Danny Welbeck | 2011-14 Performances

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Giggsforever said:
That is one depressing list for England. It wil be a long time before England will have a chance at international tournaments.
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Don't see why it is a depressing list?

Jack Wilshere is already proven at the highest level, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Welbeck have also proven they can compete at the top level. Wilfried Zaha has just signed for the biggest club in the world, Raheem Sterling made a big impant for Liverpool earlier this season, Thomas Ince will get a transfer to a Premier League club in the summer after scoring 20 odd goals from the wing this season and Luke Shaw is a 17 year old full back who has already got Premier League experience under his belt.

That only disappointing thing there IMO is how similar so many of those players are.
 
JB7 said:
Don't see why it is a depressing list?

Jack Wilshere is already proven at the highest level, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Welbeck have also proven they can compete at the top level. Wilfried Zaha has just signed for the biggest club in the world, Raheem Sterling made a big impant for Liverpool earlier this season, Thomas Ince will get a transfer to a Premier League club in the summer after scoring 20 odd goals from the wing this season and Luke Shaw is a 17 year old full back who has already got Premier League experience under his belt.

That only disappointing thing there IMO is how similar so many of those players are.
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Not to mention the fact he hasn't included Jones, Smalling etc. Also Hart will be around for a long time.
 
JB7 said:
Don't see why it is a depressing list?

Jack Wilshere is already proven at the highest level, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Welbeck have also proven they can compete at the top level. Wilfried Zaha has just signed for the biggest club in the world, Raheem Sterling made a big impant for Liverpool earlier this season, Thomas Ince will get a transfer to a Premier League club in the summer after scoring 20 odd goals from the wing this season and Luke Shaw is a 17 year old full back who has already got Premier League experience under his belt.

That only disappointing thing there IMO is how similar so many of those players are.
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Yeah but look at their names. Jack Wilshere, Danny Welbeck, Luke Shaw; they're not BPITW names! Where's Jacques Wilshernikov, Danilo Welbecinho and Lucio Schäwle? Depressing times indeed.

Wilfried Zaha, on the other hand, I've very high hopes for.
 
An Irish Red said:
Wilshere Cleverley
Zaha Rooney Sterling
Welbeck​

That would be decent enough really.
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Decent enough to win nothing.

Wilshere is a top talent and can become the best midfielder in the world, if he stays clear of serious injuries. Luke Shaw can also be a fantastic player, but a bit young to judge.

Sterling, Chamberlain, Ince and Welbeck is talented, but none of them will be great players that will win you anything. If you look at the talent in Brazil and Spain and maybe even Belgium, France and Holland you know that this generation will be in the shadow of others.

I hope Zaha will be fantastic, but I have not seen enough of him to really pass judgment.
 
Wilshere won't be the best midfielder in the world. He's good and looks like he could be a complete midfielder one day but he's no THAT great. For example I really doubt he'll ever reach the same heights as someone like Schweinsteiger.

I said in the Summer that the current England side doesn't strike me as one with great potential and I stand by it. They'll be good but when you look at the sort of talent Germany and Spain have it really puts it in a different light.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
So Shaw will be a better player than Sterling, Welbeck or Chamberlain?

How'd you figure that out?
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Have you seen him this season? For a defender, at his tender age, that is some of the most impressive displays I have seen since the start of the PL.

But, due to his age, you can never be sure that he will make it. That is why I said it was a bit early to judge, but I think he will be able to reach a higher level than the other players.
 
Giggsforever said:
Decent enough to win nothing.

Wilshere is a top talent and can become the best midfielder in the world, if he stays clear of serious injuries. Luke Shaw can also be a fantastic player, but a bit young to judge.

Sterling, Chamberlain, Ince and Welbeck is talented, but none of them will be great players that will win you anything. If you look at the talent in Brazil and Spain and maybe even Belgium, France and Holland you know that this generation will be in the shadow of others.

I hope Zaha will be fantastic, but I have not seen enough of him to really pass judgment.
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The Premier League table says differently.

How can you write off such young players? I'll tell you how...

...you're an idiot.
 
From the current group of youngster, I think Wilshere has the potential to reach world class standard, next to him we have group of potentially top talents in Smalling, Jones, Cleverley, Welbeck, Chamberlain and Sterling etc. Zaha is somewhere in between, could be potentially great player but its too early to know.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
The Premier League table says differently.

How can you write off such young players? I'll tell you how...

...you're an idiot.
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I rate Welbeck and I think in 2-3 years he'll be up there with some of the best forwards in the world, once he finally gets composure sorted out and will become more clinical in front of goal (yeah, I still think it'll happen soon), but you can't really say that he's won the title for us. He's been decent this season performance wise but his return has been rather poor and it's players like van Persie and Rooney who carried us in terms of goals and assists.
 
Giggsforever said:
Decent enough to win nothing.

Wilshere is a top talent and can become the best midfielder in the world, if he stays clear of serious injuries. Luke Shaw can also be a fantastic player, but a bit young to judge.

Sterling, Chamberlain, Ince and Welbeck is talented, but none of them will be great players that will win you anything. If you look at the talent in Brazil and Spain and maybe even Belgium, France and Holland you know that this generation will be in the shadow of others.

I hope Zaha will be fantastic, but I have not seen enough of him to really pass judgment.
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:lol:

You missed Euro 2004?
 
Sarni said:
I rate Welbeck and I think in 2-3 years he'll be up there with some of the best forwards in the world, once he finally gets composure sorted out and will become more clinical in front of goal (yeah, I still think it'll happen soon), but you can't really say that he's won the title for us. He's been decent this season performance wise but his return has been rather poor and it's players like van Persie and Rooney who carried us in terms of goals and assists.
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Exactly. It's a team game, football.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
The Premier League table says differently.

How can you write off such young players? I'll tell you how...

...you're an idiot.
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You can see the talent and compare it to other talents right now and of the past. We will see. I am certain that Welbeck will not be a player that will be part of our first eleven or be one of that players that will be the most important in future success, by success, I'm talking about players that will win us things.

I hope he will have a long career at United though, he is good enough for that.

That is my opinion and I might be wrong. You talk like your opinion is the only outcome.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
Exactly. It's a team game, football.
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You'll find it difficult to win things with solid players only and when you don't have Rooney at his best, which has been frequent lately to be fair, then this side is going to lack any genuinely brilliant players who could win them games. I'm not saying it's impossible because it has been done before but when you look at young players that Germany, Brazil and to an extent Spain and Argentina have coming through then it'll be really difficult for England to keep up. It always has been though.
 
I think England have some good young players coming through. Not just those mentioned either. There are plenty of others with a good chance, like Caulker, Townsend, Jones, Smalling, Cleverley, Butland, Clyne, Morrison, Redmond, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Walker, Gibbs, Sturridge, Rodwell, Barkley, Bertrand, and so on. Obviously not all of them will keep progressing but there's a good spread of talent... With the slight exception of strikers, who are still a bit thin on the ground.
 
sincher said:
I think England have some good young players coming through. Not just those mentioned either. There are plenty of others with a good chance, like Caulker, Townsend, Jones, Smalling, Cleverley, Butland, Clyne, Morrison, Redmond, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Walker, Gibbs, Sturridge, Rodwell, Barkley, Bertrand, and so on. Obviously not all of them will keep progressing but there's a good spread of talent... With the slight exception of strikers, who are still a bit thin on the ground.
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Do you think the majority of those are any better than any of the previous supposed 'golden generations'? England have always had plenty of good players, they just don't seem to have many of the level above.
 
The whole idea of there ever having been a golden generation in my lifetime is bollocks.

I do think there are more good young players around now than 5 years ago, though.
 
Sarni said:
You'll find it difficult to win things with solid players only and when you don't have Rooney at his best, which has been frequent lately to be fair, then this side is going to lack any genuinely brilliant players who could win them games. I'm not saying it's impossible because it has been done before but when you look at young players that Germany, Brazil and to an extent Spain and Argentina have coming through then it'll be really difficult for England to keep up. It always has been though.
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You can't predict how now eighteen year olds are going to be playing by the world cups 2018 or 2022; to write them off is nonsense. Hardly any of the world's best players were setting the world alight as teenagers; it's ridiculous to state that England's youth won't ever be good enough to win anything - in fact it's fecking retarded.
 
The English national team never looked very "golden" but the likes of Gerrard, Scholes, Lampard, Ferdinand, Terry, (Ashley) Cole and Rooney have proven themselves to amongst the very best players around when playing for their clubs.

No idea if this lot will turn out as good but England's underage teams seem to have been doing quite well recently (not that I've been following them closely)
 
sincher said:
The whole idea of there ever having been a golden generation in my lifetime is bollocks.

I do think there are more good young players around now than 5 years ago, though.
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Well yeah, that's what I was getting at with the quotation marks. It's a daft media narrative, which I think is starting to repeat itself.

Maybe you're right, though I suspect that if that is the case it'll be solely down to quantity rather quality if there has been an increase.
 
Sarni said:
You'll find it difficult to win things with solid players only and when you don't have Rooney at his best, which has been frequent lately to be fair, then this side is going to lack any genuinely brilliant players who could win them games. I'm not saying it's impossible because it has been done before but when you look at young players that Germany, Brazil and to an extent Spain and Argentina have coming through then it'll be really difficult for England to keep up. It always has been though.
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Yeah, people will say that they have players like Zaha, Welbeck, Shaw, Ince, Wilshere, Sterling, Jones and so on all promising players coming through, but of that list the only player who I think will get to the level of the other top talents around the world is Wilshere, and that is if he get's over his injury problems. Countries like Germany, Brazil, Spain all have more promising players in most positions of the pitch and I don't see the current pattern of things changing too much with English football and the national team.

Welbeck will be a good player no doubt, but it is debatable if he will be a key player for us in the future, and in what position his future lies. My personal opinion is that he will become a good winger, but world class and not a great striker or anything. Goal scoring instinct is one of those things that players are born with, like Hernandez has, but Welbeck may turn into a decent goalscorer but I doubt he'll ever be one to get over 20 goals a season consistently.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
You can't predict how now eighteen year olds are going to be playing by the world cups 2018 or 2022; to write them off is nonsense. Hardly any of the world's best players were setting the world alight as teenagers; it's ridiculous to state that England's youth won't ever be good enough to win anything - in fact it's fecking retarded.
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You can't predict it exactly how they'll be but you can have pretty accurate guesses on how they'll be in general. The best players almost always stick out at young ages, and despite what you say, this current crop of England's youngsters look like they'll be good, but not at the level of Spain, Germany, or Brazil and others like that. In individual games anything can happen, as we saw with Chelsea winning the champions league last season but they were far from the top sides around europe, just like on the international stage, England might win something, but they have a very long way to go until they are up there with the top nations quality wise.

Also, I think england's last team that had it in them to win a tournament was the 2004 team, as they had class players all over the pitch but because of various other factors (poor managers, too many distractions, Rooney's injury, players being shoehorned into the side like Scholes on the wing) they never managed to do it.
 
bosnian_red said:
Yeah, people will say that they have players like Zaha, Welbeck, Shaw, Ince, Wilshere, Sterling, Jones and so on all promising players coming through, but of that list the only player who I think will get to the level of the other top talents around the world is Wilshere, and that is if he get's over his injury problems. Countries like Germany, Brazil, Spain all have more promising players in most positions of the pitch and I don't see the current pattern of things changing too much with English football and the national team.

Welbeck will be a good player no doubt, but it is debatable if he will be a key player for us in the future, and in what position his future lies. My personal opinion is that he will become a good winger, but world class and not a great striker or anything. Goal scoring instinct is one of those things that players are born with, like Hernandez has, but Welbeck may turn into a decent goalscorer but I doubt he'll ever be one to get over 20 goals a season consistently.
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I agree, but I also think that Jones will be a world class central defender. He has had his injuries, but nothing as seriuos as Wilshere. These two players are the best talent in England by far right now.
 
Giggsforever said:
I agree, but I also think that Jones will be a world class central defender. He has had his injuries, but nothing as seriuos as Wilshere. These two players are the best talent in England by far right now.
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Yeah I have a feeling he'll be amongst the top defenders in Europe as well, should have added him. Not seen enough of Zaha to have a great idea of what he'll be like but I think it's fair to say that he isn't as promising as the likes of Lucas, Hazard or Gotze.
 
bosnian_red said:
You can't predict it exactly how they'll be but you can have pretty accurate guesses on how they'll be in general. The best players almost always stick out at young ages, and despite what you say, this current crop of England's youngsters look like they'll be good, but not at the level of Spain, Germany, or Brazil and others like that.
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The best players rarely stick out as teenagers. If they did then the majority of the world's best players would have been at the world's best clubs since that early age. The fact is that, as teenagers, many of the world's best players looked not too dissimilar from their peers, and only truly become world class well into their twenties. Many of the world's most hyped teenagers will eventually amount to very little on the big stage, and vice versa, many of the eventual world beaters will have never been considered as such when teenagers. Certainly you get some that are destined for greatness from an early age, but predicting exactly which those will be is perhaps the most difficult job in football; if Giggsforever is doing anything more than making random guesses then he should be signed up to United's scouting department with immediate effect.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
You can't predict how now eighteen year olds are going to be playing by the world cups 2018 or 2022; to write them off is nonsense. Hardly any of the world's best players were setting the world alight as teenagers; it's ridiculous to state that England's youth won't ever be good enough to win anything - in fact it's fecking retarded.
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I don't think anyone's saying they don't think England will ever win anything with these players. They'll have more than 5 tournaments when they can make it happen so chances are they will at some points. Even a team like Greece managed to win a major international trophy through determination and good management. Likewise, plenty of teams far stronger than this England side have failed - for instance the previous generation of England that looked brilliant on paper but ended up without a single medal.
 
England will always have a chance at tournaments, they do have good players and sometimes great players. In 2014 they could have Smalling and Jones playing in front of Hart and if they are all in form that's one hell of a defence.

Welbeck has everything he needs to be a top draw forward, he just needs to pull it together.

If England pick the right team with the right tactics, on their day they could beat any team - maybe with some luck involved. It will just require some faith in a few young players. Rather than the tried and tested Gerrard in centre midfield, Barry, Milner, Parker combination.
 
I don't think he deserves to win, (probably Benteke or Lukaku) but it's good to see him nominated.
 
Rafael and Nastasic being omitted is weird, but then again isn't it voted for by the players? Most of them are clueless and bias.
 
Sarni said:
Wilshere won't be the best midfielder in the world. He's good and looks like he could be a complete midfielder one day but he's no THAT great. For example I really doubt he'll ever reach the same heights as someone like Schweinsteiger.

I said in the Summer that the current England side doesn't strike me as one with great potential and I stand by it. They'll be good but when you look at the sort of talent Germany and Spain have it really puts it in a different light.
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He's as good as anybody out there his age. I still believe Thiago is the very bet in terms of young, central midfielders - but Wilshere really is special.
 
As for Welbeck, other than scoring, he's actually had a good season in every other area.

I'm not sugar-coating it or anything, his goal return is simply not good enough. That said, this has been offset by the encouragement that can be drawn from his play in other areas. He certainly needs to learn how to finish and play the right pass in the final third, but hopefully this comes over the next year or so. If that doesn't happen, then the harsh reality will be that he isn't good enough to be here, in my view. Don't see why it can't though. He seems to have the necessary arrogance/self-belief.
 
Solius said:
Rafael and Nastasic being omitted is weird, but then again isn't it voted for by the players? Most of them are clueless and bias.
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Apparently there has not been a defender nominated for any award in any division.

Oh yeah - Lukaku WTF?!?!?
 
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