David Villa | Monday 'defining day' for Spurs: Villa signs for Atletico Madrid

Brwned said:
No. He becomes a player who scores or assists 73 goals in 86 starts in two seasons.

Robben's inconsistent, Berbatov's consistent.

I think he'd be on an equal level to Torres, yes. I also think it's pretty clear that Berbatov was an excellent player for Spurs and whether you want to admit that or not, it's there for everyone to see.

If he can repeat his Spurs form for us then he'll get plenty of plaudits for being up there with the best, like Villa does.

If we're judging on past performances, like his Spurs ones, then he's not far off Villa.

If we're judging him off his first season with us, then that's just silly. Sheringham wasn't very good in his first season with us. Won player of the year a couple of years later.
Click to expand...

You say having watched Berbatov for 3 seasons in England, and how many times have you seen David Villa? Over how many seasons?

Would you even know that he's finished top assister in his league had you not been told? Course not.

Berbatov has finished second highest assister, this season, playing for manchester united, winning the title. Thats the closest he's come and he's supposedly an assist specialist.

Villa finished top assister in a season Valencia finished 4th, and scored 57 goals - thats 21 less than Barcelona that season - in a league where the art of a midfield passmaster reigns supreme and yet a striker gets the most assists.

I'll say again, this side of his game is so under rated its ridiculous. You draw your conclusions from watching him how many games? And im guessing all from this season, where he's played just 1 of the roles he can play. He used to play behind another striker and thats what he was doing when he achieved this.

Now he leads the line for Valencia and has done for just under 2 seasons and doing that its harder for him to provide goals for his team mates because oftentimes he's lacking support and has to go it alone, which is another reason he scored 40% of Valencia's goals this season.

So when his afterburners start to tire, he'll rely more on his ability to pass and create for others. He'll still score a lot of goals. But dont think that Berbatov's passing and creating ability far surpasses Villa's because they are simply playing different roles and when Villa played the same role as Berbatov he used to create and score more goals.

In specific, in 2006/2007 playing behind a striker David Villa got 11 league assists + 16 league goals. Berbatov's best so far has been 11 league assists and 15 league goals, the season before last playing for Spurs.

But somehow when Berbatov's pace has completely gone he'll last many more years than David Villa because of his ability to pass a football. :rolleyes: Villa's ability to pass a football is very good also and he'll always score you a good amount of goals, in a variety of ways. You asked your question and now I'll ask mine. In light of this - would you rather have a 33 year old David Villa or a 33 year old Dmitar Berbatov?

I know your answer already. But you knew mine already. So I'll ask anyway.
 
Ekeke said:
You say having watched Berbatov for 3 seasons in England, and how many times have you seen David Villa? Over how many seasons?

Would you even know that he's finished top assister in his league had you not been told? Course not.

Berbatov has finished second highest assister, this season, playing for manchester united, winning the title. Thats the closest he's come and he's supposedly an assist specialist.

Villa finished top assister in a season Valencia finished 4th, and scored 57 goals - thats 21 less than Barcelona that season - in a league where the art of a midfield passmaster reigns supreme and yet a striker gets the most assists.

I'll say again, this side of his game is so under rated its ridiculous. You draw your conclusions from watching him how many games? And im guessing all from this season, where he's played just 1 of the roles he can play. He used to play behind another striker and thats what he was doing when he achieved this.

Now he leads the line for Valencia and has done for just under 2 seasons and doing that its harder for him to provide goals for his team mates because oftentimes he's lacking support and has to go it alone, which is another reason he scored 40% of Valencia's goals this season.

So when his afterburners start to tire, he'll rely more on his ability to pass and create for others. He'll still score a lot of goals. But dont think that Berbatov's passing and creating ability far surpasses Villa's because they are simply playing different roles and when Villa played the same role as Berbatov he used to create and score more goals.

In specific, in 2006/2007 playing behind a striker David Villa got 11 league assists + 16 league goals. Berbatov's best so far has been 11 league assists and 15 league goals, the season before last playing for Spurs.

But somehow when Berbatov's pace has completely gone he'll last many more years than David Villa because of his ability to pass a football. :rolleyes: Villa's ability to pass a football is very good also and he'll always score you a good amount of goals, in a variety of ways. You asked your question and now I'll ask mine. In light of this - would you rather have a 33 year old David Villa or a 33 year old Dmitar Berbatov?

I know your answer already. But you knew mine already. So I'll ask anyway.
Click to expand...

Depends on a couple of things.

Whether Rooney's came on as a player who plays right up top, and who our other strikers are.

If yes, and our current strikeforce is the same, I'd say yes.

I'm beginning to doubt both of those factors though, and if they were to change then I'd possibly go for Villa.

Plemty of variables to consider Ekeke, but I'm open to it.
 
Brwned said:
No. He becomes a player who scores or assists 73 goals in 86 starts in two seasons.

Robben's inconsistent, Berbatov's consistent.

I think he'd be on an equal level to Torres, yes. I also think it's pretty clear that Berbatov was an excellent player for Spurs and whether you want to admit that or not, it's there for everyone to see.

If he can repeat his Spurs form for us then he'll get plenty of plaudits for being up there with the best, like Villa does.

If we're judging on past performances, like his Spurs ones, then he's not far off Villa.

If we're judging him off his first season with us, then that's just silly. Sheringham wasn't very good in his first season with us. Won player of the year a couple of years later.
Click to expand...

Right. Berbatov and torres equal. We wish.
 
Brwned said:
Villa and Torres equal.

73 goals or assists in 86 starts, something tells me you're not quite appreciating that stat enough.
Click to expand...

soMething tells me you're appreciating that stat way too much. So you didn't say torres and berberov. That would have been plain wrong.
 
Brwned said:
Depends on a couple of things.

Whether Rooney's came on as a player who plays right up top, and who our other strikers are.

If yes, and our current strikeforce is the same, I'd say yes.

I'm beginning to doubt both of those factors though, and if they were to change then I'd possibly go for Villa.

Plemty of variables to consider Ekeke, but I'm open to it.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. And just to solidify the point I'm making, not just to you, but to everyone who has any doubts about Villa's ability to pass and create things for team mates - The season he was top assister in la liga, he beat these players :

Ronaldinho, Xavi, Iniesta, Robinho, Cassano, Deco, Pires, Riquelme. And if I'm not mistaken this is 05/06 , a season where Ronaldinho had just won the ballon d'or... So we're talking at the height of his powers, same with Riquelme.

So err, excuse me if I dont agree that when Villa has lost his pace he wont be able to adapt his game to make more use of his creative and team-passing play. He has a different style to Berbatov's, but he has loads of ball playing ability himself and he just wont struggle with it. He'll score less goals of course but lets be honest, he's likely to be scoring quite a few more than Berbatov still.

Course all of this will be forgotten and come the next thread everyone will continue talking like David Villa is just a goalscorer.
 
Brwned said:
No. He becomes a player who scores or assists 73 goals in 86 starts in two seasons.

Robben's inconsistent, Berbatov's consistent.

I think he'd be on an equal level to Torres, yes. I also think it's pretty clear that Berbatov was an excellent player for Spurs and whether you want to admit that or not, it's there for everyone to see.

If he can repeat his Spurs form for us then he'll get plenty of plaudits for being up there with the best, like Villa does.

If we're judging on past performances, like his Spurs ones, then he's not far off Villa.

If we're judging him off his first season with us, then that's just silly. Sheringham wasn't very good in his first season with us. Won player of the year a couple of years later.
Click to expand...

Sherringham ain't a good comparison to use in this argument Brwned. His first season was actually decent and was cited as a big reason Cole had a fantastic start to the season, albeit he lost form towards the last three months of the season. It was better than the next two years when he was a sub for the most parts and made far less important by the form of Yorke and Cole.

His goals in the last two games in 99 where obviously essential but he hardly featured that season due to injury. Alot is made of the options from the bench of 99 but Ole was the super sub who consistently delivered the goods, Teddy is remembered because of the last two games of the season.

Sherringham's first season often gets criticised but it is more down to the fact that 97/98 turned into a dissapointing season and his form dropped along with Cole's in the run which made us badly exposed upfront. Overall his season was decent and he turned in some good performance in big games(Juve, Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea, etc) and his partnership with Cole was highly effective first half of the season. He was being praised as getting the best out of Cole in a way Cantona could not do at the time. By the start of December Cole had gone on a streak along the lines of 18 goals in 18 games.

He did have a very good last season with United and won the player of the year award in 00/01 but that was in fourth and final season for United. I'd have Sherringham's first season with United as his second best, but he was playing in a side without Keane, Yorke and Stam which made all the difference to the team's overall success.
 
He is very good but he'll come at a premium, a premium Eto'o may not - and Eto'o may score more. Eto'o is still my buy!
 
I bet 3 seasons of Eto'o at the club and he'll have cost more than Villa.

I'm pretty sure Villa wont be asking for £11 million a season. I dont even want to know about the goal bonus he wants on top of it.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
soMething tells me you're appreciating that stat way too much. So you didn't say torres and berberov. That would have been plain wrong.
Click to expand...

It's good enough to put him in the top 5 strikers alone.
 
Ole'sbodyguard said:
Sherringham ain't a good comparison to use in this argument Brwned. His first season was actually decent and was cited as a big reason Cole had a fantastic start to the season, albeit he lost form towards the last three months of the season. It was better than the next two years when he was a sub for the most parts and made far less important by the form of Yorke and Cole.

His goals in the last two games in 99 where obviously essential but he hardly featured that season due to injury. Alot is made of the options from the bench of 99 but Ole was the super sub who consistently delivered the goods, Teddy is remembered because of the last two games of the season.

Sherringham's first season often gets criticised but it is more down to the fact that 97/98 turned into a dissapointing season and his form dropped along with Cole's in the run which made us badly exposed upfront. Overall his season was decent and he turned in some good performance in big games(Juve, Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea, etc) and his partnership with Cole was highly effective first half of the season. He was being praised as getting the best out of Cole in a way Cantona could not do at the time. By the start of December Cole had gone on a streak along the lines of 18 goals in 18 games.

He did have a very good last season with United and won the player of the year award in 00/01 but that was in fourth and final season for United. I'd have Sherringham's first season with United as his second best, but he was playing in a side without Keane, Yorke and Stam which made all the difference to the team's overall success.
Click to expand...

You have an excellent memory Ole.

Do you think there would be a good comparison to Berbatov then?

Don't say Veron.
 
Ekeke said:
I bet 3 seasons of Eto'o at the club and he'll have cost more than Villa.

I'm pretty sure Villa wont be asking for £11 million a season. I dont even want to know about the goal bonus he wants on top of it.
Click to expand...

So you gather we wouldn't be paying Villa exorbitant wages were he to come here over Barca or Madrid? Bollocks.
 
JCurr said:
So you gather we wouldn't be paying Villa exorbitant wages were he to come here over Barca or Madrid? Bollocks.
Click to expand...

A couple of million a season. Eto'o s fee would take over his pretty fast I'd imagine. If Villa wanted lots of money he'd have signed for Manchester City or Chelsea by now, or at the very least he'd have pushed through a move to Barcelona or Real Madrid as soon as the window opened. In fact he'd have gone last summer or this jan, when he was playing without being paid for two and a half months
 
Ekeke said:
A couple of million a season. Eto'o s fee would take over his pretty fast I'd imagine. If Villa wanted lots of money he'd have signed for Manchester City or Chelsea by now, or at the very least he'd have pushed through a move to Barcelona or Real Madrid as soon as the window opened. In fact he'd have gone last summer or this jan, when he was playing without being paid for two and a half months
Click to expand...

Fanboi mania, you're quite taken with him
 
Brwned said:
You have an excellent memory Ole.

Do you think there would be a good comparison to Berbatov then?

Don't say Veron.
Click to expand...

From United, Fergie's big name signings have always been a mixed bag. Veron is the only one who overall was not worth the money we spent in the end but there are a couple who had average to decent starts and went on to be huge players. There are those like Yorke, Stam(slow first few months but exceptional after that) and Ruud who hit the ground running and set far higher standards than expected in their debut seasons but it is not the norm by any means.

If I was going pick out three players who had average to decent starts who then went onto to huge things I'd pick Keane, Cole and Rio, funnily enough all record buys like Berbatov. Not many people admit this now but Keane's first two seasons at United were not as impressive as is made out. Sure there was obvious potential there but he was the junior partner in the Ince/Keane partnership in 93/94 and far the less important out of the two. In 94/95 he was often injured and played as an emergency right back often and his temperament caused him problems. The day he got sent off against Palace for stamping on Southgate on top of all the other problems we had there were plenty predicting we would cut our losses in the summer. It was not until Ince was sold that Keane went onto to have his first monster season and then he just got better and better and progressively more important.

Cole took even longer to settle at United. Cole had a good start in 94/95 and then had two years where he could not hit it off with Cantona and was almost sold off as part of the Shearer bid. He improved in 97/98 and like I mentioned above had a period of 18 goals in 18 games but again lost form towards the end of the season and plenty wanted United to sign Salas or Kluivert instead of him, particilarly as there were question marks over his bottle in big games(such as the West Ham end of season game and the Dortmund semi final) and whether he was good enough for a club looking to win the Champions League. Cole did not truly prove his worth until the treble season and that was 3 and half year after we signed him. He was younger than Berbatov mind you but SAF made a very bold decision by sticking by him during those early years, we could easily have cut our losses.

Then there is Rio who had a decent first season but a few years of being inconsistent until he nailed the consistent form we now expect today.

There are other examples of players from other clubs such as Bergkamp and Pires as well but the United ones are perhaps more relevant as they were domestic to domestic club signings.
 
JCurr said:
Fanboi mania, you're quite taken with him
Click to expand...

Nah. Just gets annoying sometimes when some people dont know as much about him as I do.

Its perfectly natural of course - you and most people clearly arent following the players career, why would you do the research?

But still. Sometimes people accidently make it sound like they have absolute unfallable information on a player when they clearly dont.

I dont know everything about him and his situation either. But clearly I know quite a bit more than most :angel: and yeah he's clearly not a player who is going to take the piss with his wage demands. Unlike Eto'o who, if he leaves Barcelona this season, its purely because he's being absolutely ridiculous with his pay demands.
 
Ole'sbodyguard said:
From United, Fergie's big name signings have always been a mixed bag. Veron is the only one who overall was not worth the money we spent in the end but there are a couple who had average to decent starts and went on to be huge players. There are those like Yorke and Ruud who hit the ground running and set far higher standards than expected in their debut seasons but it is not the norm by any means.

If I was going pick out three players who had average to decent starts who then went onto to huge things I'd pick Keane, Cole and Rio, funnily enough all record buys like Berbatov. Not many people admit this now but Keane's first two seasons at United were not as impressive as is made out. Sure there was obvious potential there but he was the junior partner in the Ince/Keane partnership in 93/94 and far the less important out of the two. In 94/95 he was often injured and played as an emergency right back often and his temperament caused him problems. The day he got sent off against Palace for stamping on Southgate on top of all the other problems we had there were plenty predicting we would cut our losses in the summer. It was not until Ince was sold that Keane went onto to have his first monster season and then he just got better and better and progressively more important.

Cole took even longer to settle at United. Cole had a good start in 94/95 and then had two years where he could not hit it off with Cantona and was almost sold off as part of the Shearer bid. He improved in 97/98 and like I mentioned above had a period of 18 goals in 18 games but again lost form towards the end of the season and plenty wanted United to sign Salas or Kluivert instead of him, particilarly as there were question marks over his bottle in big games(such as the West Ham end of season game and the Dortmund semi final). Cole did not truly prove his worth until the treble season and that was 3 and half year after we signed him. He was younger than Berbatov mind you but SAF made a very bold decision by sticking by him during those early years, we could easily have cut our losses.

Then there is Rio who had a decent first season but a few years of being inconsistent until he nailed the consistent form we now expect today.

There are other examples of players from other clubs such as Bergkamp and Pires as well but the United ones are perhaps more relevant as they were domestic to domestic club signings.
Click to expand...

Interesting, I didn't know any of that!

Cheers for the information Ole, you're the best poster on here when it comes to anything pre-treble, by a distance.
 
Ekeke said:
Nah. Just gets annoying sometimes when some people dont know as much about him as I do.

Its perfectly natural of course - you and most people clearly arent following the players career, why would you do the research?

But still. Sometimes people accidently make it sound like they have absolute unfallable information on a player when they clearly dont.

I dont know everything about him and his situation either. But clearly I know quite a bit more than most :angel: and yeah he's clearly not a player who is going to take the piss with his wage demands. Unlike Eto'o who, if he leaves Barcelona this season, its purely because he's being absolutely ridiculous with his pay demands.
Click to expand...

:lol: Everything you said about Villa you could've just as well applied to Eto'o who was being actively shopped for feck's sake. Muppet.
 
JCurr said:
:lol: Everything you said about Villa you could've just as well applied to Eto'o who was being actively shopped for feck's sake. Muppet.
Click to expand...

Not so.

People from Barcelona have talked about Eto'o being "strange", and have claimed he's the best striker in the world but he's being unreasonable. £11 million is speculation but clearly you dont let the world's best striker go or not try and tie him to a new contract with a year to go on his current deal if he's playing nicely.

Yeah, break out the insults when you have no facts to rely on. I know the drill.
 
Ekeke said:
Not so.

People from Barcelona have talked about Eto'o being "strange", and have claimed he's the best striker in the world but he's being unreasonable. £11 million is speculation but clearly you dont let the world's best striker go or not try and tie him to a new contract with a year to go on his current deal if he's playing nicely.

Yeah, break out the insults when you have no facts to rely on. I know the drill.
Click to expand...

Oh, the irony.
 
Villa is a top quality player but I don't think there is any hope of us signing him. The Rooney Villa partnership looks a fantastic one on paper. Then again, Villa's style may not suit the PL.
 
Spoony! said:
You've ruined this forum. There's nothing brilliant about that.

Can you just stop posting?
Click to expand...

I wonder if even 1000 of your posts were from talking about football instead of insulting people.

Regardless, none that I've seen have shown even a misguided but fairly well informed opinion of anything football related. Are you able to explain the offside rule without googling it?

See, you're going to continue to bait me but I wont start insulting you. Refusing to play your game will annoy you more.

Now, you dont rate David Villa. Fair enough. Noted. Lets get things back on topic though.
 
I dont think Fergie has any interest in Villa and his agent is just making up these stories to squeeze more bread out of Perez.
Also I would be surprised Gill and the boys upstairs at United are putting out lots of stories about us buying players we are not interested in to distract other clubs from knowing our real targets even though its easy enough to guess who they are!!
 
My inner transfer muppet says I won't want us to get Villa because it obviously would mean we won't sign Benzema. But hey, Villa wouldn't be too bad either :lol:
 
Id rather see us spend 50m on Benzema then 45m on Villa.
 
If you leave aside the last season when Berbatov didn't play as a genuine striker, Villa and Berbatov scored about the same amount of league goals in the previous 5 seasons, Villa had about 90 goals and Berbatov 85 goals.

5 goals difference over 5 seasons (2003-2008), that's it.

If you play Berbatov as a striker and provide him with a good service, he will score enough goals, more than he did at Spurs where he had some good team-mates such as Lennon and Keane but generally the service wasn't quality and he had to drop deeper in order to create opportunities for the team.
 
I've just read that Madrid sporting director Jorge Valdano talked in interview with Radio Marca about Villa and he probably wants to play in Madrid. There were negotiations during last week, but someone offered more money than Real. They don't know which team did it, but Valdano thinks it may be Barcelona offering €40m with Bojan & Cáceres going on loan. Valdano also says that it's worth to accept and he won't be surprised if Valencia agree.

Asked about his Plan B if they won't sign Villa, he said they have. Forlan or Ibrahimovic? One of them is wanted by us. We'll work on it this week.
 
Real are being priced out on Villa.

I think we should offer £70m for Silva and Villa.
 
Great player, but could be very expensive. I think I would take Villa over Eto'o, but I am sure both would do good.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.