Avoid the argument then and decide how my mind works. That's your standard procedure where anything is concerned - even Ferguson. You know the intimate inner workings of everybody else's mind.............fool.
Agreed?
Correct.
Dimitar Berbatov | 2009/10 Performances
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Avoid the argument then and decide how my mind works. That's your standard procedure where anything is concerned - even Ferguson. You know the intimate inner workings of everybody else's mind.............fool.
Agreed?
Correct.
As in Blade Runners the candle that burns brightest, burns twice as fast.
Yeah but, you said we should pay £30 million for him at the time.
Needs to play with a powerful pacy striker. Waste of time on his own or with a slow paced striker.
There's a good player in our Sunday League who scores a few goals.
Not worth 30m mind, so we could buy him and not expect much.
Not worth 30m mind, so we could buy him and not expect much.
This is moving in the right direction finally!
Definition of issue and proposed solution.
He already plays with one gambit, they haven't exactly been a roaring success as a partnership have they?
It's the same old excuses, he needs this, needs to play there, price tag, blah blah. What he needs is to start showing why we choose to sign him instead of taking up the option on Carlos Tevez, until then he will always be labelled a mistake in the eyes of most fans.
Before anyone starts though, let's not get into another "Tevez didn't want to stay" debate here, after his first season he was desperate to sign, we decided to wait on the option and used the money for Berba instead. That much is fact. Because of this he will forever be judged as a mistake unless he can surpass Tevez in every way.
I know the inner workings of people like you, for you display it all too well with very post you make. Yet like to flatter yourself that your keeping it a big secret. Fact is your fooling your self alone. That is why its you who is the fool.
As this crap below shows
Eh, Chief? Maybe time to break out the good old Peace Pipe...
The bolded part is the crux of the matter. Basically unless he plays like Tevez and some he wont be accepted. He can't win.
Not when dealing with individuals like Dans.
Would Berbatov have done for City what Tevez has done?
Hat off for the persistence. It beats resistance and all that.
If you go to page 37, post 8, article 9, I am sure it has been addressed...
You mean shows he's interested and scores a few goals?
Silly notion, that.
Having said that, I do recognise that Berbatov has wonderful skills, but whether it's down to him, our system, the players he has around him or whatever, if it's not working, what's the answer?
I'd like to see him play regularly just behind Rooney or whatever front man. I don't think playing a lone striker is his role.
Does it mention there that Berba cost £30m but was never worth that?
I don't think he needs to play "like" Tevez, he just needs to play as well/better than him and have an effect in crucial moments of crucial games.
Is there anyone who can actually argue with that?
30.75m, Livvie, 30.75m.
I am pretty sure that this pops up on pages 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 etc. With the exception of page 63 possibly.Well, since you mention it, pages 1-65 do exactly this.
It's possible. There is less pressure there after all.
For example Tevez never performed like his dpoing for City for us because his second season was fecked up by uncertainty added to the pressure of playing for us.
Infact just earlier this season many where saying Tevez was gash, ''no where near worth 25 million'' and SAF was right to not 'waste money' on him. Just to show how fickle and hypocritical many in here are with their views.
Playing as well as Tevez, means closing down defenders as well as Carlos did, getting into the box from deep as fast as Tevez did and affecting big games in the same fashion. That is what he will never do. for he isn't Tevez.
Rather wanitng Berbatov to surpass the Berbatov of Spurs in his domestic and European performances is a miles more sensible way of judging him. Rather than judging him in terms of Tevez, like some logarithm.
He does SHOW interest. Because he is languid you lot chalk it off at laziness. He gets angry with himself (rightly) and the team (stupidly) for a truly bad display, his arrogant and petulant. Y'all even complain when he doesn't elaborately celebrate a goal
I see. He has 12 in the league thus far. Surely that counts as a few. Have you stopped complaining about his goals yet?
]No one for sure knows yet. for sometimnes it works very well like it did vs Spurs away, vs Bolton this year, for the last 2 months before the Bayern game this year and in Milan last season.
I agree. Especially in our team.
You should actually read what I write about Berbatov before deciding what you think you'd like me to have written in order that you can carry on spouting your championship manager-esque based arguments about anything in the footballing world.
Rubber - are you in fact Dimi?
You're getting unreasonably het up about all of this.
You're getting unreasonably het up about all of this.
There you go again making assumptions. Can you prove that we are in fact not a collection of people, all of whom share the view that you are borderline obsessive/hysterical?
plus the fact that a certain striker who wasn't as half as good as him was prefered over him
i don't think Tevez ever crumbled under preassure mate, quite the opposite
You're not getting my point Chief. In the summer of 2008 SAF choose Berba rather than taking up the Tevez option, that much is fact.
That's the reason he will be "judged in terms of Tevez" by most fans.
It aint asking a lot for him to stand up and be counted in big moments of big games, if he can't do that then for all the flicks and lovely touches in the world, he is pretty pants.
Berbatov may be languid and other such adjectives. But he is lazy, Chief.
There have been numerous times I've seen him make no attempt to chase a ball...we don't want him running around like a headless chicken, but when people say they want him to show effort, it's often where he does nothing, when he could do something.
As for his goals, 12 isn't a bad return - but we need them in vital games.
There have been numerous times I've seen him make no attempt to chase a ball...we don't want him running around like a headless chicken, but when people say they want him to show effort, it's often where he does nothing, when he could do something.
As for his goals, 12 isn't a bad return - but we need them in vital games.
He was on a two year loan. SAF thought we were short in the striking department. Give me a good reason why we should have bought him a year early, given that we had already committed to paying £5m a year for his loan, and weren't exactly flush with cash. We brought in Berbatov to offer something different, which he has. It's hard to argue that he's been an unmitigated success, but he's not been a failure either. Somehow, on here, we only seem to deal in absolutes; good or bad, success or failure.
It's astonishing to me how people will excuse his poor performances in his final season (and there were quite a few) on the basis that mean old SAF hurt his feelings by dropping him in favour of Berbatov, but I don't hear any mention of the fact that perhaps Berbatov would be a more effective player for us if SAF didn't keep leaving him out for important games. Surely he's in the Tevez position of a year ago; he knows that when the big games roll around, he's the 12th or 13th man.
The fact is that when the going got tough, Tevez got going. To City. Had he played like he has for them in his time with us, or this season had he stayed with us, then this discussion would be moot, as he'd be starting most weeks. He didn't want to do that clearly. That says plenty about him, IMO.
I feel you, but.. Berba got chances in big game after big game last season and well I was far from impressed as I'm sure deep down you was too.
You could say he had his chance, a part of me thinks his displays at Anfield and against Leeds was the straw that broke the camel's back for Sir Alex. Bringing him back for Chelsea, Sir Alex hd no choice, and he was well, you know. It's not like Tevez who in his first season scored against Liverpool away,Chelsea was his first goal, Lyon, Liverpool at Anfield last season, I mean Berba's contributions in big games just hasn't been enough and I can see why Sir Alex benches him. He ghosts through them, it's clear to see.
Even when he was brought on this season against Arsenal at home, he had a point to prove, the ball was rolled to him, his name was written in the headlines, and well he fluffed it. It's the story of his career with us.
A very good argument is that Tevez had just helped us win the CL for the only the third time in our history. Along the way he scored a vital goal vs. Lyon and put in 2 fantastic performances vs. Barca in the semis. On top of that he scored in the penalty shoot-out. He was desperate to be rewarded with a full time deal. I think this is a more than decent reason.
He has been a failure for sure. He's had his moments granted but so did Veron, some spectacular ones in fact, was he not a failure?
Bit of myth in here this. He was the third choice striker, that is a fact no matter how some people try to bend the stats. He still managed to score at Anfield (got dropped the next game), scored 4 vs. Blackburn (got dropped the next game) and won us massive matches like Wigan away. he also scored a massive goal in the 85th minute vs. Porto in the CL 1/4 final.
Big difference here, Berbatov is without question our SECOND choice striker. Tevez was second choice in season 1, in season 2 he was THIRD choice. In season one he did much more than Berba this season. Even in season two as third choice Tevez still had more "big moments" than Berbatov has had. That kind pisses on that argument, it's like you're contradicting yourself.
He was brilliant for us in year one, how can you suggest otherwise? We became the most feared attack in Europe with Rooney, Tevez and Ronaldo. When the next season came around, he was undoubtedly dropped from second choice to third choice.
I still think he should have been a bigger man and waited it out but not all people are the same, he obviously got very pissed off with SAF and when a player and manager don't see eye to eye any longer, one of them has to go. See the cases of Jaap Stam and RVN as your examples.
I agree to a point. I'd like to have seen him impose himself in big games a lot more.
In his first season particularly, Tevez had a good knack of scoring important goals. But there were also some poor performances in big games (especially when he played up front on his own), which seems to have been glossed over by the sands of time. Particularly in his final season with us. It's the reason we brought in Berbatov; to offer us another option. That and the fact that by the end of Tevez's first season, we were down to the bare bones in terms of strikers, and we couldn't go on the same way the following season.
It should never have been a 'one or the other' situation with Berbatov and Tevez. They could have worked extrememly well together as part of a squad, but Tevez decided that he didn't fancy trying to change SAF's mind about him being the third wheel to the Rooney-Berba partnership. That's a shame, but life goes on. And for Berbatov it goes on being judged by the standards of a player who has since left, and whose game bears no resemblance to his own.
Another myth, you are the original myth believer.
See the two CL semi-final performances, up top on his own... fantastic.
Anyway let's get away from ugly Carlos fecking Tevez again here, the point of this thread is Berbatov. Slagging off Tevez doesn't make Berbatov any more of a success I'm afraid.
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