City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with 130 FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th Sep 2024 | Concluded 9th Dec 2024 - Awaiting outcome

UnitedSofa said:
They need to get relegated more than one league though, dropping one league and they’re straight back into the prem and likely
challenging for the title again.
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Yup. Back to the national league and they pay compensation for any team they dislodge from the pyramid.
 
So many staff leaving, Haaland getting a 10 year deal (basically outlining they have to pay him regardless of the clubs situation), the form on the field, Pep completely losing the plot. So much of this suggests they are getting a mega punishment.
 
slyadams said:
That's funny because on the Football Ramble yesterday they were saying what they're heard from journos they know is that they're expecting a points deduction that would be almost impossible to avoid relegation from. For this season that could be as little as 40 or so points.

I still have a feeling we'll see a big fine and a 25 point deduction. City will complain and say they were hit with unprecedented punihsment but secretly be delighted, the PL gets to say they punished them but also keep City in the PL and everyone else will feel massively let down.
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Well, it might be easier and save face if they deduct points that doesn't relegate them.

Its all a farce really from the PL, showing how corrupt it actually is.
 
The league loses all credibility if the punishment isn't severe.

All the other clubs would just start doing the same and argue that the light punishment has already proved a precedent.
 
Slevs said:
The league loses all credibility if the punishment isn't severe.

All the other clubs would just start doing the same and argue that the light punishment has already proved a precedent.
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This is it. United are bending over backwards to comply with their rules, if they decide that breaking them for (at least) 10 years in a row isn’t worth a decent punishment then why bother obeying them from now on?

Newcastle would just go on an absolute mad one in the summer, because why not? What are the premier league gonna do?
 
They need to take the titles off them. No other sport lets you keep the titles if you are caught cheating. Maybe dont give it to someone else just say they are null and void.
 
UpWithRivers said:
They need to take the titles off them. No other sport lets you keep the titles if you are caught cheating. Maybe dont give it to someone else just say they are null and void.
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I feel the precedent is set with Serie A and Juventus.

But have a horrific feeling City will just get a fine that they'll have to pay (and it not go towards FFP/PSR or whatever).
 
Something that we also need to think of if they're guilty is that there may be a lot of clubs who try to sue them. We are being taken to court by Burnley currently regarding them being relegated.
 
They will get a points deduction that makes them miss the champions league once, a fine of something like 50 million and maybe a transfer ban for one period or something like this.
The journalists will call it an unprecedented and huge penalty and then the pundits will say it’s a good punishment, because anything else would hurt the league too much. Then everyone will move on, ignoring that more than a decade of premier league football and all following seasons were and will be compromised by blatant cheating, rendering the competition farcical.
 
HTG said:
They will get a points deduction that makes them miss the champions league once, a fine of something like 50 million and maybe a transfer ban for one period or something like this.
The journalists will call it an unprecedented and huge penalty and then the pundits will say it’s a good punishment, because anything else would hurt the league too much. Then everyone will move on, ignoring that more than a decade of premier league football and all following seasons were and will be compromised by blatant cheating, rendering the competition farcical.
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It's this part right here that annoys me the most, sure maybe we MU fans and possibly Arsenal and Pool fans will not forget so fast. But I'm pretty sure all this will be forgotten way too quickly, which is a shame, because this is, at least imo, one of the biggest scandals in recent football history. City fans and their playersa and staff(yes players), should feel shame for all of this when they finally get punished, becuase they willingly participated in a scam/scandal whatever you want to call it.

Edit: and the way the media(specially English) is basically ignoring this, is contributing to how a "non-issue" this feels like for most football fans, at least it seems so. We can't ignore the effect these cheaters have had on football the past like 10 years.
 
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MaMa given red said:
City won't be secretly delighted with anything that doesn't make them look completely innocent of all charges.
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Of course they will be.
HTG said:
They will get a points deduction that makes them miss the champions league once, a fine of something like 50 million and maybe a transfer ban for one period or something like this.
The journalists will call it an unprecedented and huge penalty and then the pundits will say it’s a good punishment, because anything else would hurt the league too much. Then everyone will move on, ignoring that more than a decade of premier league football and all following seasons were and will be compromised by blatant cheating, rendering the competition farcical.
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Absolutely this - it's what's been quite clear for a couple of years now. There is no true desire to properly punish them, it's all for show.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
Of course they will be.

Absolutely this - it's what's been quite clear for a couple of years now. There is no true desire to properly punish them, it's all for show.
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Why?

Anything that implies they have cheated their way to a Premier League title or two will be a stain against them forever.
 
Berbasbullet said:
Honestly my interest in football does slightly hang on this judgement.
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Yep. If it's not removing the titles and severely punishing them I don't see the point. League would lose all credibility and integrity.
 
On a side note, how brain dead is that young City fan on the fan debate? Bring back the bald and smug bloke.
 
Any kind of fine is like catching a bank robber and letting them keep 99% of the money they stole.

European ban for 5 years, relegation, titles stripped, and some motherfeckers put in jail.
 
MaMa given red said:
Why?

Anything that implies they have cheated their way to a Premier League title or two will be a stain against them forever.
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Because they're part of the football establishment, and anything that ensures they will be able to continue benefitting from over a decade of cheating and disrupting the market is a victory. It's not entirely unlikely it was factored in as a sort of "risk acceptance" when building this systemic cheating scheme years ago.

They'll spin it more than a figure skater and people will forget. Anything other than titles stripped and an obligation to change the ownership will be a massive win for them.
 
2 man midfield said:
This is it. United are bending over backwards to comply with their rules, if they decide that breaking them for (at least) 10 years in a row isn’t worth a decent punishment then why bother obeying them from now on?

Newcastle would just go on an absolute mad one in the summer, because why not? What are the premier league gonna do?
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Hardly. As much as I love a dig at city, it's hardly grotesque cheating they've been accused of. Few mill payments to mancini and inflating sponsors but mostly not co-operating.

Doesn't equal Newcastle being able to "go on an absolute mad one" because the rules are clearly not fit for purpose.

Don't be so hyperbolic haha
 
SilentWitness said:
Something that we also need to think of if they're guilty is that there may be a lot of clubs who try to sue them. We are being taken to court by Burnley currently regarding them being relegated.
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Thing is with this is that yes, at the start you have all the energy for it, take teams to court and what not but these legal battles go on for such a long time, costing so much money and people end up losing interest.

Look at how people act with City now with the charges, hardly is it mentioned compared to a year ago, they take their time to defuse the heat.
 
MaMa given red said:
Why?

Anything that implies they have cheated their way to a Premier League title or two will be a stain against them forever.
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They don’t care though, or they wouldn’t have committed the crimes in the first place. Neither do their fans for that matter.
 
Fox outside the box said:
Hardly. As much as I love a dig at city, it's hardly grotesque cheating they've been accused of. Few mill payments to mancini and inflating sponsors but mostly not co-operating.

Doesn't equal Newcastle being able to "go on an absolute mad one" because the rules are clearly not fit for purpose.

Don't be so hyperbolic haha
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There is so, so much riding in this, but posts like this one make me think that people will actually buy it just being swept under the rug.

We live in an age where truth isn’t important anymore and this just exemplifies it.
 
Fox outside the box said:
Hardly. As much as I love a dig at city, it's hardly grotesque cheating they've been accused of. Few mill payments to mancini and inflating sponsors but mostly not co-operating.

Doesn't equal Newcastle being able to "go on an absolute mad one" because the rules are clearly not fit for purpose.

Don't be so hyperbolic haha
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City broke financial rules, rules which everyone else abided by. And by doing so they allowed themselves to spend more money than they were allowed, build a mega team, lure pep guardiola and his staff, dominate English football and ultimately win the champions league. None of this happened in a vacuum.
 
Fox outside the box said:
Hardly. As much as I love a dig at city, it's hardly grotesque cheating they've been accused of. Few mill payments to mancini and inflating sponsors but mostly not co-operating.

Doesn't equal Newcastle being able to "go on an absolute mad one" because the rules are clearly not fit for purpose.

Don't be so hyperbolic haha
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Ha! A few mill? is that what you think it is?

So I assume you like the PL and others think that City generate 2nd revenue in the world? above Manutd, Bayern, Liverpool and Barca? whilst their stadium is 25% empty ?

if you classify hundreds of millions as nothing, then there is a problem.
 
Fox outside the box said:
Hardly. As much as I love a dig at city, it's hardly grotesque cheating they've been accused of. Few mill payments to mancini and inflating sponsors but mostly not co-operating.

Doesn't equal Newcastle being able to "go on an absolute mad one" because the rules are clearly not fit for purpose.

Don't be so hyperbolic haha
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Wow.
 
KiD MoYeS said:
On a side note, how brain dead is that young City fan on the fan debate? Bring back the bald and smug bloke.
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Honestly, between the three of them feck me. It’s like scrapping the barrel. It’s not even a United/city thing. The Liverpool lads on there are fine but every city fan on there just comes across as a bellend.
 
Maluco said:
There is so, so much riding in this, but posts like this one make me think that people will actually buy it just being swept under the rug.

We live in an age where truth isn’t important anymore and this just exemplifies it.
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Sadly this is way more heavy than you think.. just look at what's happening in the world and people all know the truth and yet they don't seem to care.
 
SilentWitness said:
Something that we also need to think of if they're guilty is that there may be a lot of clubs who try to sue them. We are being taken to court by Burnley currently regarding them being relegated.
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Reportedly at least four clubs will have multi million pound cases against City.

Rooney in Paris said:
Because they're part of the football establishment, and anything that ensures they will be able to continue benefitting from over a decade of cheating and disrupting the market is a victory. It's not entirely unlikely it was factored in as a sort of "risk acceptance" when building this systemic cheating scheme years ago.

They'll spin it more than a figure skater and people will forget. Anything other than titles stripped and an obligation to change the ownership will be a massive win for them.
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Firstly football fans don't tend to forget!

I still get reminded about Cantona's kung fu kick and Roy Keane hacking down Haaland senior from fans of other clubs that I know!

Secondly for City and their owners anything that implies they have cheated is hugely damaging! Let's not forget that the only reason their owners bought Man City was a Sports washing exercise. It's not good for their brand and completely tarnishes their reputation. Just look at how they reacted to the APT rules crying about the "tyranny of the majority!"

Nothing other than complete exoneration will do. This is what they have claimed all along, that they are completely innocent of all charges, bafflingly even the non co-operation ones!

These owners play by their own rules! If the Premier League decided to deduct them points, City will be publishing alternative league tables!

A lot of people underestimate how different this is to anything that has gone on before. It isn't The EFL going after Derby County or even The Premier League going after Everton and Forest. This is on a completely different scale!
 
MaMa given red said:
A lot of people underestimate how different this is to anything that has gone on before. It isn't The EFL going after Derby County or even The Premier League going after Everton and Forest. This is on a completely different scale!
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Exactly, the PL is showing bias towards Man City because their owners line up PL hierarchy with money.

If City get away with anything but expulsion, that is what has happened.
 
I see a points deduction which doesn’t result
In relegation and maybe a transfer ban. City and their owners are too important and powerful for them to be relegated.
 
MaMa given red said:
Firstly football fans don't tend to forget!

I still get reminded about Cantona's kung fu kick and Roy Keane hacking down Haaland senior from fans of other clubs that I know!

Secondly for City and their owners anything that implies they have cheated is hugely damaging! Let's not forget that the only reason their owners bought Man City was a Sports washing exercise. It's not good for their brand and completely tarnishes their reputation. Just look at how they reacted to the APT rules crying about the "tyranny of the majority!"

Nothing other than complete exoneration will do. This is what they have claimed all along, that they are completely innocent of all charges, bafflingly even the non co-operation ones!

These owners play by their own rules! If the Premier League decided to deduct them points, City will be publishing alternative league tables!

A lot of people underestimate how different this is to anything that has gone on before. It isn't The EFL going after Derby County or even The Premier League going after Everton and Forest. This is on a completely different scale!
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No disrespect intended, but I think you're being a tad naive. In any case, I strongly disagree with your view on this, but fair enough!
 
arnie_ni said:
Is there a timeline for a decision
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Probably need to lock the thread until there's any sort of date or decision now.

As every time I Iog in it's just the same 100s of tedious "they'll get off" or wild ideas on punishment based on nothing.
 
Relegation to the Championship simply isnt a viable option as it would be completely unfair on the other clubs in that division and if they did try to relegate them I can see it being met with a lot of resistance from the other clubs who wont be happy that an automatic promotion spot is being basically taken away from them and handed to City.
 
No fine will be enough of a punishment for a state backed club and any points deduction won't really affect them this season or will be a short term effect before they're back to their ways. Either of these kind of punishments will be seen as worth it for them - a treble and becoming a top club is a huge prize so cheaters need a matching huge punishment. To me that says they need a punishment that cancels out their last several years of progress and the only way to do that seems like keeping them out of the PL for several years. Relegate and PL ban for 5 years, and if they get promoted the next team takes their place.
 
If they don't get relegated two divisions, a 3 year transfer ban and 3 year European ban and titles removed then we might as well not bother playing in the PL. It would basically mean anyone can do anything they like and spend whatever they want and city are obviously in the best position to benefit from this. As others have said they'll always be better off than they were before the cheating unless you put them back a few years.
Plus everyone else should refuse to play them if they get away with it and form another league without the Saudis.

When F1 made the rules up in a race so Verstappen could win the title, that did exactly what this would do to the PL. It would be worthless just like that shower of shit is now and I've not watched 1 second of it since either. It's just fixed (within reason) just like the pl would be.
They need to be severely punished so nobody does anything like it again otherwise they've been let off and any PL season from now on will be a complete farce.
 
I don't know how many charges Everton or Leicester had but I don't think it was anything close to 115/130. So they realistically have to multiply the punishment compared to what they got.
 
I despise City as much as anyone.

But the whole 'blatant cheating' and 'players knowingly participating under a scandal' is a bit OTT. They've inflated revenue, and paid managers/players off the book. They haven't been part of a doping or refereeing scandal.

I think people struggle to separate how hollow and boring City are with the charges. The charges they are accused off have allowed them to spend more money and attract better players - and gave them an advantage but let's not pretend they would have been mid-table if they had followed the rules.

They've identified talent well over the last 10 years, brought in a winning structure, moved players on at the right time, and appointed the best manager. United have not fallen behind City because they cheated.

In saying that, the PL need to set a precedent and assure it's more than just a big fine to prevent it happening again.
 
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