He was effectively a player unwanted by one of the richest teams in the land who made it clear they were desperate to offload some players and even more desperate to sign players. Of course we were gonna have to buy high and sell low. That said, I think 16m for Welbeck is decent business.
Danny Welbeck | Arsenal player
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He was effectively a player unwanted by one of the richest teams in the land who made it clear they were desperate to offload some players and even more desperate to sign players. Of course we were gonna have to buy high and sell low. That said, I think 16m for Welbeck is decent business.
Agreed.
Your kidding right ? Football clubs are like a cattle market in the youth systems, young players nurtured and those not making the grade are moved on hopefully for a decent return on the investment. You will see failed products of Fergusons youth policy dotted all over the Premier league it's not a new thing.
Think the sentimentality comes from Wellbeck's age and him breaking the first team squad, but he's not good enough to lead the line at the club so we've sold him on for a good return, the only difference between Wellbeck and say Phil Bardsley is that is was more obvious that one wasn't going to make it from an earlier age.
Perhaps in the short time he's been there Van Gaal saw what we have all seen for so long - that Welbeck isn't a natural finisher, something that Falcao clearly is, and something that it looks like Wilson might well be. Surplus to requirements I am afraid.
I was out late with the other half last night and only just found out this was actually a thing.
Speechless, hard to put in to words how disappointed I am. He'll be immense for them now, just you mark my words.
Speechless, hard to put in to words how disappointed I am. He'll be immense for them now, just you mark my words.
So you're happy he's gone because you believe it will give Adnan and Wilson game time? Adnan was on a whole different trajectory as he's not a striker, so even though Welbeck has been played on the wings a run in his natural position wouldn't have impeded Januzaj. You admit that you haven't seen much of Wilson, but on word of mouth you'd see fit to end a player's career at a club for his benefit? On word of mouth you deduce that Wilson must have a higher ceiling as well. Im sorry but your post is full of holes. I doubt Wilson will be given a chance here either, unless he turns out to be an elite player and grabs every chance he gets. United always buy experienced forwards and ship off their home grown strikers regardless of potential. Welbeck was the first striker from the ranks to break the first team since Norman Whiteside and Mark Hughes...thats damn near 30 years!
It hurts me to see him go, but it was the right move for all parties it seems. Personally I would love to have seen him stay, and if he got more game time I think he could have gone on to be one of our best players.
I really hope he does well at Arsenal. It will hurt like hell to see him turn into the player I think he can be at Arsenal, and all of us being sick that he's not ours anymore. But he deserves it so best of luck to him.
I really hope he does well at Arsenal. It will hurt like hell to see him turn into the player I think he can be at Arsenal, and all of us being sick that he's not ours anymore. But he deserves it so best of luck to him.
Can't argue with that. Not necesarily a positive, but he's got balls OK.
Danny deserves to be first choice at a proper club. Sure it's frustrating he didn't make it here, but getting passed RVP, Rooney and Falcao is just going to be too difficult.
He need's to be playing week in week out, and at Arsenal he will get that. I have no doubt's he will become a 20 goal a season striker with great link up play, but he needed to move on to find that.
Let's just hope Danny finds it in his heart to go easy on us!
He need's to be playing week in week out, and at Arsenal he will get that. I have no doubt's he will become a 20 goal a season striker with great link up play, but he needed to move on to find that.
Let's just hope Danny finds it in his heart to go easy on us!
Another thing i would say to make you feel better, Arsenal have far too many technically sound players and i have no doubt he will fit in perfectly there, but where they lack is they need somebody to put the ball in the net and looking at their side Ozil, Carzola, Welbeck, Flamini, Arteta, OX, Wilshere etc all of them are brilliant technically but they can't put the ball in the back of the net, they have Ramsey and Sanchez who are goal scorers and with the Signing of Welbeck they still haven't addressed the issue they have had of putting the ball in the net.
Ppl will be in a bit of shock if they think Januzaj and especially Wilson will get more opportunities now. When? And instead of who? Don't forget that most of the time probably two out of RvP/Falcao/Rooney/Mata/Di Maria will be on the bench, once Carrick returns one of him/Blind/Herrera probably too. So they will be the first options to come in more often than not. We'll only have a game per week most of the time, at other times even one in two weeks. And neither Januzaj nor Wilson will develop by just coming on as a third sub in the 86th minute.
Also regarding all this Januzaj love-in as good as he is: I am sure if Welbeck was our only striker and the other striking options were as bad as Young/Valencia are, but instead we had Hazard, David Silva and Sanchez for the wings, then Welbeck would be much more valued than Januzaj.
So sometimes someone getting or not getting chances has more to do with luck and competition than with one's own shortcomings.
As it stands Januzaj is lucky that we have no other quality wingers, but despite of this he is still not getting enough game time. And similar to Welbeck he won't be a starter at other top clubs either. So within 1-2 years he will be in exactly the same position Welbeck has been in for 2 years now. We'll see what ppl will say then about him being fine with sub appearances or leaving for a competitor (depending on what decision he/the club makes).
Also regarding all this Januzaj love-in as good as he is: I am sure if Welbeck was our only striker and the other striking options were as bad as Young/Valencia are, but instead we had Hazard, David Silva and Sanchez for the wings, then Welbeck would be much more valued than Januzaj.
So sometimes someone getting or not getting chances has more to do with luck and competition than with one's own shortcomings.
As it stands Januzaj is lucky that we have no other quality wingers, but despite of this he is still not getting enough game time. And similar to Welbeck he won't be a starter at other top clubs either. So within 1-2 years he will be in exactly the same position Welbeck has been in for 2 years now. We'll see what ppl will say then about him being fine with sub appearances or leaving for a competitor (depending on what decision he/the club makes).
I think, essentially, I want him to be a massive success, but also completely let down by all his team mates, resulting in a series of 5th place finishes.
I don't know about that. When played centrally his strike rate has recently been very good. Also at an age where his finishing might improve dramatically in the coming years. When Rooney was 23 we were constantly complaining about how bad he was on one v ones.
T'is with a heavy heart that I move this to the footie forum. God speed, Danny.
He's actually played a fair bit as a striker and Van Gaal seems to see him as one. Not as though we'll be playing with conventional wingers any time soon.
I honestly don't think he seems him as a striker. Van Gaal himself said he saw Zaha as a striker, not a winger, he made no mention of Januzaj in that position. He's played him as a RWB, a CM and a wide player in 4-3-3 when we changed formation against Swansea
Very good post
I actually think with us playing 3-5-2 or if we adopt to 4-3-3, Adnan will be playing as a Striker in 3-5-2 not in a midfield or Wingbacks, while in a 4-3-3 he would be playing on the left of the three which Welbeck would have occupied, so they would have been playing in the same position. While as i have said about Wilson, i have heard from people he's a great finisher, great technically and better than Hernandez , and as i have said i rate Welbeck very highly, and i am just as sad as you are but i am just trying to put some positive spin to it, and i believe LVG might have made that decision thinking about this.
I think it's easier to say stuff like that in hindsight really. If last season Moyes got rid of Rooney to satisfy the likes of Welbeck I'd imagine most people would be pretty pissed off. Whilst I like Welbeck as a player he's nowhere near the quality of Rooney, Falcao and RVP so isn't really going to get a look in in his favoured position. To me it seems like he knew that and wanted to leave...from what you could gather last night the idea of living in London appeals to him as well. It's a good move for all involved probably. Welbeck benefits as he finally gets a chance to prove himself, Arsenal improve their strikeforce and whilst we don't benefit hugely it does give us 1 less headache to worry about and I don't really think we will miss him (although it does benefit a rival club so could come back to bite us on the arse.)
Welbeck is at a stage where he can't play 4th choice and it's fair enough, Wilson is probably happy to do that role and could do it well. It's never good to see youth players go but I don't think the club could stand in his way any longer, he was never going to play his preferred role here with the strikers we have.
Really struggling to cope with this transfer. As much stick as Welbeck has received over the years, he was United through and though. He would always do his all to help the team out and it clearly meant so much to him. So gutted he's gone to Arsenal but completely understandable.
Super Dan will get a great reception when he comes to OT.
Super Dan will get a great reception when he comes to OT.
Gutted about Welbeck leaving, especially permanently and another example of Utd selling poorly. He was under valued (in this market, English player and striker with champs league experience) and sold to a rival, a direct rival that require a striker urgently and we just gave them what they needed. Think he'll go on to be a top success at Arsenal and be first choice by end of the season.
Its good for him and pleased for him, but at tricky place now as I clearly don't want him to do well to our detriment which it would be.
Think this was a mistake, even if we sold to Spurs it would have been better. Surprised we didnt loan him to someone for a year. His price for me would never be lower than 16mil with his experience even if he had a bad year on loan. If he had a brilliant year with RVP ageing potentially he could have then come back and been first choice for us. I'd have rather sold Hernandez and loaned Welbeck. Shame, he offered us something different.
Clearly I'm delighted about Falcao and if it was a choice him or Danny then there's an obvious winner. But never like letting home grown talent go especially when he's been in or around the first team for a good few years now and played well in some big games for us.
Its good for him and pleased for him, but at tricky place now as I clearly don't want him to do well to our detriment which it would be.
Think this was a mistake, even if we sold to Spurs it would have been better. Surprised we didnt loan him to someone for a year. His price for me would never be lower than 16mil with his experience even if he had a bad year on loan. If he had a brilliant year with RVP ageing potentially he could have then come back and been first choice for us. I'd have rather sold Hernandez and loaned Welbeck. Shame, he offered us something different.
Clearly I'm delighted about Falcao and if it was a choice him or Danny then there's an obvious winner. But never like letting home grown talent go especially when he's been in or around the first team for a good few years now and played well in some big games for us.
Gutted about Welbeck leaving, especially permanently and another example of Utd selling poorly. He was under valued (in this market, English player and striker with champs league experience) and sold to a rival, a direct rival that require a striker urgently and we just gave them what they needed. Think he'll go on to be a top success at Arsenal and be first choice by end of the season.
Its good for him and pleased for him, but at tricky place now as I clearly don't want him to do well to our detriment which it would be.
Think this was a mistake, even if we sold to Spurs it would have been better. Surprised we didnt loan him to someone for a year. His price for me would never be lower than 16mil with his experience even if he had a bad year on loan. If he had a brilliant year with RVP ageing potentially he could have then come back and been first choice for us. I'd have rather sold Hernandez and loaned Welbeck. Shame, he offered us something different.
Clearly I'm delighted about Falcao and if it was a choice him or Danny then there's an obvious winner. But never like letting home grown talent go especially when he's been in or around the first team for a good few years now and played well in some big games for us.
Its good for him and pleased for him, but at tricky place now as I clearly don't want him to do well to our detriment which it would be.
Think this was a mistake, even if we sold to Spurs it would have been better. Surprised we didnt loan him to someone for a year. His price for me would never be lower than 16mil with his experience even if he had a bad year on loan. If he had a brilliant year with RVP ageing potentially he could have then come back and been first choice for us. I'd have rather sold Hernandez and loaned Welbeck. Shame, he offered us something different.
Clearly I'm delighted about Falcao and if it was a choice him or Danny then there's an obvious winner. But never like letting home grown talent go especially when he's been in or around the first team for a good few years now and played well in some big games for us.
I'd have been delighted with our signings had we not sold Welbeck and signed Falcao. But, that's the situation we have now and we just have to live with it. Long term wise, we've only got Wilson to build on with, in terms of the striker position. Hopefully, once the ship is steadied and we regain our place back at the top of the pile, Van Gaal will be looking a little bit more long term.
Welbeck will do well for Arsenal. I've always thought he was a good match for them with the kind of football they play. He is a much better player than Sanogo, at least more experienced. An English striker in his mid twenties with experiences in title runs and knock out stages of the Champions League for 16m. Arsenal have got a great bargain here.
I'd have been delighted if we'd gotten rid of Rooney and build on Welbeck, but that's just me.
How's the weather up there, "Nathan?"
Welbeck will do well for Arsenal. I've always thought he was a good match for them with the kind of football they play. He is a much better player than Sanogo, at least more experienced. An English striker in his mid twenties with experiences in title runs and knock out stages of the Champions League for 16m. Arsenal have got a great bargain here.
I'd have been delighted if we'd gotten rid of Rooney and build on Welbeck, but that's just me.
How's the weather up there, "Nathan?"
I see what you're trying to do, but I think you should only comment on players' ceilings when you've actually seen them play for yourself. By many accounts on here Michael Keane was supposedly a much better defender than Tyler Blackett. After watching them play in pre-season and in the league its clear to see Blackett is the better player. We're going to stick with 3-5-2 until the players 'get it'. At least that's what LVG has promised. With our options in attack I don't see Januzaj getting much game time in this formation unless an injury occurs. If anything I could possibly see him get a little time in Mata's position as a sub most likely. Its not looking for great for the kid and he probably could've done with a loan move as well. Sterling is only 2 months older than him and getting game time and experience.
So what do i do about my United shirt with Welbeck on the back? What a waste of money!
Agree
Funnily Hernandez who has been far better for us than Welbeck and was instrumental in 2011 league win and reaching CL finals has left on the same day to Real Madrid and we didn't even receive a penny for it, yet people don't seem bothered. That makes me think most of the fuss is made because Welbeck was an Academy player who people had high hopes for because they badly wanted to have an Academy product turn world class.
I might have a different opinion from people who think Adnan and Wilson won't be getting any chances, but we have Rvp, Rooney and Falcao as the main strikers, and i read it here that Rvp might have a knee operation soon, which will only leave Falcao and Rooney as main strikers, with Mata in the hole behind strikers, the First subs for the match would have to be Wilson or Adnan. We don't have Zaha, Hernandez, Welebeck or Kagawa anymore which LVG opted for in Preseason as strikers or in the hole, he doesn't consider Valencia or Young to be strikers, and i am confident they wouldn't be playing there.
we have plenty of options in Midfield now with the addition of Blind, Carrick, Di Maria, Herrera, Cleverley, Anderson, Fletcher etc., But on the other hand we don't have much depth after these three strikers, In fact after Mata as i am considering Rooney will play as a striker, there is only Di Maria who can play AM, and Adnan is next after him.
we have plenty of options in Midfield now with the addition of Blind, Carrick, Di Maria, Herrera, Cleverley, Anderson, Fletcher etc., But on the other hand we don't have much depth after these three strikers, In fact after Mata as i am considering Rooney will play as a striker, there is only Di Maria who can play AM, and Adnan is next after him.
Gutted.
Great signing for Arsenal, I think he will do really well there.
Having said all that, he himself forced this move so I don't think the club can be blamed too much. It seems clear he didn't want a loan. Also can't be too hard on managers picking Rooney and RVP ahead of him at centre forward.
Weird move though; in some ways it seems like neither set of fans are that happy about it. But long term, Arsenal have themselves a top player at a bargain price.
Great signing for Arsenal, I think he will do really well there.
Having said all that, he himself forced this move so I don't think the club can be blamed too much. It seems clear he didn't want a loan. Also can't be too hard on managers picking Rooney and RVP ahead of him at centre forward.
Weird move though; in some ways it seems like neither set of fans are that happy about it. But long term, Arsenal have themselves a top player at a bargain price.
I dont think we will regret this. However Im not a 100% sure. It would have been wiser to loan him out for a year. We would get to see how he does with a long run as a striker. Arsenal were desperate and would probably have agreed to a loan.
Might as well cough up the only bit of "ITK" info I ever got, without revealing the source.
A little bird told me that Danny met with Van Gaal when he first took the reins and was told that he'd be "third choice", which he was ok with - considering the ages of Rooney and RvP.
A couple of weeks later he was informed that United were looking to move him on and had been touting him round mid-table clubs, as they didn't want to sell to a rival. Turns out "third choice" actually meant third behind Januzaj and Wilson as back up to RooVP.
From that point it escalated as Danny and his agent (understandably) pushed for the best move possible for his career. Which it looks as though they got in the end. Good news for Arsenal. Shite news for United.
That's not a suprise though is it? Almost every fan of every club would prefer a local lad who has been at the club since he was 8 to suceed over a multi million pound overseas signing.
Not happy about it but what can you do? Time to let it go... hopefully it won't come back to bite us in the arse.
Or perhaps they've just been watching Welbeck consistently out-perform Hernandez over the last two years?
True but from a pure football perspective Welbeck leaving isn't such a blow to us. He joins a long list of players who we wanted successful but ultimately couldn't cut it aside from being good squad players. Of course I'd have been happier with Welbeck staying because he's as good as you get in terms of squad players but he was probably not fine with playing second fiddle to Falcao, van Persie and Rooney and pretty clearly not good enough to start ahead of them.
Not fussed that much. I don't think he has the ruthless instinct in him to score enough even as a striker. Wish we sold him somewhere else though. I don't know of many other teams fans who rate Welbeck at all.
Outperform as in score 16 fewer goals in 2012/ 2013 ?
I don't think he outperformed Hernandez at all in 2012-13. Hernandez got 18 goals in 36 games that season, some of them very important to our title challenge. Welbeck had 2 goals in 40 games. I wouldn't say he outperformed him that season at all.
You're messing with me aren't you?
This doesn't sound very believable at all. Not one bit. Why would Welbeck be behind Januzaj who's not even a natural striker and Wilson who hasn't played a full competitive game for United? If true, which I doubt it is, its truly disgusting.This. Plus the thing is Welbeck had a higher potential ceiling and was one of the fan favorites.
It is tough to see him at your rivals now. I don't even know i want him to do well or not now.
I think we wanted a loan, but Welbeck pushed for a permanent transfer only for some reason.
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