Enigma_87
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Am I the only one who thinks that Benteke isn't actually progressing but is on the same level since 2 years?
Because none of them had a great all round game and yet it didn't hinder the other attackers ability to perform around them.Why are you even mentioning the likes of Inzaghi (fourth highest scorer in the history of European football) and Batistuta in a Benteke discussion ? Those were two of the greatest strikers of the modern era, who were several notches beyond him. Why not mention Gerd Muller too eh ? Inzaghi had the natural ability to beat the trap, supreme ppsitioning skills, the intelligence of his movement opened up spaces for the likes of Zidane and Ale to exploit, or later Kaka and Rui Costa and Shevchenko. Benteke doesn't remotely have the instinct that the likes of Batistuta and Inzaghi had. It's like saying any attacker who's seemingly uncoordinated can be compared with Thomas Muller.
Wo said Hernandez is Benteke ? The core is of the issue is - will what he bring from the sub bench so good in relation to Hernandez that we need to pay £30 million+ ? No he won't.
If ifs and buts were candies and nuts, we'd all have a merry Christmas. Benteke hasn't shown any indication of the world class potential you describe, he's way more likely to be an above average to good striker for a Top 8 team than someone who could light the Champions League up. 23 league goals in the past two seasons (barely over 11 per season so it's not like he's some magnificent goalscorer either) and about decent overall ability (far removed from anything approaching elite status) is hardly indicative of world class potential. Feel free to disagree though.
Because none of them had a great all round game and yet it didn't hinder the other attackers ability to perform around them.
You pay that amount of money not expecting him to just be on the bench. He'd be competing with a wayne rooney that hasn't led our line for 5 years and is in clear physical decline.
I take it you haven't payed attention to his villa career. He had a slow start in the beginning then started scoring at a amazing rate for the 2nd half of his first season. Started his 2nd season like a house on fire and then got injured. Came back, couldn't score and then got a really bad injury at the end of that season then started the next one not playing and still recovering.
Couldn't score after coming back then suddenly burst into life after a managerial change.
Fact is he's had two spells in the past 3 seasons where he's scored at a rate that'd make any club forget his so called deficient all round game.
How is Firmino a top player? He's in the same boat as Lallana. A player who's done well for a midtable team in a top league.
You don't know Drogba before he joined Chelsea? He was amazing in the champions league and that was what prompt his move to Chelsea.
You don't know Drogba before he joined Chelsea? He was amazing in the champions league and that was what prompt his move to Chelsea.
He didn't play CL at guingamp. I defy anyone to say they knew much about him when he played for them.
At the end of the day, he doesn't have top shelf skill, and has scored at an average of 11 goals per season.
16 goals per season average not 11. In the EPL
23 league goals in the past two seasons (barely over 11 per season so it's not like he's some magnificent goalscorer either) and about decent overall ability (far removed from anything approaching elite status) is hardly indicative of world class potential.
He did play in the CL with Marseille, they finished third of their group I think and thefore played/reached the UEFA Cup final. He did well in the CL but he truly shone in the UEFA Cup scoring this goal against Newcastle in the semi final:
Did you even read the previous series of posts that lead to the conversation ? Or do you like to jump in and act the smartarse without considering the context ?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/christian-benteke-bbc-liverpool-to-meet-£32-5m-clause-seriously-like-not-even-lying.406461/page-26#post-17796811
Why omit his first season at Villa? I looked at the posts you were responding to and I don't see why you'd specifically only take count of his last two seasons when he's played three in the EPL altogether. Earlier in the same conversation you mentioned Hernandez's strike rate in his first three seasons as a comparison to Benteke's first three no? It doesn't make sense.
Because that's more recent evidence in median terms, and a better gauge for the level he will project to ?
Hernandez was included in a separate context (as was Benteke) when comparing his overall body of work through the first three seasons at United vs Benteke who scored a similar figure per season at Aston Villa through his three seasons.
Get the feeling you want to argue just for the sake of it, or are maybe seeking oneupmanship rather than more fruitful debate, and like to dredge up minutiae in emphatic fashion, so I'm just gonna leave you to it.
Because none of them had a great all round game and yet it didn't hinder the other attackers ability to perform around them.
Get the feeling you want to argue just for the sake of it, or are maybe seeking oneupmanship rather than more fruitful debate, and like to dredge up minutiae in emphatic fashion, so I'm just gonna leave you to it.
They have a good front 3 - Firmino, Coutinho and Benteke (as he'll improve them in the striker area). Behind them tho... Stoke level.
Sky Sports just posted this to see how he would fit in... That team is fecking dreadful except for Coutinho, they need a lot better to get into the top 4 next season if that's what they are boasting
They have a good front 3 - Firmino, Coutinho and Benteke (as he'll improve them in the striker area). Behind them tho... Stoke level.
Glad you think so, most of my non-Utd supporting mates seem to think he's pony and trap. Hoping for a midfield three of Herrera/Schneider/Schweinsteiger - my god that's amazing.
Sky Sports just posted this to see how he would fit in... That team is fecking dreadful except for Coutinho, they need a lot better to get into the top 4 next season if that's what they are boasting
Sky Sports just posted this to see how he would fit in... That team is fecking dreadful except for Coutinho, they need a lot better to get into the top 4 next season if that's what they are boasting
Aye, lad. You've cherry picked and cut your stats in the best of faith so far.
That is something else, but let's not forget we have a midfielder that could be better than them all.
I wouldn't say 'fecking dreadful'.
For me that's a solid team, replace Benteke with a fully fit Sturridge and that's a team challenging for a top 4 place. The thing that will let them down is the squad depth in areas, no doubt they have the depth but the quality in the depth isn't the best. Milner, Can and Henderson all very solid hard working players, that are going to consistently put in 7/10 performances - they have the flair in Firmino and Coutinho to make goals for their forwards. Scousers will be solid this season, I just think us and the other top 4 might have too much for them in the big head to heads.
They will probably use the wings with Clyne and Moreno. Firmino and Countinho are also capable of playing on the wings. That team however is pretty weak on paper in the center..It's way too narrow in the front 3 imo. Reus would probably fix this but they aren't getting him in their dreams
That is something else, but let's not forget we have a midfielder that could be better than them all.
Did Jamie Redknapp write this tweet?
He is playing for a pretty shitty team. It will be interesting to see how he does in a better attacking lineup. I think he will get a minimum of 17-20 goals this season.Am I the only one who thinks that Benteke isn't actually progressing but is on the same level since 2 years?
Cherry pick what exactly ? I've only attempted to illustrate how someone like Benteke is not going to be the world class player some are making him out to be. We have folks mentioning him in the same light as the likes of Batistuta to prove a point about the overwhelming virtues of goalscoring competence. If you disagree, fine, you're entitled to the opinion. But surely you must realize that outside of Benteke's first season at Villa (which was well over 2 seasons ago mind), he has been kind of mediocre, and not someone destined to lead a big club in terms of title chances, and European competition ? People keep coming back to his 2012/ 2013 form, but lots of players are flash in the pan in their debut seasons, and fail to replicate that sort of return over subsequent seasons, which is exactly what Benteke has shown so far with 10 goals in 2013/ 2014 and 13 goals in 2014/ 2015. How can anyone say with gumption that he will be a consistent 20+ goal per season player is beyond me to be honest.
I mean this is someone who has a similar playing style, and has been the statistical equivalent to the likes of Edin Dzeko, Wilfried Bony, Romelu Lukaku in the past 24 months or thereabouts. Hardly the most distinguished company to have, atleast in terms of what United should aim for. Not an intentional dig in all honesty, but I'm kind of ambivalent about him joining Liverpool. You can't sign some of the best strikers in Europe (by virtue of being out of the Champions League and having underperformed in recent seasons apart from the blip in 2013/ 2014) and I totally get the circumstances, so from an objective standpoint Benteke makes sense. But I do think that from a schematic fitpoint of view, someone like a Lacazette might have been a better choice.
And I still don't believe Benteke will justify the inflated £32 million fee, be it in terms of his current standard, or his projected impact based on his skillset, and lack of consistency evidenced by the performances in the last couple of seasons. That's exactly the type of fee Chelsea paid for Diego Costa, a player that showed a significantly higher level of consistency over his final 2 seasons at Atletico, both in terms of his overall play, and increasing statistical returns, going from 10 at Rayo, to 20 for Atletico in 2012/ 2013, and then replacing Falcao and scoring 36 in all competitions in 2013/ 2014 to show a progressively positive trend as opposed to Benteke who scored an encouraging 23 in his first seasons, but then reverted to the mean instead of improving and building upon the performances. And he has 0 compeitive goals for Belgium since 2012 to boot, despite the striker position being kind of weak for their national team and competition in the form of Lukaku, Origi and co.