Cristiano Ronaldo

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I'm with Hectic and Brwned (I think - I skimmed the reams of argument above). I never want to see us get rid of a player who we want and who wants us, even in a swap deal for a better one. It's team building vs a City-esque commodity mentality. Players aren't just trading cards, and a team isn't a deck. Once you've decided that principle, it's not 'extreme' to stick to it when the 'better player' is Ronaldo. The principle is hardly worth having if you only apply it to swaps for players who you're not that keen on anyway.

I still don't see why, in this strange hypothetical situation, we couldn't just offer more money. We'd have used it to buy de Gea's replacement anyway. And if Madrid really wanted a keeper that badly, they could use the money to buy one.
 
He's going to destroy us in the Champions League, and then use those performances to secure his massive new long-term contract with Real Madrid.

:angel:
 
Brightonian said:
I'm with Hectic and Brwned (I think - I skimmed the reams of argument above). I never want to see us get rid of a player who we want and who wants us, even in a swap deal for a better one. It's team building vs a City-esque commodity mentality. Players aren't just trading cards, and a team isn't a deck. Once you've decided that principle, it's not 'extreme' to stick to it when the 'better player' is Ronaldo. The principle is hardly worth having if you only apply it to swaps for players who you're not that keen on anyway.
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Of course it is. De Gea for Ronaldo is an incredibly extreme example. The principle isn't absolute like you represent, there would come a point when you go against it and IMO the club would view De Gea for Ronaldo as well beyond that point.

For you it might be a bit further, for example Young for Ronaldo or something similar. I'm genuinely shocked you wouldn't accept a swap of Ronaldo for De Gea though.
 
Proud_Lyon said:
After watching a programme on Messi, out of the 10 kilometres he does per match, he runs about 1.7 kilometres, the rest he walks around just observing. So, not only does he conserve energy, but he is around the middle just observing the opposition, he is being observant of his surroundings. This is why he is like he is, the excellent player that he is.
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Ah you mean it that way. Thought you meant distance traveled, not actual running.
 
Ole'sbodyguard said:
The cantona example with Leeds is not the best way to demonstrate that point. The way the Eric signing has been explained Fergie asked about Eric after Wilkinson had phoned and inquired about Irwin and got told where to go. It's not as if we had strategically gone for him with a sustained bid. Eric was the best about in mid-season when we needed abit of inspiration and were low on strikers with Dublin injured.

I've never had Fergie down as a chancer but the Eric signing seemed to just come from Wilkinson making contact and Fergie remembering Bruce and Pallister's views on his ability. The transfer came out of the blue and the rest is history. The fact Eric was such a huge success just adds to his mystique but it's hard to think Fergie earmarked him as someone he was desperate to get, more like Wilkinson, in his infinite wisdom, was desperate to get rid. We were after David Hirst with the big money and drew a blank with huge bids for the time.

Better example is the rumours behind Shearer who Fergie clearly wanted very much for about five years. When we trying to buy Shearer from Blackburn they apparently asked for Scholes in part exchange and big money. Fergie knocked them back straight and would only make a cash or a different player exchange deal.

The only player exchange deal I can remember us doing is Cole plus money and Gillespie. It's not something we ever seem to do.
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I agree to an extent. Was watching that 92/93 season review recently and was astounded to hear what Sir Alex said.

Interviewer: How long's he been on your mind then? Surely not just since that phonecall?

Sir Alex: Yeah, yeah. More or less that.
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Funny how things work out.

Your example is much better but I will say that I think you've misread my point - it was more about Irwin than Cantona. We just wouldn't consider selling a key player no matter what the situation, IMO. Not unless he wanted out or we wanted him out. The Scholes-Shearer example is far more pertinent though.
 
Theon said:
Of course it is. De Gea for Ronaldo is an incredibly extreme example. The principle isn't absolute like you represent, there would come a point when you go against it and IMO the club would view De Gea for Ronaldo as well beyond that point.

For you it might be a bit further, for example Young for Ronaldo or something similar. I'm genuinely shocked you wouldn't accept a swap of Ronaldo for De Gea though.
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You're missing the very point of the principle, though. It's just not about the quality of the players concerned. If anything, actually, the absurd steal which swapping de Gea for Ronaldo would be would infringe the principle more than say swapping Ronnie for Nani and Young combined. If we did the former, and consequently won the CL, there'd always be that little voice telling you that we only achieved it because we basically got given Ronaldo. In the latter case, it would at least feel vaguely like team building, because we'd have swapped an excellent winger and a decent winger for the best winger in the world. Somewhat less like a constant game of 'automatically collect all the good players and bin the less good ones', which is how City and Real do things.

I know it's not rational. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's how we should do things, or that I wouldn't be delighted if we somehow got Ronaldo back. It's just a personal gut response.
 
He's obsessed with himself, isn't he?

His new boots:

article-2257005-16BF539B000005DC-176_634x365.jpg


article-2257005-16BF5393000005DC-571_634x466.jpg


The striking white (with pink trademark swoosh) number are printed with a bold CR7 graphic and a host of numerical references to the winger's achievements during 2011-12.

1-9-14-19-27-55-60

• 1st Spanish league title
• 9 goals scored for Portugal
• 14 games played for the national team
• 19 - first player to score against all 19 rival teams competing in La Liga in a season
• 27 years old in 2012
• 55 matches played in all competitions for club
• 60 goals scored in all competitions for club
 
Also the lottery numbers for this week.
 
Brwned said:
I agree to an extent. Was watching that 92/93 season review recently and was astounded to hear what Sir Alex said.



Funny how things work out.

Your example is much better but I will say that I think you've misread my point - it was more about Irwin than Cantona. We just wouldn't consider selling a key player no matter what the situation, IMO. Not unless he wanted out or we wanted him out. The Scholes-Shearer example is far more pertinent though.
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In his book about Eric, Phillipe Auclair refutes the chance element of Fergie thinking of Cantona's name on the spot. Apparently he had enquired through Gerrard Houllier prior to that phone conversation and even asked into Eric's personality to see if he would be a good fit for the club. /tangent
 
Gazza said:
In his book about Eric, Phillipe Auclair refutes the chance element of Fergie thinking of Cantona's name on the spot. Apparently he had enquired through Gerrard Houllier prior to that phone conversation and even asked into Eric's personality to see if he would be a good fit for the club. /tangent
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Don't ruin what is a legendary story.

You'll be telling us that Howard Wilkinson has finally admitted he royally screwed up allowing the deal next.
 
unlucky for him that Messi happens to be playing at the same time. otherwise you'd have to think that Ronaldo would have gotten a few of these Ballon D'Ors.
 
Feel for him but Messi deserved it.. both didn't win anything major in the past year and on an individual level Messi's goalscoring record blew everyone out the water, even if Ronnie was pretty impressive in the euro's too.
 
utdalltheway said:
unlucky for him that Messi happens to be playing at the same time. otherwise you'd have to think that Ronaldo would have gotten a few of these Ballon D'Ors.
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Barcelona :mad:
Same can be said about us. We are unlucky that we happen to face (probably) the best team in footballing history in the CL finals or else we could and should have added two extra CL titles.
 
Unam333 said:
Barcelona :mad:
Same can be said about us. We are unlucky that we happen to face (probably) the best team in footballing history in the CL finals or else we could and should have added two extra CL titles.
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Wenger is saying the same about us though...
 
Gazza said:
In his book about Eric, Phillipe Auclair refutes the chance element of Fergie thinking of Cantona's name on the spot. Apparently he had enquired through Gerrard Houllier prior to that phone conversation and even asked into Eric's personality to see if he would be a good fit for the club. /tangent
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Fergie has contradicted himself on how that came about. When he first talked about it he said that Wilkinson phoned asking about Irwin and then said what if we throw in Cantona and that's how it came about. The story has changed a little since then.
 
Raees said:
Feel for him but Messi deserved it.. both didn't win anything major in the past year and on an individual level Messi's goalscoring record blew everyone out the water, even if Ronnie was pretty impressive in the euro's too.
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If the Spanish title isn't a major title then what is ?
 
Are those boots even legal? For association rules football, that is. The bladed studs have a sharp metal edge.

Not quite Texas Chainsaw stuff, but if you're looking to fukk someone up bad, you'll want to start with a pair of boots with this kind of stud design.
 
Maciek said:
He's obsessed with himself, isn't he?

His new boots:



The striking white (with pink trademark swoosh) number are printed with a bold CR7 graphic and a host of numerical references to the winger's achievements during 2011-12.

1-9-14-19-27-55-60

• 1st Spanish league title
• 9 goals scored for Portugal
• 14 games played for the national team
• 19 - first player to score against all 19 rival teams competing in La Liga in a season
• 27 years old in 2012
• 55 matches played in all competitions for club
• 60 goals scored in all competitions for club
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Being one year older is an achievement now :lol: ?
 
kouroux said:
If the Spanish title isn't a major title then what is ?
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I don't think League titles determine Ballon d'ors... not that I agree with that, but I think dominating a Champions League or an International Tournament generally sways the voters. When neither nominee has done that, then I think more credence is given to the individual who was better.. and 91 goals was such a ridiculous achievement, it's hard to see past Messi as the deserved winner, even if Ronaldo has won La Liga.
 
Any chance of CR blaming the loss of the Balon D'or on RM due to the lack of support publically by players etc therefore pushing through to his 'dream' move home to OT? And the loss has made him humble asking to match the top earner at the club only :)

On a serious note, what everybody else has said, had it not been for Messi, could well have been CR taking all 4 of them IMO (Not that there was not better players some years - More that he has had a very convincing case each year).
 
Raees said:
I don't think League titles determine Ballon d'ors... not that I agree with that, but I think dominating a Champions League or an International Tournament generally sways the voters. When neither nominee has done that, then I think more credence is given to the individual who was better.. and 91 goals was such a ridiculous achievement, it's hard to see past Messi as the deserved winner, even if Ronaldo has won La Liga.
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What made the difference was ultimately the start of the season.The Spanish title was important and Ronaldo would have been Ballon d'Or if it was awarded in September.I have absolutely no doubt about that.
It's just that in the meantime, Messi broke several goalscoring records and has taken the entire attention from him.The Spanish league title is a major title, not as decisive as the others but it still plays a non negligeable role.
 
Maciek said:
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Of course he's the ultimate agenda-bearing conspiracy theorist, and his rhetoric is better than his logic, but there's still more than a few grains of truth in there.

His point about defensive work is especially worth highlighting. People still peddle the rubbish about Ronaldo not doing defensive work for the team but anyone who watches him knows that he does. He takes responsibility for his wing - you will almost never see Marcelo left to fend for himself, Ronaldo always chases his full-back. And against decent teams, he almost always gets called back for set pieces, and does the same sort of sterling defensive work there that Van Persie is praised for doing for us.

Which is not to say that Messi doesn't put in a good defensive shift, but he does so in a limited area which never forces him to stray too far from the opposition goal. He presses the CBs and DMs, and doesn't go back to defend set pieces.
 
Jaybezia said:

I love the man, agree with him totally, he didn't say Ronaldo is better than Messi, he just pointed out a lot of reasons for CR winning the BD'Or
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Agreed. It's something I say a lot too, it isn't to discredit Messi but he did grow up at Barcelona with his team mates, playing the same style from the time he arrived to this point in time now. He is the absolute fulcrum of the team, everything has to go through Messi. He is still a brilliant footballer but for these reasons I want to see Messi somewhere else just to see how he would perform. I'd assume it would be a similar case to Argentina, where he is still clearly world class but is less effective. How much? Well that's the question.
 
Got blanked by Guardiola, he can be just as bad as Mourinho sometimes but im sure he had a good reason eh? hes a caf favourite.
 
He hasn't displaced anything like the level of pathetic behaviour Mourinho has so that'll be why he doesn't get the same criticism Mourinho gets, sure you knew that.

Classless from Guardiola though
 
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