Dan "The Gardener" Ashworth Has Left | Venit, vidit, non vicit

"There is a storm coming" Amorim can tell the future and manage football teams. Never a truer word said. And with our fixture list its going to be a long December.

I hope Ratcliffe is ready to get the cheque book out in January or we doomed
 
Champ said:
I don't get why people are having a go at the club here, if something isn't working or a party isn't happy then ties need to be severed, which is what's happened here.
Fans have been crying out for ruthless leadership, now we have it the fans are complaining about it.... couldn't make it up!!
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You don't get why people are having a go at the club? Really? The Club who thought he was worth millions and months in limbo, and then lose him within a few months? Does that seem like good judgment to you? Nothing went wrong somewhere in that process?
 
Dembeza said:
This is ridiculous if you consider how long we waited for him and that we paid for his gardening leave to be shortened.

All major decisions during the summer was kept on ice until he joined, and now this?

Also DOF is supposed to provide continuity because they are a “long term” appointment compared to a manager but here we are with DOF staying less than a year.

This is a total mess up
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Time will tell. The most important thing right now is to find out the reason why Dan was moved on.

One the one hand we had the glazers who kept people in for years and decades despite them failing.

So if INEOS have moved Dan Andworth on because it’s become obvious it won’t work out then that’s good. So long as the reasons are either poor negotiations, poor recruitment recommendations or simply not getting along or sharing the vision of Berrada, other directors and the manager. Best do it now than wait years.

But my only concern would be if he’s been moved on because the club doesn’t have the budget to sign the players he’s recommending. It’s interesting that the decision is coming just a few weeks before the winter window opens.
 
WPMUFC said:
The article states they were told by club sources that the club made the decision but would publicly say "mutual". The statement is worthless.
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The statement is as useless as it is terse.

It's a tick in the box adjacent to "Club announcement made?"
 
Drainy said:
I can see that but you'd also think his ideas would be more scalable to bigger tasks.

For England you probably want to promote English coaches for development and sustainability of your countries football culture.

For Manchester United you want the best available option for the way in which the club wants to play.

The only benefit to an English coach over Amorim is that culturally our fans are more used to direct physical football, which Amorim does like directness but more controlled than we're used to and the fans need to get used to less risky attacking football
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I've been used to this for a decade now.
 
justsomebloke said:
You don't get why people are having a go at the club? Really? The Club who thought he was worth millions and months in limbo, and then lose him within a few months? Does that seem like good judgment to you? Nothing went wrong somewhere in that process?
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If it can happen with players why not back room staff too? If he’s not the right fit he’s not the right fit. Better to move on asap.
 
Jacob said:
And God knows what Brailsford does.
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Yeah, seeing his name still pop up as a decision maker is depressing. Sooner he pisses off to find his marginal gains elsewhere, the better.
 
JPRouve said:
But that process was less than ideal from day one. The future CEO wasn't able to work until summer. We then targeted someone he never worked with as the DOF and he also couldn't join the club until summer.
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Yep. It meant the running of the club was on some kind of complicated, technical impassé and hiatus, and I'm pretty sure that is the situation that led to Ten Hag not being replaced in summer.

The club was hindered by the reality of lame duck executives shadowed by not-yet executives since winter, after a year of being hindered by lame duck owners shadowed by not-yet owners.
Let's look forward and hope that an upheaval at such a pivotal role is not needed anymore for a while.
 
Bad optics, but this stuff is kind of likely when you shoehorn a brand new senior team together in a short space of time. You just don't know how people will get on and whether they will have the same views of things. If the DOF and the CEO have different views on playing style, managerial appointments, recruitment etc then they won't be able to work together well. Better to get it sorted out now. I just hope it doesn't become a habit.
 
crossy1686 said:
What if the people that were hired are just shit? We keep them in the name of stability? Become stably shit?
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Yes of course. Getting it right on the pitch should always come second to whether a few fans of other clubs put 'banter club' on twitter.
 
RuudTom83 said:
Seems like INEOS love to create upheaval just before a transfer window.

Great leadership :rolleyes:
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It’s not like we are going to be very active in January. I would be surprised if we make even one acquisition.
 
quadrant said:
Bad optics, but this stuff is kind of likely when you shoehorn a brand new senior team together in a short space of time. You just don't know how people will get on and whether they will have the same views of things. If the DOF and the CEO have different views on playing style, managerial appointments, recruitment etc then they won't be able to work together well. Better to get it sorted out now. I just hope it doesn't become a habit.
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Maybe clarify that with the CEO before you challenge the Saudis and punt 5M for his release.
 
devilish said:
Soriano was the first ex Barcelona person to join city. That opened the flood gates with txiki, berrada, pep, estriarte, arteta and co following suit. Berrada joined united and was followed by Wilcox. We went for amorim while city (mothership) went for viana both at sporting. Ashworth sticks out like a sore thumb

Its too early to say but I have a feeling that our next sporting director will have links to city, sporting or/and Barca. If I'm a betting man then I'd go for either Wilcox (promotion) or txiki
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0 chance it's gonna be Begiristain but otherwise I think there might be something in what you're saying.
 
#07 said:
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Not sure that I’d believe that (or at least not straight off the bat), it’s a great little bit of misinformation to stop fans complaining about INEOS as they are aware we all hate Southgate. Let’s not forget SJR supposedly had a boner for Southgate initially too
 
It’s messy and not a good look for a club in the public eye, but it’s not that crazy. There could be all sorts of reasons why it didn’t work out and they don’t have to be catastrophic.
 
It's all the backtracking...Give ETH a contact then sack him when Amorim was available.
We hired new coaches who were "club hires" only to sack them...
Spend a year chasing Ashworth then sack him...
Not a good look for INEOS so far especially after all the "best in class" PR.
We need a 10/10 window in Jan (if even financially possible) and in the summer, both outgoings and incomings.
Some tough decisions need to be made on players who have long overstayed their welcome and I'm not talking about obvious ones like Lindelöf, Eriksen, Evans and Antony.
I'm not sure INEOS have it in them based on evidence so far...I hope I'm wrong.
We genuinely need to shift about 10 players and sign at least 7 or so.
 
I’m not sure about the Southgate links but I can see Ashworth floating someone like Potter or Gary O’Neil in a big meeting as a head coach, with Berrada looking at him like he had just witnessed a murder. Southgate’s a little too dinosaur but those two are more modern, younger British coaches.
 
Ish said:
Southgate….yikes
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The Southgate links were frightening, and I think it was all due to Ashworth. I never liked the appointment, and am extremely glad he's gone. Bit of a clown show, but good to cut the tumour out as early as its been recognised.
 
quadrant said:
Bad optics, but this stuff is kind of likely when you shoehorn a brand new senior team together in a short space of time. You just don't know how people will get on and whether they will have the same views of things. If the DOF and the CEO have different views on playing style, managerial appointments, recruitment etc then they won't be able to work together well. Better to get it sorted out now. I just hope it doesn't become a habit.
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Better still to sort this before you hire him.
 
Jim Beam said:
Meh.. if he wanted EtH to continue, delayed his sacking, had any thoughts about Southgate, didn't want Amorim this is absolutely right call. Not a great look though as one would presume all above would be in on the table before he was hired. There are probably some other issues as well. Not a fan of Ratcliffe being behind decision, it should be Beretta. He shouldn't be the driving force behind such decisons. Ineos did some good (getting Amorim in such a quick time), some bad but it is still way too early. There is also a feeling that Ratcliffe is running the club like his company. You can't do that, this is way more than a business, the level of emotions and connection is on another level. And to be worse, he leaves an impression that he gives two fecks about emotions.

All together, we win the game yesterday and this suddenly becomes a lot less of an issue.
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Notions of appointing Southgate might be criminal but hardly merits executing the fella.
 
hellhunter said:
Southgate stuff feels like a convenient leak to save face. Wasn't Ratcliffe himself a big admirer?
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I doubt they instigated the sacking of a Director of Football because he suggested a manager they didn't even attempt to go for. Either they have already recruited someone else, there has been a clash of personalities or SJR thinks he hasn't been all that great at anything.

Either way it reflects badly on INEOS' due diligence and analysis of what the club needs. Their excuse is also silly, because when you hire a "best in class DOF" it is stupid not to trust that DOF with the responsibilities he needs to do his job.

I'm leaning towards them having landed someone they want more.
 
Telsim said:
If he's been doing something illegal, I'd revise my opinion, but I think it's a pretty great stretch to suspect this to be the reason at this point.

And for your second point, yes, it is comical. You hire someone in that position because you believe he is the best. And the whole ordeal with Newcastle would imply they believed that and planned for it. But when positions of this magnitude are concerned, you can't just change your mind a few months later and sack him. It's lunacy and it puts your decision making in significant doubt. A DoF represents the long term vision of the club. INEOS chose him and chased him for months and spent millions on it. So, did the vision change on a dime? I don't know, man, that's crazy to me.

Unless they suddenly pull a Txiki Bergeinstein out of nowhere, or poach Hugo Viana... even then, what's the guarantee they don't get sacked in half a year?

Nah, I don't believe in this people.
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What do you think Ashworth did by the way?

He sat above all departments and created the structure. The idea was he would build and oversee all depts but he wasn’t not part of the long term footballing side from a decision making standpoint re what we see on the pitch. He’s basically the head of all ops. Everyone reports into him, but he is not hands on there at all. Nor is he hands on with scouting targets. He’s like a middle man between Omar and everything. Not to say he was not important (I assume he will be replaced) but Berrada is very hands on from what we’ve heard so I wonder if he simply deemed him a bit pointless in the setup.

It might be a good move, it might be terrible but I don’t think a sporting director leaving who has no track record with is that big a deal.
 
oh well, we're still a clown show then

the decision to keep ETH last summer was a major red flag wasn't it?
 
the hea said:
I think this is very close to what has happened. They tried to fix things way to fast with just picking some of the highest rated people available.
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Yeah, making those decisions in isolation hardly ever works. CEO’s usually want to have input into who they appoint/end up working with as essentially, they should ultimately be held accountable. Probably quite a few things just didn’t click in the background, making it impossible to carry on. It’s a shame but the intent was positive.
TheReligion said:
The other point is they needed to do it before the January window?
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Yeah it’s all very interesting. Probably before January as they’re not aligned on transfer strategy etc either
Ricardo de la Vega said:
The Southgate links were frightening, and I think it was all due to Ashworth. I never liked the appointment, and am extremely glad he's gone. Bit of a clown show, but good to cut the tumour out as early as it’s been recognised.
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Hahaha yeah, the analogy of a tumor is a little harsh but that’s just optics :lol: but agreed, if it isn’t working, be decisive
 
DavelinaJolie said:
Yeah, but regardless of the reason it's bloody maddening the waste of time and money on this.
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The most credible reason I’ve read, not sure if it’s true as I really don’t know if he had that much power. But JR wanted ETH sacked, Ashworth wanted him to stay. JR left it with the football people. Didn’t work out so now Ashworth pays the price. Also apparently Ashworth wanted Southgate not Amorim.

Again I don’t know if he’s power extended that far, I’d have thought that be Berrada call.
 
We're pure banter and will remain that way for baby, many years with the Glazers ultimately in charge. Whether this was his decision or ours, it's a ridiculous situation.
 
Von Mistelroum said:
We're pure banter and will remain that way for baby, many years with the Glazers ultimately in charge. Whether this was his decision or ours, it's a ridiculous situation.
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Why are people mentioning the Glazers? We can all hate the Glazers but they aren’t making these decisions anymore.
 
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