Bundesliga 2016/17

Cristiano Lell said:
It's quite obvious that neither Pep nor Ancelotti (did) see Kimmich in the Alonso role. Neither see him as a right back either, btw.
And quite honestly his contribution in midfield were nowhere near good enough to prefer him to Thiago, though of course I know your slightly bizarre aversion to Thiago probably lets you disagree.
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Surely that's not the best game to play the "Thiago is our player of the season" card? I thought we played our best football this season with the Thiago - Vidal 2 man midfield anyway and Thiago was much better in that deeper role with more responsibility than he's in the more attacking role in front of Alonso. The only exception to the "we're dreadful to watch whenever we play 433" rule this season was the game against Red Bull.
 
One team couldn't play well, the other didn't want to. Not sure what applied to which team, though. Maybe both.
 
Balu said:
Lucky for them, it got a bit warmer this week. 2 weeks ago, when it was -10 degree, some of them would have fallen asleep and frozen to death.
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Some of them are now jumping up and down in a desparate attempt to bring their lower extremities back to life.
 
Thiago speaking german is the highlight of the match. What a night.
 
Balu said:
Surely that's not the best game to play the "Thiago is our player of the season" card? I thought we played our best football this season with the Thiago - Vidal 2 man midfield anyway and Thiago was much better in that deeper role with more responsibility than he's in the more attacking role in front of Alonso. The only exception to the "we're dreadful to watch whenever we play 433" rule this season was the game against Red Bull.
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I wholeheartedly agree with that, I strongly feel the same. Sadly Ancelotti apparently doesn't. But this doesn't solve what to do with Kimmich. Are you suggesting a Vidal-Kimmich 2 man midfield would be as good? I really don't think so and I also don't think there's any evidence so far it would be.
 
Cristiano Lell said:
I wholeheartedly agree with that, I strongly feel the same. Sadly Ancelotti apparently doesn't. But this doesn't solve what to do with Kimmich. Are you suggesting a Vidal-Kimmich 2 man midfield would be as good? I really don't think so and I also don't think there's any evidence so far it would be.
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If we played a 4231, I wouldn't ask for Kimmich to start.
 
Fair enough. Anyway, with Alonso reportedly calling it quits end of the season we'll see soon enough.

Another problem of course have been Müller's performances, which really have been so unfathomably poor most of the time this season that we'd possibly even need someone else to play the attacking midfielder in the 4-2-3-1.

I have to say I'm worried about the Lahm retirement reports. He's still not that old and I don't really get it. Why the hurry to stop? He'll be more or less impossible to replace.
 
He fears his leadership is dependant on him playing on the highest level and isn't sure he can do it for another season.
 
Why though? I know the dortmund ultras aren't exactly lambs, but why this hate for leipzig?
 
I am wondering with Red Bull in the CL next season will any other club have demonstrations against them. Ajax probably would but, they probably will not make the CL proper.
 
do.ob said:
It boils down to RB being plastic and circumventing 50+1.
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And that's reason to attack their fans?(also, this notion of "plastic", can we call it for what it truly is, i.e. bitterness?)
 
giorno said:
And that's reason to attack their fans?(also, this notion of "plastic", can we call it for what it truly is, i.e. bitterness?)
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Don't understand what is wrong with what RB did. They took over a club that was in 5th division and made sure they were promoted to Bundesliga. It's not that they went full retard and spent 100s of millions on star or ageing players, they signed young players and play good football.
 
Nah, doesn't matter if they were spending billions on stars. It's pure bitterness, plain and simple. "That club was nothing then got bought by rich owners who pumped a lot of their own money into it and now they are better than my club. This pisses me off. Why can't MY club have a rich owner willing to spend out of his own pocket? I hate them"
 
I was watching the Bayern v Schalke game the other day and Kolasinac was playing very well. Any ideas on his availability or how his season has been going? Would be a great future LB and seems to have the pace and physicality to make it in the PL, although I believe i've only seen him play 2-3 times
 
IIRC he's out of contract at the end of the season. I know juventus were/are interested
 
giorno said:
Nah, doesn't matter if they were spending billions on stars. It's pure bitterness, plain and simple. "That club was nothing then got bought by rich owners who pumped a lot of their own money into it and now they are better than my club. This pisses me off. Why can't MY club have a rich owner willing to spend out of his own pocket? I hate them"
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its more deeper than this. Football fans in germany have the feeling to protect the true sense of football and to fight commercialism in its pure form. They are well aware that tv-money, advertising, sponsorship is part of the game nowadays, but the club should utilise those sources and not the other way around. It boils down to this:

1) in the history of german football, for the first time there was a club created whose sole purpose is to sell an energy drink and not to play football
2) 50+1 prohibits clubs to be controlled by owners. It limits the inflow of money, but it also protects german football from being controlled rich guys buying and selling clubs. RB leipzig is violating that and the DFB is tolerating it, additionally this is also giving them a major financial edge over klubs like cologne, berlin, frankfurt etc.
3) Which leverkusen, wolfsburg, hoffenheim and now leipzig more than 20% of the clubs are "artificial" or "plastic" or whatever you want to call it. That is a major concern.

it is also a difference in mentality between UK and germany. so its more then just bitterness. hoffenheim's owner hopp had to go trough tough abuse as well, while they werent top of the league. same for volkswagen and wolfsburg. So its not something you can see isolated.
 
Carl0s84 said:
its more deeper than this. Football fans in germany have the feeling to protect the true sense of football and to fight commercialism in its pure form. They are well aware that tv-money, advertising, sponsorship is part of the game nowadays, but the club should utilise those sources and not the other way around. It boils down to this:

1) in the history of german football, for the first time there was a club created whose sole purpose is to sell an energy drink and not to play football
2) 50+1 prohibits clubs to be controlled by owners. It limits the inflow of money, but it also protects german football from being controlled rich guys buying and selling clubs. RB leipzig is violating that and the DFB is tolerating it, additionally this is also giving them a major financial edge over klubs like cologne, berlin, frankfurt etc.
3) Which leverkusen, wolfsburg, hoffenheim and now leipzig more than 20% of the clubs are "artificial" or "plastic" or whatever you want to call it. That is a major concern.

it is also a difference in mentality between UK and germany. so its more then just bitterness. hoffenheim's owner hopp had to go trough tough abuse as well, while they werent top of the league. same for volkswagen and wolfsburg. So its not something you can see isolated.
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How did they come to that conclusion?
 
giorno said:
And that's reason to attack their fans?(also, this notion of "plastic", can we call it for what it truly is, i.e. bitterness?)
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It's not necessarily that simple.
German fans have a different perspective on investors. 50+1 has been an integral part of German football (especially as a protection of fan's interests) and thus a lot of fans have a hostile mindset towards clubs who try to find a way around that rule.
For example even Leverkusen (fyi they operate in accordance to the rule) who have been around for decades, weren't a pure marketing device initially but a sports group for Bayer employees and who go for young players and attacking football while still being quite succesfull within their means still struggle to fill their stadium because apparently people around here rather go to Gladbach, Cologne or Düsseldorf.


That being said I find this inflationary use of the word bitter pretty ridiculous. What do Dortmund fans of all clubs have to be bitter about regarding Leipzig? Bayern is the only club that has to worry less than Dortmund about them, it's the other clubs, like Cologne, Gladbach and Frankfurt or Berlin that have cause for such feelings.
I also doubt that many fans would sell out control of the club easily.


Another aspect of what happened is that Dortmund (as in the city) has a problem with right wing extremists, who nowadays apparently enjoy practicing martial arts and putting their skills to use. The football/hooligan wing of them recently tried to (forcefully) establish themselves as a group among Dortmund fans. Afaik the club banned them from the stadium, but they can't control what happen's around the stadium. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the stuff was done by them.
 
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Dortmund squad depth is impressive. No Mor, Merino, Isak, Sahin, Götze or Bender in the 18 today (though I think the latter two are injured). Guess the 'problem' with the depth of talent is that those who don't get games will be looking to move.
 
Santi_Mesut_Alexis_87 said:
3-1-4-2, with Dembele as CM?
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Same line-up as vs Leipzig, actually the first time ever he's left it unchanged between two matches for Dortmund, according to sky. Dembele nominally plays as RCM, but he doesn't really have a traditional position in that sense, he has a license to roam the entire right half of the pitch and will often act as a winger. The whole setup is pretty asymmetrical because Guerreiro acts more like a real CM and Reus is something between LCAM and ST - meaning it will at times look like a 343.
 
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