Music Commercial Hip Hop Thread

[Roman Bellic]

How important is a classic album? Not many rappers can claim to have the run Lil' Wayne did from about 2005 until 2008.

Not that important any more, it is much harder to release a classic album nowadays, you have so many materials to digest that you wouldn't have the time to appreciate an album(bar kendrick), as opposed to the old days.

You also have to take into account the fact that almost everyone listens to hip hop now so the general consensus would be skewed, you create a questionnaire asking for classic albums and a 14 year old writes "Sremmlife" by Rae Sremmurd rendering your whole questionnaire invalid, of course it might be a classic to him,but i doubt you would still be motivated to carry on with your questions.

Lastly, Almost every album follows the same blueprint ( notice i used the word blueprint in honour of the G.O.A...... never mind), Labels are all about that paper so you would need at least 2 radio songs, they are basically in charge of your album production which means your album might not come out the way you want it to.

 

[Roman Bellic]

In the wake of Kendricks second straight classic album, Hiphopwired.com made a list of 15 veteran rappers who they feel haven't dropped a classic in their careers. Here it goes.

1. Cassidy- He's sticking more to battle rap these days
2. Beanie Sigel- Some solid albums but no classic
3. Pras- The least talented member of the Fugees failed with his solo career.
4. Mase- He had a chance to have at least one, but Harlem world fell short of being a classic. It had some classic cuts though
5. Nelly
6. Gucci Mane
7. Lupe Fiasco- Still hasn't made a classic for me
8. Eve- Eve is a very skilled rapper and she had her time in the sun. She could've made a classic but it wasn't for the lack of trying. Her efforts were solid
9. J. Cole- Born Sinner is a very good album, not a classic to me (yet). Some people think forest hills dr is better than TPAB!
10. Xzibit

Its all debatable. Some fans will swear all these artists have made classics

Drake - You can make a classic album from his hits alone though

 

[Roman Bellic]

How about classic mixtapes? do mixtapes count?

Meek Mill
Drake
Big Sean
Lil Wayne
Curren$y
J.Cole
Wiz Khalifa
Mac Miller
Logic
DJ Drama (?)
Chance the Rapper (?)
The Weeknd,Frank Ocean,Future,A$ap Rocky.... okay, yes i'm slightly reaching now.

These guys all have classic mixtapes

I guess you have to include Gucci in there somewhere, cause when you have a billion mixtapes at least 1 should be a classic, i wouldn't know cause i don't listen to Gucci that much.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

Mixtapes are probably more important than albums now. They give artists that freedom to explore and make music they actually want to make rather than conform to any prescriptive formula.

 

[Loublaze]

50 cent is my favourite guy on a hook no doubt, Rihanna,Nate Dogg,R kelly and Pharell aren't really rappers, hooks are kind of their specialty..... but yeah 50 is right at the top.

His hook on "New York Times" - J.cole, still gives me chills.

Yea that was an awesome hook and beat. Like Window shopper, Stunt 101

Mixtapes are probably more important than albums now. They give artists that freedom to explore and make music they actually want to make rather than conform to any prescriptive formula.

This has always been the case. I think mixtapes had more notoriety back in the 90s and early to mid 2000s though. Maybe its just the format of consumption, idk. Mixtape Mondays used to be big. There was more hand to hand distribution that you don't see much anymore, even in the cradle of Hiphop and the mixtape game New York. The culture has changed. All about datpiff

 

[Roman Bellic]

The creative freedom on mixtapes is dope, i don't think every rapper should drop an album, an album should be for cats that have stories (relevant) to tell.

Sometimes those stories might carry on from your mixtapes.

take J.cole for example

Mixtapes - "If only i could make it to the top"

Pre 2014 FHD - "i am going to make it to the top" - This dragged on for too long IMO, i was getting disgusted at the fact that a grown ass man (25+) was still calling himself "Young Simba" and talking about how he plans to takeover the rap game, like dude you are already 5 mix tapes and 2 albums in, take it already.

2014 FHD - "I made it to the top", he finally took it and ran with it ...albeit not very far *Kendrick cashes in his Money in the Bank briefcase/contract, just as Cole survives a cage match and wins the Belt*, FHD channeled a different J.cole, his perspective was from the top of the rap game this time.

Fans love it when rappers crown themselves king and as a result - As of March 25, 2015, 2014 FHD has sold a total of 992,687 copies in the United States, he is getting his first platinum plaque before the summer ends.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Fans love it when rappers crown themselves king and as a result - As of March 25, 2015, 2014 FHD has sold a total of 992,687 copies in the United States, he is getting his first platinum plaque before the summer ends.

It doesn't work for everyone though, you just cant crown yourself king and expect your album sales to triple in size, yes I'm talking to you Maino and Papoose, i see both of you reading this, you guys don't count.

You can wear a burger king crown round Brooklyn all you want.

 

[Roman Bellic]

#April7th

 

[ArmchairCritic]

This has always been the case. I think mixtapes had more notoriety back in the 90s and early to mid 2000s though. Maybe its just the format of consumption, idk. Mixtape Mondays used to be big. There was more hand to hand distribution that you don't see much anymore, even in the cradle of Hiphop and the mixtape game New York. The culture has changed. All about datpiff

Yeah the whole format of mixtapes have changed, from actual mixes to jacking other rappers beats to now mostly being standalone bodies of actual work. I think G-Unit and DJ Drama have been very influential in that progression, and the internet of course.

 

[Loublaze]

Yeah the whole format of mixtapes have changed, from actual mixes to jacking other rappers beats to now mostly being standalone bodies of actual work. I think G-Unit and DJ Drama have been very influential in that progression, and the internet of course.

DJ Green Lantern as well, 2000s and on. Yea G-unit took it to another level. Those mixtapes as well as Eminem's with Green lantern were legendary. As far as them becoming standalone bodies of work I think a lot of that credit has to go to DJ Clue, Funk master Flex and Kay Slay for building those foundations

 

[MajorTom]

My friend told me to check this rapper out who came after a mention of 5 or so other rappers who when he mentioned them I did nothing but laugh at their names. This guy had the best name of the bunch which isn't saying much, he goes by the name of 7evenThirty. Couple of tracks I have listened to are quite good. Not many views on his videos so thought I would link one. This song has the best flow from what I've listened to so far -



If you like that then Hook Heavy is worth checking out. The guitar riff on the instrumental is quality.

 

[Roman Bellic]

 

[Loublaze]

The rappers who sound alike list. I'll add videos of the lesser known rapper of the two being compared where I feel appropriate. A lot of similarities are simply down to influences and coming from the same towns/boroughs. Some of these are really strange though...

1. Biggie and Gorilla Black- Shyne used to be the guy compared to Biggie, but the more you listened to him you could tell them apart easily. Gorilla Black on the other hand sounded like a Biggie clone (big's voice was a tad deeper though), he even sounded like Big when talking. Last time I heard from him he switched his style big time.





2. Drake and Kyle- Who the feck is Kyle? Just heard about him recently. Dude sounds a lot like Drake. A cornier version.



3. Slick Rick and Dana Dane- If it wasn't for Dana Dane always mentioning his name on his tracks I would've never told the difference. This is waaay back folks. This joint is a Halloween classic



4. Jay-Z, Bathgate and Sacario

I'd say Bathgate sounds more like Jay than Sacario does, but many people thought they both sounded just like Jigga. Sacario has Jigga's voice but his style is slightly different. Bathgate on the other hand has the voice and the style. They're both Brooklyn cats anyway. First vid is Sacario, fast forward to 58 seconds in and when he says 'one take' you think its Jay Z. They're more Jigga impersonators on this list...who would've thought.





5. Bone thugs n Harmony and Do or die- Both groups are mid west legends. I used to confuse them

 

[Loublaze]

6. Action Bronson and Ghostface Killah- I also think AB sounds like a combination of Fat Joe and Big Pun sometimes. Strange! They're both in the track below, you can see the similarities.



7. Angelous and ROE- These two motherfeckaz sound just like Jay Z. Its actually ridiculous. ROE looks nothing like his voice. Angelous even did a mixtape cut over the Blueprint 2 track and mentions the other Jigga style jackers. No shame!





8. Rich Homie Quan and Future

9. Mase, Loon and Fabolous- Kings of the lazy flow

10. Nas and Your old Droog- Interesting one. This cat has a voice similar to the Game but a flow similar to Nas

 

[Loublaze]

Foxxy Brown and Lil Kim- This one is obvious and one of the most well known. Both these women are from Brooklyn of course and both modeled their flow on Biggie.

@dxadel That Luda joint is really good. Vintage Punchline Luda! One interesting thing, the car in that cover is actually his. Its a 1993 Acura Legend he bought in 99 and he says he still drives it.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Foxxy Brown and Lil Kim- This one is obvious and one of the most well known. Both these women are from Brooklyn of course and both modeled their flow on Biggie.

@dxadel That Luda joint is really good. Vintage Punchline Luda! One interesting thing, the car in that cover is actually his. Its a 1993 Acura Legend he bought in 99 and he says he still drives it.

yeah, peeped the interview on the BFC.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Rappers that sound alike - extended list

Lil Zane - 2pac
Black Haze - 2pac
Ja Rule tried to bite from 2pac and DMX at some point in his career
Hayden Wright - Eminem ( he is a clone)
Young Thug is definitely trying to clone Tunechi (notice i said tunechi and not Wayne or Weezy)
Redcafe (the rapper...lol) - Birdman (same voice,same struggle bars, its even worse when you don't have a Lil Wayne verse to look forward to)

 

[Roman Bellic]

Speaking of Birdman, the only song he has ever killed in his entire career - which spans all the way to 1997.

 

[Loublaze]

Rappers that sound alike - extended list

Lil Zane - 2pac
Black Haze - 2pac
Ja Rule tried to bite from 2pac and DMX at some point in his career
Hayden Wright - Eminem ( he is a clone)
Young Thug is definitely trying to clone Tunechi (notice i said tunechi and not Wayne or Weezy)
Redcafe (the rapper...lol) - Birdman (same voice,same struggle bars, its even worse when you don't have a Lil Wayne verse to look forward to)

Yea, DMX was also accused of being a pac Swagga jacka. Ja and X both wearing bandanas early in their careers didn't help, but I personally feel they all just had deep voices and distinct styles. I also think Redcafe sounds like Royce da 5'9 but ill listen again for that Birdman comparison

 

[shabz]

The creative freedom on mixtapes is dope, i don't think every rapper should drop an album, an album should be for cats that have stories (relevant) to tell.

Sometimes those stories might carry on from your mixtapes.

take J.cole for example

Mixtapes - "If only i could make it to the top"

Pre 2014 FHD - "i am going to make it to the top" - This dragged on for too long IMO, i was getting disgusted at the fact that a grown ass man (25+) was still calling himself "Young Simba" and talking about how he plans to takeover the rap game, like dude you are already 5 mix tapes and 2 albums in, take it already.

2014 FHD - "I made it to the top", he finally took it and ran with it ...albeit not very far *Kendrick cashes in his Money in the Bank briefcase/contract, just as Cole survives a cage match and wins the Belt*, FHD channeled a different J.cole, his perspective was from the top of the rap game this time.

Fans love it when rappers crown themselves king and as a result - As of March 25, 2015, 2014 FHD has sold a total of 992,687 copies in the United States, he is getting his first platinum plaque before the summer ends.

Your point is flawed is it not? J. Cole goes out of his way to say he is not a king in 'Fire Sqaud'.

'While the people debate who's the king of this rap game
Here comes lil' ol' Jermaine
With every ounce of strength in his veins
To snatch the crown from whoever y'all think has it
But rather than place it on his head as soon as he grabs it
Poof, boom, paow, it's like magic
With a flash and a BANG the crown disintegrates
And falls to the Earth from which it came
It's done
Ain't gonna be no more kings
Be wary of any man that claims
Because deep down he clings onto the need for power
But in reality he's a coward
Ultimately he's scared to die'

He is just an intelligent rapper and one who raps about real life situations which makes him accessible to a lot of listeners. Sometimes you will have rappers who have digested a dictionary and thesaurus and just spit a whole load of over complicated, have to think hard about lyrics. The list of best rappers always consist of ground breakers and story tellers. Either way its going to be the hype or lyrics that makes fans the music, music that sells well will have to either have a lot of relatable lyrics or be just have a hype around it that blind people's judgement.

 

[Loublaze]

Speaking of Birdman, the only song he has ever killed in his entire career - which spans all the way to 1997.

This is a really good verse by his standards...he's no rapper like Diddy but he's done better/equal to this IMO. Do you strictly mean to say (in your opinion) this is the only track where you think he had the best verse or/and do you think this is his best verse ever as well?

 

[bleezy]

Speaking of Birdman, the only song he has ever killed in his entire career - which spans all the way to 1997.

Birdman had some decent verses in his day. This one below I think he holds his own with the Clipse, which is no mean feat.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Your point is flawed is it not? J. Cole goes out of his way to say he is not a king in 'Fire Sqaud'.

'While the people debate who's the king of this rap game
Here comes lil' ol' Jermaine
With every ounce of strength in his veins
To snatch the crown from whoever y'all think has it
But rather than place it on his head as soon as he grabs it
Poof, boom, paow, it's like magic
With a flash and a BANG the crown disintegrates
And falls to the Earth from which it came
It's done
Ain't gonna be no more kings
Be wary of any man that claims
Because deep down he clings onto the need for power
But in reality he's a coward
Ultimately he's scared to die'

He is just an intelligent rapper and one who raps about real life situations which makes him accessible to a lot of listeners. Sometimes you will have rappers who have digested a dictionary and thesaurus and just spit a whole load of over complicated, have to think hard about lyrics. The list of best rappers always consist of ground breakers and story tellers. Either way its going to be the hype or lyrics that makes fans the music, music that sells well will have to either have a lot of relatable lyrics or be just have a hype around it that blind people's judgement.

On 2014 FHD we saw a more arrogant J.Cole, he was telling stories like a rapper who has conquered the game, infact the whole concept of the album is about a lost rapper (J.Cole) finding his way back home as he has achieved mainstream success in Hollywood, but it all seems fake to him, he has to go back home to find himself and surround himself with real people to be happy.
"While the people debate who's the king of the rap game" - Drake,Kendrick. "here comes lil ol' Jermaine (who could only manage gold albums whilst the others went plat), "to snatch the crown from whoever y'all think has it", J.Cole on his previous projects was rapping about going for the crown, on this one he raps like he is close enough to snatch it, which means he sees himself on par with both of them. As for disintegrating the crown, he is just trying to stop the competition between rappers (impossible), notice he wants to snatch the crown before disintegrating it, making him the last king?

He has various lyrics on the album, where he is rapping from the perspective of a rapper at the top, not someone going to the top

"Carolina's finest, you knew that already
And turned to the greatest, I proved that already" - January 28th.

(He went on to call out Drake and Kendrick on this track, whilst also calling himself a "god" mc which is relatively new for Cole. Also calls himself New York's finest - which is basically calling himself the "King of New York")

"Small town nigga Hollywood dreams
I know that everything that glitters ain't gold
I know the shit ain't always good as it seems
But tell me till you get it how could you know?
How could you know? How could you know?" - A tale of 2 citiez

"Dreamville, give us a year we'll be on every show
Yeah, feck nigga I'm very sure
feck the rest, I'm the best nigga out
When I'm back home I'm the best in the South
When I'm in LA I'm the best in the West
You contest?
You can test, I'mma stretch niggas out
Oooh I'mma stretch niggas out
That go for all y'all if I left niggas out
This shit for everbody on my testicles
Please make sure you put the rest in your mouth, ho" - G.O.M.D

"But then I thought back, back to a better me
Before I was a B-list celebrity" - No Role Modelz

"On the road to riches listen this is what you’ll find
The good news is nigga you came a long way
The bad news is nigga you went the wrong way
Think being broke was better".

You can definitely tell J.Cole has evolved into a more confident and arrogant rapper, he is still lyrical but his perspective has definitely changed - he has come along way from being the humble guy that was telling Beyonce how a new bugatti costs a lot more than he is worth.

"Just got paid what Cochran got paid to free OJ"

 

[Roman Bellic]

This is a really good verse by his standards...he's no rapper like Diddy but he's done better/equal to this IMO. Do you strictly mean to say (in your opinion) this is the only track where you think he had the best verse or/and do you think this is his best verse ever as well?

I think this sums it up perfectly, perhaps i was being a little too harsh, i can remember i fecked with his verse on Bow wow's joint, but Birdman post Mannie Fresh has never actually killed a song with other rappers.

 

[Loublaze]

Birdman had some decent verses in his day. This one below I think he holds his own with the Clipse, which is no mean feat.

True. Also liked his verse on 'Tuck ya ice in' with Trick Daddy, Stunting like my daddy verse with Lil Wayne, 'We taking over' verse...and this lesser known gem killed this track IMO and is one of his best verses, for him. His verse starts at 1:54

 

[Loublaze]

I think this sums it up perfectly, perhaps i was being a little too harsh, i can remember i fecked with his verse on Bow wow's joint, but Birdman post Mannie Fresh has never actually killed a song with other rappers.

I agree. He had some good stuff on that Big Tymers album. Numba one stunna! I like some of the stuff he has on the Rich gang mixtape the tour part 2

 

[Loublaze]

Other good Birdman verses i thought of...Pop Bottles and Like father, like son both with Lil wayne. Perhaps we could post some good verses by generally limited/wack rappers. Master P and Diddy have a lot of those haha

 

[Roman Bellic]

Other good Birdman verses i thought of...Pop Bottles and Like father, like son both with Lil wayne. Perhaps we could post some good verses by generally limited/wack rappers. Master P and Diddy have a lot of those haha

Already on it



Diddy shocked the world bruh.

 

[villain]

Other good Birdman verses i thought of...Pop Bottles and Like father, like son both with Lil wayne. Perhaps we could post some good verses by generally limited/wack rappers. Master P and Diddy have a lot of those haha

I always loved this verse by diddy.
He's got a few really good verses tbh

 

[Loublaze]

Already on it



Diddy shocked the world bruh.

I love Diddy. Can't lie. Yea that verse was beast. He also killed it on Wacka Flackas 'Oh lets do it' remix and the 'Welcome to Atlanta' remix. His 'Lets get it' verse with G-dep and Black rob was wicked, so was his verse on 'Bad boy for life'. He doesn't write rhymes, he writes checks! I think the Diddy verse that shocked me in the 2000s was the one on 'Shake that tail feather' with Nelly and Murphy Lee. Nelly says Diddy wrote that shit all by himself at the studio. His most impressive stylistically for me has to be the one on 'Is this the end' on the No way out album feat Twista. He spit that rapid fire midwest flow and kept up with Twista. He did the same on part 2 of the same track title on the forever album. Oh yea, his verse on Faith Evan's 'All night long'

 

[Roman Bellic]

Yung Joc, not necessarily a wack rapper per say...

 

[Loublaze]

I always loved this verse by diddy.
He's got a few really good verses tbh

One of his best. Id say its the best verse but Biggie just killed that ending. Nas ghost writes some goood shit for Diddy. Check these out

 

[Loublaze]

@dxadel Young Joc was the man for a hot minute and @vi1lain two more good recent Diddy verses. The first one is just as good as the future track dxadel posted. Really the king of the remix

First verse.



Second verse


Keeping up with Twista

 

[Roman Bellic]

Lol, @Loublaze Diddy is really not that bad, although i still think Drake was right to steal that 0-100 beat from him, Diddy on that beat would have definitely caused more harm than good.

 

[Loublaze]

Lol, @Loublaze Diddy is really not that bad, although i still think Drake was right to steal that 0-100 beat from him, Diddy on that beat would have definitely caused more harm than good.

Haha yea. Diddy is one of my fav celebrities of all time, don't care what people say about him lol. He guided my fav rapper ever Biggie and I was down for anything Bad boy in the 90s.

Have you heard this Rick Ross track from his Mastermind album? Great tribute to Biggie with the 'You're nobody' beat and a line referencing the great one. His delivery on this was really good and fitting for a beat Biggie rapped on first.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Haha yea. Diddy is one of my fav celebrities of all time, don't care what people say about him lol. He guided my fav rapper ever Biggie and I was down for anything Bad boy in the 90s.

Have you heard this Rick Ross track from his Mastermind album? Great tribute to Biggie with the 'You're nobody' beat and a line referencing the great one. His delivery on this was really good and fitting for a beat Biggie rapped on first.

I love this song, he channeled his inner B.I.G perfectly, more so after being shot at, the Anti-Rick Ross mob voiced their opinion about the classic song - saying he ruined it and what not, i don't think he did.

Diddy's rant in the song is great, it really matches the story and French on the hook is sublime, he is top 3 right now when it comes to hooks, people hate on Rick Ross to somehow validate themselves as "real" "street" "Gangster", he was a C.O... so feck what, C.O's are one of the most corrupt law enforcers in the country, they are the drug dealers, how else do drugs get into prisons? Rick Ross is a great dude, he had not dropped a wack project until Hood Billionaire - haven't listened to it properly though, i really feck with the dude.

 

[Loublaze]

I love this song, he channeled his inner B.I.G perfectly, more so after being shot at, the Anti-Rick Ross mob voiced their opinion about the classic song - saying he ruined it and what not, i don't think he did.

Diddy's rant in the song is great, it really matches the story and French on the hook is sublime, he is top 3 right now when it comes to hooks, people hate on Rick Ross to somehow validate themselves as "real" "street" "Gangster", he was a C.O... so feck what, C.O's are one of the most corrupt law enforcers in the country, they are the drug dealers, how else do drugs get into prisons? Rick Ross is a great dude, he had not dropped a wack project until Hood Billionaire - haven't listened to it properly though, i really feck with the dude.

Rozay is entertaining for sure and you're right about what you said about C.O.s. Reminds me of Oz haha. My favorite album of his is Teflon Don, and his first album Port of Miami has some classics. The Diddy rant in the video was real footage apparently, its no act and Ross asked permission to use it.

 

[Roman Bellic]

Rozay is entertaining for sure and you're right about what you said about C.O.s. Reminds me of Oz haha. My favorite album of his is Teflon Don, and his first album Port of Miami has some classics. The Diddy rant in the video was real footage apparently, its no act and Ross asked permission to use it.

Yeah the footage wasn't scripted, it was Diddy without all the corniness, Oz was a dope show, became weird towards the end but it was cool - i knew it was time to stop watching it when they brought a juju man from Nigeria to control Adebisi....Lmao, he just had to die.

I have every single project Rozay has ever put out, (Well ever since he released Hustlin anyways), you can sit back and shuffle his discography because 95% of his songs sound the same, which limits him as an artiste but is perfect for when you are in the mood to feel like a Boss without having to skip songs.

 

[Loublaze]

@dxadel what do you think of this Birdman verse? He always raps about the same shit and its expected and accepted, I think what makes the verse you posted and this one different is the fact that he departs from his regular style/flow (well towards the end he goes back to his regular stop start style). Its the first one after Young thugs long ass hook

 

[Loublaze]

Yeah the footage wasn't scripted, it was Diddy without all the corniness, Oz was a dope show, became weird towards the end but it was cool - i knew it was time to stop watching it when they brought a juju man from Nigeria to control Adebisi....Lmao, he just had to die.

I have every single project Rozay has ever put out, (Well ever since he released Hustlin anyways), you can sit back and shuffle his discography because 95% of his songs sound the same, which limits him as an artiste but is perfect for when you are in the mood to feel like a Boss without having to skip songs.

I totally get that.