injury. Wan-Bissaka missed a little over a month, and of all the players in the back four, he's the least obvious "first choice." The overwhelming consensus here around January was that Dalot was the better player.

We have to admit that bissaka is the one that should be playing and not dalot

 

[Leftback99]

Ten Hag has vision. He’s just been let down by those around him.

A new guy would also have ‘a vision’.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Ten Hag has vision. He’s just been let down by those around him.

Aye. The club handing him 400m so he can buy shite like Antony is being let down alright. What a visionary

 

[hobbers]

Ten Hag has vision. He’s just been let down by those around him.

Why is he the one let down and not the other way around?

Everyone has vision, the Glazers have a vision for the club. Woodward and Arnold had vision. Every manager past and future has a vision. It's just another corporate buzzword, like legacy, tradition, united way, feel good factor etc.

Ten Hag's vision might be a bit hampered by his terrible eyesight if he thought signing Mount and Amrabat would unlock our potential.

 

[Plant0x84]

Aye. The club handing him 400m so he can buy shite like Antony is being let down alright. What a visionary

He didn’t get Kane, he didn’t get de Jong, I’m sure there are others. Also we’d agree there is a large margin of overspend in that 400m. Thats on those doing the negotiating, not the manager himself.
I was also referring to players letting him down too. Ronaldo, Greenwood, Antony, Sancho etc…..
He’s hardly had it plain sailing since he arrived has he?

 

[Plant0x84]

A new guy would also have ‘a vision’.

Useless if it isn’t supported by the club and executed by the players.

 

[hobbers]

He didn’t get Kane, he didn’t get de Jong, I’m sure there are others.

What a fecking joke. Neither did Pep or Klopp or Arteta.

Ole didnt get Rice. He didnt get Grealish.

Mourinho didnt get Maguire or Boateng.


De Jong had zero interest in signing, he was a zero percentage possibility transfer. Kane was financially unviable because of Levy. No manager at any Prem club could realistically expect or ask for or demand these two players. And none did.

And you have the fecking audacity to say he was let down because the club didnt produce these two signings for him?

 

[Leftback99]

Useless if it isn’t supported by the club and executed by the players.

What’s your argument for Ten Hag in that case.

Surely being INEOS’ guy that’s exactly what a new man would have.

 

[The United]

Some united fans really need to chill with going all-in on a manager who hasn't really shown us the goods at United yet. How many times have we been burned before?

I get the whole 'let's wait and see' vibe, but when folks start saying, 'Oh, I knew he'd be great because he had a plan or whatever,' it's kind of ridiculous. Every manager at this stage has a plan or some grand idea when they walk in. Big deal. What matters is whether they can actually make it work on the pitch—preferably more than a season.

Obviously, it does not mean we have to shout "sake him" every game. And I am aware of the upper management being shit. But, after 400 meters, there has to be something tangible.

 

[Plant0x84]

What’s your argument for Ten Hag in that case.

Surely being INEOS’ guy that’s exactly what a new man would have.

I’ll concede I was thinking that as I posted, but I think ten hag hasn’t actually done anything worthy of the sack yet, nd a change would be for changes sake.

 

[Plant0x84]

What a fecking joke. Neither did Pep or Klopp or Arteta.

Ole didnt get Rice. He didnt get Grealish.

Mourinho didnt get Maguire or Boateng.


De Jong had zero interest in signing, he was a zero percentage possibility transfer. Kane was financially unviable because of Levy. No manager at any Prem club could realistically expect or ask for or demand these two players. And none did.

And you have the fecking audacity to say he was let down because the club didnt produce these two signings for him?

You need to calm down.
I didn’t say that was the ONLY way he had been let down, and I don’t see transfer spend as a sign of his backing - we are shit with money, and shit at selling too.

 

[hobbers]

You need to calm down.
I didn’t say that was the ONLY way he had been let down, and I don’t see transfer spend as a sign of his backing - we are shit with money, and shit at selling too.

It's not any way he was let down. No manager can expect impossible signings.

Moyes going after Fabregas and Bale was 50x more realistic than chasing De Jong and Kane, and that was still an absurdly stupid waste of time and resources.

 

[KD6-3.7]

We will absolutely not win the EL.
For some reason, EL is seen as an easy peasy win.
Ole and ETH both tried to win the EL and failed.
The moment we come up against a decent team, we'll be knocked out.

Except that was last season. They don’t even need to be decent anymore for us to lose we have regressed so much.

I would much rather come last in our champions league so we just go back to playing once a week which might offer us a little respite with injuries.

 

[Hammondo]

I’ll be flabbergasted if he’s still here by the end of November. The Luton and Everton games have got ‘sack’ written all over them. The question is though, will they sack before INEOS arrive or will they just hang on and send everyone packing at the same time when they arrive?

He needs to win those games, we simply cannot accept less at this point. I don't think we have a single point Vs decent teams.

 

[Hammondo]

Some united fans really need to chill with going all-in on a manager who hasn't really shown us the goods at United yet. How many times have we been burned before?

I get the whole 'let's wait and see' vibe, but when folks start saying, 'Oh, I knew he'd be great because he had a plan or whatever,' it's kind of ridiculous. Every manager at this stage has a plan or some grand idea when they walk in. Big deal. What matters is whether they can actually make it work on the pitch—preferably more than a season.

Obviously, it does not mean we have to shout "sake him" every game. And I am aware of the upper management being shit. But, after 400 meters, there has to be something tangible.

I believe in our position we need to learn through experience. We need to test ideas out, fail and succeed and build our future off of it.

We are not in a position to get it right now.

 

[Plant0x84]

It's not any way he was let down. No manager can expect impossible signings.

Moyes going after Fabregas and Bale was 50x more realistic than chasing De Jong and Kane, and that was still an absurdly stupid waste of time and resources.

You also need to quit living in the past.

 

[gantherbale]

Some united fans really need to chill with going all-in on a manager who hasn't really shown us the goods at United yet. How many times have we been burned before?

I get the whole 'let's wait and see' vibe, but when folks start saying, 'Oh, I knew he'd be great because he had a plan or whatever,' it's kind of ridiculous. Every manager Tutuapp 9Apps at this stage has a plan or some grand idea when they walk in. Big deal. What matters is whether they can actually make it work on the pitch—preferably more than a season.

Obviously, it does not mean we have to shout "sake him" every game. And I am aware of the upper management being shit. But, after 400 meters, there has to be something tangible.

Well how much time does he need to not put us in situations like losing a UCL match against a below mid level team

 

[Offside]

There was a game against Chelsea in May which was enjoyable. Even then we got battered first 20 mins. Aside from that, there genuinely hasn’t been an enjoyable United game in 8 months. Can’t remember it being this bad.

 

[Toshey]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

 

[USREDEVIL]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

I fault him only for Antony and Mount. Unfortunately those were big money signings. I was having a go over Onana but he's been great for a few games now.
The Casamero's and Varanes cannot really be put on him. They were great last season but they are getting on, and maybe they're in decline now.

 

[el3mel]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

What does "proven" even mean ?

Martinez is one of the best we have had ? He literally only played one good season.

 

[Cerberus]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

Casemiro signing is horrible regardless of last season - paying 70 million and putting him on a fat 5 year contract when he's losing his legs at his age is genuinely outrageous and displays a lot of short-term thinking from Erik. Also, the issue is not just the signings themselves, but the utterly erratic nature of them. Why would Ten Hag chase FDJ then go for Casemiro who is a completely different type of midfielder? Then he goes for Mount (another terrible signing) who is also completely different to FDJ. The Eriksen signing is not terrible in a vacuum, but when you realize Eriksen is the only midfielder he's signed that can progress the ball from deep and that responsibility is largely thrust upon him - then yes it's a god-awful signing. You can't even argue it was an emergency either considering the amount of money wasted on the likes of Mount, Antony + Case.

 

[Lay]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

His transfers have been so good that we have only lost 9 games this season!

 

[Doracle]

The "bad transfers" stick people use to beat ETH with, is possibly one of the worst arguments ever.

- Martinez - comfortably our best CB, one of the best we've had.
- Casemiro - exactly 6 months ago the majority of you were calling him "best DM in the world" and putting him into "best transfers ever" list.
- Malacia - backup fullback, he has done absolutely OK and costed peanuts.
- Eriksen - excellent free transfer, he has helped us A LOT.
- Onana - PROVEN quality keeper, has a tough start, too early to write him off, he has shown good stuff.
- Hojlund - great talent, excellent future ahead.
- Mount - useful squad player, he'll find his form. Once again - a PROVEN player.

And there goes Antony - he has been ok last season, disappointing this. Heavy price tag. Still might turn it around and come good.

I don't want to discuss the emergency loans we had in the likes of Weghorst and Dubravka. Amrabat doesn't cover himself in glory so my guess is he won't be signed permanently. Still - midfield option.

So he has had exactly 2 kinda questionable transfers and you wanna use that against him?
C'mon. That's a joke.

Very generous assessment:

Martinez - good player but still slightly questionable what his true level is. Even last season, we conceded a lot of goals with him in the team. Definitely a positive but not anywhere close yet to “one of the best we’ve had”. 8/10 signing

Casemiro - excellent short-term but the questions were always going to be whether this was a sensible transfer across the long contract given to him. Should be able to get decent money from SA for him even if he doesn’t re-find form. 7/10

Malacia - very average player from what we’ve seen. Ok as cover but never going to be a starter in my view. 4/10

Eriksen - good free transfer. 7/10

Onana - obvious question marks given his start. Agree too earlier to give a proper rating but the fact you are even talking about possibly writing him off shows the issues. 6/10

Hojlund - good prospect. Vastly overpriced. 7/10

Mount - a signing that was severely questioned because no one could work out where he would play and a player many of us have seen play a lot and know he is not a game-changer. A £120m investment or so counting wages. He’s arrived and, to no one’s surprise, we don’t have a position for him to play. An absolute shocker of a signing, especially given he was free next summer and we just gifted Chelsea £50m+. 2/10 as it stands.

Antony - it’s hard to imagine a signing worse than Mount but, given ETH had actually seen this guy play at close quarters, this is as bad as it gets. No ability to beat a man, no crossing ability and his only attribute (running backwards) is most often required when he gives the ball away misplacing a simple pass. We paid one of the highest transfer fees of all time for a player who genuinely wouldn’t look out of place at Sheffield United. 1/10

Yes, there are some good deals in there but two of them currently look like awful signings and only Martinez has no real question marks. It isn’t a great record.

 

[Lay]

Lisandro Martinez must be the most overrated player this forum has had a love in for. Maybe its due to the way he was treated early on with the media but he's put in his fair share of stinkers and has been roasted more than times than he should have by opposing forwards. He isn't a failure of a signing, but he is nowhere near our best.

 

[Fortitude]

Ten Hag has vision. He’s just been let down by those around him.

Your reasoning makes him infallible.

Is he culpable for anything in your eyes, if yes, what?

 

[hobbers]

You also need to quit living in the past.

We didnt excuse Moyes because he wasnt given Bale, Mourinho because he wasnt given Maguire, Ole because he wasnt given Rice.

So how can the Frenkie shambles be an excuse in ETH's favour?

 

[andersj]

but he's put in his fair share of stinkers

After his injury he has not been good. I think most can agree on that. But he really did not play a fair share of stinkers last season. Even in a few awful games from Man Utd you would struggle to mention where he put a foot wrong.

 

[Leftback99]

Lisandro Martinez must be the most overrated player this forum has had a love in for. Maybe its due to the way he was treated early on with the media but he's put in his fair share of stinkers and has been roasted more than times than he should have by opposing forwards. He isn't a failure of a signing, but he is nowhere near our best.

Definitely. Has his strengths on the ball but the jury is out defensively especially if we want to play a high line unlike last season. Adds nothing to our poor set piece abilities either.

 

[Plant0x84]

We didnt excuse Moyes because he wasnt given Bale, Mourinho because he wasnt given Maguire, Ole because he wasnt given Rice.

So how can the Frenkie shambles be an excuse in ETH's favour?

Again, you are focusing too closely on one part of what I said and missing the wider context. Its not about excusing anybody, its just not the right time to change the manager now.

 

[Laurencio]

Definitely. Has his strengths on the ball but the jury is out defensively especially if we want to play a high line unlike last season. Adds nothing to our poor set piece abilities either.

He's both our best defender and the worst defender in the league in the air.