What other manager would accept his level of giveaways?
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Again goes missing when the team needed him. Can't understand why can we not sub him off when he is having a stinker. As far as having a leader on the pitch is a concern then we have Varane, Casemiro etc. who can't be much worse than what Bruno offers in such games.
I share your concerns but we don't really know. Most of us were very suprised how he played in that one game, I think against Everton. It has been just one game, granted, but in this game, we saw Bruno not playing like Bruno. So he is capable of it. Don't really know if it is worth it, but right now, he is part of the squad so try to make the most of him. I don't know, wether we can create a system that is working, but who would really guarantee it isn't possible.
I see your concerns, but lets be sensible. This rashness in his play, we've seen it even from Martinez a couple of times. We've seen it even from Casemiro yesterday. This isn't a coincidence, maybe it is ETHs instruction. I hope, it isn't but it is a possibility. And even if not, better to have somebody like Bruno on the bench (shortterm) than Lingard or Perreira if a goal is needed. No player should be scapegoated, the issues are too diverse. This should also apply to Bruno and Rashford. I am totally in support though, of taking players who have a bad day out of the team. Even if that risks the result and I am on your side, that this is the point in time, where Rashford and Bruno should sit a game out. But lets also not kid ourselves. This alone will not work wonders even if it stops the immediate bleeding maybe. The time to plan the squad is gone. For now ETH has to make the most out of what he has.
I dont think we have any other option other than Bruno as we simply dont have any other creative option in midfield and Eriksen fitness levels leaves a lot to be desired.
We have recruited and identified areas of improvement in the squad poorly.
We have recruited and identified areas of improvement in the squad poorly.
Used to be a huge Bruno fan but this season he's becoming more of a liability than being creative or productive.
Just poor passes and his decision making is brain dead really. Has regressed a lot since he's arrived, truly shows this club sucks the quality out of you.
Just poor passes and his decision making is brain dead really. Has regressed a lot since he's arrived, truly shows this club sucks the quality out of you.
From the victories we have, Bruno scored goal against Burnley and turned the game against Nottingam Forest from 0-2 to 3-2 (1+1). He went missing yesterday but can't blame ten Hag too much for not subbing him as there is always a chance for Moments FC when Bruno is on the field.
Why are people so overly concerned about having one player responsible for the creativity? Why are Newcastle able to score 3 goals against PSG with Tonali, Bruno Guimaraes and Longstaff in the midfield? They don't have a creative number 10.
Chances will come from all angles when you control the game and build up attacks. It really isn't a complicated concept. You don't need to have a player whose sole purpose is to create as many chances as possible.
Chances will come from all angles when you control the game and build up attacks. It really isn't a complicated concept. You don't need to have a player whose sole purpose is to create as many chances as possible.
And when Bruno goes what do we do? Search the market for the next player who is supposed to come in and be ‘our creator’? This is a ridiculous approach to football. So many teams who seem to be more proficient in attack than us seem to manage without having or needing a player who creates 5 chances per match.
If you watched Warren Zaire-Emery play tonight against Newcastle, you would see a perfect demonstration of what midfield quality is. He got a brilliant assist, but that was by the way. That is not what determines whether you play well or not. He showed quality in all of his actions. First touch, ball carrying, turning away from players. That’s what we need. And he’s only 17. Anyone pretending to be completely blind to this argument is in total denial. In fact, I honestly question whether you can really want the best for the team more than you want to win an argument in this instance. You have your stats, while our play continues to be miles off it. Who wins here?
Because we have the dumbest fan base of all football clubs. You know… its the United way and all to have counter attacks after counter attacks.
People don’t realise we had control of the game (except a few times against Barca) and everyone played their role FOR the betterment of the team.
Somehow we only have memories of our wingers running and crossing and have left out all the other important work done by Scholes in dictating the pace of the game (something Bruno can never do), Rooney playing out of position to lay chance after chance for Ronaldo (something Rashford will never do), Ji Sung Park running for others (something Mount should do), Antonio Valencia keeping the ball and providing width (something we have no one at RW to do) and Carrick doing the basics and keeping the ball (something Amrabat can do if you dont fecking play him LB)
So basically we want United of old without realising what the important cogs of the machine were.
Bruno productivity is pretty good. There is no debate on that but his performance overall isnt great. And his reckless passing puts us in danger and we need players to actually cover his issues. Same goes with Rashford when he plays on left and we need someone to cover as his defensive tracking is not upto the standards required. You cant have multiple players whose deficiencies needs to be compensated. We had Rooney, one of the greatest players to ever play for us, to cover for Ronaldo. Right now we have bunch of attackers who are good at attack but ( but not world class) not doing their defensive duties and that shows in our performance.
There were rumours when he was linked to City that City scouts thought he doesn’t have the capability to play in City’s possession based system.
We need to realise quickly that we cant play multiple passengers in attack and then play ageing midfielders behind them and expect a good balanced performance. We need to drop either one of Rashford or Bruno, or get them onboard with defensive duty required. Else we need to drop on of them and play someone like Amrabat or Hannibal who will give us more cover in central part.
Personnel are not the issue, its how much freedom that is provided to players in attack. Its why Antony plays on right because he does his defensive duties. But at the moment for some reason both Rashford and Bruno are allowed to free roam and we dont have enough legs in midfield to cover when we lose ball.
Unless he’s able to play as a #10, high up the park just off of Hojlund he’s pointless atm.
He’s rubbish on the right, and deeper he is a hindrance.
He’s rubbish on the right, and deeper he is a hindrance.
I never thought Bruno is one of the best. He wasnt successfully at bug clubs and Ole bought him for big money from Portuguese league. He came in and did well in his 1st season and has been downhill since. Everyone was raving about his performance but look at his current state in the last 2-3 years, it is declining at a rapid pace. He is not scoring and assisting so much. You can't rely on his scoring and creating now. I think it is time to ship him if anyone comes with a decent offer.
There are also rumours that our own scouts didn't want us to sign him either, because he loses the ball too much.
I would agree, but my issue with that is he never passes to Højlund. Its like he is blind to his great runs. At the moment Mount or Eriksen are our best option at the 10 if we want to get the most out of Rasmus.
Bruno seems like a guy, he can really thrive for a mid table team where he can have all the freedom and just be required to pull a rabbit out of a hat as often as possible but as soon as things get more structured, he struggles, it isnt for him.
Rashford is similar.
When football gets more nuanced and more organised, those two are seemingly detrimental.
Oh well, we know who this seasons Ronaldo and Maguire are.
Rashford is similar.
When football gets more nuanced and more organised, those two are seemingly detrimental.
Oh well, we know who this seasons Ronaldo and Maguire are.
He’s become pretty binary, on/off, hit or miss. He’s the Portuguese Fred.
just kidding, calm down
just kidding, calm down
His technique in tight space is terrible, we can't play progressive football with him as the main guy. We need someone like Ødegaard, someone can dribble and connect teammates around him.
Some rather horrible statistics from his 2023&2023 campaign so far. Dribbled past 12 times in 7 games 
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.| Per 90 | Percentile | |||
| Pass completion rate | 77.01% | 48 | ||
| Dribble Success Rate | 30.77% | 23 | ||
| Disposessed | 6 | 0.86 | 39 | |
| Dribbled Past | 12 | 1.71 | 5 |
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Basically all of them? In amongst the legitimate criticism of Bruno there’s a hell of a lot of hysteria and myth mixed in. One of which is this idea that he is uniquely bad at giving the ball away.
Here are some stat to cut through the bluster (all from PL).
There have been 65 Premier League Players dispossessed more often than Bruno so far this season. This includes players such as Curtis Jones, Phil Foden, Evan Ferguson, Saka, Martinelli, Pahlinha, Guimaraes, Enzo Fernandes, Salah, Casemiro, Kulusevski, Maddison, Bissouma and Odegaard.
His pass completion % is not good (69%) but there are plenty of highly rated players with similar %'s. Haaland, Gibbs-White and Darwin Nunez are three of the players with a worse %. Maddison is 79%. Odegaard 80%. So not a huge difference from the best playmakers in the league this season. And Bruno's attempting more difficult passes than most. We know this because Rodri, Bissouma and Enzo Fernandez are the only midfielders who have a higher "progressive distance" to their passes (i.e. completed vertical passes) and all of them play in deeper areas of the pitch than Bruno (Odegaard's progressive distance is less than half as much) And we also know he is attempting riskier passes because he is second only to Salah (77% pass completion) for big chances created.
So yeah, plenty of managers would accept this level of giveaways. Because there's an obvious upside. And let's not forget that these stats are all from a season so far where the whole team has been playing like muck and it is obviously extremely hard for any United player to rack up impressive stats.
"Dribbled Past" seems to be the new "xG" this season.
Not sure how useful of a stat it is...but if we can use it to bash the players even more, then I'm all for it!
Not sure how useful of a stat it is...but if we can use it to bash the players even more, then I'm all for it!
Some rather horrible statistics from his 2023&2023 campaign so far. Dribbled past 12 times in 7 games
Per 90 Percentile Pass completion rate 77.01% 48 Dribble Success Rate 30.77% 23 Disposessed 6 0.86 39 Dribbled Past 12 1.71 5
Nice selective use of stats there. Being dribbled past that many times is not good but he's tackled more players than Declan Rice has, winning more tackles than Rodri, Szobozlai, Palhinha and Caicedo (as well as, by a big margin, Odegaard and Madisson).
The bolded part is the core of the issue, isn't it?
And for your first sentence - I would agree that such a general slag as the one you quoted aren't really worth anything but your first sentence isn't much better if we are honest. We don't know, which managers would like to have him in their teams - so it makes no sense to state that noone would, just like it makes no sense to say everyone would.
If it means one less pass out of every ten he attempts reaching its target (compared to Odegaard/Maddison) in order to create the second highest number of big chances in the PL this season, is that really such a terrible burden for the team to bear? Not to mention over twice as much progressive distance on his passes as those two.
And this is a season where he’s not been anywhere near his best.
Not the core, but it is a problem.
69% Vs 79/80% IS a significant difference though - especially in a game where small margins are the difference between 3 points and none
Those stats really are proof that he is too wasteful
The players you mention who are more wasteful are generally attackers rather than midfielders so not a good comparison
Worrying to see Casemiro name on the dispossessed list too
I know your standpoint on the matter and I know you are a fan of the player and another one I am very critical of. I'll happily try to close the distance between us by saying, the issue isn't just Brunos passing behaviour. It seems to be some faulty instruction given that even Casemiro fell victim to it against Galatasaray.
And to answer your question: you've choosen your words wisely, let me ask you back, what is the 2nd highest number of big chances worth if our results are pretty bad and have us in 10th place? I think, the same way some of his critics are overdoing the analysis of some stats, his fans are doing the same exact thing. Status Quo is, for all of Brunos good looking individual stats the team itself, even only the attack has come short for years. Most of our rivals are more productive. How much of that is only down to Bruno is debatable. But every time you see him attempting "a difficult pass", other posters see a low percentage pass in behind that has as much chance of coming back as a dangerous counter as it has to score from it.
His best position is wide right of the front 3.
And all these people saying drop Bruno, for who exactly?
I get dropping Rashord for Garnacho (although I disagree with it)but Bruno is the only one that looks like creating in a team bereft of goals.
Mason Mount runs a lot and ”looks tidy” (whatever that means) but his output in very little. And that has been true since his Chelsea days.
For me the season is already a write off so I hope Bruno gets dropped for a couple of games just so you lot feel what its like supporting a team that creates very little.
And all these people saying drop Bruno, for who exactly?
I get dropping Rashord for Garnacho (although I disagree with it)but Bruno is the only one that looks like creating in a team bereft of goals.
Mason Mount runs a lot and ”looks tidy” (whatever that means) but his output in very little. And that has been true since his Chelsea days.
For me the season is already a write off so I hope Bruno gets dropped for a couple of games just so you lot feel what its like supporting a team that creates very little.
To put it mildly. Same with pass completion. I don't think 69% vs 77% pass completion is a huge concern for a team so long as that's happening in advanced areas of the pitch. What is an unacceptable risk is a player whose passing is scattergun in deep areas of the pitch. Rodri's pass completion is 94.8%. Declan Rice is 92.4%. Casemiro is 81.4%. Anyone who thinks Bruno losing possession cheaply is the biggest cross this team has to bear is really missing the point.
All of the managers, you say, but all of the previous managers also failed, so where does that leave us? None of the top managers would do it, which is what our aim should be.
I know you're trying to post the dispossessed stats to make Bruno look better, but how about you look at loss of possession as a whole instead of dispossessed? Neither of these players you listed have lost possession more than Bruno, so it's a bit of a nonsense argument.
As for the pass completion rate; do you really find it surprising that attackers have worse pass completion rate than midfielders? Bruno should not be anywhere near 69%, and yes, it is quite a huge difference from 79-80%.
He also shares that second spot for big chances created along with Trippier and Anthony Gordon, and just one more than Maddison, Ward-Prowse, James Garner and Estupinan and Amadou Onana. Not really risk-taking players other than Maddison.
There are right backs in the league able to create almost as many chances in the league as Bruno (Trippier and TAA), so he really isn't a necessity in a midfield three to create, especially not when his other midfield qualities are non-existant.
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I wouldn't mind us going back to basics and perhaps sacrificing a bit of creativity for solidity, just to see if that would change anything.
Some sort of midfield comprising of any three of: Casemiro, Amrabat, Hannibal and Mainoo.
God help us if that happens. 13 PL teams have scored more goals than us so far this season.
So what harm can it do? We should try and make ourselves a bit more difficult to play against, especially with the absence of three of our starting back four. I'd probably suggest pairing Amrabat and Casemiro with one of Hannibal or Mainoo.
Yet another poster who thinks the responsibility of creating chances should be given to one player, instead of a team. Who was responsible for creating chances in Newcastle's 4-1 thrashing against PSG?
Absolutely speechless how some people think this is a healthy approach to become an elite football team, especially after witnessing our glory for many years.
Yeah it would make sense to do this with the injuries to three of the best four defenders in the team.
I doubt it would work but anything is worth a try at this point.
You are ignoring the fact Bruno does his fair share of defensive work. He’s hardly an Ozil or Pogba type player.
And he doesn’t give the ball away in the center circle, its more him trying a cross or through ball that doesn’t reach its target.
Are we just going to play keep ball for 90 minutes with sideways passing.
Exactly. What we have been attempting clearly hasn't been working. A bit of extra solidity in the midfield might be a bit uninspiring, but could allow us to eke out some results.
Do Newcastle, Brighton, Aston Villa or West Ham play sideways passing? Why do you think we need Bruno to be a functional football team? Bruno runs a lot, he doesn't actually do much defensively. And even if he did, look how many goals we've conceded. Does it look like that midfield works?
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