City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th September 2024

Dumbstar said:
And Utd fans are 100% doing exactly the same now with Qatar. None of this changes what City actually became though. They broke FFP and all sorts of rules, not the dancing Liverpool fans in 2006.

I would walk away. I'm not pretending. It seems a few (not a lot, just a few) Utd fans on Redcafe have some decency too and would walk away. Both things are unknown. What is known right now, padre, is that you clearly revelled in the oil and blood as a fact, not assumption.
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I wasn't get stuck into him about the cheating, you already know my feeling on that and we've been through multiple time what I feel should happen City. You literally commended me on my stance on it by the way.

I was going in on him shouting about blood money etc... when his own club clearly chased the "blood money" for years(long before City).
I've seen you say this before and if you do I'll commend you for it but the reality is 99% of people who say what you said actually won't, I'm just honest about it. I'd genuinely love to see Qatar buy you out to see if you stick to your word.

There are literally hundreds of you's in the United/Qatar thread already doing mental gymnastics to backtrack on their words from the last decade right now. Even the majority who stand firm now will still keep following and it will be at most like it was at City and like it would have been at Liverpool a tiny, tiny percentage. I've been consistently honest on how I feel about it at City, its easy to preach when you aren't in that sitution.

I await the day it happens cause honestly I know you'll be doing the same backflips that first I was and now the people who fought with me for a decade are.
 
el_loco_bielsa said:
And Man City supporters wonder why the world thinks they‘ve been sportswashed by a revolting regressive primitive regime which exists due to a bunch of black gold pouring out of the ground where they once pitched their tents.

Exhibit A right here.

Splash out a bunch of billions on a faraway club to buy yourself an instant army of fools who’ll propagate the sheikh’s gospel on every online forum.

In the meantime, continue to practice a mix of 7th-century sharia law coupled with 7th century employment rights and watch as it’s shouted down and whatabouted reductio ad absurdum to within an inch of its life by the fools you’ve bought yourself in Manchester or Paris.

Happening as we speak to the toon army too. Yes, we’ll start another petition because that’s what we do here in the modern civilised world. In the meantime you carry on with your ‘rational’ defence of your owners’ regime and practices.
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Can you genuinely not read? What in my post you quoted defends the sheik? Where have I said anything about Sharia Law? Where have I defended any of the practices in the middle east?

You claim to be civilized but post repeatedly like an angry man child, if you were any way civilized you'd be able to engage in discussion instead of storming in like a loud drunk dipper in Kiev who picks a fight with no brain and then cries and lies about it when he gets something back. If being a loud obnoxious angry man is civilized I guess you've passed.

Again I have never made ANY defence whether rational or irrational of any of AD's regime and practices you numpty! I for one think they are despicable people, with a horrid hr record who have acquired what they have acquired based on a legacy of murder and happening to live where theres lots of oil.

The fact you try and equate me saying the mighty Liverpool chased oil money to those things is frankly insulting, down right stupid of you and pretty much exactly what I expect of angry Dippers.

I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of your post given your club was on its back, legs spread begging for DIC since 2006.
 
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padr81 said:
I wasn't get stuck into him about the cheating, you already know my feeling on that and we've been through multiple time what I feel should happen City. You literally commended me on my stance on it by the way.

I was going in on him shouting about blood money etc... when his own club clearly chased the "blood money" for years(long before City).
I've seen you say this before and if you do I'll commend you for it but the reality is 99% of people who say what you said actually won't, I'm just honest about it. I'd genuinely love to see Qatar buy you out to see if you stick to your word.

There are literally hundreds of you's in the United/Qatar thread already doing mental gymnastics to backtrack on their words from the last decade right now. Even the majority who stand firm now will still keep following and it will be at most like it was at City and like it would have been at Liverpool a tiny, tiny percentage. I've been consistently honest on how I feel about it at City, its easy to preach when you aren't in that sitution.

I await the day it happens cause honestly I know you'll be doing the same backflips that first I was and now the people who fought with me for a decade are.
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I haven't been following your posts, but are you saying that you condemn the cheating and want the owners to leave?
 
Flying high said:
I haven't been following your posts, but are you saying that you condemn the cheating and want the owners to leave?
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Yes. Exactly that. Not only the owners but I want everyone knowingly complicit banned from football.
 
This amount of anger isn’t healthy lads. Think a few people need a little break and to remind themselves that this is just football. It’s not that serious.
 
padr81 said:
I wasn't get stuck into him about the cheating, you already know my feeling on that and we've been through multiple time what I feel should happen City. You literally commended me on my stance on it by the way.

I was going in on him shouting about blood money etc... when his own club clearly chased the "blood money" for years(long before City).
I've seen you say this before and if you do I'll commend you for it but the reality is 99% of people who say what you said actually won't, I'm just honest about it. I'd genuinely love to see Qatar buy you out to see if you stick to your word.

There are literally hundreds of you's in the United/Qatar thread already doing mental gymnastics to backtrack on their words from the last decade right now. Even the majority who stand firm now will still keep following and it will be at most like it was at City and like it would have been at Liverpool a tiny, tiny percentage. I've been consistently honest on how I feel about it at City, its easy to preach when you aren't in that sitution.

I await the day it happens cause honestly I know you'll be doing the same backflips that first I was and now the people who fought with me for a decade are.
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There's a difference between being owned by a nation state (which I still think is wrong and anti competitive) and a nation state systematically cheating to become successful.
 
padr81 said:
You'll have fans like that.

I'm pretty indifferent to sugar daddies and state ownership in general though as the hypocrisy of who can and who can't and how much and what means we take their money annoys me. I mean no offence to anyone with this, but I know hundreds of human rights activists on this forum will suddlenly be doing mental gymnastics as to why their club is different if United or Liverpools sale does go through as you said.

For me its also hypocritical to say "United can't be owned by Qatar but Bayern can be part owned by Adidas" given the latters human rights record while not on the same level is still absolutely vile or "We can't be owned by Qatar but we'll gladly take their sponsorship money". If we're removing owners based on hr records, we have to deal with it root and branch in my opinion. All or nothing. That Bayern fan banner at the Etihad nearly had me pissing myself laughing. "Football is for the people" whilst their kit manufacturer who own 10% of their club run sweatshops that have 8 year olds make their gear...

Truth be told I'm also a hypocrit, I own a smart phone but I complain about samsung and apple, I own Nike, Reebok and Adidas clothing, I didn't walk away from City after the takeover. So I kinda get what alot of fans here will do because I'[ve already lived it.

Don't get me wrong, I believe City are guilty, I don't know if we'll be found guilty which is my usual argument here. Legally its harder to stick. I also believe despite what the owners have done for the club if guilty they should be expelled from football as should everyone who is knowingly involved. There should be zero tolerence for cheating. Then I look at Juve and the Italian clubs and I think "shits rotten to the core anyway".

In an ideal world we'd have a proper ownership test, personally I'd love to see a real level playing field with homegrown rules, salary caps, transfer fee caps, limited transfers etc..
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I think you're spot on with the hypocritical comments, both about fans performing mental gymnastics and you yourself being a hypocrite, as we all are. In your/everybody's defence, on the personal front we are all constantly practicing cognitive dissonance on some level, unavoidable in the world we live in sadly.

All or nothing as you mention in your post is impossible, we would all be walking around in the nip starving to death if we went for 'all'. Is it worth looking the other way for football though? I am genuinely gutted that (assuming Qatar take over) the last game of football I'll ever really care about will be an absolute pasting by your lot at Wembley. Find it staggering that any Utd fan would welcome this takeover. Given what we enjoyed under Fergie, where would the joy be in getting back to the top on the back of industrial level oppression?

This isn't a dig btw, I am long time lurker but infrequently log-in and think you're a quality poster. I also understand why City fans would welcome it given the afore mentioned Fergie years.
 
Call me hypocritical or whatever, I have no problem with the Qatari guy owning the club. Yes the mideast is far from perfect but the western world isn't saintly at all. As long as we don't dope financially, I'm fine with it.
 
mshnsh said:
Call me hypocritical or whatever, I have no problem with the Qatari guy owning the club. Yes the mideast is far from perfect but the western world isn't saintly at all. As long as we don't dope financially, I'm fine with it.
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That's only a hypocritical view if you have slated city or others for being state owned in the past.

I object to any nation owning United or any other club. I don't want to rank Qatar or any other state based on their record, but there are countries who would be less objectionable, I'm sure.

The point is though, especially after what has happened with city, a good government would step in and stop it from happening again. But, just as with the glazers, they will do nothing. And years from now, they will finally concede that they should have stepped in before it was too late.

Grim times.
 
redcucumber said:
There's a difference between being owned by a nation state (which I still think is wrong and anti competitive) and a nation state systematically cheating to become successful.
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Isn't this exactly what I've been saying in this thread? Not sure what your questioning with the quote.
 
Any word on updates/timelines? Feels weird how all this simmers along in the background, when it's just a few weeks from given City the Prem trophy.
 
Bob Contact said:
I think you're spot on with the hypocritical comments, both about fans performing mental gymnastics and you yourself being a hypocrite, as we all are. In your/everybody's defence, on the personal front we are all constantly practicing cognitive dissonance on some level, unavoidable in the world we live in sadly.

All or nothing as you mention in your post is impossible, we would all be walking around in the nip starving to death if we went for 'all'. Is it worth looking the other way for football though? I am genuinely gutted that (assuming Qatar take over) the last game of football I'll ever really care about will be an absolute pasting by your lot at Wembley. Find it staggering that any Utd fan would welcome this takeover. Given what we enjoyed under Fergie, where would the joy be in getting back to the top on the back of industrial level oppression?

This isn't a dig btw, I am long time lurker but infrequently log-in and think you're a quality poster. I also understand why City fans would welcome it given the afore mentioned Fergie years.
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This is a perfectly fair comment not a dig at all. My feelings on City are genuinely mixed but the truth is I can't walk away. In an ideal world we wouldn't be owned by who we are but sadly we are. But City are still City and will be City long after Abu Dhabi are gone, I've got no issue with following us in the conference or at the top. United will always be United, you've been through 20 years of leeches and it kinda sucks whats gonna follow but just remember that the club will be there long after the ownership.
With regards City the club is a huge part of my life and a big bond I share with my mother and her side of the family (my dad being Irish is of course a United fan, thank God not a Pool fan), even if my mother only really got into football to wind up my dad. No owners are gonna take that from me nor should I let them. The same will apply to you guys.

When I say root and branch I don't think its possible globablly but is it possible for Fifa/Uefa with football to be consistent. Something like.

"Right all ownership is going to be dealt with based on proper fit and proper persons tests not the nonsense we have now!"
"Gear manufacturers using sweatshops are going to have to prove they've gotten with the times to be allowed to have their logo's on football gear".
"If we're outlawing questionable middle Eastern owners we also have to outlaw questionable middle eastern sponsorship" for example how can you tell UAE they can't own a club but allow the sponsorship of the Emirates Stadium. It reeks of hypocrisy. "You're cnuts and murderers and can't own x, but we'll happily take your money and plaster you on our stadiums, shirts, stores etc..."
If we're banning ME sponsorship based on HR records we have to look at tech giants (not that its an issue in England as far as I know).

Basically football needs to go all in, it can't draw a line or it reeks. Like I said imagine rocking up to City with a banner about human rights when 10% of you ownership is human rights abusing Adidas, it reeks of fan hypocrisy. Even if it fecked City over I'd be all for cleaning football, but saying Abu Dhabi can't own a club but can sponsor a stadium or shirt, it just makes zero sense. Its the same blood money and if its in, its in or out its out (it should be out)
 
Beachryan said:
Any word on updates/timelines? Feels weird how all this simmers along in the background, when it's just a few weeks from given City the Prem trophy.
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I'm sure it was mentioned somewhere that it could be a couple of years.
 
Fair play to @padr81 he consistently comes on here and says if City are guilty of cheating they should have the book thrown at them.

If they are found guilty, I'd just like City to hold their hands up and sack everyone who was complicit and allow the PL to audit their accounts for as long as they see fit. I don't want them relegated or titles stripped i certainly wouldnt rejoice 2 more titles or whatever it is, just an acknowledgement of wrongdoing wishful thinking I know.

It's really important that something does come out of this though, as the Saudis and potentially the Qataris or any extremely wealthy owners will just think if they can get away with it so can we. Football would be finished.
 
Fts 74 said:
Fair play to @padr81 he consistently comes on here and says if City are guilty of cheating they should have the book thrown at them.
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They despise him over at Bluemoon which tells you all you need to know.
 
padr81 said:
Can you genuinely not read? What in my post you quoted defends the sheik? Where have I said anything about Sharia Law? Where have I defended any of the practices in the middle east?

You claim to be civilized but post repeatedly like an angry man child, if you were any way civilized you'd be able to engage in discussion instead of storming in like a loud drunk dipper in Kiev who picks a fight with no brain and then cries and lies about it when he gets something back. If being a loud obnoxious angry man is civilized I guess you've passed.

Again I have never made ANY defence whether rational or irrational of any of AD's regime and practices you numpty! I for one think they are despicable people, with a horrid hr record who have acquired what they have acquired based on a legacy of murder and happening to live where theres lots of oil.

The fact you try and equate me saying the mighty Liverpool chased oil money to those things is frankly insulting, down right stupid of you and pretty much exactly what I expect of angry Dippers.

I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of your post given your club was on its back, legs spread begging for DIC since 2006.
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Ah yes. Reasoned debate. Here’s the voice of reason, a catalogue of ad hominems. This sort of stuff belongs dare I say it on the cesspit that is blue moon, or perhaps in the sort of cease and desist letters your lawyers send anyone who dares question the might and integrity of your club?
 
el_loco_bielsa said:
Ah yes. Reasoned debate. Here’s the voice of reason, a catalogue of ad hominems. This sort of stuff belongs dare I say it on the cesspit that is blue moon, or perhaps in the sort of cease and desist letters your lawyers send anyone who dares question the might and integrity of your club?
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Really you of all fecking idiots are going to talk about ad hominems etc... when you accused me of shit I didn't do.

You completely misrepresented the position I had taken and my comment.

So find the posts I made about Sharia law, defending abu Dhabis hr record and other such bollix you posted or kindly admit your full of shit, then feck off and find a stadium to push over.
 
padr81 said:
Really you of all fecking idiots are going to talk about ad hominems when you accused me of shit I didn't do.

You completely misrepresented the position I had taken and my comment.

So find the posts I made about Sharia law and other such bollix you posted or kindly feck off and find a stadium to push over.
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:lol:

I think you need to go and have a little lie down. You’re sounding a tad….stressed?
 
el_loco_bielsa said:
:lol:

I think you need to go and have a little lie down. You’re sounding a tad….stressed?
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Says action dipper who stormed into the thread like he was Rambo all "cnut this and cnut that" I'm having a great time actually.

I just don't beat around the bush with people who make shit up (liars).
 
Escobar said:
Very much looks like
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It'll take awhile but we'll get done. Just the fact that we were fine with the Arsenal supporter as part of the panel at the start and now we aren't suggests to me, we're delaying the inevitable, kinda grasping maybe even getting desperate. It might be 2024 when it is finished but there is no way we can walk away from 115 charges unless completely innocent and the odds of that are slim.
 
Take all titles away in the effected seasons and permanently tarnish their reputation. That will be the end of City as this new 'powerhouse' club.

Unbelievable how they had to cheat despite having that wealth. They could have been a bit more patient, still won loads of stuff and been completely within the rules. But no.....that's not good enough when you come from one of the most corrupt areas of the world. They don't follow, they make their own rules.
 
padr81 said:
Basically football needs to go all in, it can't draw a line or it reeks. Like I said imagine rocking up to City with a banner about human rights when 10% of you ownership is human rights abusing Adidas, it reeks of fan hypocrisy. Even if it fecked City over I'd be all for cleaning football, but saying Abu Dhabi can't own a club but can sponsor a stadium or shirt, it just makes zero sense. Its the same blood money and if its in, its in or out its out (it should be out)
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Sorry but that's a lame excuse. You are trying to justify it by saying everybody does a little so why cant we do a lot. There is a big difference between a giant company that tries to run a clean operation (and employs armies of people in Germany to do so) but occasionally gets it wrong, versus a country that doesn't give two fecks about human rights and will happily murder and abuse thousands of people if their face doesn't fit.

If the PL can see past the brown envelopes to find them guilty, they need to make an example and show that it can't be tolerated. If they don't, football is finished and every oligarch and dictator on the planet will be getting involved.
 
el_loco_bielsa said:
Refute it, if you have an argument. I’m waiting. I suspect I will be for a while.
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Amongst the many reasons why a rich man or parastatal of a country has bought a club, the reason has never, ever been, to amass a army of acolytes on internet forums. Even if that is a byproduct, it doesn't fecking matter, given that these rich people/parastatals are already embedded into the politics, economics and societies of the countries of these clubs.

That you think a couple of posters arguing the merits of Qatar/Newcastle move the needle in the real world in any practical sense is delusional, and if that's your first go to as proof of "sportswashing" then you're scraping the barrel.
 
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el_loco_bielsa said:
And Man City supporters wonder why the world thinks they‘ve been sportswashed by a revolting regressive primitive regime which exists due to a bunch of black gold pouring out of the ground where they once pitched their tents.

Exhibit A right here.

Splash out a bunch of billions on a faraway club to buy yourself an instant army of fools who’ll propagate the sheikh’s gospel on every online forum.

In the meantime, continue to practice a mix of 7th-century sharia law coupled with 7th century employment rights and watch as it’s shouted down and whatabouted reductio ad absurdum to within an inch of its life by the fools you’ve bought yourself in Manchester or Paris.

Happening as we speak to the toon army too. Yes, we’ll start another petition because that’s what we do here in the modern civilised world. In the meantime you carry on with your ‘rational’ defence of your owners’ regime and practices.
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Excellent post, mate
 
BusbyMalone said:
This is why when the question gets asked about why isn't anyone talking about City and their cheating, or why doesn't anyone care, it's because you got mouth-breathing plebs like this guy going "Yeah, they've broken the rules and cheated their way to the top and screwed everyone else over, and as a result are dominating their league now and for the foreseeable future...but that football they play, huh? phwoar!"
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That’s literally one of the caf narratives. It’s abhorrent.
 
City's tactics are incredibly transparent in all this. They claim they have irrefutable evidence of their innocence in relation to the charges and yet they're constantly relying on technicalities and time wasting rather than defending the case on its merits with the evidence they claim to have. They'll probably get away with it too. Throw rubbish at the wall, outspend the opposition on legal fees, never actually answer a case.
 
It's hilarious seeing the City fans trying to defend them, like when they say the leaked e-mails aren't evidence because they were hacked. Surely if they were hacked it means they are genuine e-mails that prove they were cheating
 
Abraxas said:
City's tactics are incredibly transparent in all this. They claim they have irrefutable evidence of their innocence in relation to the charges and yet they're constantly relying on technicalities and time wasting rather than defending the case on its merits with the evidence they claim to have. They'll probably get away with it too. Throw rubbish at the wall, outspend the opposition on legal fees, never actually answer a case.
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Exactly, they claim to have all this evidence to prove their innocence yet rather than using it they took Premier League to court to try and get the investigation blocked but failed and now they they are taking the Premier League to court again with some nonsencical and desperate claim about the guy running the independant panel being bias because he is an Arsenal fan.

From the way they have continously tried to dodge these charges by trying to get them blocked or wrapped up in red tape it definately seems like they have something to hide.
 
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