City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th September 2024

You would think all the English clubs would be pushing more for an outcome on these 115 breaches. Even more so now that City have basically monopolised every competition they play in England.

But the noise around it is just so small.
 
Last edited:
City strolled in, cheated to their heart’s content (until they got what they wanted), and casually inserted themselves into the very top of the food chain with literally no comeuppance. They’ve made an absolute mockery of club football and the next step is to wash their history.

You’d like to say it’s unbelievable, but it was all a given, as documented in this very thread and others.
 
RuudTom83 said:
You would think all the English clubs would be pushing more for an outcome on these 115 breaches. Even more so now that City have basically monopolised every competition they play in England.

But the noise around it is just so small.
Click to expand...

Perhaps the league has instructed the clubs to not kick up a fuss for now, let the legal stuff play out. If City get off with hardly nothing or say a hefty fine but not much else, maybe the other clubs will put out statements, do pressers, and possibly start a mutiny.

If I were a club owner, I would not be content with the equivalent of a slap on the hand and I would be pushing for permanent expulsion/dissolution as the extreme penalty, but to a lesser degree I would want relegation a few levels down with a minimum five years before promotion eligibility to the top flight, plus a massive fine in the hundreds of millions. I don't think the league can kick an ownership out as that would require other legal avenues and politics*, but perhaps such extreme punishment as expulsion or relegation would lead to Abu Dhabi pulling out, or committing far less resources if they remain.

What may happen is a massive fine to be distributed to the clubs thus far less votes required for expulsion as these owners will take their millions from City and turn their cheek. It would effectively be a bribe to remain in the league.

*This has occurred in the US, see Dan Snyder and Donald Sterling.
 
Giggsyking said:
4m a year, that is a fecking disgrace.
Click to expand...

How so?

Of the original build cost, the council paid around £33 million (Sport England paid around £77 million). They will have already easily recovered that and going forward have zero financial liability for any costs incurred in the operation & upkeep of the stadium.
 
RuudTom83 said:
You would think all the English clubs would be pushing more for an outcome on these 115 breaches. Even more so now that City have basically monopolised every competition they play in England.

But the noise around it is just so small.
Click to expand...

The media will ignore it because it doesn't serve their interest to point out that the reigning league champions are accused of cheating.
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
They're too big now for anything to happen to them.
We will hear about it once every couple of months whenever there's some sort of procedure in the courtroom.
Then they'll appeal. then things go quiet again for some time....

And then, even if some years pass and they get stripped of their past achievements (seems unlikely to me and to many other posters by the looks of it)-
Do we fans of competing teams get some sense of relief?

Did Inter fans feel as if they won that league title that was given to them after Juve got done, back in the day?

It probably feels like nobody won the title in the years when a cheating team did so.

I'm not sure there's anything that can help with the present feeling of knowing that the strongest side in your competition almost certainly doesn't play by the same rules as everyone else.
Click to expand...

I can understand the points raised here but one thing that is also a potential issue is if City haven't been done for being dubious with their operations, what's to stop another club from just being oblivious to FFP if the ramifications aren't significant enough. What's to stop a Newcastle from X10 their plans and just going absolutely insane in the markets etc.

Like the situation with United and the Greenwood / Antony, its more about how the league sets a precedent moving forward. They have to act accordingly.
 
Fortitude said:
City strolled in, cheated to their heart’s content (until they got what they wanted), and casually inserted themselves into the very top of the food chain with literally no comeuppance. They’ve made an absolute mockery of club football and the next step is to wash their history.

You’d like to say it’s unbelievable, but it was all a given, as documented in this very thread and others.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. It's why I always wanted them to win ahead of Liverpool. Its like losing to Lance Armstrong.
 
Bugs Bunny said:
Obtained naming rights to the stadium from the council. Good for City.

All operating, maintenance & future capital costs are borne by the club. Good for the Council.

Good deal all round really :)
Click to expand...
Especially the guy who signed it off.
 
Tyrion said:
Pretty much. It's why I always wanted them to win ahead of Liverpool. Its like losing to Lance Armstrong.
Click to expand...

This reasoning is something we tell ourselves to feel less dirty about being the biggest City fans in the last decade. If it was Liverpool whom they bought then you'd be hoping for Liverpool to win over City?
 
erikcred said:
This reasoning is something we tell ourselves to feel less dirty about being the biggest City fans in the last decade. If it was Liverpool whom they bought then you'd be hoping for Liverpool to win over City?
Click to expand...

That is a fair point. It helps that its the club we hate most.
 
SuperiorXI said:
It's an absolute joke and robbery of the locals. The fact it was pushed through by a city fan and now honorary president tells you all you need to know. Pure corruption.
Click to expand...

When cities bid for Olympics or Commonwealth Games, a big part of the process is demonstrating the post-games legacy with particular focus on the main stadium

The most common end results are either White Elephants that stand unused or broken promises (e.g. West Ham stadium)

Manchester bid several times for the Olympics and Commonwealth games in the decade or so prior to winning the Commonwealth games, with no success. Those proposals typically included an 80k ish capacity stadium

Whatever you think of Manchester City, the eventual solution for the Commonwealth games was brilliant for the city of Manchester, who would not have won their bid to host the games without this solution. The club paid half the by today's standards, relatively modest costs to convert from athletics to football. Nobody can say with a straight face there hasn't been a hugely successful re-development and enhancement of the entire area surrounding the stadium. The old Maine Road was given to the council and the site was used to create a lot of housing. The council get a significant annual income which would never have happened if they had not done the deal with city. Other (minority) sports have fabulous infrastructure for their respective homes in the new campus. Manchester as a city has benefited from the extra publicity of now having two top football clubs on the international stage instead of one.

The idea the city, or the council, have been shafted by city, looks insane.

It was also a good deal for the club, but there can be times when deals are a winner for all concerned. I'd love to see you say with a straight face exactly who has been shafted and how, by this 'pure corruption' !
 
It feels to me that even though city have the hacks in their pocket, nobody outside of their fanbase really seems to care when they win things.

They won the treble, and it seemed like it was a news story for about two days and then forgotten. It's like everyone just shrugs.
 
miked99 said:
It feels to me that even though city have the hacks in their pocket, nobody outside of their fanbase really seems to care when they win things.

They won the treble, and it seemed like it was a news story for about two days and then forgotten. It's like everyone just shrugs.
Click to expand...
They're easily bought. I remember listening to some podcast with football journalists and they were all fawning over how well they're looked after by City hospitality and how the food was amazing.

Fat cnuts.
 
miked99 said:
It feels to me that even though city have the hacks in their pocket, nobody outside of their fanbase really seems to care when they win things.

They won the treble, and it seemed like it was a news story for about two days and then forgotten. It's like everyone just shrugs.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately this won't be the case forever. My 7 year old nephew grew up in a Chelsea household, I got my 5 year old godson into United early on. Both have now switched to City because they win everything. Most of my friends' kids around the Manchester area all support City. The kids all love Grealish.

Just like Chelsea when all those kids grow up the hows and whys will all be forgotten. It's why its so important that it goes on record that they cheated.
 
11101 said:
Unfortunately this won't be the case forever. My 7 year old nephew grew up in a Chelsea household, I got my 5 year old godson into United early on. Both have now switched to City because they win everything. Most of my friends' kids around the Manchester area all support City. The kids all love Grealish.

Just like Chelsea when all those kids grow up the hows and whys will all be forgotten. It's why its so important that it goes on record that they cheated.
Click to expand...
Been abroad a lot the past two months and the proliferation of City shirts has been alarming. Haaland, De Bruyne or Grealish adorned on every shirt. That and Messi’s pink kit is about the only thing I’ve seen outside of Bayern shirts. Not a single United one across 3 continents.
 
jontheblue said:
When cities bid for Olympics or Commonwealth Games, a big part of the process is demonstrating the post-games legacy with particular focus on the main stadium

The most common end results are either White Elephants that stand unused or broken promises (e.g. West Ham stadium)

Manchester bid several times for the Olympics and Commonwealth games in the decade or so prior to winning the Commonwealth games, with no success. Those proposals typically included an 80k ish capacity stadium

Whatever you think of Manchester City, the eventual solution for the Commonwealth games was brilliant for the city of Manchester, who would not have won their bid to host the games without this solution. The club paid half the by today's standards, relatively modest costs to convert from athletics to football. Nobody can say with a straight face there hasn't been a hugely successful re-development and enhancement of the entire area surrounding the stadium. The old Maine Road was given to the council and the site was used to create a lot of housing. The council get a significant annual income which would never have happened if they had not done the deal with city. Other (minority) sports have fabulous infrastructure for their respective homes in the new campus. Manchester as a city has benefited from the extra publicity of now having two top football clubs on the international stage instead of one.

The idea the city, or the council, have been shafted by city, looks insane.

It was also a good deal for the club, but there can be times when deals are a winner for all concerned. I'd love to see you say with a straight face exactly who has been shafted and how, by this 'pure corruption' !
Click to expand...

As usual, for a City fan, you missed the point that they did all this by cheating. This is the description of sports washing.
 
RuudTom83 said:
You would think all the English clubs would be pushing more for an outcome on these 115 breaches. Even more so now that City have basically monopolised every competition they play in England.

But the noise around it is just so small.
Click to expand...

It will be interesting to see what happens with Everton. Of the clubs facing FFP investigations, they are the one that are closest to being settled.

I think I posted this on here before but as far as City are concerned it seems like a settlement with the Premier League is the most likely outcome.
 
Sassy Colin said:
As usual, for a City fan, you missed the point that they did all this by cheating. This is the description of sports washing.
Click to expand...

Sports washing by who ?!? Me ? My fellow owners ? We were a PLC traded on the UK Stockmarket. In fact like many fans, I owned a handful of shares (worth a nominal sum).

The stadium deal was announce in 2000. The stadium was built for the Commonwealth Games were in 2002. We (City) moved in one year later.

It was not until c 2006 we were bought by Thaksin shinawatra and by the Sheikh in 2008
 
Fortitude said:
Been abroad a lot the past two months and the proliferation of City shirts has been alarming. Haaland, De Bruyne or Grealish adorned on every shirt. That and Messi’s pink kit is about the only thing I’ve seen outside of Bayern shirts. Not a single United one across 3 continents.
Click to expand...

Yeah I live in Italy at the moment and a few of the guys i play football with turn up in City shirts. I wonder when the big clubs will start to notice the dent in revenue as they lose fans.
 
jontheblue said:
Sports washing by who ?!? Me ? My fellow owners ? We were a PLC traded on the UK Stockmarket. In fact like many fans, I owned a handful of shares (worth a nominal sum).

The stadium deal was announce in 2000. The stadium was built for the Commonwealth Games were in 2002. We (City) moved in one year later.

It was not until c 2006 we were bought by Thaksin shinawatra and by the Sheikh in 2008
Click to expand...
In an age where teams are having to fork out billions for new stadiums and re-developments your club is benefitting from a extremely beneficial deal. 4m per year/333k per month/83k per week for an entire stadium is pittance. The deal should have been with caveats (incremental increase in rent) so that the locals can benefit from your investment since you're heavily benefitting from having a stadium handed to you.
 
cyberman said:
That article is simply nonsense.
Click to expand...

It's not, stick a load of restaurants, arenas, hotels and entertainment complexes around your stadium, and profit from all the revenue that comes in outside matchday and stick it towards your FFP budget. The cost of development and building doesnt count towards FFP but the revenues/profits gained from it does.
 
SuperiorXI said:
In an age where teams are having to fork out billions for new stadiums and re-developments your club is benefitting from a extremely beneficial deal. 4m per year/333k per month/83k per week for an entire stadium is pittance. The deal should have been with caveats (incremental increase in rent) so that the locals can benefit from your investment since you're heavily benefitting from having a stadium handed to you.
Click to expand...

Have you even red your own previous post, or do multiple people have access to your account ?

You alleged sportswashing. I pointed out it was pre Abu Dhabi and for that matter, pre Thaksin. You should have backed down gracefully rather than continue to make an idiot of yourself. Sportswashing is a perfectly reasonable topic, but not in relation to the periods the club was a PLC

But if you want to separately talk about the commerciality of the deal, great. There was a deal to pay the council a percentage of revenue to start with, but it was renegotiated, with the council receiving more money than they used to, as part of the investment by the club owners into the stadium expansion. The club are paying to invest on a site they don't own. You want locals to benefit - well every past and future building contract in connection with the stadium has a requirement (at the behest of our owners), to employ primarily local contractors. From Ancoats to the stadium, a route I walk regularly to games, the area has been transformed with huge investment. And by the stadium ,we have the new concert venue and hotel being built.

Of course if facts don't actually matter, sure, sportswashing, cheating, blah blah blah.
 
11101 said:
Yeah I live in Italy at the moment and a few of the guys i play football with turn up in City shirts. I wonder when the big clubs will start to notice the dent in revenue as they lose fans.
Click to expand...
The amount of Haaland shirts I see at the children's playground is disgusting. This is why I don't feel bad that we are the destroying the planet for these little s****. Have fun renting all your life.
 
jontheblue said:
Have you even red your own previous post, or do multiple people have access to your account ?

You alleged sportswashing. I pointed out it was pre Abu Dhabi and for that matter, pre Thaksin. You should have backed down gracefully rather than continue to make an idiot of yourself. Sportswashing is a perfectly reasonable topic, but not in relation to the periods the club was a PLC

But if you want to separately talk about the commerciality of the deal, great. There was a deal to pay the council a percentage of revenue to start with, but it was renegotiated, with the council receiving more money than they used to, as part of the investment by the club owners into the stadium expansion. The club are paying to invest on a site they don't own. You want locals to benefit - well every past and future building contract in connection with the stadium has a requirement (at the behest of our owners), to employ primarily local contractors. From Ancoats to the stadium, a route I walk regularly to games, the area has been transformed with huge investment. And by the stadium ,we have the new concert venue and hotel being built.

Of course if facts don't actually matter, sure, sportswashing, cheating, blah blah blah.
Click to expand...

city are a sportswashing project for the UAE, yes. United will be one for Qatar soon enough, but that does not excuse what city now are, Jon: a sportswashing entity for an autocracy.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
The amount of Haaland shirts I see at the children's playground is disgusting. This is why I don't feel bad that we are the destroying the planet for these little s****. Have fun renting all your life.
Click to expand...

Almost every kid I see at football wearing a City shirt bought the looky looky knock off gear while on holidays somewhere, usually Spain.

Liverpool / Utd kids tend to have proper kits.
 
No wonder the media are quick to put the boot into
Shane88 said:
They're easily bought. I remember listening to some podcast with football journalists and they were all fawning over how well they're looked after by City hospitality and how the food was amazing.

Fat cnuts.
Click to expand...
If this is the case you'd expect a club like Utd to be ahead of the game on this, however I've seen the standard of food the press receive at OT and it's pretty poor, always looks like it's been forgotten about and quickly thrown together.
 
Hal9000 said:
It's not, stick a load of restaurants, arenas, hotels and entertainment complexes around your stadium, and profit from all the revenue that comes in outside matchday and stick it towards your FFP budget. The cost of development and building doesnt count towards FFP but the revenues/profits gained from it does.
Click to expand...
City are pretty unique in this case, their community investment is simply a continuation of the reasoning to build a stadium in that location in the first place. Lots of people spoke of investment in the Old Trafford area when supporting the Sheikh Jassim bid, I'd be wary of this, the gentrification and foreign investment that's gripped the city centre is already on the doorstep of Old Trafford which is home to a long standing community and with the exception of a few side streets around the stadium is in good shape.
 
neon_badger said:
If this is the case you'd expect a club like Utd to be ahead of the game on this, however I've seen the standard of food the press receive at OT and it's pretty poor, always looks like it's been forgotten about and quickly thrown together.
Click to expand...
Feck them.

I've always thought they were spoiled pricks. Free tickets and hospitality to massive football matches and what do they the offer in return? Nothing.

United should save money and cut back on their hospitality. A Capri Sun and a ham & cheese sandwich per journalist per match. That's your lot.
 
Pes6Monster said:
city are a sportswashing project for the UAE, yes. United will be one for Qatar soon enough, but that does not excuse what city now are, Jon: a sportswashing entity for an autocracy.
Click to expand...


I'm really not sure why I bother, but here we go anyway

The topic was the deal for the stadium agreed between Mcr City and the City of Mcr (Council) for the commonwealth games. That deal was struck before the UAE had even heard of mcr city. The first allegation on here was along the lines of 'it's city, so must be dodgy as f***'. I pointed out why it wasn't dodgy and the retort was 'yes but it's still sportswashing'. I then pointed out that we weren't owned by the Sheikh then and instead, were a PLC........
 
jontheblue said:
Have you even red your own previous post, or do multiple people have access to your account ?

You alleged sportswashing. I pointed out it was pre Abu Dhabi and for that matter, pre Thaksin. You should have backed down gracefully rather than continue to make an idiot of yourself. Sportswashing is a perfectly reasonable topic, but not in relation to the periods the club was a PLC

But if you want to separately talk about the commerciality of the deal, great. There was a deal to pay the council a percentage of revenue to start with, but it was renegotiated, with the council receiving more money than they used to, as part of the investment by the club owners into the stadium expansion. The club are paying to invest on a site they don't own. You want locals to benefit - well every past and future building contract in connection with the stadium has a requirement (at the behest of our owners), to employ primarily local contractors. From Ancoats to the stadium, a route I walk regularly to games, the area has been transformed with huge investment. And by the stadium ,we have the new concert venue and hotel being built.

Of course if facts don't actually matter, sure, sportswashing, cheating, blah blah blah.
Click to expand...
Have you read my post? I haven't even mentioned sportswashing. You are referring to the other poster. Maybe check in the future before making an idiot out of yourself.

Regardless of your investment in the area (which by the way hugely benefits your club i.e. the training complex, convenient to forget this fact) you have been paying what can only be described as a pittance for a proper world level stadium that has one of the highest capacities in the PL. Don't make it sound like you're doing the locals a favour when it's a clear bad deal for the taxpayer with the amount of money involved at your club these days.
 
I've made peace with the fact nothing will happen except a fine that will mean nothing to them.
 
neon_badger said:
City are pretty unique in this case, their community investment is simply a continuation of the reasoning to build a stadium in that location in the first place. Lots of people spoke of investment in the Old Trafford area when supporting the Sheikh Jassim bid, I'd be wary of this, the gentrification and foreign investment that's gripped the city centre is already on the doorstep of Old Trafford which is home to a long standing community and with the exception of a few side streets around the stadium is in good shape.
Click to expand...

Not really a unique case. Real Madrid have just refurbished the Bernabeu so they have more restaurants, shopping center, hotels etc for the main purpose it will be all year attraction. Barcelona are doing the same with Nou Camp. Spurs have complex around their stadium, even got a go kart track underneath now, Fulham new riverside stand has a whole complex of restaurants and hotels, Evertons new stadium will have a whole complex around it aswell. It's now the new normal.
 
jontheblue said:
When cities bid for Olympics or Commonwealth Games, a big part of the process is demonstrating the post-games legacy with particular focus on the main stadium

The most common end results are either White Elephants that stand unused or broken promises (e.g. West Ham stadium)

Manchester bid several times for the Olympics and Commonwealth games in the decade or so prior to winning the Commonwealth games, with no success. Those proposals typically included an 80k ish capacity stadium

Whatever you think of Manchester City, the eventual solution for the Commonwealth games was brilliant for the city of Manchester, who would not have won their bid to host the games without this solution. The club paid half the by today's standards, relatively modest costs to convert from athletics to football. Nobody can say with a straight face there hasn't been a hugely successful re-development and enhancement of the entire area surrounding the stadium. The old Maine Road was given to the council and the site was used to create a lot of housing. The council get a significant annual income which would never have happened if they had not done the deal with city. Other (minority) sports have fabulous infrastructure for their respective homes in the new campus. Manchester as a city has benefited from the extra publicity of now having two top football clubs on the international stage instead of one.

The idea the city, or the council, have been shafted by city, looks insane.

It was also a good deal for the club, but there can be times when deals are a winner for all concerned. I'd love to see you say with a straight face exactly who has been shafted and how, by this 'pure corruption' !
Click to expand...

Who has been shafted? The rest of the league for a start, who have to pay their own way and stick to the rules.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.