Chido Obi Martin

lysglimt said:
Just out of curiosity - which of our young strikers would you trust to start a tough away match if Højlund got injured ?
Wheatley who has had a mediocre season - Biancheri who has started something like 2-3 matches for the U21 or Chido who turned 17 a month ago and has played about the same amount of games at U21 as Biancheri?

It's not just about the team - it's also about the youngster, why do you think good managers are so careful about which clubs they loan players to ? Even if a player is talented enough - that doesn't mean they are mentally talented to start a game at Anfield or at Old Trafford. 15 minutes here or 20 minutes there is one thing - to rely on them to get points is a completely different ballgame. It could cost us points, and even worse it could set their development back years.
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Evidence from tonights game, Zirkzee should not be playing for us and should be sold on, got booed off.
I do agree it can set their development back years but give them a chance to prove they deserve to step up. Season is done, let them get game time now they could surprise everyone. The only way to build up confidence and mentality is by putting them on the bench and giving them the time, maybe none of them are worth it but how will we know if we dont play them or loan them out to develop them.
Weve a 16 year CB on the bench tonight so its an option for us to throw one of the strikers on the bench as well.
If Hojlund gets injured we can use Diallo, Garnacho up front and have the youth strikers on the bench. Zirkzee mentality is shot to pieces getting hooked after 32 mins will destroy him.
 
AbusementPark said:
Evidence from tonights game, Zirkzee should not be playing for us and should be sold on, got booed off.
I do agree it can set their development back years but give them a chance to prove they deserve to step up. Season is done, let them get game time now they could surprise everyone. The only way to build up confidence and mentality is by putting them on the bench and giving them the time, maybe none of them are worth it but how will we know if we dont play them or loan them out to develop them.
Weve a 16 year CB on the bench tonight so its an option for us to throw one of the strikers on the bench as well.
If Hojlund gets injured we can use Diallo, Garnacho up front and have the youth strikers on the bench. Zirkzee mentality is shot to pieces getting hooked after 32 mins will destroy him.
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We need proven goalscorers - not kids
 
lysglimt said:
We need proven goalscorers - not kids
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We dont have the money for them, holding onto Zirkzee when we can try and cash in on him before his stock plummets completely and use the money in the summer for another overhaul. Why not throw Chido on the bench and see how he fairs?
 
AbusementPark said:
Evidence from tonights game, Zirkzee should not be playing for us and should be sold on, got booed off.
I do agree it can set their development back years but give them a chance to prove they deserve to step up. Season is done, let them get game time now they could surprise everyone. The only way to build up confidence and mentality is by putting them on the bench and giving them the time, maybe none of them are worth it but how will we know if we dont play them or loan them out to develop them.
Weve a 16 year CB on the bench tonight so its an option for us to throw one of the strikers on the bench as well.
If Hojlund gets injured we can use Diallo, Garnacho up front and have the youth strikers on the bench. Zirkzee mentality is shot to pieces getting hooked after 32 mins will destroy him.
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So a 23 year old who’s had a couple of seasons experience in a top European league has already had his mentality shot to pieces by our current state, and you think that makes it the right time to throw in a few teenagers who have barely even played for our U23 team!?

Make it make sense.

The coaches will promote youth players into first team training when they think they are ready for it, and they’ll do that based on what they think is best for their development. They’re not going to do it in the hopes that some 17 years olds can magically save our disaster of a squad/season.
 
Rockets Redglare said:
Because he’d get absolutely battered by the likes of Dan Burn and Fabian Schar and his confidence would be shot to bits.
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Much like Hojlund and Zirkzee do anyway?

I’d be giving him a chance now. He can’t do any worse.
 
Rockets Redglare said:
Because he’d get absolutely battered by the likes of Dan Burn and Fabian Schar and his confidence would be shot to bits.
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I actually think young naivety is what the team probably needs right now. I don’t think a teenager would be ruined confidence wise right now because they wouldn’t know any better and would just play with excitement.

This isn’t necessarily a comment on Chido needing to play for the record, just saying in general at this point we’d probably see an uptick in performances by just injecting some young, dumb, energetic lads that are just ecstatic to get a chance
 
Zumbi said:
So a 23 year old who’s had a couple of seasons experience in a top European league has already had his mentality shot to pieces by our current state, and you think that makes it the right time to throw in a few teenagers who have barely even played for our U23 team!?

Make it make sense.

The coaches will promote youth players into first team training when they think they are ready for it, and they’ll do that based on what they think is best for their development. They’re not going to do it in the hopes that some 17 years olds can magically save our disaster of a squad/season.
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It’s to give them game time, what’s so alien about that? How else will they get afforded the time unless they play? Zirkzee looks devoid of confidence, any pass he tried to make during the game failed,previous games he was completely ineffective and felt like we were a man down. He’s not good enough to play the system we are currently using, give the youth players a chance to show what they can or can’t do.

Just throwing them into the team to try and save the season isn’t what I’ve said, it’s to help give them game time and exposure. The league season is over already, it doesnt need to be just a Zirkzee replacement from the youth team, Kukonki has been on the bench a couple of times already and is only 16 years old, why can’t Chido be given a bench role and a few minutes game time? I’m not on here saying the players will save the season or make us world beaters but give them exposure to the Premier league and see how they perform.
 
AbusementPark said:
It’s to give them game time, what’s so alien about that? How else will they get afforded the time unless they play? Zirkzee looks devoid of confidence, any pass he tried to make during the game failed,previous games he was completely ineffective and felt like we were a man down. He’s not good enough to play the system we are currently using, give the youth players a chance to show what they can or can’t do.

Just throwing them into the team to try and save the season isn’t what I’ve said, it’s to help give them game time and exposure. The league season is over already, it doesnt need to be just a Zirkzee replacement from the youth team, Kukonki has been on the bench a couple of times already and is only 16 years old, why can’t Chido be given a bench role and a few minutes game time? I’m not on here saying the players will save the season or make us world beaters but give them exposure to the Premier league and see how they perform.
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Maybe Ruben doesnt want to be Tommy Docherty II? Get us relegated?
 
AbusementPark said:
It’s to give them game time, what’s so alien about that? How else will they get afforded the time unless they play? Zirkzee looks devoid of confidence, any pass he tried to make during the game failed,previous games he was completely ineffective and felt like we were a man down. He’s not good enough to play the system we are currently using, give the youth players a chance to show what they can or can’t do.

Just throwing them into the team to try and save the season isn’t what I’ve said, it’s to help give them game time and exposure. The league season is over already, it doesnt need to be just a Zirkzee replacement from the youth team, Kukonki has been on the bench a couple of times already and is only 16 years old, why can’t Chido be given a bench role and a few minutes game time? I’m not on here saying the players will save the season or make us world beaters but give them exposure to the Premier league and see how they perform.
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You just sound a little clueless about the reality of bringing very young players in from the youth teams through to getting minutes for the first team.

Step number one is bringing them into first team training and seeing how they cope with the jump in levels there. Only once they have shown they can cope with that, are they considered for minutes off the bench in an actual game.

That’s what Amorim is doing with Kukonki right now, and that’s what he’ll do with other youth players once him and the youth coaches think they’re ready.
 
Give him a chance? Has anyone for this idea actually watched him play a full 90 minutes?

Against Newcastle in front of Casemiro and Eriksen...is a sure fire way to absolutely kill the lad. Burn and Schar would of had the easiest night of their lives.

Maybe a better shout would be to try him in the Europa League for the last 10-15 minutes. But lets be honest there are bigger fires to put out first.

Leave him in the reserves and let him develop away from the first team shitshow.
 
Anyone that thinks Obi Martin is ready for the 1st team is deluded and hasn't watched him play. He's a fine prospect but not ready and won't be for a while.
Biancheri looks a lot more ready to be integrated into the 1st team squad, he's a alot more mature with less hype about him, he's a very good finisher, great in holding the ball up and bringing other players into play.
 
Obi or Biancheri, I would prefer to start giving minutes to some of these academy kids shooting the lights out at some level. We can't keep spending 40/50 million on squad fillers that literally make no impact on the first team but are detrimental to our squad building goals. These kids and the likes of Kone in midfield have been signed for their high potential so lets start to see what they're made of. Would expect both to be raw but at times its difficult to see how the likes of Chido could be worse holding a ball up or connecting with the other forwards than Rasmus at times.
 
5-10min here and there and intention of integrating obi or biancheri in the first team, see how they perform. Amorim should be looking at midfielders in the under 21 for similar roles
 
Mylock said:
Anyone that thinks Obi Martin is ready for the 1st team is deluded and hasn't watched him play. He's a fine prospect but not ready and won't be for a while.
Biancheri looks a lot more ready to be integrated into the 1st team squad, he's a alot more mature with less hype about him, he's a very good finisher, great in holding the ball up and bringing other players into play.
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This.
 
Mylock said:
Biancheri looks a lot more ready to be integrated into the 1st team squad, he's a alot more mature with less hype about him, he's a very good finisher, great in holding the ball up and bringing other players into play.
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Perhaps a player to fit the Mason Mount role?
 
Mylock said:
Anyone that thinks Obi Martin is ready for the 1st team is deluded and hasn't watched him play. He's a fine prospect but not ready and won't be for a while.
Biancheri looks a lot more ready to be integrated into the 1st team squad, he's a alot more mature with less hype about him, he's a very good finisher, great in holding the ball up and bringing other players into play.
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Agree. I don’t think Obi Martin is ready at this stage. He got the skills and attitude, but against bigger guys, his not the same force as against u18 players. That said, I would love to see him get 10-15 minutes against some tired legs.

Biancheri could probably do more at this stage. He got more understanding of the game and will take the pass instead of shooting when that’s a better option. And as you say; he can finish.
 
Zumbi said:
You just sound a little clueless about the reality of bringing very young players in from the youth teams through to getting minutes for the first team.

Step number one is bringing them into first team training and seeing how they cope with the jump in levels there. Only once they have shown they can cope with that, are they considered for minutes off the bench in an actual game.

That’s what Amorim is doing with Kukonki right now, and that’s what he’ll do with other youth players once him and the youth coaches think they’re ready.
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Cheers for the condescending comment, my original point is that the youth players should get a chance over Zirkzee as he should be sold in January. He’s not good enough and offers nothing, why not give youth a chance instead of him and see how things go. Many teams in an injury crisis bring youth players in and are forced to use them, this is no different if we lose Zirkzee. It’s not as if they will be the main striker for the team either, it will be bit part involvement, coming in for a few minutes at a time.
 
AbusementPark said:
Cheers for the condescending comment, my original point is that the youth players should get a chance over Zirkzee as he should be sold in January. He’s not good enough and offers nothing, why not give youth a chance instead of him and see how things go. Many teams in an injury crisis bring youth players in and are forced to use them, this is no different if we lose Zirkzee. It’s not as if they will be the main striker for the team either, it will be bit part involvement, coming in for a few minutes at a time.
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Your assessment is not wide off the mark. I brought this idea up a few months ago before Zirkzee got found out and a few were hesitant.

A lot of people live in a comfortable shoebox, where all the variables must align before they make a move. Zirkzee is evidently not good enough. United can't hit a barn door with a laser pointing pen. Might as well take the risk.
 
These posts always bemuse me.

Whether people like it or not, a youth player who has never played a single minute of professional football is likely to play worse than the first team player we deem to be shite.

Even if we think Zirkzee is shite, there’s a very high probability a youth team player, talented as they may be, might look even worse on the pitch.
 
Zed is not dead said:
These posts always bemuse me.

Whether people like it or not, a youth player who has never played a single minute of professional football is likely to play worse than the first team player we deem to be shite.

Even if we think Zirkzee is shite, there’s a very high probability a youth team player, talented as they may be, might look even worse on the pitch.
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you can't be worse than Zirkzee
 
Zed is not dead said:
These posts always bemuse me.

Whether people like it or not, a youth player who has never played a single minute of professional football is likely to play worse than the first team player we deem to be shite.

Even if we think Zirkzee is shite, there’s a very high probability a youth team player, talented as they may be, might look even worse on the pitch.
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If he runs about and puts a bit of effort in hed be doing a lot more than Zirkzee ever did.

Zirkzee is comfortably the worst forward we’ve had in a long time. Weghorst was miles better ffs.
 
Zed is not dead said:
These posts always bemuse me.

Whether people like it or not, a youth player who has never played a single minute of professional football is likely to play worse than the first team player we deem to be shite.

Even if we think Zirkzee is shite, there’s a very high probability a youth team player, talented as they may be, might look even worse on the pitch.
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I think more it's people need to realise our position. Now is not the time to be careful, we need goals now, we need to fasttrack him. It's possible he could help us. If he doesn't fine but at least try. Get him in training first at least and see how he does.
 
Bwuk said:
If he runs about and puts a bit of effort in hed be doing a lot more than Zirkzee ever did.

Zirkzee is comfortably the worst forward we’ve had in a long time. Weghorst was miles better ffs.
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:lol: Tell us how you really feel...

Bwuk said:
1 goal in 7. Worrying.
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Bwuk said:
McTominay is way better.

If we played McTominay as a false 9 for the 7 games this season Zirkzee has, I’d be amazed if he didn’t score more than 1.
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Bwuk said:
He’s shite. 1 in 8. Doesn’t look like scoring half the time. Frequently under hits passes too.
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Bwuk said:
Laughable people on think getting rid of McSauce and replacing him with this muppet was a good idea.
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Bwuk said:
As tempting as it is to say let's see him under the new manager, if we can move him on in January it's a no brainer for me.

I just don't see it with Zirkzee.
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Bwuk said:
Cash in. Hes shite. Makes Antony look value for money.
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Bwuk said:
He's played 18 times and has 1 goal.


Surely the worst striker in the league at this point.
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Bwuk said:
I'd take every single one of them over Zirkzee.
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Bwuk said:
Weghorst was way better
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Bwuk said:
He’s utter shite. We’d genuinely be better sticking Maguire uptop.
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Bwuk said:
Weghorst was way better. He could actually run for starters.
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Bwuk said:
Hopefully the last we see of him wearing a United shirt.
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SuperiorXI said:
You disagree? Need I remind you that we can't score for shit and are almost in the relegation zone? Why in gods name should we be ignoring a talent like Obi Martin who scores for fun?
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So did Charlie McNeill, Reo Griffiths, Oakley Cannonier, Layton Stewart, Jay Stansfield, Martell Taylor-Crossdale, Tom Cannon, Zak Emmerson, Morgan Whittaker and Victor Akinwale. Scoring at U16s & U18s level doesn't mean they are ready for first team football.
 
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top1whoisman said:
So did Charlie McNeill, Reo Griffiths, Oakley Cannonier, Layton Stewart, Jay Stansfield, Martell Taylor-Crossdale, Tom Cannon, Zak Emmerson, Morgan Whittaker and Victor Akinwale. Scoring at U16s & U18s level doesn't mean they are ready for first team football.
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It's needs must. We're 7pts off relegation in January and our strikers are not performing. Something has to be done. Even if he is not ready surely he cannot be worse? Right now our strikers are offering nothing.
 
SuperiorXI said:
It's needs must. We're 7pts off relegation in January and our strikers are not performing. Something has to be done. Even if he is not ready surely he cannot be worse? Right now our strikers are offering nothing.
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Of course he can. Højlund is waaaay ahead of him in the pecking order for Denmark. Nor would Obi make it to the Dutch squad currently.
 
lysglimt said:
We need proven goalscorers - not kids
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We do. But some of our youth players that made it, did it because we had injuries and problems with the first team players. For example Rashford came off the bench and got 2 against Arsenal. Garnacho another one

If we dont play the youth at times when the senior players arent doing well, none will make it
 
top1whoisman said:
Of course he can. Højlund is waaaay ahead of him in the pecking order for Denmark. Nor would Obi make it to the Dutch squad currently.
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International football has no relevance here. Looking at the situation right now, we're starving goals. Do you not agree that he deserves a chance, and could possibly work out? He's a resource available right now that we're not using.

There's a long history of kids as young as 16 making PL debuts. Wayne Rooney got his debut at 16.
 
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