City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th September 2024

NicolaSacco said:
You might well be right, I definitely don’t claim any personal knowledge; I just struggle to see how you could come to that (or indeed any) conclusion and yet still not be able to specify which specific charges you think they’ll be found guilty on. Feels like a hopeful stab in the dark otherwise. Still, we shall see.
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I’m not claiming any personal knowledge, just discussing what we know and base my opinion on that. A number of legal experts have been discussing it online and on Sky Sports and seem to be of similar thinking.

That said we shall see.
 
Marcus said:
If guilty, I think their owners would no longer pass the requirement to remain owners.
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You mean Man City might be put back on their original (pre Abu Dhabi) path? :)
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Dansk said:
It's more severe because it's not just about breaching the financial rules, it's about knowingly misrepresenting the club's finances. It's basically fraud. They've falsified their records in order to circumvent the rules, and they've done it again and again.

Think of it like perjury. If you commit a crime, you can be punished for it. If you lie about it under oath and are found guilty of perjury, you're also punished for that on top, and it's generally more severe than the majority of crimes are on their own.

In football, purely financial breaches are generally punished by financial means (i.e. fines) while other breaches can have more severe consequences. Defrauding the governing body of English football is a much bigger deal than spending more money than you were allowed to spend. There's a very real possibility of points deductions, revoking prior titles, and even relegation. For years now, City have falsified their records and swindled their way to success in a manner that goes beyond simple over-spending, and their unapologetic threats of using lawyers to drag the prosecution indefinitely makes them all the more deserving of punishment.
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Jesus Christ :lol: Watch them get away with this as well... Points deduction should definitely not be enough, unless they strip so many they're forced to relegate.
 
Mike Smalling said:
There's no knowing how that season would have panned out under different circumstances. It just doesn't work like that.

Ole was clearly an extremely limited manager that thrived on a feelgood factor for a while, but collapsed completely when it came coaching the sides and making some of the tough decisions that were needed.
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I’d go further, Ole is the biggest victim in all of this. UEFA had them bang to rights for these very same crimes a season before he came second and they squirmed their way out out v a weak UEFA / CAS. Now they’re getting done for those very same fecking crimes.
City should have had a points deduction for that season and banned from Europe which would have seen Pep walk and a player exodus. Instead they win the league and got to a CL final.
Ole may not be a top manager but that doesn’t make him finishing second to cheats any less valid than others and Klopp.
 
Bluelion7 said:
We haven’t violated FFP.

And on City… the big test will be whether this actually leads to anything, and, also, legitimate concerns about the fairness and motivations of any investigations.

If they did it, is it going to get overturned and shifted into some sort of 20m euro fine instead again?

And the obvious allowances of bias to anything that protects the two or three traditional powers on the league always astonished me. Why would an Arsenal member be allowed on the commission at all?

Finally, are they going to address the fact that FFP, at its core, violates fair, competitive business practices?

You can spend money … but only if you already have money, and a certain amount of fans already… and so on. I’m trying to imagine what this would look like in America if, say, the Dallas Cowboys were allowed a larger salary cap than other teams due to their massive fanbase.

It’s bad enough that the Ravens backup WB almost made the pro bowl simply due to fan voting. To have stuff like that affect actual team construction is weird.


That’s not “fair”. It is simply a crooked way of trying to ensure that only particular teams stay at the top by design.

Either allow people who purchase a business to compete fairly by investing however much money they are willing to risk… or have an actual “fair” cap where all teams are limited to the same amount.

FFP, as it’s structured, would violate American law, and may, if tested, violate certain international laws related to fair business practices.
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This thread has nothing to do with Chelsea or the NFL or capitalism, FFS.

Please go away.
 
Apologies if it's already been said but I've been at work and I'm only just catching up on all of this and can't get through 27 pages!

As well as the repercussions for City it could also have a massive impact on who buys us! Certain States might think twice now knowing they won't be able to plunder money into the club as City have "allegedly" done.
 
Ciddy said:
Apologies if it's already been said but I've been at work and I'm only just catching up on all of this and can't get through 27 pages!

As well as the repercussions for City it could also have a massive impact on who buys us! Certain States might think twice now knowing they won't be able to plunder money into the club as City have "allegedly" done.
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Another positive from today's news.
 
It's disheartening that my first thought is the best lawyers in the world will be on this for City and nothing will be done if the accusations are upheld by the "independent" body.
 
Bluelion7 said:
We haven’t violated FFP.

And on City… the big test will be whether this actually leads to anything, and, also, legitimate concerns about the fairness and motivations of any investigations.

If they did it, is it going to get overturned and shifted into some sort of 20m euro fine instead again?

And the obvious allowances of bias to anything that protects the two or three traditional powers on the league always astonished me. Why would an Arsenal member be allowed on the commission at all?

Finally, are they going to address the fact that FFP, at its core, violates fair, competitive business practices?

You can spend money … but only if you already have money, and a certain amount of fans already… and so on. I’m trying to imagine what this would look like in America if, say, the Dallas Cowboys were allowed a larger salary cap than other teams due to their massive fanbase.

It’s bad enough that the Ravens backup WB almost made the pro bowl simply due to fan voting. To have stuff like that affect actual team construction is weird.


That’s not “fair”. It is simply a crooked way of trying to ensure that only particular teams stay at the top by design.

Either allow people who purchase a business to compete fairly by investing however much money they are willing to risk… or have an actual “fair” cap where all teams are limited to the same amount.

FFP, as it’s structured, would violate American law, and may, if tested, violate certain international laws related to fair business practices.
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Seems like you are worried about Chelsea considering your attempts to soften Citeh's wrong doings.
 
Anyone who thinks an example will be made of City is deluded.

Weak spined corporates will more likely impose an absolutely ludicrous punishment such as a £150,000 fine.

Expect no justice.
 
fergieisold said:
Seems like you are worried about Chelsea considering your attempts to soften Citeh's wrong doings.
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Of course he is. When the bodies look at 1.5b being wiped off and how unfair it is to FFP we’ll see a few asses twitch
 
cyberman said:
I’d go further, Ole is the biggest victim in all of this. UEFA had them bang to rights for these very same crimes a season before he came second and they squirmed their way out out v a weak UEFA / CAS. Now they’re getting done for those very same fecking crimes.
City should have had a points deduction for that season and banned from Europe which would have seen Pep walk and a player exodus. Instead they win the league and got to a CL final.
Ole may not be a top manager but that doesn’t make him finishing second to cheats any less valid than others and Klopp.
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This is the funniest thing I've read all year.
 
Idxomer said:
This is the funniest thing I've read all year.
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How? We were so comfortable in second that year it was ridiculous. The only club above us was the club that got away with the crimes they were found to have done and are the crimes that will kill the club 5 years later.
Where am I wrong?
 
cyberman said:
How? We were so comfortable in second that year it was ridiculous. The only club above us was the club that got away with the crimes they were found to have done and are the crimes that will kill the club 5 years later.
Where am I wrong?
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Everywhere.
 
Bluelion7 said:
We haven’t violated FFP.

And on City… the big test will be whether this actually leads to anything, and, also, legitimate concerns about the fairness and motivations of any investigations.

If they did it, is it going to get overturned and shifted into some sort of 20m euro fine instead again?

And the obvious allowances of bias to anything that protects the two or three traditional powers on the league always astonished me. Why would an Arsenal member be allowed on the commission at all?

Finally, are they going to address the fact that FFP, at its core, violates fair, competitive business practices?

You can spend money … but only if you already have money, and a certain amount of fans already… and so on. I’m trying to imagine what this would look like in America if, say, the Dallas Cowboys were allowed a larger salary cap than other teams due to their massive fanbase.

It’s bad enough that the Ravens backup WB almost made the pro bowl simply due to fan voting. To have stuff like that affect actual team construction is weird.


That’s not “fair”. It is simply a crooked way of trying to ensure that only particular teams stay at the top by design.

Either allow people who purchase a business to compete fairly by investing however much money they are willing to risk… or have an actual “fair” cap where all teams are limited to the same amount.

FFP, as it’s structured, would violate American law, and may, if tested, violate certain international laws related to fair business practices.
Click to expand...


Its a competition,

The rules are agreed and signed up to.

If you want a free for all leave the league and start your own.

Or get the rules changed but don't agree, then cheat, then complain about it.
 
Well it just shows how football is a hypocritical business. 100 charges dont happen over night and while I would like a points deduction if they are limited to true fair play it will criple them in the long run. Its not gonna happen though
 
We won't see them stripped of any titles I would think. That would be reserved for match-fixing and blatant cheating.

The recent points deduction of Juventus is probably a good benchmark for what we can expect. Probably a chunky points deduction and a hefty fine. Maybe a transfer ban too?
 
I think we can all agree that the punishments that would be appropriate-relegation, multiple years of bans of transfers/european competition-will never happen. So I hope that at the very least they are proven guilty and we can officially recognize that which every football fan has known for a decade-they are a bunch of cheating cnuts.
 
eire-red said:
We won't see them stripped of any titles I would think. That would be reserved for match-fixing and blatant cheating.

The recent points deduction of Juventus is probably a good benchmark for what we can expect. Probably a chunky points deduction and a hefty fine. Maybe a transfer ban too?
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I think that too. 20-30 points deducted and transfer ban for season or two.
Which still would be great.

Shame that we must wait for months now (eelven maybe over a year) to see what happens.
 
eire-red said:
We won't see them stripped of any titles I would think. That would be reserved for match-fixing and blatant cheating.

The recent points deduction of Juventus is probably a good benchmark for what we can expect. Probably a chunky points deduction and a hefty fine. Maybe a transfer ban too?
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It is blatant cheating though. They’ve spent money the rules said they couldn’t. They don’t win those titles without doing that.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
By your logic, bigger "victim" would be Jose. He was also 2nd. And with title in hand, he wouldn't implode like he did in 3rd season. So no Ole in United. No?
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But they weren’t convicted of crimes then right? We were shit the year the sentence same down. I remember being 6th and everybody was saying 5th might have been good enough for CL
It was a two year ban and I think Liverpool won the league in the second season and I’d say they’d have rebuilt after that so it really was just Ole second placed season.
I know everybody was cheated for well over a decade now but it’s the months before the Ole season where they were fecking found out and punished. They should have stayed punished because they were guilty as hell and are so guilty they’re being punished 3 years later for the same fecking thing.
They already got caught!
 
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