I bet that's what the asylum warden said as he denied your release.
Danny Welbeck | 2011-14 Performances
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I bet that's what the asylum warden said as he denied your release.
He was dispossesed two fecking times, ONLY TWO TIMES, and yet he tried and had more dribbles than any of our players, was more involved than our any other attacking player, scored goal from only chance he had, had 3 dribbles and our whole team had 7 in total, and yet he was sloppy in possession, and was hesitant to drive with the ball forward. 
Any one got any stats for these claims that he gave the ball away and was sloppy in possession?
Really doesn't tally with how I remember his game, thought he was the exact opposite.
Really doesn't tally with how I remember his game, thought he was the exact opposite.
( I think Decotron's comment referred to the incorrect pronoun.)
He's very neat and tidy in possession so I strongly disagree with that. This season he hasn't even missed a lot of chances. His finishes has been fine so far it's more of his attacking positions at times.
He was neat in possession: 85% pass accuracy.
Welbeck's one of the few fecking players we have that can actually keep the ball under pressure, rather then shitting themselves and trying to get rid of it as quickly as possible.
Fellaini had an 87% possession rate, was he neat in possession? We were poor at keeping the ball today, and Welbeck was a part of that.
What? We're talking about completely different players. Some of Fellaini's passes that were successful were poor, due to him being technically average. Welbeck is very different, his passing was good today. I find it funny that were are even discussing passing stats in the first place. Welbeck was excellent defensively... Moyes played a low block today - not sure how much more Welbeck could have done...
Did Danny run towards the opponent's goal though?
He's a very 'safe pair of hands' (feet?) with the ball, but he was supposedly the left hand side of an ATTACKING three tonight. As far as I recall, he played exactly 0 penetrative passes, crossed the ball exactly 0 times and created precisely 0 chances for his teammates.
People have become so obsessed with possession and 'tidiness' they've forgotten the point of the damn sport. If one of your only 3 attackers is as negative as Welbeck was today, it basically renders your attack obsolete.
And I don't put that on Moyes, Danny HAS to start going towards goal. He consistently skinned their right sided midfielder - but that was on route back towards his own half, before playing it to Vidic.
He's a very 'safe pair of hands' (feet?) with the ball, but he was supposedly the left hand side of an ATTACKING three tonight. As far as I recall, he played exactly 0 penetrative passes, crossed the ball exactly 0 times and created precisely 0 chances for his teammates.
People have become so obsessed with possession and 'tidiness' they've forgotten the point of the damn sport. If one of your only 3 attackers is as negative as Welbeck was today, it basically renders your attack obsolete.
And I don't put that on Moyes, Danny HAS to start going towards goal. He consistently skinned their right sided midfielder - but that was on route back towards his own half, before playing it to Vidic.
Welbeck did start on the left, but his movement brought him to the centre. He was almost playing as an interior. He dropped into the centre to try and overload the midfield and give us an advantage. Even his goal was scored from a central position.
I don't know why he is being criticised. We set up a low block and made the space compact for Shaktar, forcing them to play on the wings, where Valencia, Cleverley, and Welbeck did a lot of a great defending... And the reason I said he was "tidy" in possession was because some say that he wasn't particularly good with his passing. You're expecting Welbeck to do something he doesn't do regularly on the wing: take on players and run. Yet he scores a crucial goal, and you've not credited him for that (?).
As a player who's not established himself as a key member of the first eleven yet, he's an easy target for the moaners (who I swear actually don't even watch the matches properly and just watch the ball all game- it would explain a lot)
I agree his goal came from a rare moment when he was in the box centrally, but I don't agree generally with that. He spent long periods of the match towards the touch line.
I'm sure he was given instructions on how important tracking back would be, and offering another body defensively, but he is still a striker. There were countless times when he'd shake a marker, look up the pitch and then just go backwards.
It's all the rage to criticise midfielders for constantly playing it safe and backwards, but if your two wingers are also doing the same - that's why we're creating nothing.
Danny is too scared of making mistakes imo. When you're one of only 3 attacking players on the pitch (and the other is Valencia) you have to be a risk taker, and you have to offer something going forwards.
Otherwise you get what we had tonight: 90 minutes and about two actual attempts at scoring a goal.
I'm not a moaner, he was fantastic defensively, but I thought he, along with the vast majority of our front six, was guilty of being sloppy in possession. It's not a particularly outlandish opinion considering our own manager claimed to be disappointed with how much we gave the ball away. Danny is normally fantastic in possession too, it's one of his greatest attributes.
How much is down to 'being sloppy' and how much is down to the fact that the opposition pressed quickly and were actually quite good? I can only remember Welbeck turning the ball over once or twice and a handful of passes that were picked off.. not exactly disastrous given what we were facing
It is extremely naive to think you can turn up at Donetsk play an expansive game, keep the ball and steam roll the opposition, which seems to be what some of our fans are demanding
It is extremely naive to think you can turn up at Donetsk play an expansive game, keep the ball and steam roll the opposition, which seems to be what some of our fans are demanding
Must admit that I thought by now that Welbeck's development would've taken a more sharp upwards trajectory. It all seems a bit safe at the moment instead of the sort of stuff I would've predicted from the brilliant looking youngster he was a few years back. That's not to say it's not still within him or that he absolutely should've taken those steps by now; I just rated him highly and thought we'd have seen a bit more of that by now. Definitely looked a more threatening player back then. Even when he was first introduced to the first team, I distinctly remember him languidly drifting through half the Spurs team on two separate occasions in the same game. Made it look easy!
*This was one of them, but the other was better.
He still sort of does stuff like that on occasions but it's within him to be more consistent.
*This was one of them, but the other was better.
He still sort of does stuff like that on occasions but it's within him to be more consistent.
Where have you got that from what I said? Jesus. I've said in another thread that Moyes was spot on tactically tonight. All I've said was that I wanted us to keep the ball better, something our manager also said, it's not asking for that much. Danny, amongst many others, was guilty of losing possession cheaply (10/55). You're right with your first point, it wasn't disastrous, and I never said it was. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I was imagining him giving the ball away more than usual, but I don't see why I would, I'm a massive Welbeck fan.
I'm still not convinced by him on the wing, he seems like a safe option there in that he won't do anything particularly stupid and will put in a good shift defensively but ultimately doesn't look convincing going forward and will often look clumsy while running with the ball. His crossing is also nowhere near the standard you'd expect from a United winger and creativity isn't something you'd put down as his strength either.
The end product isn't quite there but he's improving, it'd help if we could actually give him some time up front - then again he looks more like a support striker and we shouldn't really be playing with one as that'd mean going back to 442 which isn't the way. I'm sure he's going to be a useful player for us for years but I'm still not certain where exactly we should play him to get the best out of the player.
The end product isn't quite there but he's improving, it'd help if we could actually give him some time up front - then again he looks more like a support striker and we shouldn't really be playing with one as that'd mean going back to 442 which isn't the way. I'm sure he's going to be a useful player for us for years but I'm still not certain where exactly we should play him to get the best out of the player.
What crossing? He doesnt cross. And thats ok. He finds a pass and keeps the ball instead. What he does do is still score goals from on the wing now. And he works hard coming back. And he does have a couple of dribbles.
Thats more than enough to earn his place in the team
Thats more than enough to earn his place in the team
It's hardly like he's lighting up the scoring charts, or creating the sweet sum of f*ck all.
Tracking back and scoring every now and then should not get you into a front 3 for Manchester United. Despite the Ji Sung Park phenomenon.
He's scoring regularly from there.
Woodward didn't offer the minimum release I heard..
Tonight he was basically what we've seen from Kagawa plus defending, keeping the ball under pressure and goals. Yet everyone thinks Kagawa is a hero at the moment.
Two goals, one assist in five games.
Third in scoring on the team.
Yeah, he's pretty useless.
Third in scoring on the team.
Yeah, he's pretty useless.
Does anyone honestly think that about Kagawa? Or do they simply feel Kagawa should be given more playing time?
Thought he looked good when he came on vs. Sunderland.
I am beginning to fear that the lad may end up not fulfilling his potential by being consistently played out of position. Messrs Hodgson and Moyes need to understand that the lad is first and foremost a striker NOT a wide player or someone who can do a defensive job.
His ability on the ball and strength may end up costing him in the long run. Danny needs to be a bit more selfish and insist on playing upfront. But to do this, he also needs to demonstrate that he can hit the back of the net with some degree of regularity and improve his off the ball movement in the attacking third.
It will be a shame for such a technically sound striker to be deployed anywhere else than in an attacking role. Just watching him for England now it amazes me at how much better he is than someone like Sturridge who gets the nod to play upfront and is seemingly ahead of him in the pecking order for strikers. Danny boy, you need to put yourself first sometimes!
His ability on the ball and strength may end up costing him in the long run. Danny needs to be a bit more selfish and insist on playing upfront. But to do this, he also needs to demonstrate that he can hit the back of the net with some degree of regularity and improve his off the ball movement in the attacking third.
It will be a shame for such a technically sound striker to be deployed anywhere else than in an attacking role. Just watching him for England now it amazes me at how much better he is than someone like Sturridge who gets the nod to play upfront and is seemingly ahead of him in the pecking order for strikers. Danny boy, you need to put yourself first sometimes!
I agree it hampers his development, but what else would you do with him at the moment? Van Persie and Rooney are far better players centrally at the moment, while you'd argue that Hernandez's superior finishing would possibly get him the nod ahead of Welbeck in a central role at the moment. I hope he gets more time there, but I'm struggling to see where he'd get it at the moment.
Don't agree that he's better than Sturridge though. They're both close as overall footballers but I'd probably give Sturridge the nod, especially with his recent form, although I've had that debate enough before without getting anywhere so I'll leave that one there.
Would you rather he didn't play at all? I'd rather he get games out wide.
He might be a better 'all round' player than Sturridge, but he's not a better goal scorer at present, so it's quite right that Sturridge is playing upfront ahead of him. Welbeck is pretty much excellent at everything except finishing.
Making a massive effort to get into goalscoring positions with good runs into the box which is nice to see. He'll be fine, even playing wide, though he scored so often lately for a England that maybe he deserved a run in the centre forward spot. Still drifted centrally a lot though and had some lovely interchanges through the middle. He is able to run past people with the ball but I'm not sure we saw it enough. I love Welbeck. He has all the attributes to become a great player.
If Welbeck didn't play left wing, it'd be Young or Milner. feck that, keep Danny out wide.
This is not remotely true.
He's not good enough to play striker. Technically sound, fast...doesn't matter if you're bad at finishing, which he is. Sturridge deserves to play up front ahead of him because Sturridge is scoring goals for fun. Something that Welbeck has never been able to do.
You've responded to your first paragraph with this bit. I'm not sure we can call Welbeck "first and foremost, a striker" right now. His strengths seem to be mobility, energy, closing down and being able to carry the ball comfortably and link up well rather than the key elements regarding the striker position that are composure in the final third and finishing.
How much better h is than Sturridge? Really? Surely Sturridge is the better player right now.
Hodgson employs him as a wide striker and me thinks it gets the best out of him for England
RVP>Rooney>>>>>>>Hernandez>>>Welbeck
This isn't true at the moment. Since his transfer to Liverpool, Sturridge has been almost excellent and much better than Danny has ever been as a striker.
People always like to judge Danny as a striker inspite of him not playing there in 75% of the matches. I think he created almost three goals for England yesterday.
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