So you don't see much difference between them defensively?
Darron Gibson - is he good enough for Everton?
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Their roles are different .. therefore Gibson won't get in the positions Carrick will....and vise versa - though that wasn't always the case. I believe it more a limitation of Carrick then him being a defensive genius. Obviously we ask it of him, but I'm not sure we bought him for that role. At the end of the day, our defensive record without Carrick, isn't so bad...
He was very effective last night. Always looks so much more comfortable playing as a forward thinker in a midfield three.
I think that's his biggest problem at United. Not so much a lack of talent, as the fact the only position he's in any way suited to, doesn't actually exist in a typical United eleven.
He needs to prove himself more useful than a 20+ goal a season forward to have any hope of playing regularly, and I don't even think someone like Sjneider would be able to do that convincingly.
I think that's his biggest problem at United. Not so much a lack of talent, as the fact the only position he's in any way suited to, doesn't actually exist in a typical United eleven.
He needs to prove himself more useful than a 20+ goal a season forward to have any hope of playing regularly, and I don't even think someone like Sjneider would be able to do that convincingly.
I'm not sure what you're saying...
If Gibson was played in Carrick's role do you think he'd provide as much defensively? Or do you think the reason he's not played there is because he's not good enough defensively, and Carrick is?
If Gibson was played in Carrick's role do you think he'd provide as much defensively? Or do you think the reason he's not played there is because he's not good enough defensively, and Carrick is?
So you don't see much difference between them defensively?
I said their roles are slightly different and therefore there will be a difference in their defensive performances. However in general, there is not much difference. Neither are quick. Both can pass the ball long and short. Both are questionable under pressure. Both can't dictate games. Gibsons has a better shot. Both are decent tacklers. Carrick gets more blocks in due to his position/ing.
Anybody else get nervous when he was hugging Anderson from behind? Those eyes are evil I tell you!
how do people still not get the fact we need players of his ilk in our squad. Players that will never will be required to play every game or even week in week out. Squads arent built on a foundation of world class players and never will be.
This is very true.
Squads arent built on a foundation of world class players and never will be.
As Rio says "We're a squad, not a team"
(Thought it was the same thing lol)
Gibson's pass to Valencia > Iniesta's ball to Pedro
Indeed. Theres only a few 1st choice players in our squad (I count 4), the rest are very much squad players. United is all about squad rotation now and Gibson plays his part.
Just goes to show how out of touch people are
Just goes to show how out of touch people are
That brilliant pass from him last night v Schalke.
Another great pass from Gibson again to Valencia against The Airtricity select in pre-season.
The lad has great vision & is well able to pass the ball, no doubt about it.
Another great pass from Gibson again to Valencia against The Airtricity select in pre-season.
The lad has great vision & is well able to pass the ball, no doubt about it.
So, no-one going to admit they had him penned down as a one-dimensional player who could only shoot and he's beginning to prove you wrong?
Over the course of this season, there's been a lot of people claiming he doesn't even have a decent shot.
I'll admit that I never really believed that he was going to a 1st teamer here. I'll still take some convincing that i'm wrong. However i've also defended him many times.
Brwned, look at the MOTM thread and see how many dipsticks chose to leave him out of the top 3 entirely. These are people who watch games with preconceived ideas and refuse to believe their own eyes. Crazy stuff. Pretty easily our best player with Valencia close behind.
Brwned, look at the MOTM thread and see how many dipsticks chose to leave him out of the top 3 entirely. These are people who watch games with preconceived ideas and refuse to believe their own eyes. Crazy stuff. Pretty easily our best player with Valencia close behind.
Good on Gibson.
I hope those wankers who gave him stick on twitter are eating humble pie now.
I hope those wankers who gave him stick on twitter are eating humble pie now.
He has a decent shot but it's not great like a lot of people make it out on here to be.
Thought Gibson was excellent last night, the pass for Valencia's goal was beautiful. Still won't make it though.
good spot. Unfortunetly opinions are like arseholes everyone has one!He may or may not make it at United. Probably won't.
He'll always have a cracking shot though. As well as an excellent range of passing, which is something he is only very recently getting credit for.
Just a pity the rest of his game needs a lot of work.
Credit where it'd due, though. He played very well last night and really got stuck in, physically, when Shalke started trying to rough us up. Played like he had a point to prove and proved it IMO.
He'll always have a cracking shot though. As well as an excellent range of passing, which is something he is only very recently getting credit for.
Just a pity the rest of his game needs a lot of work.
Credit where it'd due, though. He played very well last night and really got stuck in, physically, when Shalke started trying to rough us up. Played like he had a point to prove and proved it IMO.
Agree with you that he played well last night. Good to see him working a lot harder than he used to.
He's always been a fantastic striker of the football, his work rate and commitment to development have been his downfall. IMO
I hope this is a kickstart to his career and a start to gaining the fan's trust, because he is a talented footballer.
At 23 its about time he's started showing what he can do for the first team.
Hmmm.....great game or good game?
Looking like you could very easily lose this bet then, if he's not sold this summer then that's pretty much it. Following your 'Welbeck's more Championship level than Premiership level' it seems your ability to spot talent in a young player's not quite as good as you think, and a bit of patience can go a long way.
I feel like this has been mentioned before...
Sir Alex is one of the biggest backers of his striking and ability to get goals, more so than most of his backers on here I'd have thought. His striking's been a bit off this season (won't be surprised to see him get another before the end of the season) but up until then it was very promising, and he's obviously been told to focus more on his passing this season.
Stats from November:
Shots to goals ratio
Gibson's scored 9 in 78 since his debut, or 1 in 8.6.
Ronaldo's scored 150 in 1341 over the same time period, or 1 in 8.94.
Or if you take it from Gibson's breakthrough season (08/09) it's 8.6 and 9.1 respectively. Lampard's record is 8.8 over the same period, FWIW.
Shots accuracy
31 in 78 , or 1 in every 2.52, for Gibson.
530 in 1341, or 1 in every 2.53 for Ronaldo.
As for the quality of striking, come on, he's had some really spectacular strikes. More so than many strikers will have done at his age, never mind midfielders.
As Ive said before he is not as bad as some people WANT to believe. Its increasingly obvious that SOME will never give him full credit. They started out believing he was awful and now increaingly they are a minority who merely support each other.
And as Ive said before Gibson is not as good as I and most of us WANT him to be.
For some the glass is half empty. For some half full.
But he looks increasingly like a decent squad player and the fact that his detractors are so grudging is the reason many REAL FANS will say....come on play fair with the lad.
Frankly if he plays against Chelsea, Blackburn and Blackpool and is not brilliant in all three, there is a MINORITY who will look for this thread to say "I told you so". And theyd love it.
Last night Darron Gibson was Man of the Match for a lot of people. Not necessarily all and thats fair enough.
And certainly in our best three and it would be unreasonable to leave him out of that.
And as Ive said before Gibson is not as good as I and most of us WANT him to be.
For some the glass is half empty. For some half full.
But he looks increasingly like a decent squad player and the fact that his detractors are so grudging is the reason many REAL FANS will say....come on play fair with the lad.
Frankly if he plays against Chelsea, Blackburn and Blackpool and is not brilliant in all three, there is a MINORITY who will look for this thread to say "I told you so". And theyd love it.
Last night Darron Gibson was Man of the Match for a lot of people. Not necessarily all and thats fair enough.
And certainly in our best three and it would be unreasonable to leave him out of that.
Credit where due - very good game last night. Got up from a fairly tasty looking kick in the ribs to win us the tie with some clever passing and drive from the middle.
Hopefully he goes on to a great career at United. If nothing else, I think he's probably won himself another contract with his performances this season. Still doesn't mean he'll properly make it, though
Hopefully he goes on to a great career at United. If nothing else, I think he's probably won himself another contract with his performances this season. Still doesn't mean he'll properly make it, though
Obviously SAF sees a hell of a lot more of him than we do, and we all know one of his biggest factors in choosing players for any game is trust, if he felt like he couldn't trust Gibson then he wouldn't play him, end of story. He certainly doesn't make it onto my favourite player list, but Fergie sees something in him or he wouldn't keep playing him and that's good enough for me
He is good enough to be part of the squad but I can't see him ever being a first teamer - it is up to him if he is satisfied to spend most of his career on the bench.
If he keeps performing like he did last night then I will happily admit being wrong about him.
Would also be great for my fantasy draft
That's fair!
But I have to admit that he has progress a lot in his last two games. Good for his self confidence.
I think he is a really normal one, but this club has the ability to transform a normal one in a good/excellent one, it's magic.
We have won a Champions League with Blomqvist, we can win a Champions League with Gibson...
We have won a Champions League with Blomqvist, we can win a Champions League with Gibson...
Yeah, he's got an absolute peach of a strike on him. Different class. Amazes me that there was people on here trying to claim he doesn't after, shock horror, miscuing a few.
I don't think anyone can really question his shooting, or even that he's a a relatively decent passer of the ball. It's the other areas of midfield play he falls down on, IMO. Movement, awareness or space and runners, reading the game etc. The real tests lie ahead for him, not in a game like yesterday where the other side have almost nothing to offer.
Good work as always Brwned. Where are those shooting stats from?
I'm with you on the quality of his passing too. Interviews with United players would frequently pick him out as one of the best passers in training, I remember one as well where three players were asked who was best at 'hit the crossbar' competitions and all three mentioned Gibbo alongside Scholesy.
His pass to Aiden McGeady who was then fouled for a penalty when Ireland drew 1-1 away to Slovakia earlier in this Euro campaign was absolutely stunning, can't find a video of it though.
What he needs to work on, and what he is gradually getting better at, is getting more involved, and his defensive work. Couple of blinding tackles last nigh, mind.
Technically, he is a good striker and passer of the ball.
The concern with Gibson is what he does off the ball. It has not been good enough for the majority of his United career. He is tactically naïve when we do not have the ball, and in a two-man midfield, he struggles frequently.
Yesterday he was very impressive, though, and I am not against having him in the squad as backup.
The concern with Gibson is what he does off the ball. It has not been good enough for the majority of his United career. He is tactically naïve when we do not have the ball, and in a two-man midfield, he struggles frequently.
Yesterday he was very impressive, though, and I am not against having him in the squad as backup.
Just from ESPN, couldn't be arsed adding it up again so I just went back to one of my old posts. Both ratios will look worse after this season though.
I think we're all agreed that his main failings are mental rather than technical - whether due to lack of tactical understanding, poor speed of thought (although the Valencia pass was very promising in that respect) or lack of purpose/drive. They're not exactly easy attributes to improve upon but drive aside they are linked to experience and maturity, which is good.
When we preach patience we get told of how everyone can't be a Fletcher. Some folks just never learn....
thought he has put in some excellent performances this season.
I see him in the squad again next season and if he keeps improving, who knows...
I see him in the squad again next season and if he keeps improving, who knows...
Is there anything sweeter than seeing a whipping-boy redeem himself?
Impressed with his response to the press and his treatment by his own fans, he probably needs a lot more games to be consistent though.
If we buy an established midfielder he should be considered for a loan. I'd rather not we got rid, he's very reminiscent of Lampard in his early days.
Impressed with his response to the press and his treatment by his own fans, he probably needs a lot more games to be consistent though.
If we buy an established midfielder he should be considered for a loan. I'd rather not we got rid, he's very reminiscent of Lampard in his early days.
I said the same thing in an earlier post mate. It really is disgusting. How one cannot see that he was one of our top 3 performers vs Schalke is beyond me, preconceived ideas or not.
I dislike this idea that a player is 'redeemed' in the basis of one performance as much as I hate it when a player is condemned off the back of not much more.
Gibson has been harshly treated by a section of fans who have simply been, for lack of a better word, disrespectful. A great performance or a shit performance vs Schalke doesn't change that.
His passing looked very good on Wednesday though and perhaps we are now seeing signs as to why Sir Alex persists with bringing him in every so often.
Gibson has been harshly treated by a section of fans who have simply been, for lack of a better word, disrespectful. A great performance or a shit performance vs Schalke doesn't change that.
His passing looked very good on Wednesday though and perhaps we are now seeing signs as to why Sir Alex persists with bringing him in every so often.
I don't like the assumption that this was his only good performance of the season. He's actually had more good than bad performances this season.
He's had a few solid displays this season, including helping to knock Arsenal out of the FA Cup and our best away performance all season - the 4-2 trouncing of West Ham. Even in that infamous Crawley game he was the only United player who showed some ability, with some penetrative passing early on.
Still big doubts about his long-term United future but he's definitely got more criticism than he's deserved for his overall contribution to our season.
Indeed but I don't see how if people didn't rate him on Tuesday that he's suddenly disproved the doubters on the Wednesday.
He gets far too much stick than is fair or palatable but I think we can read too much into just one game. I agree with you that he has had a couple of good performances this season. I think when he does under-perform, the hysterical reaction to it, makes him seem like a worse asset than he actually is.