Casemiro (out)

[Mrs Smith]

Thought the Saudi clubs were interested?

They might be interested, but Casemiro is already rich beyond rich and maybe he doesn't fancy two years living under the current regime in Saudi with the various rules that would govern his lifestyle, and that of his family's, out there. Milan, Turin, Madrid, Paris, London and even Manchester are surely more desirable places to be

 

[Dan_F]

If it’s just covering a tiny fraction of his wages I don’t see the point. We can’t get through the whole season with three midfielders plus Bruno.

It needs to be enough to bring in a loan or replacement, otherwise just wait till summer.

 

[Roboc7]

There’s no point in keeping him when the manager has no intention of playing him, save some money by loaning him out and last thing we need is being unable to get rid of him in the summer.

Hopefully him and Antony do well enough on loan that we can get offload both in the summer.

 

[Berbaclass]

If it’s just covering a tiny fraction of his wages I don’t see the point. We can’t get through the whole season with three midfielders plus Bruno.

It needs to be enough to bring in a loan or replacement, otherwise just wait till summer.

Well sending him on loan would help our PSR with a wage contribution.

 

[Eleven-Eighteen]

Keep forgetting that Casemiro is not 38. What we ask of him physically vs what he offers definitely makes him seem 38

 

[GwilDor]

Neymar leaving Al Hilal should leave room for another foreigner aswell, though they might have had room already for all i know. What happens in the next week will be massive for how the rest of our season end up i think.

 

[Insanity]

We are never lucky to enjoy the profligacy of the Chinese/Russian/Saudi leagues. We only get broke ass Italian or Spanish clubs who come looking for cheap deals with us paying chunk of the wages.

 

[Kaos]

They might be interested, but Casemiro is already rich beyond rich and maybe he doesn't fancy two years living under the current regime in Saudi with the various rules that would govern his lifestyle, and that of his family's, out there. Milan, Turin, Madrid, Paris, London and even Manchester are surely more desirable places to be

This is a non-factor. The lifestyle and rules for these global superstars in Saudi is completely different to your average Joe in the eyes of the regime. Ronaldo hasn't had to live his life any differently over there, heck they've even made an exception for him to allow him to live with his (unmarried) partner. Its not like he would be playing or living under Taliban supervision. Granted he'd be in hot water if he started hosting dogging sessions in downtown Riyadh or decided he fancied being a drug trafficker as a side hustle, but otherwise he'd be completely fine and comfortable there.

 

[bosskeano]

loaning him out and getting some of his wages covered would be a huge step for Amorim bringing in someone else

 

[Red_Aaron]

He clearly can't play midfield in Amorims system but if he sticks around maybe he can play in the back 3, he should theoretically be a good option for the play building aspects and he's still an asset on set pieces

The question is whether he's prepared to work hard enough, the fact he's not got any pitch time of late leads me to believe he might not be putting the effort in on the training pitch

 

[humdinger]

He clearly can't play midfield in Amorims system but if he sticks around maybe he can play in the back 3, he should theoretically be a good option for the play building aspects and he's still an asset on set pieces

The question is whether he's prepared to work hard enough, the fact he's not got any pitch time of late leads me to believe he might not be putting the effort in on the training pitch

He’s making the bench at least so I assume he is putting in effort. He’s probably just not good enough.

 

[RuudTom83]

He clearly can't play midfield in Amorims system but if he sticks around maybe he can play in the back 3, he should theoretically be a good option for the play building aspects and he's still an asset on set pieces

The question is whether he's prepared to work hard enough, the fact he's not got any pitch time of late leads me to believe he might not be putting the effort in on the training pitch

The only issue with that idea is that United are stacked with CB's this season. It's probably the position they are strongest.

Means Casemiro has very little opportunities for minutes...he would be waiting for an injury crisis really.

 

[croadyman]

They would probably refuse to loan him to us ironically.

Yeah I wouldn't be surprised

 

[Chesterlestreet]

For some reason I thought his contract expires in June. But it doesn't - it expires next June (2026).

What a mess.

Top five earner in the PL - maybe even worse (could he be top 3)?

Feckin' travesty. And he's hardly old in current terms. Should have several seasons in him yet.

 

[croadyman]

Case to Roma on loan, we go for Luiz from Juve?

Wish we could but sadly don't see it, have this gut feeling he is doing a loan deal under radar and it breaks very late in the window.

 

[Eleven-Eighteen]

He clearly can't play midfield in Amorims system but if he sticks around maybe he can play in the back 3, he should theoretically be a good option for the play building aspects and he's still an asset on set pieces

The question is whether he's prepared to work hard enough, the fact he's not got any pitch time of late leads me to believe he might not be putting the effort in on the training pitch

Even De Ligt is looking caught out in Amorim's back three right now. The only people who look solid are Maguire and to some extend Martinez and Yoro. Casemiro doesn't have the legs to track back when needed, nor the safe slides to avoid red cards / penalties

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Even De Ligt is looking caught out in Amorim's back three right now. The only people who look solid are Maguire and to some extend Martinez and Yoro. Casemiro doesn't have the legs to track back when needed, nor the safe slides to avoid red cards / penalties

De Ligt looks the best of the 4 for me.

 

[foolsgold]

If it wasn’t for the wages factor, I’d keep him as a rotation / option from the bench, we’re still in 2 cup competitions. I’d like to salvage some silverware from the season and his experience as a serial winner could count. But there’s no getting past the need to take his (and Rashfords) wages off the books asap. Can’t have our two most expensive players contributing nothing.

 

[croadyman]

If it wasn’t for the wages factor, I’d keep him as a rotation / option from the bench, we’re still in 2 cup competitions. I’d like to salvage some silverware from the season and his experience as a serial winner could count. But there’s no getting past the need to take his (and Rashfords) wages off the books asap. Can’t have our two most expensive players contributing nothing.

That's why I would like to see him go on a loan to Roma, we go and get Luiz on same kind of deal but lower wages.

 

[Berbaclass]

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

Have to say, I love his honesty. Every man and his dog can see Casemiro just doesn’t have the legs anymore to play in the PL, it’s refreshing to see our manager / head coach saying what we all see.

 

[Josep Dowling]

£70m plus £375k in wages. How was that ever approved for a player in his 30s. Previous management were so incompetent.

 

[caid]

Have to say, I love his honesty. Every man and his dog can see Casemiro just doesn’t have the legs anymore to play in the PL, it’s refreshing to see our manager / head coach saying what we all see.

I mean part of the problem is that basically no one has legs in our team. So yeah we cant compensate for a less mobile midfielder.
Martinez, Maguire, De Ligt, Mainoo, Eriksen aren't going to cover huge spaces. Garnacho and Amad might but maybe not particularly effectively with their level of physicality.
I think casemiro will wind up looking pretty good in the right team, thats not here at the moment though.

 

[EdinburghDevil]

De Ligt looks the best of the 4 for me.

Yes, once Yoro is up to speed De Lift will play in the middle of the 3.

Casemiro looks to have been leapfrogged by Collyer and having a talented youngster on low wages is a much better fit for the role in the squad both Collyer and Casemiro currently have.

Need to find a way to move him on. Antony, Radford and Casemiros wages off the books would be a big boost

 

[FerociousCorgis]

if they have any respect for themselves you would hope that casemiro and rashford would both be moved on this window. Instead i fully expect both to be here and collect paycheck for doing jack shit

 

[Antisocial]

if they have any respect for themselves you would hope that casemiro and rashford would both be moved on this window. Instead i fully expect both to be here and collect paycheck for doing jack shit

I am a little surprised Casemiro is seemingly happy to sit back and not play football for the last 18 months of his contract - I understand he's getting paid an insane wage that others won't match (maybe Saudi) but all his career he's been such a competitor, I thought he'd be one of those players who'd want to make the most of his career. Sitting-out for the rest of his contract for the sake of money I didn't think he would want to do.

 

[Stadjer]

if they have any respect for themselves you would hope that casemiro and rashford would both be moved on this window. Instead i fully expect both to be here and collect paycheck for doing jack shit

I find this so strange. They dont respect themself if they arent walking away from a 350k a week deal? It would be crazy to walk away from that if you arent going to get anything comparable somewhere else.

 

[aeh1991]

Top answer.

edit: I predict Luke Shaw will get treated similarly next year. He's faster than Case but it doesn't make sense to keep him when he's injured all the time.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

I find this so strange. They dont respect themself if they arent walking away from a 350k a week deal? It would be crazy to walk away from that if you arent going to get anything comparable somewhere else.

both of these players have made a crap ton of money in their lives. Both could not earn another cent and live lavish lives until they day they die. Guess what they cant do for that amount of time? Play footy. Rashford especially will be pissing away his "prime" while getting dropped from international football. He will have zero shot to be remembered as a player once he retires as anything more than a footnote.

 

[simonhch]

Yes, it's clear that Casemiro still has a lot of quality, but he isn't mobile and he can't play at the intensity that Amorim's system demands. A high, press, high energy system. It doesn't mean he is a bad player suddenly, he is just clearly not suited to what we want from him. Initially when he came, we played a relatively sensible 4-2-3-1, with the two deep midfielders largely sitting back. Over time, we started to play with this bizarre 4-0-5-1 formation, with ETH instructing the two pivots to join the attack and create overloads, which constantly left us exposed in the middle, and left both the CMs scrambling to get back, running aimlessly towards their own goal. It was tactical suicide. No-one looked good in that system, least of all an ageing Casemiro. In the few games RVN was in charge, we moved to an orthodox 4-2-3-1, and I thought Casemiro looked the best he had looked since his first season at the club.

Amorim, meanwhile, requires mobility and the ability to step up and aggressively press, from his two CMs. He also likes them to be able to ball carry. Which is why Ugarte is such a pivotal player for him, and also why, when he can, he plays Bruno as one of the two CMs. Casemiro would be a good signing for a team not attempting to play such front foot, intense football. If he can sit in midfield and screen the defence, he can still be a top, top player for the right team. His line breaking passing, is way better than many give him credit for, and if he can conserve energy and patrol those areas in deep midfield, he is still a great player. Serie A would be a great destination for him. Think he would do well back in La Liga too, for the right team. Hopefully we can ship him out, not because I don't like him - I think he's always been a leader on and off the pitch, and brought the right attitude - but mainly because he doesn't fit and he eats up an enormous amount of resources.

If we can get even 50% of his wages covered to the end of the season, I would ship him out. If we could get a low fee for him, say 10M or so, and get out of the rest of the contract, I would do that too. We need wiggle room to be able to continue to retool the squad so it more closely resembles the vision of the manager. What I like about the players we are going after, is that they are typically fairly young, and multi-faceted, and all seem focused towards an intense style of play. This means they should all be fit for purpose even if we have a managerial change. That is vitally important.

 

[Roboc7]

I am a little surprised Casemiro is seemingly happy to sit back and not play football for the last 18 months of his contract - I understand he's getting paid an insane wage that others won't match (maybe Saudi) but all his career he's been such a competitor, I thought he'd be one of those players who'd want to make the most of his career. Sitting-out for the rest of his contract for the sake of money I didn't think he would want to do.

I doubt he is happy he just isn’t going to walk away from a huge contract that easily. I’m sure he also wants to see what his options are rather than just take first offer gets and he may not even really have any.

I’m sure there will be some sort of settlement in the summer but the club is going to take a big hit and in a way they deserve to for agreeing to such a ludicrous transfer and contract.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

I mean part of the problem is that basically no one has legs in our team. So yeah we cant compensate for a less mobile midfielder.
Martinez, Maguire, De Ligt, Mainoo, Eriksen aren't going to cover huge spaces. Garnacho and Amad might but maybe not particularly effectively with their level of physicality.
I think casemiro will wind up looking pretty good in the right team, thats not here at the moment though.

Can’t argue with that, we’ve built a very slow un athletic team but I think most recognise that anything we do to improve that is only for the better.

 

[bucky]

Top answer.

edit: I predict Luke Shaw will get treated similarly next year. He's faster than Case but it doesn't make sense to keep him when he's injured all the time.

We should be looking to get rid of Shaw during the summer.

 

[aeh1991]

We should be looking to get rid of Shaw during the summer.

my bad, I meant next season. Fully agree with you if there is any buyer though

 

[tjb]

Top answer.

edit: I predict Luke Shaw will get treated similarly next year. He's faster than Case but it doesn't make sense to keep him when he's injured all the time.

If Luke Shaw can come back healthy, I actually see him displacing Lisandro. His ability to get into midfield due to his ball carrying ability could make us more dynamic that we currently are.

 

[bosskeano]

we all know his legs are shot, much like Eriksen, and he needs to go. i enjoyed watching him play simply as you know he gave it everything he had in the gas tank

 

[tjb]

Yes, it's clear that Casemiro still has a lot of quality, but he isn't mobile and he can't play at the intensity that Amorim's system demands. A high, press, high energy system. It doesn't mean he is a bad player suddenly, he is just clearly not suited to what we want from him. Initially when he came, we played a relatively sensible 4-2-3-1, with the two deep midfielders largely sitting back. Over time, we started to play with this bizarre 4-0-5-1 formation, with ETH instructing the two pivots to join the attack and create overloads, which constantly left us exposed in the middle, and left both the CMs scrambling to get back, running aimlessly towards their own goal. It was tactical suicide. No-one looked good in that system, least of all an ageing Casemiro. In the few games RVN was in charge, we moved to an orthodox 4-2-3-1, and I thought Casemiro looked the best he had looked since his first season at the club.

Amorim, meanwhile, requires mobility and the ability to step up and aggressively press, from his two CMs. He also likes them to be able to ball carry. Which is why Ugarte is such a pivotal player for him, and also why, when he can, he plays Bruno as one of the two CMs. Casemiro would be a good signing for a team not attempting to play such front foot, intense football. If he can sit in midfield and screen the defence, he can still be a top, top player for the right team. His line breaking passing, is way better than many give him credit for, and if he can conserve energy and patrol those areas in deep midfield, he is still a great player. Serie A would be a great destination for him. Think he would do well back in La Liga too, for the right team. Hopefully we can ship him out, not because I don't like him - I think he's always been a leader on and off the pitch, and brought the right attitude - but mainly because he doesn't fit and he eats up an enormous amount of resources.

If we can get even 50% of his wages covered to the end of the season, I would ship him out. If we could get a low fee for him, say 10M or so, and get out of the rest of the contract, I would do that too. We need wiggle room to be able to continue to retool the squad so it more closely resembles the vision of the manager. What I like about the players we are going after, is that they are typically fairly young, and multi-faceted, and all seem focused towards an intense style of play. This means they should all be fit for purpose even if we have a managerial change. That is vitally important.

I think athleticism may be the most important feature in Amorim's system, similar to that of Jose's teams. The midfield 4 (wing backs and 2 CM's) have a lot of ground to cover, so need to have the athleticism to be able win their battles. The problem we have had is that this is the area where the club as a whole are lacking the most. Under Ten Hag, it wasn't as easy to identify as there were a lot of system's based issues. However, its becoming quite clear that even some of the players that we thought were athletic struggle to keep up with the demands of the league and the system.

 

[Josep Dowling]

We are never lucky to enjoy the profligacy of the Chinese/Russian/Saudi leagues. We only get broke ass Italian or Spanish clubs who come looking for cheap deals with us paying chunk of the wages.

It’s not luck, it’s down to club owner relationships with Saudi and underhand tactics to stay above PSR rules.

 

[roseguy64]

I doubt he is happy he just isn’t going to walk away from a huge contract that easily. I’m sure he also wants to see what his options are rather than just take first offer gets and he may not even really have any.

I’m sure there will be some sort of settlement in the summer but the club is going to take a big hit and in a way they deserve to for agreeing to such a ludicrous transfer and contract.

Yep. He might be prepared to wait until summer when clubs will be better able to accommodate him.

 

[Ace Krampus]

Neymar leaving Al Hilal should leave room for another foreigner aswell, though they might have had room already for all i know. What happens in the next week will be massive for how the rest of our season end up i think.

I don't see how Neymar leaving Al Hilal would be good in terms of needing Casemiro's buy-in