City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with 130 FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th Sep 2024 | Concluded 9th Dec 2024 - Awaiting outcome

SER19 said:
because if they can appeal it over a protracted period of time, what do you do while its pending? Lets say they get a 50 point deduction, imposed this season and it relegates them, but then they appeal. What do you do while that process rolls on and on on?

for the record, id love for them to be relegated
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I suppose you need to wait for all appeals to conclude before applying the punishment then. You'd have the same problem if you gave them a 100 point deduction spread over a few years because they if they successfully appeal they could probably sue for loss of earnings if they don't get into Europe because you've punished them. That's why I prefer a simple relegation punishment, or ideally that plus points deduction.

Edit: people are saying they can't appeal anyway so all this is moot
 
SER19 said:
because if they can appeal it over a protracted period of time, what do you do while its pending? Lets say they get a 50 point deduction, imposed this season and it relegates them, but then they appeal. What do you do while that process rolls on and on on?

for the record, id love for them to be relegated
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Well they won't be remanded in custody pending the appeal. The slap on the wrists won't be applied until any appeals process is complete.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if they were suspended from the League pending the results of an appeal though :D
 
Sassy Colin said:
Well they won't be remanded in custody pending the appeal. The slap on the wrists won't be applied until any appeals process is complete.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if they were suspended from the League pending the results of an appeal though :D
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They should have been suspended from the league the minute they stopped co-operating with the invstigation into their cheating. It's one thing to claim innocence but flat out refusing to even engage in the process should have seen them suspended until they did co-operate.
 
Sassy Colin said:
Well they won't be remanded in custody pending the appeal. The slap on the wrists won't be applied until any appeals process is complete.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if they were suspended from the League pending the results of an appeal though :D
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Its a mess, and we all saw it coming for over a decade but were told by many, including city fans on here, that our worries were rooted in jealousy and an unwillingness to seal-clap for the emirati owners. The damage done to the league has been enormous, but it happened year on year, where we incrementally got used to each new absurdity- so here we are, with a team thats won 6 from 7 titles, robbing other teams in the process, and no matter how guilty they are found, they will still be better off than when their cheating owners took over.

We're doing the same for Newcastle now, the reporting is as if a group of boys climbed out of a mine in the north and scrapped their way to a trophy.
 
stevoc said:
They should have been suspended from the league the minute they stopped co-operating with the invstigation into their cheating. It's one thing to claim innocence but flat out refusing to even engage in the process should have seen them suspended until they did co-operate.
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This.

If you don't cooperate, you don't play. Simple.
 
Keegan saying both sides may claim victory…

I reckon they’ll be done for lack of cooperation and the League will claim victory that way and say the evidence was unable to be obtained.

City will say see, we said we wouldn’t get done for the other bits and we had every right to not show our books as a result of the way the emails were obtained.
 
SuperiorXI said:
feck me then we'll have to wait until the season after for the appeal, then the season after that for the appeal to the appeal... this whole process has been: -

giphy.gif
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:lol: :(
 
strandty said:
I reckon they’ll be done for lack of cooperation and the League will claim victory that way and say the evidence was unable to be obtained.
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This wouldnt make sence as City couldnt have been charged if the Premier League were unable to obtain any evidence that they believe prooves the offences were comitted.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
Hardly an exclusive, they've been doing this ever since the charges were made.

Bascially the rules are to just ignore everything, and assume your viewers are too stupid to notice.
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Yep. They seem to have taken the approach of ‘just don’t even reference it’ that a lot of organisations do with criminal cases. Forgetting the fact that this isn’t one.
 
strandty said:
Keegan saying both sides may claim victory…

I reckon they’ll be done for lack of cooperation and the League will claim victory that way and say the evidence was unable to be obtained.

City will say see, we said we wouldn’t get done for the other bits and we had every right to not show our books as a result of the way the emails were obtained.
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They should get relegated just on the refusing to co-operate alone. Never mind the other stuff.

You can't just pick and choose which rules to follow.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
Hardly an exclusive, they've been doing this ever since the charges were made.

Bascially the rules are to just ignore everything, and assume your viewers are too stupid to notice.
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They’ve invested billions and billions in the Premier League. The last thing they want to is to see it lose face like having the team that’s won 8 out of the last 13 titles proven to be systematic cheats. The directors at Sky must look at what happened to Serie A post cheating scandal and shudder.
 
JBG said:
That is some bullshit, controlling free speech basically.. let the pundits speak their mind on this.
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C'est Moi Cantona said:
Hardly an exclusive, they've been doing this ever since the charges were made.

Bascially the rules are to just ignore everything, and assume your viewers are too stupid to notice.
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I mean reading between the lines it feels like preparing for a city slap on the wrist and telling them to not get emotional and “stick to the facts” when the verdict drops?
 
JBG said:
That is some bullshit, controlling free speech basically.. let the pundits speak their mind on this.
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No it's called not wanting to get sued, potentially for defamation. Which is probably the smartest strategy from their perspective given that further legal maneuvers on City's part should be expected following any negative verdict.
 
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BAMSOLA said:
No it's called not wanting to get sued, potentially for defamation. Which is probably the smartest strategy from their perspective given that further legal maneuvers on City's part should be expected following any negative verdict.
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They can speak their mind without having to go in on the legal parts of it. It seems like skysports aren't even allowing them to express their actual opinions and thoughts on it.
 
JBG said:
They can speak their mind without having to go in on the legal parts of it.
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All there is to speak about is the verdict and the problem with speaking your mind is it is not scripted so can easily lapse into an opinion that later is viewed as defamatory, especially if the premier league's judgement is later found to have no legal basis which given how sponsorship rules have gone in this case could turn out to be the case with some parts of it.

You really can't blame them for only wanting to report the facts of the judgement and to stay away from any opinions on what it means or says about either party.
 
RedRocket9908 said:
Sky are already warning their pundits

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City innocent incoming? I would guess 95% of the pundits on there feel City are guilty. They might get too overly emotional about it when the verdict comes in, knowing it's probably the end of the PL as we know it.
 
LordSpud said:
City innocent incoming? I would guess 95% of the pundits on there feel City are guilty. They might get too overly emotional about it when the verdict comes in, knowing it's probably the end of the PL as we know it.
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Most on reddit seem to think this means the opposite.
 
115 point deduction incoming? Surely it should be something in that ballpark.
 
Mb194dc said:
115 point deduction incoming? Surely it should be something in that ballpark.
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Most people, Ornstein, City fans, journalists all think there is a good chance they will get away.

I dont understand anyone that thought they will get punished, this was never going to happen.
 
If you say they average 90 points per season, they would need to incur a 60-point deduction to relegate them.
That would not have been enough last season, 2021 and probably this season had they been their usual selves.

I hope they get the book thrown at them and given a 114-point reduction just to be certain.
 
Berbasbullet said:
Honestly my interest in football does slightly hang on this judgement.
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same. we have to compromise all the time in a sport so riddled with greed and corruption, but the line is surely here- a middle-eastern sheikh taking control of a club that could have been chosen at random and using them very plainly to sportswash abu dhabis image, and in the process destroying the competitiveness of the biggest league in the world for a decade - building the most uninspiring succesful team of all time. They have quite literally ripped the soul out of that club, but english football more generally, and have been facilitated in doing it by the media and sky sycophants. I cannot make a convincing argument to stick with it if they get away with it.
 
romufc said:
Most people, Ornstein, City fans, journalists all think there is a good chance they will get away.

I dont understand anyone that thought they will get punished, this was never going to happen.
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That's funny because on the Football Ramble yesterday they were saying what they're heard from journos they know is that they're expecting a points deduction that would be almost impossible to avoid relegation from. For this season that could be as little as 40 or so points.

I still have a feeling we'll see a big fine and a 25 point deduction. City will complain and say they were hit with unprecedented punihsment but secretly be delighted, the PL gets to say they punished them but also keep City in the PL and everyone else will feel massively let down.
 
From the start of all of this, I've been expecting it to end up like the previous attempts - where City's expensive lawyers help them escape serious punishment and they just end up with a comparative slap on the wrist. A type of small punishment that makes it 100% worth all the success that the cheating helped bring about and won't much hinder more immediate attempts at success.

The way it's going, the noises coming out, the fact City have been 'winning' those other things against the PL and it's rules - is all adding to my expectation that we'll see them as good as get away with all their cheating.

The most I've ever expected is stuff like fines, (suspended) transfer embargoes, and any point deduction (which I'm not expecting) only being a suspended one, etc. I've never expected stripped titles, huge point deductions or demotion down leagues or anything genuinely serious like that. It's what it should be, but I've never expected it from the start and even less so nowadays.
 
Berbasbullet said:
Honestly my interest in football does slightly hang on this judgement.
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Same. If they get away with it then we may as well just sit back as Newcastle and Man City 'battle it out' to see which sports washing project can outspend the other one in to oblivion!
 
slyadams said:
That's funny because on the Football Ramble yesterday they were saying what they're heard from journos they know is that they're expecting a points deduction that would be almost impossible to avoid relegation from. For this season that could be as little as 40 or so points.

I still have a feeling we'll see a big fine and a 25 point deduction. City will complain and say they were hit with unprecedented punihsment but secretly be delighted, the PL gets to say they punished them but also keep City in the PL and everyone else will feel massively let down.
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City won't be secretly delighted with anything that doesn't make them look completely innocent of all charges.
 
MaMa given red said:
City won't be secretly delighted with anything that doesn't make them look completely innocent of all charges.
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it doesn’t really matter what the verdict is. City will go full Trump and their client journalists will report their words verbatim that it’s a total exoneration
 
MaMa given red said:
City won't be secretly delighted with anything that doesn't make them look completely innocent of all charges.
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I think they would. In the old days a relegation would really just be a blip in the road for City, they'd give all their players some bonuses to keep them for a year and be back up in the PL in a year and the CL in 2 years and they crack on. A relegation now could be diasterous. They'd have to gut their squad to meet financial constraints being outside both the PL and CL.

They won't like be tarred with the brush of being guilty, but from a business and sporting standpoint avoiding a relegation should be their only concern.
 
MaMa given red said:
City won't be secretly delighted with anything that doesn't make them look completely innocent of all charges.
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They will be ecstatic about anything that doesn't force them to admit guilt. They would happily get a £100m fine, relegated, transfer banned, banned from the CL, as long as the narrative that 'nothing was ever proven' remains. Their owners don't care about football one bit, their owner has been to like 2 games, but they care a lot about the reputation of anything related to Abu Dhabi. As it stands, we're on the brink of them essentially being accused of fraud, the trial ended a while ago, there's a reason we've not heard anything yet. Whatever punishment comes, they will be in a far better position after it compared to when the cheating started. They win no matter what. All we can realistically hope for is this period is wiped out the record books.
 
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