Im actually mixed race, and most of my friends are black. But it's funny because your stereotypes seem more racist than anything that cop did.
Cop in America doing a bad job, again
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Of course. Do they enjoy it when you dismiss racism so casually and denigrate programs that are designed to help people overcome 200+ years of institutionalized discrimination in the US?
Well thinking all black people should think the same also seems more racist than this cop in this video.
Never claimed that but she's a real threat, isn't she? Funny how he started roughing her up the minute she started talking to metro PD. I guess she was a threat to his career in that moment.
I'm not saying the cop was right, just that he probably wasn't racist. and in my opinion the only way to fix these issues is by getting at the heart of the problem instead of labellum people racist every time something happens.
Ahh, my bad. I shouldn't listen to so much Public Enemy.
Ok, but for me the heart of the problem is that in the southern US it seems a vast majority of whites don't like black people very much. A lot of those people carry that attitude to work with them.
In this instance a very minor traffic violation set everything off. Something that most people probably wouldn't get pulled up on, I'm basing that on what I see everyday in the fourth largest metropolitan area in North America. So I think it's valid to return to my original question of the officer's motive in pulling her over in the first place. Granted, the video says it was March 31st so he may have had a ticket quota to meet.
Im not saying there aren't racists in America, or specifically the south, but it isn't a "vast majority" in any way shape or form. Fortunately, things have gotten a lot better, regardless of how terrible it all seems on Tv.
As for why he pulled her over, I'm not sure. I think there are too many variables to determine if it was definitely race related. It's not like it was an unwarranted stop. It could have been because he's a strict officer that gives everybody he sees violate a law a ticket. He could have been an officer wanting to pull her over just to explain what she did wrong. (I got pulled over once for having an air freshener hanging from my mirror). He could have, like you said, pulled her over to meet a quote. Or, he could have pulled her over because she is black. It's just too hard for me to tell in this instance and that's why I think it's not right to label this as a racist incident.
Being of mixed race myself but having white skin, I can tell you with confidence that the vast majority of white people hold some form of racist beliefs toward blacks, native americans, asians...pretty much everyone who isn't white. I jokingly refer to myself as a double agent because people act normally around me and very often the racism comes out. Sadly, we'll need another generation or two before it's almost gone.
I'm not sure we have evidence that the stop was warranted, do we? It's just the word of a police officer who roughed a woman up because she called the police to complain about him.
Everyone is racist and prejudiced
To be honest she deserved to be arrested, cop stops her and she calls 911 -why? Second she stepped out of her car and not giving the documents to the cop doesn't matter if you black, white or Martian you will be arrested. She's stupid and soon or later cops will refuse to do the work and we will end up with the national guard doing their job.
From the video the cop is obviously in the wrong here, and will hopefully be punished for his conduct, but the woman could have handled this differently. Take the ticket and then ask that the dashcam footage of the infraction be presented in court. If it is as she says, and she did nothing to warrant the stop, then the ticket would be thrown out.
When you say white then let's divide which whites we are talking about, at work they nicely label me as south European (the Americans with north (specially Germanic) European parents), same to the ladies who work in the school kitchen (Greek), I know the Irish and Italians had the same problem in the beginning of the 20 century and today they moved up from the lower division to the premier. For us Portuguese is no white/black mix but a mulato or mulata (feck they are hot) and for the north Europeans all "mulatos" are black.
I think was Houston or another city but the black guy who got shot after he told the police he had a gun was shot by a Hispanic officer and the media rarely mention that in hope a tragedy would happen with the so called #blacklivesmatterifkilledbyawhite
Probably is the case and that's why they give more tickets at the end of the month.
people are racist regardless of color. the japanese think they are better than koreans and chinese. mainland italians look down their noses at sicilians. and the wheel keeps turning.
and as someone else posted - if your state is running out of cash the police will be out en force to hand out tickets to put cash in the coffers
Yeah, I meant to say that as well but thanks to European Imperialism whites did it better than anyone else and, rightly, having caused the most damage with it (i.e. the slave trade) tend to get the most flak for it. I mean, with all that racial superiority Caucasians should have a firm understanding by now that 'race' is a bogus concept and skin colour has scant significance outside of protecting folic acid in the blood of fertile women from UV damage and the production of vitamin D in developing children.
I always find it interesting when white people tell others about racism, including 'things are better now' and 'there's racism everywhere' as if that's some sort of solace or justification.
There is racism everywhere, for example black Americans are racist towards black Africans.
The only thing black Americans can do to black Africans is call them names, stereotypes and say they're poor or uneducated. As a black African I'd know.
It's hardly the same as systemic or institutional racism. Plus we could go into the history behind the depiction of black Africans on western media which has led to such negative stereotypes being born in the first place, and it certainly wasn't done by black Americans. But that's another discussion.
Point is, we need to be careful trying to generalise racism to just name calling and ill feeling towards another group.
It's not that simple quite frankly, but is used to diminish the effects of actual racism.
'Black people are racist towards other black people too!', that doesn't make racism okay and all that it proves is that black people are capable of being stupid & insulting human beings, just like everybody else, so I guess they aren't so different then right? Black people (or any other race) shouldn't have to be perfect human beings in order to treated the same.
Must admit I'm having some trouble understanding the fuss about this video. I don't live in the USA and have never been there so the only knowledge I have of American traffic cops stopping cars has come from the programmes shown on the television in the UK, the "real life" ones where they follow the cops in their work.
What most amazed me when I watched them was how the cops stop anyone and everyone (be they black, white or sky blue pink) for the slightest offence and then when they stop them they approach the car very carefully in case one of the occupants has a gun. They rarely let them reach for anything (again in case it's a gun) and more often than not the occupants have to get out of the car straight away and are then handcuffed, seemingly as a safety precaution for all. Then they get about the business of dealing with the offence.
Really couldn't believe it when I first started watching these programmes. What I'm getting at is that I was amazed she was even allowed to reach for her phone, never mind refuse to hand over her documents, without getting cuffed first. They were much firmer with these minor traffic offences on all the programmes I watched, so to me he was a very tolerant and patient cop.
What most amazed me when I watched them was how the cops stop anyone and everyone (be they black, white or sky blue pink) for the slightest offence and then when they stop them they approach the car very carefully in case one of the occupants has a gun. They rarely let them reach for anything (again in case it's a gun) and more often than not the occupants have to get out of the car straight away and are then handcuffed, seemingly as a safety precaution for all. Then they get about the business of dealing with the offence.
Really couldn't believe it when I first started watching these programmes. What I'm getting at is that I was amazed she was even allowed to reach for her phone, never mind refuse to hand over her documents, without getting cuffed first. They were much firmer with these minor traffic offences on all the programmes I watched, so to me he was a very tolerant and patient cop.
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Surprised this hasn't been mentioned, unless I missed it. A crew of Chicago cops that goes around busting heads. They call them the Skullcap crew. Shockingly, there is a dearth of disciplinary actions against them.
Edit: linkage. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/aug/03/chicago-skullcap-crew-police-brutality
Edit: linkage. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/aug/03/chicago-skullcap-crew-police-brutality
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I find it interesting that so many blacks lean so heavily on the racism crutch.
Quite simply it is very much a Liverpool mentality...always the victim, it's never your fault.
Read the title as 'Capatan America' 
Wow. The ignorance here is simply embarrassing to read.
Black Americans can be totally racist and especially to white people. All races are inherently racist but when you have had hundreds of years of oppression and still are targeted because of your skin pigment then its really hard to expect them to take a passive position on this.
Thats just completely horrible ignorant bullshit. Id hate to think what you thought of the Irish.
Not even worth a response to be honest, but at least your ignorance and true feelings have come to light
The system is a byproduct of reality as well as perception, while I am sure there are people within the system (historically) that have manipulated its implementation to serve their own particular agenda's, it is often simply 'cause and effect'. At some point, there was a necessity to treat various members of society somewhat differently, whether this registers as 'right or wrong' is irrelevant, I am merely highlighting the concept.... As a direct consequence programs were implemented to tackle what the public perceived as being a 'threat'. The notion of 'racial discrimination' is intertwined with socio economic status, more crime is inherently found in lower income areas where the socio economic status of its inhabitants lend themselves to criminality. As stated in a previous post, the reason why the vast majority of these poverty stricken areas are made up of minorities is open to debate, however, it is a fact never the less. Ergo, if crime is associated with lower income areas and the vast majority of these low income areas are populated by Black Americans, Latino American's etc... then the logical association (think Pavlov's dog's Classical Conditioning) between Crime and Ethnicity is positively reinforced. Again, this isn't an endorsement, but it does set a level of context that is often overlooked.
Does this mean the system is 'racist'? Perhaps depending on your perspective, however, it is important to acknowledge that there is a reason it exists.... cause and effect.
This is an interesting grouping of statistics compiled by the BJS, shows some of the issues faced, but it also shows disparities between genders and other variables that are consistent with the same psychological and physiological profiling methods as highlighted above:
This article is a little longer, but it's definitely worth a read irrespective of your personal stance:
http://www.amren.com/archives/reports/the-color-of-crime-2016-revised-edition/
Some additional statistical figures for reference:
http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=702
Here is another table of statistics showing various ethnicities and arrests:
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2013/crime-in-the-u.s.-2013/tables/table-43
No one is suggesting that 'Stereotypes' are fundamentally true, however, there is a reason that a Stereotype exists, it is loosely based upon experiences albeit subjective and dated for the most part. With that knowledge though, people are often subject to 'Stereotype Threat' whereby they subconsciously fulfill the said stereotype as it is an expected action.... you can see where this becomes a vicious circle though, as a non accurate stereotype is positively reinforced by those observing and thus creating the illusion that it is both accurate and true.
A good little video from a Stanford Professor on Stereotype Threat (and this isn't simply based around Race:
While i do agree with the notion that people shouldn't be pulled over based upon 'race' alone, it is simply impossible to remove it from the equation. If I am looking for a radical insurgent with ties to ISIS, then the ethnicity, gender and physical appearance are fundamentally important. This is profiling of course, but in the role and context of its application it is almost impossible for it to be removed... and nor should it in this case.
The real issues may appear to be racial in nature on the surface, but when you look a little deeper they are more intertwined with economical status and poverty.... and that is an entirely different discussion!
Poverty is a huge factor in crime etc but poverty and race are linked, trying to seperate the two is foolish. Its the same thing all over the world.
Of course both are linked, but they are linked via socio economic factors. You are not simply poor because you are a minority, conversely, you are not simply rich because you are white. They have variables that contribute to one another but they are not mutually exclusive.
You seem to be working very hard to minimise the relevance and impact of racism here. I find your comments to be suspicious in intent. In some situations and countries racism is a major factor relating to poverty, crime then becomes a function of that racism.
Minimize? I don't see where that has been the case, I would suggest that I am merely not allowing 'topical issues' cloud the judgement of events. Racism obviously does exist and sadly it is something that needs to be addressed. However, to suggest that 'racism' is the root cause of all ills, poverty, crime, disenchantment, the failure of society etc... without actually looking at the root cause is 'equally suspicious' and arguably more divisive. Making a statement justifying crime as a response to 'racism' (validating via a cause and effect approach) is typical fodder for the 'racism crutch' that was highlighted (however misguided) above.
My original statement stands on its specific merits.... If you wish to take that as minimizing the impact of racism then that is your prerogative.
Every comment you have made in this thread works towards minimising the level of racism in social issues. Every one, even your responses to me. Thats how i am interpreting it anyway. If its not what you are trying to do you are doing a very poor job of articulating your thoughts as far as i can tell.
I think you are working very hard to minimise the importance of racism through out your comments in this thread. I stand by my comments too.
As stated, 'minimizing' is your perspective and thus 100% subjective.
I have simply presented data and qualitative metrics to show that the problem may just be a little bigger than what is 'painted on the tin', it isn't an attempt to minimize its impact, but by the same token it isn't to suggest it is the be all and end all either. The ability to look at all the data irrespective of your personal bias and what you hope it highlights, is a dying art.
I have simply presented data and qualitative metrics to show that the problem may just be a little bigger than what is 'painted on the tin', it isn't an attempt to minimize its impact, but by the same token it isn't to suggest it is the be all and end all either. The ability to look at all the data irrespective of your personal bias and what you hope it highlights, is a dying art.
Has some one cleared up the thread here? The woman was completely in the wrong.
Yeah but systemic racism and white people are all racist and all that
Except the fact that people like this idiot of a woman do nothing but enforce an even further divide.
What is ignorant and embarrassing is this woman's behavior. Her actions do nothing but hurt those of us that actually have a desire to improve things.
Who the feck asks for another police officer as if this were customer service at McDonalds?
And why get out of the car when pulled over by the cops?
And why get out of the car when pulled over by the cops?
Using statistics to define and understand human behaviour is nice in theory but ignores a lot of variables which won't show up in your data.
For example does it highlight the ethnic neighbourhoods which were flourishing, creating jobs, businesses, top schools and comparatively high incomes - only to be burned to the ground by neighbouring white neighbours? That then keeps the status quo and doesn't allow blacks and other minorities to create their own wealth.
What about the Ronald Reagan era and the introduction of drugs in targeted communities? Which not only creates a cycle of abuse, but often times removes a parent or both parents from households forcing kids to grow up not just in poverty but without guidance.
Education funding being directly linked to the affluence of the area in which the school is?
The FBI's illegal activities relating to the Black Panthers, MLK, Malcolm X, James Baldwin and similar organisations and individuals?
I could go on, point is, you can't reduce the construct of racism to data, all the data will show you is a very one dimensional perspective that doesn't take into account human behaviour influenced by racism. I mean you're talking about crime and ethnicity as if there isn't other data that proves racial profiling exists. Then you've got human accounts who have worked in the force who will also tell you the same. But that won't show in statistics, all you'll see is positive reinforcement that crime and ethnicity are linked. That was kind of the point. If you over police any area you'll find all sorts of crime. When you've got people of ethnic minorities getting larger sentences for the same crime as white people, usually drug related.
What you won't see is members of the KKK knowingly hired by police forces. Or judges, lawyers, businessmen being part of the KKK also.
So again while it is not all as it appears on the surface about racism. Using data is a way of minimising the effect of racism, but also the behaviour of humans with regards to racism is very one dimensional.