Duncan Castles : Jose Mourinho on collision course with Ed Woodward over Manchester United transfers

Been trying to highlight this point, it's only bad business if we don't win anything. If we win the title do you honestly believe anyone on the board will give a toss about the lack of resale value for 2 players, while they are busy counting their potential new earnings from increased sponsorship and marketing revenues? Big picture Igor, it's not about sell on value for individuals, but what the team achieve as a group, that's where the value comes in.

That is true and I agree, but signing them players doesn't mean we win the league.
If we don't win the league in two years time, who would you rather have in your team at that point, Matic and Perisic or Fabinho and Perisic.

If it was a vital cog in winning the league, I am all for it, but with 6 big teams all aiming for the title, it's hard to win no matter who you sign. At least with the likes of Fabinho over Matic, it's one less player to potentially replace, while also improving

I'm all for the Matic signing, I think he's a good player, but if figures are to be believed, both him and Fabinho will cost similar amounts of money, and that is surely a no brainer
 
The club is more important than the manager, and like always with mourinho he's already creating drama which for me he won't get to year 4 at united. Putting my opinion above mourinho's judgement? Half the cafe do that. And there is not another club out there that would pay that amount of money for those 2 players, if perisic was that good, why isn't anyone else after him? We don't see a cue of clubs after him which sums the player up. And I would rather we sign nobody, than throw money at a problem that is not solved, if it's not better than what we have got, then it's not solving a problem meaning it's wasting money. I am glad ed is putting his foot down on these clubs fantasy prices
There you showed your agenda which is heavily influenced by the narrative by the media. Mourinho quit 2 clubs to go to bigger. 3 times he got the boot the first time with Chelsea is unusual. Madrid is tough experience. SAF wouldn't last under those circumstances. Only his last sacking was inexcusable.

in case he is backed, there would be no question. Here your problem is you already made upyour mind thus acting on that notion that Mourinho wouldn't last long. Instead of buildina better story than Inter & Porto, you already give in. If you can't support a manager like Mourinho to make his team, then what's the point ofhiring in the first place. Why not keep LVG and have him keep promoting youth?

You sound like you're an ITK and so sure about price & fee. As far as it fee goes, they're all over the place at the moment, just like last summer with Micky & Pogba case.

You dodged allthe questions in my previous yet another your own view. You can't even give a profile of player you think would help the team. Just because a player you don't like and may cost fee you rather give up than at least trying to improve the team even just.

Before keeping on with your rant about throwing money at problem and ended up with no fix, remember that Mourinho so far was good with his signing & has achieved something. Weird to punish a manaher now due to some paranoid future fantasy.
 
The 'overpaying' shit has to be looked at as well, Everton just spent 30 mil quid on Keane and Jordan fecking Pickford each, they've spent over 100 mil quid already. Everton.

 
The club is more important than the manager, and like always with mourinho he's already creating drama which for me he won't get to year 4 at united. Putting my opinion above mourinho's judgement? Half the cafe do that. And there is not another club out there that would pay that amount of money for those 2 players, if perisic was that good, why isn't anyone else after him? We don't see a cue of clubs after him which sums the player up. And I would rather we sign nobody, than throw money at a problem that is not solved, if it's not better than what we have got, then it's not solving a problem meaning it's wasting money. I am glad ed is putting his foot down on these clubs fantasy prices

Pointless continuing with you now. You are still making presumptions about throwing money away or targets that are not good enough. It's your personal and unqualified opinion of things you know nothing about that you are using to reason why we should ignore the very man our own board highlighted as the best option to make these decisions. You have clearly decided you don't like the way mourinho does things, and that's fine, few do. But to dismiss everything he has achieved previously whilst using similar methods, simply to peddle your own disapproval of his philosophy, is an utter waste of time really. How can u say no other club would do this, when all the other clubs he has been at have enjoyed success after first listening to and then backing Jose? doesn't make sense to me. Bring in a manager who is very successful doing things his way, and then don't let him do things his way, and still expect him to win for you. If we didn't want mourinho or his methods we should have hired somebody else.
 
Could be because they're expecting a lot of money coming in from Lukaku.

Of course, it's still a pretty big sum spent by a club that's not really in some overly-wealthy hands (in comparison to the big dogs that is) for players of questionable (albeit solid) quality.
 
Woodward is probably on holiday because all the deals are sorted.

Just fine measures that need agreeing that his understudies can sort out.
 
That is true and I agree, but signing them players doesn't mean we win the league.
If we don't win the league in two years time, who would you rather have in your team at that point, Matic and Perisic or Fabinho and Perisic.

If it was a vital cog in winning the league, I am all for it, but with 6 big teams all aiming for the title, it's hard to win no matter who you sign. At least with the likes of Fabinho over Matic, it's one less player to potentially replace, while also improving

I'm all for the Matic signing, I think he's a good player, but if figures are to be believed, both him and Fabinho will cost similar amounts of money, and that is surely a no brainer
Every signing is a gamble. The call lies with the manager's vision. If he thinks Cleverley can be a part of title winning team, then we go with that gamble than sticking with slipping G who slipped at key moment & cost the team.

We don't know the future. Strange thing does happen. What if Fabinho for some reason in 2 seasons become irelevant like Felipe Melo?

The 6 team competing for the title is a myth. The quality gap between the 6 teams is close on paper: yes. For all of them to challenge: no. Arguably half of those don't have the mentality to challenge. They look tough but couldn't mount a challenge. The other half hs the mentality but there is problem with team building. The key to it is getting a stable team throughout the length of season than dominance. Chelsea did last season.
 
That is true and I agree, but signing them players doesn't mean we win the league.
If we don't win the league in two years time, who would you rather have in your team at that point, Matic and Perisic or Fabinho and Perisic.

If it was a vital cog in winning the league, I am all for it, but with 6 big teams all aiming for the title, it's hard to win no matter who you sign. At least with the likes of Fabinho over Matic, it's one less player to potentially replace, while also improving

I'm all for the Matic signing, I think he's a good player, but if figures are to be believed, both him and Fabinho will cost similar amounts of money, and that is surely a no brainer

Are you saying it is somehow more preferable to not win with Fabinho and Perisic, than it is to not win with Matic and Perisic? ;)

It's a no brainer for you, because you haven't worked with Matic or Fabinho. But Jose has worked with both, and will be fully aware of their potential benefits to our team.

Signing them doesn't guarantee anything of course, but what is as close to a guarantee as you can get is that when you give mourinho what he feels he needs, he delivers success time and again. That has been the case throughout his career and we have no reason to believe that given the license to do things using his methods again now, he will be any less successful. That's what the club knew when they hired him, so in for a penny, in for a pound as they say. Back him or sack him.
 
Woodward is what I see as a corporate schmoozer, who specialises in the commercial and business side of his job and frankly seems to have limited aptitude when it comes to securing signings. A friend of mine has met him at an event and said he doesn't seem have much interest in football, but knew a lot about rugby, hence I was unsurprised to hear he had been in NZ to watch the first Lions test.

In any case you have to question the method of sending a man who is mainly a commercial man to speak to players and representatives, rather than say a consortium of mourinho, a director and perhaps an ex player. Surely they would be far more likely to convince a player.

I'd expect perisic to sign just before the tour and morata being the 'big signing' that drags on into august. I would take this if our other signing was Fabinho/Nainggolan and not matic. In any case we need to seriously get a move on and make some signings or I can see a repeat of last season and a top 4 battle which could spell the end of jose rightly or wrongly.
 
Sadly not enough people grasp this concept. Signing players at 28-29 for huge money is just daft and is such a dumb move as it forces us into a corner we shouldn't be in. We should be targeting the best talent at 20-25 and signing and building a team that can have a strong present and then future.
True and such short termism is what has delivered us right into Madrid's hands re-Morata. If we had signed a younger striker when we signed Ibra, even if he had suffered the same fate, we would be looking for a loan signing to see us throough to January but instead we are forced to sign a starting player at ridiculous fees. If we sign Matic and Perisic we would be looking at another major rebuild just two years from now when those players need replacing and that fact should be reflected in their prices - if not then Ed needs to tell Mourinho to suck it up or walk because we can't compromise the club's future for instant gratification or worse just to massage Jose's ego. In fact he should be told that before he came Martial managed 17 goals in his debut season so he should expend his efforts in ensuring that Martial returns to such levels not wasting money on average Joes like Perisic who have achieved nothing of note in their careers.
 
There you showed your agenda which is heavily influenced by the narrative by the media. Mourinho quit 2 clubs to go to bigger. 3 times he got the boot the first time with Chelsea is unusual. Madrid is tough experience. SAF wouldn't last under those circumstances. Only his last sacking was inexcusable.

in case he is backed, there would be no question. Here your problem is you already made upyour mind thus acting on that notion that Mourinho wouldn't last long. Instead of buildina better story than Inter & Porto, you already give in. If you can't support a manager like Mourinho to make his team, then what's the point ofhiring in the first place. Why not keep LVG and have him keep promoting youth?

You sound like you're an ITK and so sure about price & fee. As far as it fee goes, they're all over the place at the moment, just like last summer with Micky & Pogba case.

You dodged allthe questions in my previous yet another your own view. You can't even give a profile of player you think would help the team. Just because a player you don't like and may cost fee you rather give up than at least trying to improve the team even just.

Before keeping on with your rant about throwing money at problem and ended up with no fix, remember that Mourinho so far was good with his signing & has achieved something. Weird to punish a manaher now due to some paranoid future fantasy.

First was on my phone so its difficult to answer your questions, again you trying to deny that the price will very much be 50 million plus or we would still be struggling to get him for a player who is peaking, that is not good money spent. So if we struggling to get the players, that says either club is not wanting to sell, and we have a problem agreeing a fee which sounds pretty expensive.

Has for kagwa and RVP argument, and? I think the fans were more concerned about the fact the club still had not signed a CM, which it was crying out for with fletcher failing fitness levels, scholes retiring the fans wanted fresh blood in the engine room, but think there still was more good to come out of it than bad, many were against the tevez signing he was too much like rooney. So this is not the first or last time fans have said this, but this kind of spending on players who won't do much than what we already got, scouting should be able to do better than this list of players.

Gundogan I am glad we never signed him with his injury problems no matter the age. The club still has a limit, and if these players are older they got to make the impact straight away, and I just don't see spending what will close to 100 million on 2 players will do a job. But don't forget the club has shareholders to answer too, its no longer a full on glazer owned club, so woodward has more than just mourinho to answer to, especially if the signings don't come off. What also got to take into account, clubs will fleece united if those prices are right, they be saying well if you spending that kind of money on 28 year olds we want more. The club has to make sure when they spend big on pogba situations its one of those rare occasions, so negotiation skills are strong.

Mourinho done good so far? ok he won a europa league and league cup, how can many fans complain? I was happy, even though only over a decade ago we would also laugh at liverpools cup treble in 2001. But if we going on performances in the PL, he has failed, 6th position, looking toothless upfront even when zlaten was fit, the style of play is awful and could not score a goal at any of the top sides grounds, so I would say he has miles to go to improve. And so far the signings we could make this summer don't seem to solve what our problems are, scoring goals. I think there are players in this team who could easily score 10 to 12 around a striker, pogba, martial and mhki can easily hit 10 to 12, for me I don't think we play with tempo or make OT pitch bigger, and we not getting the best out of what we already have got.

Pointless continuing with you now. You are still making presumptions about throwing money away or targets that are not good enough. It's your personal and unqualified opinion of things you know nothing about that you are using to reason why we should ignore the very man our own board highlighted as the best option to make these decisions. You have clearly decided you don't like the way mourinho does things, and that's fine, few do. But to dismiss everything he has achieved previously whilst using similar methods, simply to peddle your own disapproval of his philosophy, is an utter waste of time really. How can u say no other club would do this, when all the other clubs he has been at have enjoyed success after first listening to and then backing Jose? doesn't make sense to me. Bring in a manager who is very successful doing things his way, and then don't let him do things his way, and still expect him to win for you. If we didn't want mourinho or his methods we should have hired somebody else.

No you just don't like someone else's point of view to you that's why. Again who else is in for perisic? yes I know Pogba did not have many after him for that price. If mourinho was at other big clubs and he said, yeah I want matic and perisic 28 going 29 for a combined fee of probably 100 million, the clubs would laugh him out of the building, its reckless spending on 2 players who really don't bring anything new than what we have not already got, and we be relying on pogba and herrera in CM again. If our options beyond pogba and herrera are matic, carrick and fellaini. Mourinho also knows the kind of club that united are, so he needs to adapt is well. But lets be honest here, the club hired mourinho because there was no one else truly out there. And united have backed Mourinho, what ed is having problems with trying to justify spending that kind of money. Don't forget, the club has shares to answer too, and its going to be very hard for ed to explain why we spending that kind of money on 2 ageing players. If any of us were in ed's position we would also be having problems spending that kind of money, and negotiations are getting the price right, This is why a DOF is needed
 
the issue is with Mourinho and he shouldn't be spouting off in the media using his mouthpiece Castles

lets face facts - he is a manager who works in the short term and isn't thinking about budget

for example he isn't thinking about buying and developing a young defensive midfielder - he wants the finished product in Matic

he wants established players who will do a job for us over the next 2/3 years which is as long as he's been at any club

what's best for Manchester United is that he focuses on targeting players in the age range of Pogba/Lindelof/Bailly

if we pay the kind of money being quoted for Matic etc we may as well enter transfer negotiations saying we will pay double

my worry is that we've seen how grumpy and twatish Mourinho is - if we don't get the players he wanted due to unavailability or not paying way way over the odds his mood will be unbearable next season......especially if results don't go well

that's the thing about Mourinho - we should be on a high having won 2 trophies and qualifying for the champions league - there looks to be good squad unity and this should be the building block for something special - instead his attitude could spoil it all
 
True and such short termism is what has delivered us right into Madrid's hands re-Morata. If we had signed a younger striker when we signed Ibra, even if he had suffered the same fate, we would be looking for a loan signing to see us throough to January but instead we are forced to sign a starting player at ridiculous fees. If we sign Matic and Perisic we would be looking at another major rebuild just two years from now when those players need replacing and that fact should be reflected in their prices - if not then Ed needs to tell Mourinho to suck it up or walk because we can't compromise the club's future for instant gratification or worse just to massage Jose's ego. In fact he should be told that before he came Martial managed 17 goals in his debut season so he should expend his efforts in ensuring that Martial returns to such levels not wasting money on average Joes like Perisic who have achieved nothing of note in their careers.

Shame you're not the manager instead of a loser like Jose. What were the board thinking?

Oh, and if/when we need to replace Matic and Perisic, we'll need to buy two players, max, not a rebuild ffs.

Christ, where do these "fans" come from?

Price of success. The age of the customer. The supporter is dead.
 
True and such short termism is what has delivered us right into Madrid's hands re-Morata. If we had signed a younger striker when we signed Ibra, even if he had suffered the same fate, we would be looking for a loan signing to see us throough to January but instead we are forced to sign a starting player at ridiculous fees. If we sign Matic and Perisic we would be looking at another major rebuild just two years from now when those players need replacing and that fact should be reflected in their prices - if not then Ed needs to tell Mourinho to suck it up or walk because we can't compromise the club's future for instant gratification or worse just to massage Jose's ego. In fact he should be told that before he came Martial managed 17 goals in his debut season so he should expend his efforts in ensuring that Martial returns to such levels not wasting money on average Joes like Perisic who have achieved nothing of note in their careers.
Just with how CAF thinks, let's say that young forward. He suffered same fate as Zlatan. Then we would look to patch up until his return. What if he suffer both post injury psychological problem likeShaw as well as second season symddrone like Martial.

Who was that good young forward that moved last summer? If anything the less proven Morata is the same one being mentioned as similar riddiculous price.

If we achieve our short term goal then the rebuilding ismuch easier to do. Doing business as top dog is better than persuading a player to join an ever developing center aka Arsenal. The way you think we may entertain the idea of rehiring Moyes. That guy knows how to plan long term and knowto neglect some unnecessary immediate goals. And he knows how to scout big name signings too. Or bring back LVG and the philosoph so Martial can have the ball at his feet without working on his off ballmovement. Oh we save money by either start Rooney as forward or midfielder.
 
Last edited:
the issue is with Mourinho and he shouldn't be spouting off in the media using his mouthpiece Castles

lets face facts - he is a manager who works in the short term and isn't thinking about budget

for example he isn't thinking about buying and developing a young defensive midfielder - he wants the finished product in Matic

he wants established players who will do a job for us over the next 2/3 years which is as long as he's been at any club

what's best for Manchester United is that he focuses on targeting players in the age range of Pogba/Lindelof/Bailly

if we pay the kind of money being quoted for Matic etc we may as well enter transfer negotiations saying we will pay double

my worry is that we've seen how grumpy and twatish Mourinho is - if we don't get the players he wanted due to unavailability or not paying way way over the odds his mood will be unbearable next season......especially if results don't go well

that's the thing about Mourinho - we should be on a high having won 2 trophies and qualifying for the champions league - there looks to be good squad unity and this should be the building block for something special - instead his attitude could spoil it all

Though, in actual fact, if you insist on facing facts, you've zero proof that Mourinho has actually said anything to the press. So let's park your speculation for a moment.

I agree, the best thing for Manchester United in the long term is buying players like Pogba/Lindelof/Bailly, which again, if we're facing facts, Mourinho has already done. Signing Matic is, again, complete speculation. Let's indulge in this one though. When has signing a 28+ year old ever worked out for Manchester United? Robin Van Persie? Teddy Sheringham? Zlatan? Larrson? Van Der Sar? Berbatov? I'm sure there are other examples.

It's probably safe to agree that signing a mix of players is the correct approach. All the evidence points to that still being United's policy.

The dummy spitting at the current lack of signings is quite embarrassing. Perhaps some fans should be checking their own attitude before speculating what Mourinho's may be in the future.
 

Really? We are going down the same road again? First line telling us yet again that money spent on Perisic is money badly spent. Based on nothing but your own questionable presumptions of the players merits and the fact no-one else is in for him.

Ignoring the fact that mourinho is in a position to make those calls, and again ignoring the fact that our club hired Jose because he is the best at taking these types of decisions and turning them into success.

Falsely claiming other clubs would laugh him out for making similar demands, despite the fact he has been at some of those other clubs and they actually didn't laugh him out. They took the seemingly more radical route of actually backing the man they hired to bring them success, and lo and behold, they were rewarded with success.

We have been over this. All your arguments are based solely upon your disagreement and your obvious disapproval of his methods. Problem is, his methods are tried and trusted and proven to bring success. Your alternative suggestions are speculative and unproven, and have been founded without any real inside knowledge of how we do business or how we determine the quality or value of players. The overall value or cost of backing mourinho or not, can only be measured with any certainty at the end of the season. Until then back your manager and hope we get the success mourinho's methods have so often delivered. Don't back him and we definitely won't win anything.
 
Surely you don't really believe that, do you?
Well I refuse to believe Woodward would just walk out midway through the transfer window if we are really struggling like the press are trying to make out.

We never really know what's happening, for all we know we could have 4 players lined up just waiting to return from holiday?
 
Though, in actual fact, if you insist on facing facts, you've zero proof that Mourinho has actually said anything to the press. So let's park your speculation for a moment.

I agree, the best thing for Manchester United in the long term is buying players like Pogba/Lindelof/Bailly, which again, if we're facing facts, Mourinho has already done. Signing Matic is, again, complete speculation. Let's indulge in this one though. When has signing a 28+ year old ever worked out for Manchester United? Robin Van Persie? Teddy Sheringham? Zlatan? Larrson? Van Der Sar? Berbatov? I'm sure there are other examples.

It's probably safe to agree that signing a mix of players is the correct approach. All the evidence points to that still being United's policy.

The dummy spitting at the current lack of signings is quite embarrassing. Perhaps some fans should be checking their own attitude before speculating what Mourinho's may be in the future.
if Castles is reporting it, given their relationship you can all but say it is a fact that Mourinho is instructing it

not to be churlish but you pick out some older players who were all very effective for us - Van Persie was a final season splurge for Fergie, Berbatov was 27 whilst Sheringham, Zlatan, Larrson and Van Der Sar cost us a combined 5 million quid

my issue isn't with Matic or even with his age - it's with us likely to be spending 40/50 million on a player who is 29 in a few weeks - spending that on a Van Persie who will win you games almost single handedly like he did in Fergie's final year is one thing but is Matic that important to us? - maybe this signing is important to Mourinho who wants to free Herrera/Pogba in a midfield 3.

if we signed Matic and Perisic you could be spending 100 million on two players who might be at their best for a season or two - it's the short term-ism of these targets which worries me. We brought in Zlatan and Mhiki last Summer on a free and 30 million which is very acceptable in terms of not getting messed about in the transfer market.

Maybe we should be targeting Bakayoko if he is looking for a physically imposing defensive midfield player - he's the guy Conte wants to improve upon Matic.

as you say though a lot of this may not be true
 
if Castles is reporting it, given their relationship you can all but say it is a fact that Mourinho is instructing it

not to be churlish but you pick out some older players who were all very effective for us - Van Persie was a final season splurge for Fergie, Berbatov was 27 whilst Sheringham, Zlatan, Larrson and Van Der Sar cost us a combined 5 million quid

my issue isn't with Matic or even with his age - it's with us likely to be spending 40/50 million on a player who is 29 in a few weeks - spending that on a Van Persie who will win you games almost single handedly like he did in Fergie's final year is one thing but is Matic that important to us? - maybe this signing is important to Mourinho who wants to free Herrera/Pogba in a midfield 3.

if we signed Matic and Perisic you could be spending 100 million on two players who might be at their best for a season or two - it's the short term-ism of these targets which worries me. We brought in Zlatan and Mhiki last Summer on a free and 30 million which is very acceptable in terms of not getting messed about in the transfer market.

Maybe we should be targeting Bakayoko if he is looking for a physically imposing defensive midfield player - he's the guy Conte wants to improve upon Matic.

as you say though a lot of this may not be true

Maybe having a mix of experience and younger players is more important. Maybe they'll be there to shepherd in the next set of younger players....
 
A pretty good summary in my view, emphasizing the often overlooked point that it is Woodward's job to get players in, yet if that doesn't happen then it's somehow the managers fault for having unrealistic expectations. Mourinho's list was supposed to have secondary choices on it too, wasn't it? So if one target can't be obtained for whatever reason, there is a back up option already provided. If Woody is still on the primary targets we may need the window to be open for another 2 months at this rate. Might offer some insight as to why Rojo wasn't signed until after the manager who initially wanted him had already left! :)

Yeah it's the double standards I don't get. I don't see how it can be Jose's fault if the club fail to sign players. He would have discussed his ambitions and targets before he even took the job, so would have done so on the basis that United share the same ambitions and targets. To then turn around and blame the manager for being unrealistic is silly...he won two trophies and got the club back in the CL. He's done his bit so far.

The targets we've been linked with also don't exactly seem unrealistic. Only Ronaldo would be in that category and the link with him has nothing to do with Mourinho, and I don't think anyone would exactly blame Woodward for not bringing the likes of Ronaldo or Messi in either.

That's because he was on holidays till July 30 after playing in the euros till July first week. He was signed around august 5th. Nothing to do with us.



Except the cases he did well? He signed all the signings lvg wanted before the tour in 2015. He also signed all players lvg wanted in 2014. He signed all players mourinho wanted in 2016. So basically 3 windows where managers wanted the players and he delivered on them. It's quite obvious to anyone that he has done a good job.

He signed 6 players in LVG's first season. Two of those were Herrera and Shaw...targets he was supposed to sign the previous season and nothing to do with LVG. A third, Rojo, was revealed by Phil Neville (I said Giggs in the previous post but I got confused) to be a target while Moyes was manager, so again, not LVG's signing. That leaves Blind, Di Maria and Falcao...and two of those didn't seem to have anything to do with LVG either. We ened up with asquad that was horribly short of numbers in certain areas, which LVG was keen, repeatedly, to point out wasn't his fault.

In his second season we signed five players but LVG was still moaning all season about lacking players with creativity and mentioning "targets" we had. I'm not sure how much to read into that since it was clear to everyone by this point that LVG was full of shite, so it's debatable. Martial though was signed into the season...Jose seems to have made it clear this season that he doesn't want people brought in that late.

It's still wait and see in regards to this season, and it's all subjective to a degree, but the logic I don't get in this thread is the willingness to absolve Woodward of any possible blame in anything that may or may not happen, as if he has done something Fergie-esque to be considered above criticism (and even Ferguson got criticised). Yet at the same time a willingness to blame Mourinho for what is actually Woodward's job.
 
if Castles is reporting it, given their relationship you can all but say it is a fact that Mourinho is instructing it

not to be churlish but you pick out some older players who were all very effective for us - Van Persie was a final season splurge for Fergie, Berbatov was 27 whilst Sheringham, Zlatan, Larrson and Van Der Sar cost us a combined 5 million quid

my issue isn't with Matic or even with his age - it's with us likely to be spending 40/50 million on a player who is 29 in a few weeks - spending that on a Van Persie who will win you games almost single handedly like he did in Fergie's final year is one thing but is Matic that important to us? - maybe this signing is important to Mourinho who wants to free Herrera/Pogba in a midfield 3.

if we signed Matic and Perisic you could be spending 100 million on two players who might be at their best for a season or two - it's the short term-ism of these targets which worries me. We brought in Zlatan and Mhiki last Summer on a free and 30 million which is very acceptable in terms of not getting messed about in the transfer market.

Maybe we should be targeting Bakayoko if he is looking for a physically imposing defensive midfield player - he's the guy Conte wants to improve upon Matic.

as you say though a lot of this may not be true

And the fact it sounds like he cannot find anyone else says to me, he's not really opened his gaze on what else could be out there. Now last years signings I always thought this was the model I thought mourinho was going for, players around 23 to 26, and if there is a sneaky deal for an outstanding experienced player snap him up. What also worries me is us relying on herrera and pogba again, meaning if one of those 2 is not available, we will have a matic, carrick and fellaini has backup, that also worries me meaning very rotation again meaning we could see burn out again before april. But can you imagine if pogba and herrera are not available, and we have carrick, matic or fellaini in a midfield 2 or 3, that is also pretty brainless and slow. Would anyone even think fergie would continue the RVP pursuit? if arsenal kept upping the price on RVP's head to nearly 40 million or more, hell fergie did not even bother to lodge a bid he did not think arsenal would sell to a rival
 
if Castles is reporting it, given their relationship you can all but say it is a fact that Mourinho is instructing it
As I have pointed out several times this all started out by de Brun who completely made up in his own mind that Jose might quit based mainly on the tone of Woodie's voice in an interview.

It was posted in the transfer spec Twitter thread and I immediately predicted some other journos would pick up on it and it would send some posters into a meltdown.

So no we can not take it for a fact that Jose fed castle anything. The timing and source point more to click bait journalism by someone who is given far too much credit for being accurate and/or having inside info on the club.
 
And the fact it sounds like he cannot find anyone else says to me, he's not really opened his gaze on what else could be out there. Now last years signings I always thought this was the model I thought mourinho was going for, players around 23 to 26, and if there is a sneaky deal for an outstanding experienced player snap him up. What also worries me is us relying on herrera and pogba again, meaning if one of those 2 is not available, we will have a matic, carrick and fellaini has backup, that also worries me meaning very rotation again meaning we could see burn out again before april. But can you imagine if pogba and herrera are not available, and we have carrick, matic or fellaini in a midfield 2 or 3, that is also pretty brainless and slow. Would anyone even think fergie would continue the RVP pursuit? if arsenal kept upping the price on RVP's head to nearly 40 million or more, hell fergie did not even bother to lodge a bid he did not think arsenal would sell to a rival
you make some great points there - especially with the lack of mobility we will have in a midfield missing Herrera or Pogba

a Carrick/Matic/Fellaini midfield would be some spectacle
 
you make some great points there - especially with the lack of mobility we will have in a midfield missing Herrera or Pogba

a Carrick/Matic/Fellaini midfield would be some spectacle

So we sign matic for allot of money, but does not solve the problem of perhaps giving Herrera and pogba a rest, seems pretty careless to me. Meaning when they missing we have no control or creativity, carrick is closer to 40, fellaini is 30 this year, and matic is 29 this year, lets not forget Herrera is 27, so allot of CM's in our squad coming to their late 20's.
 
Mourinho's confrontational "if you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen" style of management is probably one of the reasons he has been so successful - he calls players out and challenges them to respond his criticism - but is also most likely the main reason he doesn't stay anywhere for too long as he falls out with too many people.
It's a double-edged sword.
Yep, pretty much, we're United, ed needs to get the stuff done, no one has a greater financial
I agree with all you just said. Woodward has contributed our problem in terms of price hike. He boasted in 2014 we can do things other teams can only dream of etc. He has built a rod for his own back.
Morata aside I feel the same at the moment. It's deflating.
Same, I trust mou but looking at the quality we got in last year only offering the Europa, it's sad to see the quality dip, ofcourse there are some issues as to why that is but we are so powerful in terms of money I can't help think that the Glazers have something to do with our limited spending or haggling for prices.
 
So we sign matic for allot of money, but does not solve the problem of perhaps giving Herrera and pogba a rest, seems pretty careless to me. Meaning when they missing we have no control or creativity, carrick is closer to 40, fellaini is 30 this year, and matic is 29 this year, lets not forget Herrera is 27, so allot of CM's in our squad coming to their late 20's.
yep that's the worry but Jose doesn't think of 3/4 years down the line

do we even need a dedicated defensive midfield player - Herrera was superb there and whilst he isn't 6'2 and build like a brick shithouse he can pass/tackle and has great energy - pretty sure I saw some post on here about how well his numbers compared with Kante

in terms of under-23 midfielders - Dier/Verratti/Sanches/Weigl/Keita/Fabinho/Bakayoko/Carvalho - I wonder how many of this list are available - you'd happily offer up to Pogba money for Verratti
 
Woodward is probably on holiday because all the deals are sorted.

Just fine measures that need agreeing that his understudies can sort out.
No, apparently Woodward is working to a 31 August deadline. At the moment he's in New Zealand on holiday, enjoying the Lions tour.
 
No, apparently Woodward is working to a 31 August deadline. At the moment he's in New Zealand on holiday, enjoying the Lions tour.

Is he supposed to be working 7 days a week from the end of the season to the start of the season or am I missing something?
 
Is he supposed to be working 7 days a week from the end of the season to the start of the season or am I missing something?

Yeah I don't get why him being in NZ is such an issue, it's the 21st century for ffs, there are plenty of jobs where you can work remotely.

For all we know Woody might have been there with agents, or corporate hospitality for clients.

Does it really matter.
 
yep that's the worry but Jose doesn't think of 3/4 years down the line

do we even need a dedicated defensive midfield player - Herrera was superb there and whilst he isn't 6'2 and build like a brick shithouse he can pass/tackle and has great energy - pretty sure I saw some post on here about how well his numbers compared with Kante

in terms of under-23 midfielders - Dier/Verratti/Sanches/Weigl/Keita/Fabinho/Bakayoko/Carvalho - I wonder how many of this list are available - you'd happily offer up to Pogba money for Verratti

I think we need I say 2 midfielders, a DM and a CM, maybe one that can instantly improve our team and a DM to give us an alternative, so much like the 2007/08 season where we could rotatate scholes, carrick, fletcher, Anderson and Hargreaves. I think signing 2, sees us not needing either of carrick and fellaini. Yeah if we spending big there is plenty out there, matic and perisic are strange ones costing a fortune without making any long term improvements
 
That is true, and when I meant young players, I meant the likes of Fabinho instead of Matic.
Fabinho has clearly put out there that he'd move to United and he'd be costing similar sorts of money to Matic, so it's really a no brainer

Personally I'd like both of them but on this board Matic is seriously underrated imo he'd be a fantastic signing for us.
 
Yeah I don't get why him being in NZ is such an issue, it's the 21st century for ffs, there are plenty of jobs where you can work remotely.

For all we know Woody might have been there with agents, or corporate hospitality for clients.

Does it really matter.

If the manager really has tasked him with getting all the signings in before training resumes and this is the final week before training resumes and the transfers aren't resolved then yes it's fairly poor practice.

He's the CEO of an extremely important organisation and these dealings are crucial to our performance/profit. I know it's 2017 and we can work remotely but he needs to be available for a face to face negotiation in Spain (or similar) at short notice if required.

That said - that's all assuming all the transfer machinations are Woodward's direct responsibility, it may be that they are all done by a huge team and he has no input whatsoever other than okaying fees. In which case this is more an issue of perception, ie. it doesn't look great symbolically to the fans that our figurehead is larking about on the other side of the world when we need reinforcements.
 
Is he supposed to be working 7 days a week from the end of the season to the start of the season or am I missing something?
Not when he's on holiday obviously. Anyway the tour starts soon so I'm sure he'll be back for that - marketing partners to schmooze, etc.
 
It's impressively stupid logic to believe that Woodward not being sat in his office, by the dial-up telephone, dictates that United's entire operation comes to a standstill.

Some of you lot are probably irritated at the thought of him having a lie-in on a Saturday.
 
It's impressively stupid logic to believe that Woodward not being sat in his office, by the dial-up telephone, dictates that United's entire operation comes to a standstill.

Some of you lot are probably irritated at the thought of him having a lie-in on a Saturday.
If, as I've been told, Jose has given Ed a 31 August deadline, it's not inconceivable that he sees this as the ideal time to squeeze in a few weeks holiday taking in the Lions tour. Then onto His own US tour, leaving himself the whole of August to complete Jose's list, by which time the market should have opened up a bit.
 
What's to laugh about? you think Woodward has to be glued to his fax machine for a deal to progress?

Woodward will have many people working below him to get deals concluded, not just him.