Seperate point to what I'm making really, we've been undeniably shite in the transfer market.
Enzo Fernández | signs for Chelsea
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Now he’s ready and proven to come directly into the team. Coming from South America this wouldn’t have been the case and he’d need to accumulate the minutes to get to where he is now. Quick example look at Amad, we have to send him on loan to get to the level we require.
Would they really? If so, what is so special about Chelsea that they weren't?
Yeah, it's basically what soccernomics explained. Eventually there will be a more efficient way found to get these types of players. There's a been a lot of change in ownership recently, so I can't imagine it will stop in the short term mind.
I meant back in June when Benfica nabbed him.
Someone else pointed out if Álvarez got one it should have been fine, but Álvarez had 6 WCQ games for Argentina while Enzo had no caps.
Let's be honest if a player signs for a club in the summer and has already forced his way into the midfield of the World Champions and become a key part of their midfield, he was hardly in need of a developmental loan.
Even if he wasn't ready, are we really saying this 6 months at Benfica is worth the €100m surcharge then? Developing young players is a part of football and clubs pour millions into state of the art training facilities. I'm also not convinced spending that kind of money is conducive to getting the best out of a lot of those players - the added pressure is enormous and most players still require an adjustment period when they sign for a new club.
Would be a great Eriksen replacement but so is Bellingham. But there will be more competetion for Bellingham in the summer.
I just saw CBS and assumed. Where was he before this summer!?
It’s not that simple. He started on the bench in the World Cup. He moved to a club that offered him playing time. 6 months is a long time to be playing week in and week out improving. Compared to going to Chelsea and waiting your turn between Jorginho, Kovacic and Mount. Add Kante if fit too.. he arguable doesn’t make the World Cup squad.
So what you are stating is something that rarely happens at the highest level unless your Neymar Jr level of talent. Enzo benefited from the move to Benfica and no-one in Europe at the highest level was ready to have Enzo as a first teamer in the summer. Now they are.. and because of this Benfica benefit.
Caceido --> Liverpool
Enzo --> Chelsea
Bellingham --> Real
Rice --> United (?)
Enzo --> Chelsea
Bellingham --> Real
Rice --> United (?)
Ffs
No idea. I had never heard of him until the Chelsea takeover process, where he appeared to have some sources close to the sale. He has since pivoted into being some kind of Chelsea ITK but he's been more miss than hit on that front.
We need to find the next gem for 20m, as we missed our chance in summer. I feel we are priced out now
As I've already said in the previous page, the "€100m surcharge" is misleading due to how screwed the Argentine peso is.
Under normal circumstances he would cost atleast €70m to get out of River (similar to what Madrid had to pay for Endrick). I guess you could maybe say we should have had the foresight to get him from River but he hasn't suddenly shot up €100m in value, circumstances got Benfica a player significantly cheaper than market value, as did City with Alvarez.
Works for me. ETH turns Rice into Ince II
Shame we let Lingard go, we would have had Rice and Beanz in the midfield
I'm not underestimating the value in playing regular football. If it was a case of Enzo Fernandez himself choosing Benfica over other top clubs, fair enough, but there is no evidence that was the case and I doubt he would be jumping ship so soon after if that was a decision he'd made.
Julian Alvarez is a better point of comparison than the Amad one you made. City bought him, he went back on loan for the rest of the season and he hasn't been exposed to a lot of first team football for them. He also started the World Cup on the bench, broke in and went on to have a very good tournament. It is possible to identify a talent and sign them if they're good enough. Some players do need a stepping stone club, but equally you don't have to be Neymar to sign directly for a big club from South America.
How often do players move from the Argentinian league for 70m? Teenagers from the Brazilian league is a different ball game. I get you're trying to reframe the 130m fee, but it's still astronomical and is only being paid because it's his release clause and Chelsea don't want to risk losing him to another team in the summer. It's a huge overpayment.
We've definitely got the short straw there.
Sounds like a poor excuse to me. The exchange rate might be poor but are you seriously suggesting River Plate have sold two of their top talents for a flat fee in their own currency without accounting for inflation?
Nah Rice is really good, he's evolved his game too with a more progressive style. West Ham seem to be struggling to adapt for him, he's outgrown them and would be an asset in any PL side City included.
Crespo cost €4.13m from River to Parma in 1996, at that point the PL transfer record was just over double that (admittedly about to be smashed to pieces by Shearer) so I'd say that was quite a lot for that time.
I get there's going to a banter aspect especially if he takes a while to acclimatise, all I'm saying is the narrative that his value has jumped €100m in 6 months simply isn't true.
I’ll say it now and I’ll say it again, Rice = McTominay.
If the players were reversed, we’d be saying the exact same things about both players for both teams. Do not want.
Quite bullish to post something so daft twice
River keeps 25% of Enzo, so maybe the sell will go around 40 millions for River, not bad.
120M for him is absolutely bonkers. Let’s have Frenkie for 75M and tie him up on a ship to Manchester instead. At least the latter is proven and top class quality
Fair enough
They are literally the same player
All it shows is our scouting in S America at least is shit. Benfica got him for 10 mill euros plus add ons was it? How come they keep finding these jewels and we cant? We paid roughly the same for Pellestri due to Forlan with no comparison in the players.
The record sale from the Argentinian league is Lautaro Martinez to Inter, who signed for around €25m.
Fernandez's true value was perhaps higher than what River Plate sold him for in the summer, but the difference between what Benfica paid for him and what Chelsea are reportedly paying for him now is literally over €100m. It's nothing to do with banter, those are just the numbers.
I've never really seen the fuss with Rice. Decent/good player, sure. I don't see our need for him while Casemiro is bossing things.
Yeah Cas is huge for us. Almost too big, I would like to see us forward plan in that regard so we dont overly depend on him. On paper him + Rice can operate together, but right now I do enjoy the balance of Eriksen-Casemiro.
Putting it like this doesn't really excite me, to say the least. Rice isn't bad, but compared to the others... How much would West Ham want for him? I wouldn't pay a 100M.
You’ve answered my point he came in went on loan and is their second striker for Haaland.
Who was buying Enzo to be their rotation CM and how does that improve his development. There is no real argument here. Chelsea want him now because of his good career choice to join Benfica. If he had joined Chelsea he’d probably have the development trajectory of Havertz.
He made a good career move so far. Chelsea now in January may yet still hault his progression. All I’m saying is he doesn’t go Chelsea in the summer and have the buzz he has now. The reason none went for him is because they don’t want what they seen in the summer they want what they see now. Unfortunately they have to pay an extra premium for the minutes and opportunity Benfica gave him.
I think West Ham will realize they cant sell him for 100m or over 100m like they suggested before. He'll just run down his contract and without Europa on top they'll have nothing to offer him. He would be comfortably cheaper than Enzo + Bellingham I reckon. Though not cheap as standalone obviously, maybe 80m? I don't know.
But he is very good.
McTom is probably slightly better if anything !
I get people don’t rate Rice, and he’s massively overpriced, but some of these opinions are bonkers.
But not the player we need at all imo. He‘s good, in his position. But we need an 8 rather than a 6.
He’s been coached by Moyes, Pelligrini and Southgate. I can understand people not seeing the bigger picture.
I’d be happy if that’s how we end up with due to the rest going elsewhere. Let’s not forget he’s also a captain. Like a real one not an epiphany like Harry Maguire.
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