Day 19: Brazil vs Mexico and Belgium vs Japan

oneniltothearsenal said:
Not invested just curious. I've never heard anyone claim baseball is higher in toughness factor than basketball or any other team sport so I was curious why you believed it was.
It sounds like the reason is possible fights and potential for a baseball to hit you?
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It’s not just the fights or getting hit by a pitch (or a runner) or getting cleated or the mentality of “you never rub where the pitch hit you” etc.

It’s also the physical grind of a baseball season. The MLB season is 2x as long as the NBA season with the added kicker that it is outdoors in the summer. I’ve lost 15 pounds in a day before catching 18 innings of a double header.

Being a wrestler and a wrestling coach (the Olympic variety dammit) also colors my opinion of basketball as “the sport boys do during men’s wrestling season”.
 
Ainu said:
We've been pretty irrelevant and crap for a very long time.
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I guess the recent surge of talent colored my view on it.
Hojoon said:
Pretty sure it's the usual 3 at the back with Kompany taking Boyata's place.
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ti vu said:
I guess back 3 like usual. Carrasco as left wing back
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True. I was looking at Carrasco and thinking left wing instead of left wing back.

Although now thinking about it, I don’t know who I thought was playing left back in a 4-4-2.
 
buchansleftleg said:
I think Neymar is going to grow to be just as much of a cnut as Suarez is but he has better PR machine behind him and Fifa giving him referees like nursemaids rather than disciplinarians.

I really hope Belgium outdoo Germany and take them totally apart in the next round.

Maybe hatricks for Hazard, Lukaku and deBruynne before the first half finishes will make Neymar a jibbering wreck, appearing for the second half with white powder streaming from his nostrils and trying to pull a gun on the ref screaming that the match needs to be restarted!

Now that would be fun to watch!
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Its not gonna happen, sorry. The countries that knock Brazil out are always the same: Germany, Argentina, Netherlands and France a lot of times. If you hate Brazil you just need to wait Brazil x France:lol:But you better give up this Belgium beating Brazil thing.
 
Charles Miller said:
Its not gonna happen, sorry. The countries that knock Brazil out are always the same: Germany, Argentina, Netherlands and France a lot of times. If you hate Brazil you just need to wait Brazil x France:lol:But you better give up this Belgium beating Brazil thing.
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If Belgium goes through Japan, and they keep going with Carrasco as fullback Tite will make a "churrasquinho" with that left side. :lol:
 
Red Dreams said:
Brazil are the international version of the scousers.

Always feeling entitled and forever victims.
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With a major difference between them, they actually win something.
 
Charles Miller said:
Its not gonna happen, sorry. The countries that knock Brazil out are always the same: Germany, Argentina, Netherlands and France a lot of times. If you hate Brazil you just need to wait Brazil x France:lol:But you better give up this Belgium beating Brazil thing.
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We’d have beaten you in 2002 if you didn’t bribe the ref :p
 
Carolina Red said:
It’s not just the fights or getting hit by a pitch (or a runner) or getting cleated or the mentality of “you never rub where the pitch hit you” etc.

It’s also the physical grind of a baseball season. The MLB season is 2x as long as the NBA season with the added kicker that it is outdoors in the summer. I’ve lost 15 pounds in a day before catching 18 innings of a double header.

Being a wrestler and a wrestling coach (the Olympic variety dammit) also colors my opinion of basketball as “the sport boys do during men’s wrestling season”.
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Makes sense. I think people tend to rate the sport they played as 'tougher' or more demanding than others that are not aficionados of the sport. I've heard all sorts of debates over the years between people championing their favorite and putting down the others. Rugby players and NFL football fans debating which sport is tougher, which one is for wimps. Water polo players insisting their sport was more demanding cardio than any other "gopher" sports, etc. Even seen fights break out between people championing their favorite sport.

For me I found in 1980s America there was a lot of really silly biases that have mostly disappeared about football by now.
But for some reason Neymar seems to trigger some people more than other players that dive/flop/etc.

Oh also, I don't even like the mentality that toughness is some positive. One just needs to look at CTE to see the problem with the NFL elevating 'toughness' as a virtue.
 
Carolina Red said:
They’ll skewer them, eh?
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Quite frankly can't see any team more solid than Brazil, France has potential but they looked defensively vulnerable against a chaotic Argentina side, unless they improve that can't see another team to stop them winning this.
 
SCP said:
If Belgium goes through Japan, and they keep going with Carrasco as fullback Tite will make a "churrasquinho" with that left side. :lol:
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Brazil right side is a bit shite. Their best RB is Danilo! Belgium can always turn into back 4 with Vertongen doing a decent job as LB. Hazard is not primary keeping width but we know how he likes to drift over there. Brazil? How would they improved their right side especially defensive?

SCP said:
Quite frankly can't see any team more solid than Brazil, France has potential but they looked defensively vulnerable against a chaotic Argentina side, unless they improve that can't see another team to stop them winning this.
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I am not sure where do you this solidity from? Goal conceding stats? Watching games, it's the incompetence of opposition forwards to put chance away, not Brazil's defense doing well. Costa Rica, Serbia, Mexico all created scoring good chance for their forwards to fail. When it comes,to team with good goal scoring forwards, then it would show.
 
ti vu said:
Brazil right side is a bit shite. Their best RB is Danilo! Belgium can always turn into back 4 with Vertongen doing a decent job as LB. Hazard is not primary keeping width but we know how he likes to drift over there. Brazil? How would they improved their right side especially defensive?
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Belgium will need to adapt to Brazil, Brazil will keep going as they have been doing with Tite, compact team with always a added bonus of having players like Neymar, Coutinho, if not Jesus they have Firmino who can come from the bench, heck even Paulinho can penetrate inside the area to cause problems.
 
It would be really funny if Japan was the one to cause the upset.
 
SCP said:
Belgium will need to adapt to Brazil, Brazil will keep going as they have been doing with Tite, compact team with always a added bonus of having players like Neymar, Coutinho, if not Jesus they have Firmino who can come from the bench, heck even Paulinho can penetrate inside the area to cause problems.
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BeLgium is naive coached by Martinez so adapting is not their option. However just as I said in previous post, Brazil solidity is a stretch. Against team with better goal scorers then it would show.
 
SCP said:
Quite frankly can't see any team more solid than Brazil, France has potential but they looked defensively vulnerable against a chaotic Argentina side, unless they improve that can't see another team to stop them winning this.
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If Mexico had any sort of clue what they were doing in the final 3rd today, Brazil would be the ones packing their bags to head home.

I agree with @ti vu ... I don’t see that solidity you’re talking about.
 
Imho the biggest up this Brazilian side seems to have developed that almost no Brazilian side could claim in the past is patience and restraint. I agree that out of all the teams thus far they have looked the most like likely wc winners. It feels a bit like the kind of performances you tend to see Germany put in - not Brazil.

Then again - I also believe they still haven't been truly tested by a potent attack.
 
ti vu said:
I am not sure where do you this solidity from? Goal conceding stats? Watching games, it's the incompetence of opposition forwards to put chance away, not Brazil's defense doing well. Costa Rica, Serbia, Mexico all created scoring good chance for their forwards to fail. When it comes,to team with good goal scoring forwards, then it would show.
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Basically the worst team they faced was Costa Rica, Switzerland and Serbia are 2 good European NT's and they only suffered a single goal from a set piece, they were clearly above anyone else on the CONMEBOL qualifiers, I mean if you think Martinez is a better manager than Tite just because one managed in England while the other only coached clubs in Brazil you are entitled to your opinion.
 
Carolina Red said:
If Mexico had any sort of clue what they were doing in the final 3rd today, Brazil would be the ones packing their bags to head home.

I agree with @ti vu ... I don’t see that solidity you’re talking about.
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Lets see if Japan will not cause more troubles to Belgium than Mexico to Brazil then.
 
SCP said:
Basically the worst team they faced was Costa Rica, Switzerland and Serbia are 2 good European NT's and they only suffered a single goal from a set piece, they were clearly above anyone else on the CONMEBOL qualifiers, I mean if you think Martinez is a better manager than Tite just because one managed in England while the other only coached clubs in Brazil you are entitled to your opinion.
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Qualifier means jack white in WC finals, let alone KO stage. Not unusual for team doing well in qualifier to be underwhelming at the WC

Switchzerland and Serbian are good but that's it good. They are not ever considered powerhouse and their record in big tournament showed. In this moment, they're not on Belgium level let alone France.

Where did you get the impression I am comparing the two coaches? I was saying, when it comes to raw talent at disposal. Belgium is no worse, and talent alone would mean Belgium can trouble Brazil more than anything they face thus far, and as naive as Martinez, he has better option to adapt in game than Brazil who RB position (fullback-wingback-key position in their team through history) is as underwhelming as it gets,
 
The winner of Brazil vs Belgium will win the World Cup i'm guessing.. Brazil seems way too strong though and with Germany Argentina and Spain already out it will be a walk in the park for them ! 6th world cup in a few days, quite impressive.
 
Tite can just play Marquinhos at right back if he wants that side more solid defensively or just go back to the system we used in qualifying by playing a midfield three.
 
El-Buitre said:
The winner of Brazil vs Belgium will win the World Cup i'm guessing.. Brazil seems way too strong though and with Germany Argentina and Spain already out it will be a walk in the park for them ! 6th world cup in a few days, quite impressive.
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France? They’ve looked more impressive than Brazil IMO
 
Carolina Red said:
I don’t see how that’s relevant to Mexico and Brazil.
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Simple, the winner from that match will face Brazil. Brazil is favourite.
ti vu said:
Qualifier means jack white in WC finals, let alone KO stage. Not unusual for team doing well in qualifier to be underwhelming at the WC
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No but they are indicators. CONMEBOL qualifiers, 5th placed Peru - home. 4 th placed Colombia hardly favourite against England. 3rd placed Argentina - home. Only the second placed Uruguay is on the QF, do you know how many points they were behind Brazil?

10, do you know the GD for Brazil? + 30, Uruguay? + 12. I mean I know there are some narratives here, but I want you to explain me why Brazil is not favourite for this WC? Don't tell me you believe Belgium or France are favourites against them? Are you.
 
ti vu said:
What is your point? We're discussing Brazil's defensive solidity.
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My point is simple. I say Brazil is solid you come with Belgium or France. And I say to you Brazil has a better team reason why they are favourites. I mean if you think France or Belgium will have those big and long avenues of space Mbappé had vs Argentina then ok.
 
El-Buitre said:
The winner of Brazil vs Belgium will win the World Cup i'm guessing.. Brazil seems way too strong though and with Germany Argentina and Spain already out it will be a walk in the park for them ! 6th world cup in a few days, quite impressive.
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Belgium and then possibly France is hardly a walk in the park. Both games are about as 50/50 as you can get.

Between Brazil and the field I'll take the field.
 
Can't see Japan getting much out of this game. Fair play not gonna help them against Hazard, Lukaku and De Bruyne.
 
SCP said:
Simple, the winner from that match will face Brazil. Brazil is favourite.
No but they are indicators. CONMEBOL qualifiers, 5th placed Peru - home. 4 th placed Colombia hardly favourite against England. 3rd placed Argentina - home. Only the second placed Uruguay is on the QF, do you know how many points they were behind Brazil?

10, do you know the GD for Brazil? + 30, Uruguay? + 12. I mean I know there are some narratives here, but I want you to explain me why Brazil is not favourite for this WC? Don't tell me you believe Belgium or France are favourites against them? Are you.
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Last time Brazil won the WC, they struggled in qualifier for the WC. Same WC, Argentina on the other hand trumped the qualifier yet to shite the bed in the WC. And we have people talking about the Coference Cup curse.

Peru's qualified for the WC, but doesn't mean they're rated at better team than say Chile. One can have a good (qualifying) campaign. Doesn't a measure stick for team quality. Not rare to have highly rated team miss out the WC finals.

Favorite for the World Cup itself should be considered based on how the team perform in the WC, not qualifiers. And that comes to the point where Brazil doesn't display what you described as solidity.
 
Interesting tactic from the Japanese. Not just sitting back - yet anyway.
 
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