Right, so just so everyone's clear and on the same page, were disregarding goals. Got it? DISREGARDING GOALS.
Now, go on, compare them people. But please keep goals out of it.
Cristiano Ronaldo
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Now, go on, compare them people. But please keep goals out of it.
And Ronaldo isn't better than Messi. Do you genuinely believe Ronaldo back in the mid noughties would have won the individual accolades so easily against say Ronaldinho of 2005? Big fat feckin no.
I'm not saying he isn't, I'm just making the point that Henry was up against some fantastic players.
As good as Henry was, I don't for one second believe he is better than Ronaldo, its laughable in fact.
Don't twist my words. Ronaldo is one of the greatest goal scorers of all time. He's not one of the greatest players. otherwise I could say Gerd Muller was better than Maradona.
Exactly my point. That Ronaldo has improved and kept up with Messi is infinitely more impressive than Henry consistently failing to nail down the spot of the best player in the world. If you put a player of Ronaldo's quality and had him start his career in the late 90's, without Messi's competition he would had won at least 5/6 Ballon D'Ors. Hell, the modern era has plenty of great players, but Ronaldo/Messi have raised the bar for excellence so high that anything less than 1 goal a game for them is a disappointment, whereas during the 90's/early 2000's you were a great striker if you could get 1 in 2.
You seem to be blinkered here, Ronaldo will go down as one of the Worlds greatest, maybe hes not better than Messi, but hes in that elite group, Henry was not.
So Kaka and Messi are not good players to compete with? 
Even Kaka in his prime was capable of doing things Henry would never be able to pull off.
Even Kaka in his prime was capable of doing things Henry would never be able to pull off.
When Ronaldo was at his best, there was three premiership teams in the semis of the CL each year (06/07, 07/08, 08/09). United, arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool were 4 of the top 5 teams in Europe during those years. There was nowhere near such dominance from premiership teams when henry was at his best. Until 06 arsenal were mostly disappointing in Europe (that was not down to henry though).
It's possible no one is better than messi so obviously Ronaldo isn't.
Are you actually bigging up Henry's competition for these awards? You do realise that's a pointless exercise given Ronaldo is competing with messi, right?
He's in an elite group because he's pulling up stupid numbers, and like I said before, that seems to win you the Ballon d'Or these days. He wasn't Real's best player last season or at least the most important throughout the Champions League, yet the mighty impressive statistic of 17 goals wins him the best player in Europe. Go figure.
Exactly, that proves the quality of the PL was better from 06-09 rather than 2004 lol.
And Henry isn't in the conversation for either.
Love to have him back, and if there was even a sniff it was possible United would be all over it, the extra sponsors he would pull in would be worth it alone, sad to bring that up but that's just how it is.
He's a great guy who clearly loves, and cares for our club still even though he's moved on, not sure the same could be said if a certain player had 'moved on' to Chelsea last year.
He's a great guy who clearly loves, and cares for our club still even though he's moved on, not sure the same could be said if a certain player had 'moved on' to Chelsea last year.
Jeez that Shed End guy is an absolute melt! He's making half of this up as he goes a long haha.
Well what else would prove it other than the performances of clubs in the biggest club competition? lol
I've got a question - who apart from Ronaldo has won a ballon d'or due to "pulling stupid numbers" (and presumably not on merit) in recent years?
Your treating his goals like they mean nothing, they wouldn't have won the Champions League without them, its that simple. He puts the fear of God into teams which gives other players the freedom they need.
His all round play is exceptional, not just his goal scoring, I've no idea what player you watch, if you actually watch him.
There's an argument Messi in 2010. He scored 47 goals, but wasn't as pivital as say Sneijder in his team success (A treble too). I disagree with it because he was frighteningly good in the league, but it's a valid argument.
Next year:
433
Di Maria-Falcao-Ronaldo
433
Di Maria-Falcao-Ronaldo
Right, what part of his 'exceptional' all round play is so much better than Henry's? I'm genuinely surprised at the number saying it isn't close without any reason why.
So Ronaldo sucks because he didn't have to compete with Zidane, Ronaldinho, Figo etc?
But it's funny how you don't acknowledge the fact that C Ronaldo has had to compete with Messi, Kaka, Iniesta and Xavi
But it's funny how you don't acknowledge the fact that C Ronaldo has had to compete with Messi, Kaka, Iniesta and Xavi
I'd still side with Messi in that one. While Sneijder was superb for Inter, if you had asked people who the best player in the world was at that time then they would've said Messi. He still had a great year overall, and it could've just taken a goal in that Inter semi-final for everything to change and for Messi to have ended up going on to win another CL. Not that I'd have begrudged Sneijder the award, but I don't disagree with Messi getting it on that occasion.
As a player who can on his own take you to glory - Ronaldo > Henry for me.
As an entertainer - Henry > Ronaldo.
The sheer understatement of Henry's ability is this thread is amazing.
As an entertainer - Henry > Ronaldo.
The sheer understatement of Henry's ability is this thread is amazing.
Desailly joined Chelsea when he was 30 and past his prime. When Henry was his age he was becoming a bench player for Barcelona and then went to America.
It's a whole another thing to see Desailly being bullied whilst playing for Milan then when he was playing for Chelsea.
Eh? He'd just won the World Cup and was then pivital in the year we nearly (and should have) won the league. You don't turn to shit at 30 years old, and he was courted by other big clubs in 1999. Yes he wasn't the same player he was at Milan, but he was by no means past it.
FFS. If I read that 21yr old Edwards is better than Ronaldo, imma flip a switch. It's insane.
How old are you, out of interest? Have you seen Edwards live?
Both were great players - equally so for me.
Henry had a spell where he was unplayable to be fair to him. Great, great player in his prime and as good as the PL has seen.
If you want to come to Man Utd, then feel free to come here Ronaldo. You're just having selective pangs of homesickness whenever you have contract negotiations with Real Madrid.
Oh right.
Whoa, steady on there, amol!
Why is it insane? You only have to read what his peers thought of him as a player to know that he was something very, very special. He's iconic really.
How can anyone say Henry is as good if not better than Ronaldo? Ronaldo is better than him in every way and that's without mentioning the goal scoring records vs each other.
He'll be over rated due to the tragic circumstances surrounding his death.
I'm sorry but Ronaldo is the best player who's ever played in England. Again people won't agree, but the standard the game is at nowadays is an all time high, and imo Messi and Ronaldo are the best players to have played the game. Some players like Ronaldinho or Zidane may have been more aesthetically pleasing, but Messi and Ronaldo just destroy teams and set stupidly high records.
How can you know he was overrated, did you see him play?
He could have had all the natural talent and potential in the world, however, tragically, he did not do enough to be considered better than Ronaldo.
I'd disagree with alot of that to tell you the truth, since football is a business now with the bigger clubs grabbing the best of the best which means that quite a number of matches they play are comfortable for them, especially if they play to a certain level. That's why players like Ronaldo and Messi are scoring for fun really: always bound to get chances when you're playing with the type of quality their teams possess. That's why records don't mean much to me to tell you the truth.
As for Ronaldo being the best ever in England and himself and Messi being the best ever: I can't agree at all. They're not all rounders. Highly effective players but when you read about Edwards he could play in any position and dominate a game. It's not all about goals and stats when it comes to a game of football. It's about presence and desire..... and apparently he had a winning aura about him and an indomitable spirit. You don't get many of those type of players anymore.
Ronaldo gets plenty of protection nowadays and pitches, balls, conditioning etc have improved. It also helps that he has the luxury of playing with so many wonderful players.
Edwards was a different breed by all accounts. Didn't have a flaw in his game and could play anywhere on the pitch. Sure Bobby Charlton said he was the greatest player ever to play the game and he's played against and watched his fair share of wonderful footballers.
I'm sorry, but that doesn't make him better than Ronaldo or Messi. We're just getting into Silly Valley, now. This was a lad who died at the young age of 21 - he can't be considered the greatest at anything, by virtue of that fact. If Messi, Pele, Maradona etc. had retired all at 21 we wouldn't be able to call them the best in the world, and quite rightly so. The same logic applies to Edwards. He's one of those players I'm sure is greatly admired by the old-timers who saw him and this, combined with the tragedy of his life, propels his legend into stratospheres that just aren't appropriate. It's like when people admire artists/musicians/actors who die too early, their 'lost potential' transcends into greatness, through nostalgia mainly. Life doesn't work like that.
The original quote though was about United legends... that's why I responded because undoubtedly he will always be up there with the other icons we have at the club. Not sure Ronaldo can sit up there with Edward, Best, Charlton, Cantona etc.
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