Danny Welbeck | 2011-14 Performances

[ciderman9000000]

Lynx might be a bit hard against Welbeck, but this is a loosing argument

It isn't part of any argument. I've been looking for a gif of Welbeck's shot against Foster since the event, have thus far failed to find one until just now when looking for a gif of Welbeck's best effort last night (if anyone has one it'd be appreciated).

Where better to post such gifs than in the Danny Welbeck thread?

Lynk can feck off tbh; the guy clearly knows shit all about football; his opinion on Welbeck holds about as much worth as that of Katie Price on the formation of the universe.

 

[Lynk]

This is the main defense anytime someone criticizes him. Other defenses include "feck off, you're a shit bandwagoner" and posting Youtube compilations. Welcome to the mains.

One page later

Lynk can feck off tbh; the guy clearly knows shit all about football.

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[ciderman9000000]

Didn't call you a bandwagoner, didn't post a YouTube compilation, didn't even 'defend' Welbeck.

Retard

If you think this thread exists solely for you to talk bollocks about one of the best players to come through our academy in ten years then you can do one.

 

[Lynk]

"Knows nothing about football" implies I'm a bandwagoner, you posted a compilation, gif or not is irrelevant, and you're obviously defending him or else you wouldn't get so worked up about it.

 

[ciderman9000000]

"Knows nothing about football" implies I'm a bandwagoner , you posted a compilation gif or not is irrelevant, and you're obviously defending him or else you wouldn't get so worked up about it.

Does it?

No.

It implies you know nothing about football.

 

[moses]

Will you two do this tedious bickering by PM if you must do it?

 

[Lynk]

I can at least hold down a debate without needing to resort to GIF's or childish insults.

 

[moses]

Like that?


Sometimes not engaging is the best repsonse.

 

[Drainy]

This season he has 1 goal in 23 appearances. Let's not kid ourselves, that's a terrible return for an attacking player in a team as good as ours. I'm judging him without the rose tinted specs of some, some who'll excuse his poor form because he's a "local lad who loves the club". Well guess what? So are most of the posters on this forum. Being local shouldn't exclude you from criticism.

You might not want to hear it because it's against your agenda, but the lad has played probably 90% of his time in the league this season as a winger.

Valencia has 0 goals and 4 assists in 15 appearences (1 of which was as a sub)
Young has 0 goals and 3 assists in 14 apps (2 as a sub)
Welbeck has 1 goal and 3 assists in 15 apps (8 as a sub)
Nani (just for the sake of it) has 1 goal and 1 assist in 7 apps (3 as a sub)
and Giggs has made 11 apps in the league (5 as a sub) and made or scored a single goal yet.

and yes, I know our wide players haven't been good- I said so in another thread but give them as much stick as the 22 year old that you seem to irrationally dislike- if you want to be fair.

 

[Lynk]

You might not want to hear it because it's against your agenda, but the lad has played probably 90% of his time in the league this season as a winger.

Valencia has 0 goals and 4 assists in 15 appearences (1 of which was as a sub)
Young has 0 goals and 3 assists in 14 apps (2 as a sub)
Welbeck has 1 goal and 3 assists in 15 apps (8 as a sub)
Nani (just for the sake of it) has 1 goal and 1 assist in 7 apps (3 as a sub)
and Giggs has made 11 apps in the league (5 as a sub) and made or scored a single goal yet.

and yes, I know our wide players haven't been good- I said so in another thread but give them as much stick as the 22 year old that you seem to irrationally dislike- if you want to be fair.

Jonny Evans and Patrice Evra both have 4 goals this season. Your point being?


Also Giggs hasn't made a goal yet? Did you watch the game yesterday? (Unless you're excluding cup games)

 

[Drainy]

Jonny Evans and Patrice Evra both have 4 goals this season. Your point being?

Well if defenders are scoring 4 then wingers should be scoring 10 by this point and strikers should be scoring 30.. because football works like that.

We're scoring a lot from corners (thanks to quality deliveries from RvP and Rooney) and defenders tend to be the best at attacking the ball in the air...
FFS Collins scored two against us yesterday from it, that doesn't mean he's a better attacking player than Welbeck- it's not comparing like with like, but you don't want to do that because you are wrong.

 

[Drainy]

(Unless you're excluding cup games)

That tends to be what in the league means.

 

[Judge Red]

I see the Heskey comparisons. His goal tally suggests he doesn't deserve his place but his overall contribution to the team tells you otherwise.

 

[Dargonk]

Was a bit frustrated with Welbeck to be honest. His build up play and interchange in the opposition half and final third is very good. But for a striker, he just doesn't seem to get into positions to score at the moment. He had that one chance where some nice play lead to him getting a decent shot off (one where he also could have played it across to Hernandez if he wanted). But other than that I can't think of any real situation where he actually threatened to score.

Its my one worry about him right now, and I feel his lack of goals is impacting his own mind as well. I really wanted him to get on the score sheet and build from there, but at the moment he just doesn't seem to be creating those chances. We saw Hernandez grab his chances when he was give game time, but Welbeck doesn't look like he is going to be able to do that right now. Hopefully he gets on the score sheet soon though.

 

[JakeC]

Because people can't accept opinions and move on. I'm constantly forced to defend myself, or laugh at romantic bollocks.

He's a fantastic player, you're a bellend.

Move on.

 

[Gaeilge]

He's a fantastic player, you're a bellend.

Move on.

He is far from a fantastic player. He is an exceptional talent and one of the best products of our youth academy in quite some time, but, he is not a fantastic player yet.

He has obvious will and desire when he loses the ball and strives to track back for it. A fantastic trait in a player. He also often dwells far too much in possession and for every great touch he has, a poor one can follow. The very same can be said for his eye on goal. He can obviously score but there is a bundle he needs to work on.

Why feel the need to name call? This is a forum which is based on personal thoughts and debate. He has his opinions on Danny, just as you do.

 

[MrMojo]

He is far from a fantastic player. He is an exceptional talent and one of the best products of our youth academy in quite some time, but, he is not a fantastic player yet.

He has obvious will and desire when he loses the ball and strives to track back for it. A fantastic trait in a player. He also often dwells far too much in possession and for every great touch he has, a poor one can follow. The very same can be said for his eye on goal. He can obviously score but there is a bundle he needs to work on.

Why feel the need to name call? This is a forum which is based on personal thoughts and debate. He has his opinions on Danny, just as you do.

Absolutely, it's just an opinion on a footballer after all. I'm guessing the name calling is an attempt to be in the majority.

 

[Gaeilge]

Absolutely, it's just an opinion on a footballer after all. I'm guessing the name calling is an attempt to be in the majority.

Well whatever it is, is largely unnecessary and just portrays shite.

Back to the topic of the thread, I love having Danny here and couldn't be happier to see him playing well. Hopefully he can keep it up and build a shot of confidence. Wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for him to be in the fold with the other three

 

[Platato]

Because people can't accept opinions and move on. I'm constantly forced to defend myself, or laugh at romantic bollocks.

Forced? heh. Have a word with yourself.

 

[Big-Red]

Because people can't accept opinions and move on. I'm constantly forced to defend myself, or laugh at romantic bollocks.

If people just accepted opinions we'd get nowhere in life. Why shouldn't you have to defend your opinions?

 

[Lynk]

He's a fantastic player, you're a bellend.

Move on.

Fantastic? Jesus christ get over yourself. Robin Van Persie is fantastic. Danny Welbeck is a 22 year old striker who has scored 1 goal all season, and I'm calling him out on it. Your insult adds nothing except show you up to be a pathetic poster. Stick to the general mate.

Forced? heh. Have a word with yourself.

What with people calling me a Bandwagoner, a fecking idiot, bellend etc. Yeah I am kind of forced to defend myself. I'd expect this shit from Liverpool fans, not ours.

If people just accepted opinions we'd get nowhere in life. Why shouldn't you have to defend your opinions?

I have no problem debating, and I'm prepared to have my own views challenged on these things. But when it just becomes "Welbeck is great, feck off" There's no point, because these people are like cult followers.

 

[Platato]

What with people calling me a Bandwagoner, a fecking idiot, bellend etc. Yeah I am kind of forced to defend myself. I'd expect this shit from Liverpool fans, not ours.

No you're not. As moses said, you can not just respond. Have you been out mate? Getting called a 'fbellend' by a fellow United fan will happen at least once in your life.

 

[Lynk]

Simple questions.

1. Why do you consider Welbeck a fantastic player?
2. And has he been good enough this season? Yes or No?
3. Does he have the tools to be a fantastic forward, aside from his dribbling?

Also please don't constantly overuse the "Well he played on the wing in 90% of his games" he hasn't. He's played on the wing a lot more this season yes, but it's not as much as some of you would like to believe. 1 goal this year is a terrible return from a forward. He's being outscored by players like Cleverley, Anderson and Evra from open play. In the assists tally, Hernandez a player some numpty branded "Championship Level" is out-providing him. To draw comparisons with another similar player, Sturridge, someone who has also played on the wing mostly and who is of a similar age and build, he's scored 3 goals this season in nearly half the amount of appearances.

To me Welbeck lacks the clinicalness to be a top striker. And I'm not sure he can ever gain it, to the top finishers like Hernandez, RVN or RvP it's instinctive, it's a natural intelligence in the same way that you can be a good passer but lack the ability to dictate tempo. He has a good atitude and he is a good dribbler at times, but is frequently let down by his decision making and his inconsistent touch (He can pull off the difficult moves at times, but at others he looks gangly and awkward)

 

[ghaliboy]

Heskey never showed the ability to play football like Welbeck can. He falls over a few times and he's branded clumsy. These players just don't get a break do they, every fault is highlighted.

To be fair Heskey is absolutely murdering the A-League playing as a lumbering poacher. Looks razor sharp.

Found his level?

 

[Lynk]

Heskey when he was younger and at Leicester in paticular was an entirely different prospect. In fact when he was Welbecks age now he scored 22 goals in all competitions

 

[An Irish Red]

To me Welbeck lacks the clinicalness to be a top striker. And I'm not sure he can ever gain it, to the top finishers like Hernandez, RVN or RvP it's instinctive, it's a natural intelligence in the same way that you can be a good passer but lack the ability to dictate tempo.

Danny Welbeck: 45 games, 10 goals.
Robin Van Persie: 50 games, 10 goals.

That's their statistics over two seasons at a comparable age. Both were played as a winger more often than not (whether you'll admit to it or not is a different thing altogether).

For the record, I don't think Danny will ever be as good as Robin Van Persie is now. I have no idea what sort of heights he will, or will not, reach. The only thing that I'm sure of is that he will improve drastically from what he is now.

 

[lysglimt]

Welbeck is exactly as he was when he was at U18 level - brilliant with the ball, looking likely to be a world class player - it's just that he doesn't score goals.

Welbecks scoring record at U18 level was actually pretty poor when you consider how much better he was than his opponents. He could score 3-4 goals in a match and then go 6-7 games without a goal.

He always seemed to participate so much in the build-up and when the ball entered the penalty box - he was never there

 

[Swaters16]

To be fair Heskey is absolutely murdering the A-League playing as a lumbering poacher. Looks razor sharp.

Found his level?

I wouldn't call it murdering by yeah he is really sharp at the moment, on his game. He's apparently torn his thigh though so that's the end of that. Anyway, the Jets play like shit with him on the park regardless of his goal return. All they ever do is pump it long to him.

 

[ciderman9000000]

Simple questions.

1. Why do you consider Welbeck a fantastic player?
2. And has he been good enough this season? Yes or No?
3. Does he have the tools to be a fantastic forward, aside from his dribbling?

1. Danny Welbeck is a fantastic player because at twenty-two years old he's established himself as a back-up striker in one of the world's greatest and most successful football teams; during that time he has also established himself as a regular England international, an important member of the squad. There isn't a football club in England who wouldn't happily welcome Welbeck into their squad tomorrow if he were available at a price which they could afford. He's achieved all this by not being your typical striker, his attributes in the defensive phase being one of his greatest strengths; regularly hassling and dispossessing opponents in their own defensive half, Welbeck creates chances from positions whereby his team seem to be on the back foot. His pace, close control, physicality – not easily dispossessed himself – and ability to drive the ball forward when in possession are all assets to his game which he uses to great effect. Though he's currently lacking a degree composure in front of goal, he's demonstrated in the past that he has the ability to find the top corner from distance, as well as that to improvise in tight situations. He's a dedicated, well disciplined, hard-working team player with a professional demeanour and an attitude towards self improvement through patience and determination, well equipped mentally to wait for his chances and learn from his mistakes. There can be no doubt that Danny Welbeck is a fantastic young player.

2. He's been good enough this season; complaints about him are immature and indicative of a lack of understanding of the game. The only thing lacking from his game this season has been goals, but then he's not often played as a center forward for United, nor had many 90min games. It's difficult for a fourth choice striker to make a mark on any team, yet despite the recent barren spell – one which has been unfairly exaggerated by misfortune and at times fantastic goalkeeping – Danny has demonstrated his worth to the team in other areas. He's made no great leaps and bounds forward in the last four months, but neither has he regressed as a player; since the signing of RvP he's finding game-time in his preferred position predictably difficult to come by, but nevertheless his future at United would seem to be secure – a feat rarely achieved by academy graduates – and with time on his hands and an attitude to take advantage of the fact, even his harshest critics will in all likelihood be well aware of his worth as a player come May.

3. (See 1.)

 

[NoLogo]

Well said Ciderman.

One of the reasons I never understood all the talk about Lewandowski is the fact that Danny reminds me so much about the Polish striker before he became Dortmunds 1st choice striker.

Lewandowski had all the attributes that make him a great striker today, good linkup play, good work attitude, could keep onto the ball really well and he did all those things better than Barrios when ha came to Dortmund but he missed a lot o chances, hell even in his first season as the first striker for Dortmund he bottled a lot of absolute sitters but also scored some great goals.

Welbeck has all the attributes to make him a great striker and if we give him the playing time and he stays injury free he is only bound to get better in the coming years.

 

[Rossa]

Lynk: people are criticising you because you criticise United players like YOU were a Liverpool supporter - that's why. I've hardly seen you make one positive comment in here, and that is being an ass!

Welbeck has terrific pace, sublime technique, is strong and can finish some very nice goals at times. What he lacks is a consistent finish, especially from easier chances. That will come in time.

 

[Giggsforever]

Lynk: people are criticising you because you criticise United players like YOU were a Liverpool supporter - that's why. I've hardly seen you make one positive comment in here, and that is being an ass!

Welbeck has terrific pace, sublime technique, is strong and can finish some very nice goals at times. What he lacks is a consistent finish, especially from easier chances. That will come in time.

This is not better than Lynk. He has good technique and is struggling with his finishing. I have still not met a non United supporter that has rated Welbeck. So I actually think the truth is in between the two arguing sides here.

And the fact that none of you are actually addressing the big problem with Welbeck is a bit strange. He will have to get his body balance/control sorted out, or he will have no chance making it at the level United are competing.

 

[Rossa]

This is not better than Lynk. He has good technique and is struggling with his finishing. I have still not met a non United supporter that has rated Welbeck. So I actually think the truth is in between the two arguing sides here.

And the fact that none of you are actually addressing the big problem with Welbeck is a bit strange. He will have to get his body balance/control sorted out, or he will have no chance making it at the level United are competing.

Why is that no better? His technique is VERY good, if a bit inconsistent at times. He has managed to finish some brilliant goals, which is why I said he CAN finish well. The problem with Welbeck is that he struggles to score easy goals and to score on a regular basis.

The fact that he plays for Englands national squad testifies to others thinking that he is quite good.

All that said, I do think he has been a bit dissapointing this season, but I never rated him as a winger.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

I think the current plan is to have Welbeck replace v.Persie's role in the team when v.Persie retires or leaves for one last challenge.

I see what people mean when they criticize Welbeck. Yes there are holes in his game, but all of his main weaknesses are things related to inexperience. Things that are likely to fade over time. (ie, around the time v.Persie bids us farewell)

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Very nice to see and know that despite Welbeck getting limited playing time this season (Compared to last, due to the team being stronger up front obviously) - Have not heard a bad word from him, not a moan or anything, wish every player had his attitude.

 

[ciderman9000000]

This is not better than Lynk. He has good technique and is struggling with his finishing. I have still not met a non United supporter that has rated Welbeck. So I actually think the truth is in between the two arguing sides here.

And the fact that none of you are actually addressing the big problem with Welbeck is a bit strange. He will have to get his body balance/control sorted out, or he will have no chance making it at the level United are competing.

That's the second time you've said that:

The poor finishing is because of the poor body balance. If he can't develope and get that sorted, he will never be good enough. Strange that the ones thinking he is already a great player either refuse to see that or that they refuse to argue his negative sides.

I think you're well wrong on that one.

Welbeck may appear as being clumsy or unbalanced at times, but that appearance is a false one. Just like Peter Crouch, Welbeck's height and build causes him to look clumsy on the ball, in contrast though, as with Peter Crouch, the reality is anything but. Welbeck has excellent balance and control, as repeatedly demonstrated by his ability to link up play in tight situations, reproduce deft flicks, back-heels and technical pieces of skill when under pressure and run past multiple opponents with the ball at his feet. His technical ability should not be under scrutiny; he's very well equipped in this regard.

What he's lacking is not body control – something which he has in abundance regardless of appearances – but composure in front of goal.

 

[Jimy_Hills_Chin]

Welbeck's height and build causes him to look clumsy on the ball

That is total BS. He is 6ft tall and not skinny by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[ciderman9000000]

That is total BS. He is 6ft tall and not skinny by any stretch of the imagination.

No, but he has long legs and a higher center of gravity than most, so it isn't total BS at all.

 

[Jimy_Hills_Chin]

No, but he has long legs and a higher center of gravity than most, so it isn't total BS at all.

Have you taken the lads inside leg?

 

[MrMojo]

No you're not. As moses said, you can not just respond. Have you been out mate? Getting called a 'fbellend' by a fellow United fan will happen at least once in your life.

Really? You reckon if you were having a debate about football with mates somebody would call you a fecking bellend because of your opinion. Never happened to me and it would seem completely irrational if it did.

He's a fantastic player, you're a bellend.

Move on.

I see this quite a bit and I don't get it, this is a forum for debate, why would you urge somebody to stop debating Welbeck in the Welbeck thread. It's like going into Greggs and asking them to stop making pasties.

I disagree with Lynk, but that's what this place is for. He's not arguing with himself so whilst others want to debate with him why not let it continue. How boring would this thread be without Lynk having an unpopular opinion.